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kingofthenerds
02-09-2008, 06:09
Well I have not played since 3rd edition, and decided to get back into it.

I really liked the old 2nd edition skeleton teams.

I bought a box of skeletons and have been painstakingly sculpting on helmets and shoulder pads.

I made them up like a dead human team.
2 as throwers, converted to throwing pose.
4 as catchers, converted to catching pose.
4 as blitzers, 2 visibly different to be wight or blitz-ra.
6 Lineman.

I don't care if I win to start, my question is what of the two teams should I pick.

The Khermi team is appealing for the Throw-ras. The standard undead team is appealing as the interest in all skeleton fades I have more options.
I'm starting with 16 skeletons. And lots of rerolls. If I'm Undead I'll have 2 wights. and 14 skeleton. If I'm Khermi I'll have 2 throw-ras and 2 blitz-ras, and 12 skeleton. Obviously Khermi is better to start, but having gouls or zombies allows for more options.

I'm joining a league, Want to start as all skeleton and then adding something fun down the road.

I may even start with 16 of the 30,000 skeletons :-b

Adding gouls, or having better skeletons?

Marlow
02-09-2008, 07:09
I really do not like Khermi, AG 2 Sure Hands does not make a good ball carrier. My Throw-Ra's keep getting killed which does not help either...

AG 3 on Wights will be very useful and you could also have a couple of large Skeletons as Mummy's, and then when you get tired of not being able to pick up the ball you can add the Ghouls!

kingofthenerds
02-09-2008, 07:25
Well I could start just like the champions of death from the fluff...

12 skeletons... And A whole lot of rerolls.

Marlow
02-09-2008, 08:31
12 skeletons... And A whole lot of rerolls.Take the Wights, Take the Wights!

2x Wights = 180k
12x Skeletons = 360k
5x Rerolls = 350
Total = 890k... That still leaves 110k for Cheerleaders, Fan Factor, etc

Even with 40k Skeletons as per the proposed LRB6 Changes
2x Wights = 180k
11x Skeletons = 440k
5x Rerolls = 350
Total = 970k

I can not see a team ever needing more than five Rerolls per half. You can only use one per turn and with Cheerleader/FF you can get more on the Kick Off table.

Cirrus the Blue
02-09-2008, 09:35
Like Marlow said, don't get too excited just yet about your skeletons only being 30,000 Gold anymore! They've since updated LRB5 to alter the skeletons to having Regeneration, Thick Skull for 40,000 Gold on all undead based teams.

All that aside, in a league setting, this could work out relatively well, although it'd take a LOT of games for your team to really get off the ground without the teams' other attributes. That being said, I'd go with the Khemri team as you can fit more players in without taking away from the 'skeleton' feel of the team. Or, proxy those figs with a different team altogether! Put in a beefy Mummy player posing as the Ogre and you've got yourself a pretty great line-up for a Human team. ;) (assuming that's allowed, of course) lol I wish you good luck with them!

- Cirrus

Leilond
02-09-2008, 09:46
There's only one problem with this roster
Your skeletons will be really slow to skill up, and will die not so rarely... thus I don't know if that rostar will never be able to remain or become competitive in a league

Marlow
02-09-2008, 10:28
There's only one problem with this roster
Your skeletons will be really slow to skill up, and will die not so rarely... thus I don't know if that rostar will never be able to remain or become competitive in a league

With Regen and St 3 they will die less than my Goblins and I have a dozen of them with two skills each! Just make sure you hire Igor as an inducement each game.

Leilond
02-09-2008, 12:14
With Regen and St 3 they will die less than my Goblins and I have a dozen of them with two skills each! Just make sure you hire Igor as an inducement each game.

Well... I play skaven, thus not a very casuality maker team, and I usually make at least 2-3 unsaved casuality when I play against much skeletons... I don't know how can a full skeleton roster resist a dwaf or melee oriented undead team

Marlow
02-09-2008, 13:28
Well... I play skaven, thus not a very casuality maker team, and I usually make at least 2-3 unsaved casuality when I play against much skeletons... I don't know how can a full skeleton roster resist a dwaf or melee oriented undead team
Casualties themselves are not the problem, it is just the Perm Injuries that are. Most of my team ends up in the D&I box with Goblins but few of those are lasting.

You need 51+ on the D68 to get a Permanent Injury/Death, which is 33%. Skeletons will Regen half the time, and with an Igor you have an extra chance to save that 1 in 6 that does not. Since there are no other players to hog the SPP's Skeletons will get skills and be less prone to injury.

kingofthenerds
02-09-2008, 15:36
I found the LRB6.

Khermi is getting switched to being actually all skeleton. With tomb guardians.

Makes sense seemed like 4 mummies was a bit much, I had no interest in even building more than 1 or 2.

With that in mind I could have 4 different skeletons if I stayed Khermi, however, from a modeling perspective its more interesting to do undead for adding Ghouls, Zombies, and Mummies when the skeleton thing fails for long enough.

Gaftra
02-09-2008, 16:07
the khemri change was really needed. the problem with all skellies is more like doing all thralls rather than all goblins who have some kind of starting ability thralls and skells just cant do anything and though skells will survive a touch more but with no apothecary if youre player with two skills buys it youre boned (zing!). whights are solid gold and i think the undead team is a blast to play.

the anti santa
02-09-2008, 19:47
I think the khemri team would be the best choice.

Sadly 10K for thick skull is not that great a deal, but you can still get a lot of players for your cash.

The blitz-ras obviously as blitzers with the thro-ras (both awful names and yet another reason why khemri are one of the worst teams) as throwers.

Then you could have 1 mummy/tomb guardian as a undead Ogre.

Any skeletons who roll +MA or doubles could be made catchers by taking catch/dodge.

Darkson
03-09-2008, 02:01
Like Marlow said, don't get too excited just yet about your skeletons only being 30,000 Gold anymore! They've since updated LRB5 to alter the skeletons to having Regeneration, Thick Skull for 40,000 Gold on all undead based teams.
Not quite correct - those are not official changes, they are experimental rules that may be made official for LRB6.

Leilond
03-09-2008, 09:15
Casualties themselves are not the problem, it is just the Perm Injuries that are. Most of my team ends up in the D&I box with Goblins but few of those are lasting.

You need 51+ on the D68 to get a Permanent Injury/Death, which is 33%. Skeletons will Regen half the time, and with an Igor you have an extra chance to save that 1 in 6 that does not. Since there are no other players to hog the SPP's Skeletons will get skills and be less prone to injury.

I didn't explained well my mind.
If my team, a skaven team, a not casuality oriented team, is capable of make 3 UNSAVED casuality each game it play against skeletons, a very melee oriented team (like dwarf, Orcs or Undead teams) can easly make 5-6 casuality per game... This can be a real problem for the skeleton team for two reason: if you take 5 casuality each game, one will be "a serious injury" (at least a niggling, AT LEAST) and you risk to play a lot of drives with less than 11 players in the pitch

Marlow
03-09-2008, 10:37
*Shrug* Perhaps you are just good with Skaven? I have had two of my Elves killed in the same turn, however statistically multiple lasting Injuries in one game are unlikely.

An all Skeleton team is most likely going to be the Underdog player and get Inducement. If they always take an Igor which is only used on skilled players who got a Permanent Injury they should be able to build up several proficient players. As with others teams linefodder can just be left to accumulate injuries until they die.

There are plenty of teams with mostly AV 7 Players in the game, such as your Skaven, and these teams are not loosing an average of one player per game so why would Skeletons? Personally, I loose more players from failed Dodge/GFI than from being hit.

kingofthenerds
04-09-2008, 06:41
I got to play a practice game, as Wood Elves verse my Friend who is still learning the rules who played my undead (using mummies, wights, zombies and ghouls).

The Game itself isn't that much different from 3rd, the changes seem more on the campaign system.

With that said getting smashed isn't going to be the problem I have with the all skeletons, its that It will be hard to move the ball, either picking it up or just getting to where it is.

If the ball is kicked to me and lands in the back field I imagine a wood elf can get to the ball and pick it up before my skeletons can. I also think I'll have even more trouble on defense.

With that said their really wasn't that many casualties, both sides were heavy 7 av, and that mummy smacking up my elves.

All that aside, I've still not decided what team to enter the league with. I'm almost 100% sure I'm starting with 16 skeletons. Mainly due to my cool models I've scupted up :-b But still unsure what team to be for changes down the road.

Edit: The Fantasy ghouls look really cool, and with some green stuff for a makeshift armor kit, the models could be worth losing the throw-ras ability to take passing skills, and starting with sure hands.

Leilond
04-09-2008, 11:31
I got to play a practice game, as Wood Elves verse my Friend who is still learning the rules who played my undead (using mummies, wights, zombies and ghouls).

The Game itself isn't that much different from 3rd, the changes seem more on the campaign system.

Huge change are made on the foul system. Now the fouler do not get the +1/+1 on the armor/injury roll, and cannot apply any of the "damaging" skills like mighty blow and so on. Dirty player add +1 to the Armor OR injury roll, instead of both... thus in 3rd edition a dirty player that fouled had +2 to armor AND injury roll, while now the same player has +1 to armor OR injury roll. This change totally the fouling on the pitch, because only with at least 3 foul assistance it worth the risk of the action
There are also other important changes, that make this game more tactical and less "injury all your opponent's players and you'll win"

Cirrus the Blue
05-09-2008, 04:33
There's also little (or big, whichever you prefer) tweaks here and there to the rest of the skills/mutations/traits list to make them worlds more balanced and hence - fair (Piling On only lets you re-roll armor or injury instead of adding 2D6 plus the guy's Strength to punch armor or effectively and efficiently kill a guy instantly, for example.), and also the Inducement system which I feel is nearly perfect already and vastly different, although still reminiscent of the old Special Play Cards way back in 3rd Edition. Also the new injury table makes things incredibly difficult to actually kill a guy anymore as opposed to only needing to roll boxcars, which is a good thing, too. :) There's more little tidbits throughout such as the kickoff table, etc., but most of them only make a massive difference in League play. The good part is that they didn't really change very much at all on 'how' to play overall though in the way the mechanics work of picking up, throwing, running, etc. and that makes it great for long time players who've taken a long break to practically jump back in and have a game with a quick skim of the new book.

- Cirrus

Gatsby
03-10-2008, 20:25
i was thinking this
10 skellies
2 mummys
2 ghouls
4 rerolls
4 fanfactor
1 assistant coach
1 cheerleader

kingofthenerds
02-11-2008, 04:25
Thought I would post an update.

I started the league with 15 skeletons and 7 rerolls. I ended up making it an undead team so I could add the occasional Zombie conversion, as well as add ghouls when the novelty of this team wore off.

I'm 4 games into it. First 2 were disasters couldn't pick up the ball or throw a block. 7 AV means its hard to keep 11 on the field for very long. I ended up slaughtering my oponent in game 3, it was vrs vampires, I won due to his bad luck, I think my opponent failed at least 7 blood lust rolls.
His bad luck was my fortune, game 4 was a win as well due to all the skills I picked up from game 3 including a 3AG skeleton to pick up the ball, and a Zombie for the line.

I think if I had this to do over I would have purchased
less rerolls 4-5 and only 12-13 skeleton and some FF, keeping my team raiting around 74 range and grabbing some cards or a vampire till I had more skills on the skeletons.

Right now I'm sitting with 280,000 in the bank, and only 1 spot free in the roster. 14 skeletons, 1 Zombie, 1 cheerleader, 1 Coach, 6 FF and 7 Rerolls.

I can't wait for 40k skeletons, Thick Skull would be EXTREAMELY valuable to my team... Keeping more bones on the field.

Marlow
04-11-2008, 11:41
Since you went with Undead have you though of adding the Wights since they can be quite skeletol in appearance? I do not find Thick Skull help that much. You may remain on the pitch but are stunned so they are out of play for at least a turn.

Even my Goblins only have five rerolls so I think seven may be overdoing it. You can always get rid of rerolls to bring the team value down. I would suggest two more Zombies for the line as the AV 8 will help.

kingofthenerds
05-11-2008, 20:31
The whole motivation for the team was a conversion Idea.

I simply love my models, but a good looking wight to match my theme has evaded me. I've made 3 different models at this point and none of them have satisfied me. But I'm still trying. Once I work out a model I'll add them no question.

For some reason my all skeleton team ends up with tons of them in the KO'd Box. One game I had 8 of my 15 players in KO'd.

I played 2 more games since my last update, I'm at 3 wins and 2 loses now.
I have 2 zombies right now, killing a Pro elf player. I'm not buying zombies rather taking them as I get them. Zombie fantasy models with helmets and blood bowl kit green stuffed on to them fit perfect into my team.

After thinking about it, I should have gone with 2 wights from the start instead of 2 of the rerolls.

spevna
09-11-2008, 08:17
Im going the way of the all skeleton team (khemri) and taking 2 Throw-ras, 2 Blitz-ras and then 12 skeles. Will let you know how it goes.