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Warp Zero
31-08-2008, 12:36
Y'know, I never really thought about it before, but I was wondering something. Are there any non-specific chaos god daemons? I don't mean lesser ones like one tiny daemon that was clawing on the underside of auxillery engine 4A during a journey through the warp. I mean, real intelligent and more powerful ones.

I guess maybe something along the lines of Cherubael (from Eisenhorn trilogy). I don't think it was ever hinted that he followed a specific god. I mean, its not like he was a Tzeentch daemon specifically right?

A friend and I are running a map campaign where some of the fluff revolves around a daemon. Many of the Chaos players that are participating have armies with different themes. There's an Undivided army, a Slaanesh one, a Tzeentch one, etc....

I was wondering if I could make the daemon that they're all rallying under be non specific. Or are all daemons from a specific "chaod god lineage"? Like Plaguebearers, Bloodletters, etc...

Frgt/10
31-08-2008, 12:42
Kathartes are non specific. they are otherwise known as furies
otherwise just the odd undivided daemon prince. no greater daemons that i know of

MvS
31-08-2008, 12:51
Independent daemons are a very old part of the Warhammer Chaos imagery.

These 'independents' could be of almost any power level, although probably not to the degree that they match or outclass the Big Four.

The original Emperor imagery was a demonstation of this.

Firaxin
31-08-2008, 16:53
These 'independents' could be of almost any power level

I once saw one that was OVER 9000!!!!!!!!!!!


...The daemon Horus meets in the HH series is undivided, afaik.

MvS
31-08-2008, 17:41
You did what with the what now???

Charax
31-08-2008, 17:45
It's a dragonball meme. Ignore it and it'll go away

Lothlanathorian
31-08-2008, 17:50
I do believe that the new Chaos Codex makes it pretty plain and clear that there are undivided daemons of varying levels of strength and influence. Also, it could be an ancient Daemon Prince that is more daemon than mortal and has been alive and in the Warp for so long that he doesn't even remember being a mortal at all.

Richter Kless
31-08-2008, 18:08
It's a dragonball meme. Ignore it and it'll go away

Oh don't try to pretend like you are mr. grumpypants now. I know you laughed too.

Zadok
31-08-2008, 18:18
I do believe that the new Chaos Codex makes it pretty plain and clear that there are undivided daemons of varying levels of strength and influence. Also, it could be an ancient Daemon Prince that is more daemon than mortal and has been alive and in the Warp for so long that he doesn't even remember being a mortal at all.

Lothlanathorian has the right idea.

I would imagine Chaos undivided daemons (greater daemons and otherwise) would be just as common as god specific Daemons. A good example of this is the Daemon Prince Prelicator. ( i know I'm not spelling that right.) He was first mentioned in the previous Chaos Space Marine codex, and then mentioned in Ben Counter's book "Chapter War".

Technically the Daemon primarchs Perturabo and Lorgar count as being undivided greater daemons.

They definitely exist Warp Zero; but beacuse they do not have a solid imagery like the specific Greater Daemons, I dont' think people are inclined to write as much about them. Maybe you could write about a Undivided Greater daemon with his own lineage or history? I don't think it's impossible for a GD to change it's appearance, or the appearance it's followers. (Demon or otherwise)

Lothlanathorian
31-08-2008, 18:39
Also, the 'generic daemons' of the new Chaos Marine book and the back of the Daemonhunters book. They are examples of non-God specific daemons.

And I believe it was Periclitor. (I call him Prince Percilator to make fun of his silly and hard to pronounce name)

Malevon
31-08-2008, 18:47
There are rules for Undivided Daemons in Codex: Daemonhunters and of course Codex: Chaos Space Marines. There's no physical description though; they can look like whatever you want!

Yes, Cherubael and Prophanti were not followers of any major power.

Zadok
31-08-2008, 18:53
I remember when Daemonhunters first came out, they had a hobby article were various player made their own original greater daemons for the purpose of being antagonists. I can't seem to find it anymore now that the GW website has changed. It was really good though.

Malevon
31-08-2008, 19:00
http://oz.games-workshop.com/games/40k/daemonhunters/painting/daemons/default.htm

Good ol' Australian GW... I really hope they never take that site down, as it's the only source for a lot of stuff...

Warp Zero
31-08-2008, 19:01
Thanks guys. You've been a great help. I sort of figured there would be undivided daemons, but I wasn't really sure.

The Daemon that I'll be writing about in the campaign's fluff is very powerful. Much more powerful than even a named greater daemon in the Daemon Codex, but no where near as powerful as say, one of the big four. Think Apocalypse scale daemon.

Anyways, I won't go into the details and bore you guys. Just wanted to check if I was doing something that was against established lore.

Xandros
01-09-2008, 02:31
Also, the 'generic daemons' of the new Chaos Marine book and the back of the Daemonhunters book. They are examples of non-God specific daemons.

I don't think so.

The story on those pages depicts daemonettes and a Keeper of Secrets while the imagery is clearly of daemons of Khorne. Even so, I like your explanation better.

Warp Zero
02-09-2008, 08:57
Now that I feel better about not violating any steadfast daemonology lore, I've written up some basic lore surrounding this daemon. It plays a central role in my club's upcoming map campaign.

While I haven't gotten around to designing what this daemon looks like (or its stats), I have finished drawing the campaign poster which features the gate that it is trapped behind.

If you're curious, the poster can be seen here:


http://warp-zero.deviantart.com/art/Warhammer-40k-Campaign-Poster-96679048

It's basically an Imperium vs. Chaos campaign. The forces of Chaos are trying to free the daemon. I'm sure as the campaign goes on, I'll run into more gaps in my knowledge. Then I shall run back to the forums and ask more questions. :)

Lothlanathorian
02-09-2008, 19:30
I don't think so.

The story on those pages depicts daemonettes and a Keeper of Secrets while the imagery is clearly of daemons of Khorne. Even so, I like your explanation better.

If you are saying that the pictures they used of the models are of God-specific daemons then you are spot on. I was saying, and I think you understood, that the rules in the book are meant to be generic daemons not specific to any god. So, in being generic, they could be daemons of any of the Big 4, or they could be Undivided daemons.