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Pontus
07-11-2005, 13:51
Question: Do beastmen herds negate ranks when charing an enemy unit in the side or rear?

As Ive read the rules i know skirmishers do not negate ranks, but beastmen adopt almost a regular formation when in combat. Can anyone clear this up for me please? (rules references, page # etc would be great, i own all warhammer books)

Sincerely Pontus

Ophidicus
07-11-2005, 14:03
Just checked BoC, and it would appear not... they get rank bonus, but do not explicitly negate it. Poop. :(

Threch
07-11-2005, 14:05
As I understand it, beast herds do not cancel ranks. I don't have a chaos book to look at, but I belive beast heards are skirmishers, and also have the ability to add +2 rank bonus due to their special melee form-up. This extra ability does not replace their skirmisher rules as far as I know. Their special formation is in addition to being skirmishers.

Which brings and odd question to mind... If a Skaven player fired/cast into melee with a beast heard, (or any other skirmisher for that matter,) would they still have to subtract -1 for the skirmisher rule? This seems a bit silly, but I don't know of any place in the Skaven codex or BRB that states otherwise.

Pontus
07-11-2005, 15:28
Thanks for the answears so far guys. Anyone else have anything to say about it? A definite answear would be nice. Are the rules boys still around answearing emails? If they are, whats the email adress?

Sincerely, Pontus

Latro
07-11-2005, 15:41
Question: Do beastmen herds negate ranks when charing an enemy unit in the side or rear?

As Ive read the rules i know skirmishers do not negate ranks, but beastmen adopt almost a regular formation when in combat. Can anyone clear this up for me please? (rules references, page # etc would be great, i own all warhammer books)

Sincerely Pontus

Beasts of Chaos page 18:

It is explained that units with the "Raiders" special rules behave just like skirmishers with some extra exceptions like the +2 max rank bonus and such.

Since skirmishers don't cancel ranks, Raiders don't either because there's nothing about it mentioned in the exceptions.

:cool:

Festus
07-11-2005, 17:17
Hi

Thanks for the answears so far guys. Anyone else have anything to say about it? A definite answear would be nice. Are the rules boys still around answearing emails? If they are, whats the email adress?

Well, you got the same answer twice (three times now) and I will make it a fourth:

As a Beastherd basically is a skirmishing unit - albeit with some exceptions noted in their entry and rules - they basically follow the rules for skirmishing units (except where noted, you guessed it!):
Thus they do not cancel rank bonus on a flank or rear charge.

Greetings
FEstus

Pontus
08-11-2005, 08:49
Thank you for your replies. I did not mean to be distrustfull, but i think the rules in fantasy battles are somewhat sketchy and judging from the various FAQ's and Q&A's that ive read, you cant realy apply logic. Rules contradict rules all the time.

Sincerely, Pontus

Festus
08-11-2005, 10:08
Hi


I did not mean to be distrustfull,
I didn't take it as such.

But around here happen to be some of the most knowledgeable folks concerning WHFB rules to be found anywhere on the internet. Apart from having an intimate knowledge of the rules, we usually have access to a wide database from various sources, spread around...

If we (more than just one opinion) agree on a certain point, it is *very* likely that this indeed is the case.

But, TBH, we often disagree as well, which can lead to heated debates sometimes :D

Greetings
Festus

Atrahasis
08-11-2005, 13:45
But, TBH, we often disagree as well, which can lead to heated debates sometimes :D

You can bet your last coin of any value that if we do disagree, that there is a bloody good reason for it. We each won't see it that way, but that's the nature of disagreement. ;)

Selsaral
08-11-2005, 15:12
Notice however that beast herds can still get a flank or rear bonus if the unit has 5 or more models in it.

Festus
08-11-2005, 17:00
Hi

Notice however that beast herds can still get a flank or rear bonus if the unit has 5 or more models in it.
Of course, why shouldn't they?

Greetings
Festus

Selsaral
09-11-2005, 16:23
Hi

Of course, why shouldn't they?

Greetings
Festus

I wasn't claiming it was a profound point containing the wisdom of the immortal Gods, so TREMBLE MERE MORTALS.

I was just throwing out a tiny point that someone might have wondered about.

MarcoPollo
10-11-2005, 04:30
You still force the opponent to make panic tests due to flank and rear charges too.

T10
10-11-2005, 10:01
I was just throwing out a tiny point that someone might have wondered about.

And it was a valid point.

-T10

Major Defense
10-11-2005, 14:15
And it was a valid point.

A valid point? Why I'm a MERE TREMBLING MORTAL over that one!! :cheese:

T10
10-11-2005, 14:23
Only mere mortals need tremble. :)

-T10

Keller
10-11-2005, 17:45
You still force the opponent to make panic tests due to flank and rear charges too.

Yes, but remember, that is only if the unit is already engaged in combat. Charging in the flank/rear of an unengaged unit does not cause such a check.

Assumed, maybe, but not to be overlooked.