PDA

View Full Version : Alternative Force Organisations/Army Selection



Tarax
28-08-2008, 14:47
I've been thinking about changing the way we build our armies. (Yes, again.;) )

In 40K we sometimes see the minimum of Troops choices, although with the new rules this will have changed. But still people will try to bring the most of the other types as well, thus minimizing Troops choices, while still getting most slots. Eg. 6 5-man squads of Space Marines instead of 3 10-man squads.

In Fantasy some armies, like High Elves, will use more Special units while minimizing its Core units.

It is true that units outside of Troops/Core are better, but they are few.

In some game systems you don't buy units, but battallions or battlegroups, which comprise of a set amount of certain units. This could be taken and given a place in Fantasy and 40K.

Just some examples:
(In 40K it is slightly easier, so I begin there)
You have to take 2 Troops choices before you can take 2 choices of the other categories (Elite, Fast, Heavy). You can not take another choice before you first get another 2 Troops choices.

A Fast choice will comprise of 2 squads of Marine Bikers and one Squad of Attack Bikes.

(Fantasy)
A Bretonnian Lance (unit of Knights) comes with a retinue of 2 other units, either 2 units of Men-at-Arms or 2 units of Bowmen (non-skirmish) or one of each.

An Empire army is made up of battallions of infantry supported by other units. You take an parent unit with 2 detachments and you can take any other unit as support. eg 20 halberdiers with 10 handgunners and 10 swordsmen can take a cannon as support, or a unit of knights.

This whole thing could be as complex or as simple as can be.

Any thoughts?

lanrak
28-08-2008, 19:35
Hi.
IMO the 'army composition ' method used in WH is plenty good enough.

Special and rare units are limited dependant on the army size.

Why GW dont use this in 40k is beyond me.

Do they have to ration out the good ideas between the games , so poor old 40k doesnt get to use any!:D

Mind you a TO&E and 'random selection of units', could make for a points free narrative driven concept that would suit WH and 40k much better IMO.

TTFN
Lanrak.

Condottiere
28-08-2008, 20:53
TO&E work better with "modern" force structures. Try explaining to a Chaos general that he needs to take along 3 companies of Marauders for each unit of Warriors, but has the option of calling for reinforcements in the shape of one squadron of Chaos Knights, possibly two from Divisional reserve, assuming his overlord authorizes it.

Tarax
29-08-2008, 09:28
TO&E work better with "modern" force structures. Try explaining to a Chaos general that he needs to take along 3 companies of Marauders for each unit of Warriors, but has the option of calling for reinforcements in the shape of one squadron of Chaos Knights, possibly two from Divisional reserve, assuming his overlord authorizes it.

TO&E, what is that? Can't figure it out.

You don't have to explain it to the Chaos general. It's staring him in the face. There are thousands of Marauders and just a handful of Warriors. At least that's what the fluff will tell you. Alas not so on the tabletop.

That's the reason I want to change the selection bit. To make it look more like the background and disallow people from just taking the best units available.

kdh88
29-08-2008, 13:46
TO&E, what is that? Can't figure it out.

Table of Organization and Equipment. Basically, it's the document modern armies use to define what their units are supposed to have in terms of manpower and equipment.



That's the reason I want to change the selection bit. To make it look more like the background and disallow people from just taking the best units available.

People will always take the best unit; this would only change the best unit from being one type of model to several. Second, your examples don't really
fit the fluff. While there are more warriors than marauders overall, that doesn't mean that every single army has exactly the same proportion of one to the other, or that all armies even contain marauders.

Bathfinder
29-08-2008, 13:52
One way to change the way to construct armies could be to restrict not the number of choices but the amount of points. for example 2nd ed had "at least 25% squads, maximum 50% characters and max 50% support". Something like that could be used, more or less strict, I don't know...

Another version of this could be something like "maximum points in other cathegories than troops is half the points spent on troops" or whatever...?

Tarax
01-09-2008, 16:44
Table of Organization and Equipment. Basically, it's the document modern armies use to define what their units are supposed to have in terms of manpower and equipment.

Thanks. I'm not really sure what good it is to me. But let me think about it.


People will always take the best unit; this would only change the best unit from being one type of model to several. Second, your examples don't really fit the fluff. While there are more warriors than marauders overall, that doesn't mean that every single army has exactly the same proportion of one to the other, or that all armies even contain marauders.

Why do you think there are more Warriors? From what fluff. I mean, there are tribes of Marauders and from which only the strongest get to be Warriors, ie the chosen ones.
Not every army is the same, but that doesn't mean that every army has a disproportionate number of Warriors.


One way to change the way to construct armies could be to restrict not the number of choices but the amount of points. for example 2nd ed had "at least 25% squads, maximum 50% characters and max 50% support". Something like that could be used, more or less strict, I don't know...

Another version of this could be something like "maximum points in other cathegories than troops is half the points spent on troops" or whatever...?

Up untill 5th this was the case. In the beginning I liked the change to Core, Special and Rare. But now it's all gone wrong again. At least IMO.

Whatever the change will be in organisation, it should be different from what it is now.

lanrak
02-09-2008, 22:05
Hi.
As reguards to TO&E it can be taylored to suit a particular force organisation, army composition.

You could just list the unit types avaiable.
And let the players pick what they want o use.

BUT before deployment roll to see which units have been
delayed, re directed etc.