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Kurisu313
04-09-2008, 13:19
One of my friends new lootas is carrying a shuriken cannon, suitably orkified, and it got me thinking.

Eldar weaponry requires a psychic command from it's firer to fire. Orks possess a gestalt psychic field of 'Can we do it? Yes we can!", so do you think it's possible for an ork to fire an eldar gun?

I suppose he couldn't reload it though. Maybe he could alter it's ammo capabilities, but that seems unlikely.

elvinltl
04-09-2008, 13:45
Possible to fire... Just pull the trigger. Let's just hope the Greenskin is holding the gun the right way. :D

Hellebore
04-09-2008, 14:10
Part of the original background for eldar weaponry is that they don't have triggers, instead requiring a psychic command.

Since then the miniatures have started to INFER a trigger, although the background hasn't said anything about it.

I don't know if an ork's psychic field would be focused enough to fire them,

Hellebore

Radium
04-09-2008, 14:12
Possible to fire... Just pull the trigger. Let's just hope the Greenskin is holding the gun the right way. :D

Let's hope he doesn't!

Anyway, an Ork would be able to fire Eldar weapons, and as you said, reloading would most likely be a problem.

pinegulf
04-09-2008, 14:16
Who cares? Just uze it a klub. WaAaAgghhh!

Bregalad
04-09-2008, 15:44
Part of the original background for eldar weaponry is that they don't have triggers, instead requiring a psychic command.
Part of the original Ork background is that they can make stuff work even when physical laws say that it shouldn't work. So they probably CAN use Eldar weaponry.

ChaosTicket
04-09-2008, 17:53
Orks can't fire eldar weapons because a few reasons. One is that many eldar weapons are keyed to the Aspect Warriors' brain signals within their helmet. Another is that Eldar weapons are designed for the nimble eldar, orks would just break eldar weapons, and orks cannot repair the psycho plastic eldar technology like teh can human and ork-tek.

boogaloo
04-09-2008, 18:05
i figure they could make 'em work, i fiugre if it's they're special thing that they can make stuff work just cuz, they should be able to make wraithbone (a highly responsive psycho plastic) do SOMETHING even if it's not the way the eldar designed it to work.

PondaNagura
04-09-2008, 18:18
in game sure why not. in fluff, why would they, panzee gunz don't hav enuff dakka!

Burnthem
04-09-2008, 18:28
I expect some would and some wouldn't, all depending on that particular Orks latent powers and the situation it was in. If an Ork was sat in his hut and tried to get it to work i doubt it would, yet if the Ork was in a life-or-death situation and just grabbed the nearest gun out of desperation, i expect it would work due to the Orks mental state.

Maybe.

Kurisu313
04-09-2008, 18:48
in game sure why not. in fluff, why would they, panzee gunz don't hav enuff dakka!

I'll admit that they lack 'oomph', that loud noise that orks love, but I think a scatter laser has plenty of dakka.

To burnthem, that's not really how the ork's gestalt field works. It's not the law of anime, where the hero can only launch his ultimate attack under great pressure. Also, orks don't get desperate, they enjoy it too much :P

Rather, the more orks congregate, the more powerful the field is. It's not a matter of figuring the gun out, it's a matter of 'is the orky psychic field able to trigger the gun?' The greater the ork's belief that he can fire it, and the number of orks nearby are the deciding factors, IMO.

Burnthem
04-09-2008, 18:52
The greater the ork's belief that he can fire it, and the number of orks nearby are the deciding factors, IMO.

Yeah, thats kinda what i meant :D

Commisar Dave
04-09-2008, 18:54
It could if you buy into that "We think it should works so it does" stuff, I however like to think an Ork would just hit them "pointy 'eaded eldar"
about the head with it/throw it at them or fire it from a Kannon :D

Kurisu313
04-09-2008, 19:05
So the general consensus is 'maybe, but why would you when you could just beat the pointy-eared gits around the 'ead with it?'

Darkhorse
04-09-2008, 20:54
Mainly because it's a flimsy piece of plastic rather than a solid lump of metal.
Orks dislike laser weaponry because of the lack of mind numbing noise, as for

Part of the original Ork background is that they can make stuff work even when physical laws say that it shouldn't work. So they probably CAN use Eldar weaponry.
No, that's part of the 3rd Edition excuse for Ork background, The Original background is WAAARGH ORKS which makes no mention of that concept and they most definatly did have access to Eldar weaponry and other equipment at that time.

Adra
04-09-2008, 22:31
As any Ork will tell you: "The Eldar guns, good sir, are just not loud enough. Now let us give the chaps over there a jolly good seeing to."

Eetion
04-09-2008, 23:07
Unless its a Blood Axe....
When it becomes "ded quietz its reight gud.... see dey dont know im dere untils i dropz one and even a cuplez more before I runz in and it em wi ma choppa.... all sneaky loike

Dribble Joy
05-09-2008, 00:01
No, that's part of the 3rd Edition excuse for Ork background,

True, but it is now 'accepted' Ork fluff. And personally I don't overly mind.

The problem being that the single line 'many captured examples of ork technology do not function unless being used by an ork', is inferred by many people that ALL ork tech is physically unsound, which is untrue. Many does not mean most or all. 1000 out of a trillion is 1000, but it's by no means a majority.

As to the thread subject, I am inclined to say no. While orks have an unconscious psychic ability, Eldar tech is attuned the the psychic patter of the wielder. The weapon in question would not function and would likely blow up or at least give the ork a nasty shock.

Alessander
05-09-2008, 02:33
I remember one of the older loota models had a shuriken weapon welded into the mass of weapons that made the gun.

Orks are able to make impossible things happen. Just like they believe that a coat of red paint makes things go faster, a determined ork will make an eldar weapon shoot. It may end up shooting something completely different that it should, but that's orkyness for you!

The Inquisitor rulebook allows Inquisitors (and anyone, in fact) to use eldar weaponry. The psychic impulse fluff on eldar weapons is a thing of the past, just like shuriken weapons have a miniature black hole in the tip.

MrBigMr
05-09-2008, 03:26
Doesn't inquisitor have an inquisitor special character who has a shuriken pistol? And I don't remember it saying anywhere that non-Eldar can't use such weapons. What I can remember from talking to an Eldar player I know, the weapons have options for both mental and physical firing options. The mental trigger would be the preferred, working by a line drawn from the gun into the suit and its systems. It would allow super fast firing without the added motion of actually pulling the trigger. But some weapons don't have this connection line, or it might be damaged in battle and that is when one would use the physical trigger.

Or at least that's what I've come up with. Guess now someone will explain to me how it ain't so. Doesn't matter, my Chaos vets are still gonna field their shuriken pistols, scorpion claws and fusion guns.

Faustburg
05-09-2008, 07:39
Agreeing that it would be reasonable that they would have different versions of the guns, both with psychic links and physical triggers, and the latter would be the ones that occasionally end up with other races.

In the Orks case, it will probably work out until he gets embarrassed in front of his mates by the whimpy sound it makes, and goes to the Mek to have it fixed. The Mek says "Allright, let's open it up and see what we can do. Probably needs more nails...", and goes to get his bestest chain saw. After that, the Shuriken cannon is a big club.


I don't know who started the "Orks make happen anything they believe in" movement, but the books have nothing like that, no matter what edition you look at.

All it says, and ever have in varying terms, is merely that a lot of the time captured Ork weapons, vehicles or other artefacts can't be made to work by human scientists, and they are theorizing (read: it's true) that it has something to do with the greenskins latent psychic field.

Ravensgard
05-09-2008, 14:01
I agree with Burnthem, when an ork is in battle he would even make the most complicated weapons work, just look at that shokk attack gun.

But i don't think an eldar weapon would be an ork's first choice of weapon because it's indeed not so "dakka". Only in dire circumstances and he lost both his choppa and shoota.

Poseidal
05-09-2008, 14:11
But i don't think an eldar weapon would be an ork's first choice of weapon because it's indeed not so "dakka". Only in dire circumstances and he lost both his choppa and shoota.
Eldar use dakka that's choppy.

Iracundus
05-09-2008, 14:58
All it says, and ever have in varying terms, is merely that a lot of the time captured Ork weapons, vehicles or other artefacts can't be made to work by human scientists, and they are theorizing (read: it's true) that it has something to do with the greenskins latent psychic field.

Nowhere in the 3rd ed. background does it say Ork technology works purely because of psychics. The background just states some humans believe that Ork technology relies on psychics. There can be a very big difference between what human tech-priests believe and what is really true, and it seems many posters in this thread have made the mistake of confusing those two things as being synonymous.

As an example of the fallibility of tech-priests and their theories: Necron gauss weapons. In the Necron Codex, the tech-priest flatly states that the previous tech-priest had proven gauss weapons to be impossible to implement, yet the very existence of Necrons with working gauss weaponry shows the Adeptus Mechanicus to be grossly wrong.

Gorbad Ironclaw
05-09-2008, 15:15
No, that's part of the 3rd Edition excuse for Ork background, The Original background is WAAARGH ORKS which makes no mention of that concept and they most definatly did have access to Eldar weaponry and other equipment at that time.

That's what I thought as well, and to be honest, I always thought that 'invention' was stupid. It just seems silly to me and doesn't really make much sense. It also takes away some of the mystery of the Orks, rather than enhancing it I feel.

Clockwork-Knight
05-09-2008, 15:24
Keep in mind what Iracudus wrote. The tech-priests are not infallible. In fact, they don't understand most of xeno-technology either because they're not allowed to study it at all (the puritan faction, biggest of all), or because they never bothered with it before (because ork technology for example was always considered to be more primitive than imperial ones - until they found out that orks can actually build powerful tractor beams, have far more reliable teleporters, forcefields, and understand the warp better than any magos on Mars could).

Boss Kopstud
05-09-2008, 17:09
As far as the "psychic trigger/physical trigger" thing goes for the Shuriken Catapult, GW made SM Scout models in the RT/2E era that were armed with them, and they were on the "what random weapons do my models have" tables in the RT books. That implies that at least SOME Shuriken Cats had physical triggers, at least back in those days... But as far as the Ork Loota question, who's to say some crazy Mekboy didn't pick one up, run a drill bit down the "bore" to enlarge it and convert the weapon casing to fire Ork ammo??? Just as likely an explaination as the Ork Loota shooting a Shuriken Cat.

Clockwork-Knight
05-09-2008, 22:39
The idea of shuriken catapult doesn't have to be restricted to Eldar only. After all, the shuriken catapult just fires slices of metal, cut from a block of metal put into the weapon by applying strange force fields in it. Quite high-tech, but nothing psykery-like so far. Only the trigger mechanism is restricted to eldar psyonics and DNA, and that's on an Eldar Shuriken Catapult. Human and orkish "shuriken catapults" could function in a similar way (perhaps not slicing metal with advanced force fields, but simply having some thousand ammo put into it, and without any psychic trigger mechanism). A metal slice throwing device shouldn't be infaisible for both humans and orks. Perhaps it only has 1000 shots, whereas eldar versions can have up to 3000, but that doesn't matter then for game rules.

On the other hand, I could see orkish versions of shuriken catapult being steam-powered, to make more 'dakka'-ish sounds. :p

Messiah
05-09-2008, 23:23
As far as the "psychic trigger/physical trigger" thing goes for the Shuriken Catapult, GW made SM Scout models in the RT/2E era that were armed with them, and they were on the "what random weapons do my models have" tables in the RT books. That implies that at least SOME Shuriken Cats had physical triggers, at least back in those days... But as far as the Ork Loota question, who's to say some crazy Mekboy didn't pick one up, run a drill bit down the "bore" to enlarge it and convert the weapon casing to fire Ork ammo??? Just as likely an explaination as the Ork Loota shooting a Shuriken Cat.

I remember those scouts, but AFAIK, they were released before the fluff about psychic weaponry.

Hellebore
06-09-2008, 00:53
The shuriken catapult used by the imperium wasn't grown from psychoplastics either. It was a human equivalent of an eldar weapon.

It's not the TYPE of weapon that determines the firing mechanism, it's the mode of manufacture and the people who make it that determines that.

Hellebore

Dictator
06-09-2008, 02:40
I have read many a balck library tale where gangers trade with eldar pirates to get better guns to fight the under ground wars. AKA shuriken catapults

Edit: I know the black library is not canon, but still, it is not an un-fluffy concept.

Faustburg
06-09-2008, 09:32
Nowhere in the 3rd ed. background does it say Ork technology works purely because of psychics. The background just states some humans believe that Ork technology relies on psychics. .

I did not say that, don't ever put words in peoples mouths.

Of course the vast majority of Ork Tech follows conventional physics, what I was pointing at was the misunderstanding of the "psychic factor" as being an ork super wish-come-true power...

Iracundus
06-09-2008, 11:28
I did not say that, don't ever put words in peoples mouths.

Of course the vast majority of Ork Tech follows conventional physics, what I was pointing at was the misunderstanding of the "psychic factor" as being an ork super wish-come-true power...

You did say it in your previous statement:


...they are theorizing (read: it's true) that it has something to do with the greenskins latent psychic field.

That statement right there makes the mistake of equating humans theorizing something to it being actually true.

DantesInferno
06-09-2008, 12:18
That statement right there makes the mistake of equating humans theorizing something to it being actually true.

To be fair, it's an hypothesis which makes a good deal of sense when you add in what we know about the War in Heaven. Assuming that the Orks are the descendants of the Krork (as the Deceiver at least seems to think), they're one of the second-generation Old One warrior species created to fight the C'tan/Necrons. The first generation of the warrior client species that the Old Ones created were designed to battle on their behalf by channelling power from the Warp against the C'tan and their Necron servants (it's thought that the Eldar were created by the Old Ones at this stage). Two things happened as a result: firstly, the immense turmoil caused in the Warp by the massive increase in emotions of warp-capable creatures led to the Warp becoming more dangerous; and secondly, the C'tan began their Great Work to seal off the Warp from realspace. As a result, the first generation species began to be slaughtered by the resurgent C'tan.

So the Old Ones made a second generation of fighter species, which allegedly included the Krork. Clearly, this second-generation of species would need to be more subtle than the first generation, which apparently relied on utilising the destructive powers of the warp. We know one of the second-generation races were the Jokaero, which the Necron Codex describes as "technology-mimicking". It's not out of the realms of possibility that the Krork were designed as a warrior-race to bridge the gap between the Eldar and the Jokaero. The former use the power of the warp as a weapon; the latter mimic the technology of their foes. A middle ground could be to use small amounts of warp power to enhance weaponry technology.

Tokamak
06-09-2008, 12:36
Yes, anything works in the hands of an ork, how did you think they'd fire their own guns patched up with screws and bandage? As long as an ork thinks it works, it works.

Iracundus
06-09-2008, 14:47
Yes, anything works in the hands of an ork, how did you think they'd fire their own guns patched up with screws and bandage?

Their guns and technology works because they have inbuilt knowledge on how to construct robust pieces of technology, including force field applications that is beyond what the Imperium is capable of. Just because the Imperium cannot figure it out does not mean it cannot operate on sound engineering principles. The fact Ork hunters from Armageddon can and did use Ork weaponry shows their guns are not reliant on psychics alone to work, since humans are not all latent psykers the way Orks are.

What Orks are not good at is getting things to work outside of what they consider "proper" technology, hence why they do not favor lasers or anti-grav technology in general, and why they end up breaking or failing to maintain certain things like targeters or vehicle suspension systems.

Faustburg
06-09-2008, 16:30
In a fictional universe, what would the purpose of creating a fictional theory that is false?

Any sensible person will realize it is "true", as fictional universes go, otherwise there would be no point.

(the most recent re-print of hte theory is in the Ork codex, p.10 btw, it's nothing that has fallen out)

But what I didn't say was that all Ork technology work on that principle (the need for psychics so to speak), which was what you claimed I did, and what ****** believe when they say "orks can do whatever they believe they can do".

Idaan
06-09-2008, 17:23
That's because of the nature of the 40k universe where everything and nothing is canon at the same time. There is no one single truth which you must follow and identify with. Because there are so many playable, opposed factions from which you can pick, it's useful for the writers to depict everything is from a non-objective point of view, thus not taking away other races coolness or uber-factor. Just compare Imperial Fists and Iron Warriors accounts on the Iron Cage accident or Orks and Black Templars versions of the 3rd Armageddon War. Not to mention entire backgroundbooks made definately of lies and propaganda (Munitorum Manual, Uplifting Primer). That's what makes 40k so beautiful.

Or at least that's the theory. Recently there's too much Eldar/Guard whipping and Marine-worship for my liking.

MrBigMr
06-09-2008, 18:02
Wonder if Orks would prefer laser weapons if they were like the Banshee in the Freespace games, emiting a blast at 180db when fired in atmosphere? If they did, Noise Marines wouldn't be far behind.

As for the dual trigger mechanism, we have to remember that the catapult is the AK47 of the Eldar, used by their militia, the Guardians. They're conscripted people, labourer, artistans, etc. who have been raised in defence of their world. They don't have much in the way of military experience nor training, so I think that supplying them with weapons that are sure to work even if their user hasn't bonded with it day and night (aka. a physical trigger) seems more than likely, don't you think? I mean, just because it's a mental link doesn't mean it's somehow easier to master than a physical one. Eldar mind isn't that focused to begin with. Why do you think they have all that discipline and such to make them focused. You gice some young upstart who thinks he knows everything a gun and he's probably shot you before literally the thought even crossed his mind. Same might go for pistols as well.

But that doesn't mean they can't be hooked to some psychic link or have versions with a psychic link, but nothing really make a gun more reliable (lets say the link is damaged) than a button on the gun which when pressed makes the gun shoot.


As far as the "psychic trigger/physical trigger" thing goes for the Shuriken Catapult, GW made SM Scout models in the RT/2E era that were armed with them, and they were on the "what random weapons do my models have" tables in the RT books.
I also spotted in the old collector models/bitz section that the old Nurgle palanquin could have a rider (looked like a plague Marine) armed with a shuriken catapult.


I have read many a balck library tale where gangers trade with eldar pirates to get better guns to fight the under ground wars. AKA shuriken catapults

Edit: I know the black library is not canon, but still, it is not an un-fluffy concept.
For one, anything with the 40K badge is official and second, there is no real canon. Reading Necromunda and Inquisitor rulebooks, on top of some BL novels makes it quite clear that such event would be more than possible, hell, maybe even not that uncommon. Why should Eldar pirates more care about selling guns to humans as a human pirate would be about selling nukes to Orks?

Tau codex does talk about Tau trading with bordering Imperial colonies and even the Spyrer suits in Necromunda are rumoured to be of Tau origin. I believe their names are in Tau.

ChaosTicket
06-09-2008, 18:26
Eldar have I think 4 different bones in their fingers, and their fingers are very long, a big meaty ork sausage woldn't even be able to pull the trigger, and orks natural brutal psychic field would break the wraitbone even faster then their meaty fingers.

You can convert things in game but oh, you Chaos Vets wouldn't be able to get their armored fingers to operate the weapons ment for the frail eldar, and they probably wouldn't even be able to reload.

I would say only beings with similar proportions to the Eldar would be able to use eldar weapons, so no Orks or Astartes using them, and then the weapons would be limited in their effetiveness as you woudn't be able to gte more ammunition except by getting another weapon.

madd0ct0r
06-09-2008, 23:43
Shruiken catapult + Mekboy.
roll a d6

1. Mekboy replaces the cyrstal stack with a pile of stickbombs to make it into a grenade thower. On first use the gun explodes, singeing the ork and propelling the barrel through da beakie's head.

2. With sufficient spikes and a wrap of steel sheeting, the catapult becomes an efficent club. Every now and then the tip explodes in a cloud of shruikens. The club becomes known as 'Da Haircutta.'

3. Despite using his best tools, the Mekboy fails to find the trigger. The gun has a new firing mechanism added and a funnel at the front to aid loading the buckshot.

4. The Mekboy decides it's a good bit of choppy dakka and straps it into his shoota. By overcharging the power pack he spends a happy hour or so trying to slice his own bullets in midair before running out of ammo.

5. On discovering that the wraithbone is slightly flammable, the mekboy straps the shruiken onto his favourite welding torch. Now da Beakies get hit by a cloud of burning choppy bits that stick in them.

6. The Mekboy is impressed by the idea but is disappointed in the choppiness of the shruikens. His new, steam pressured version fires slabs of metal the size of dinner plates. The weapon becomes known as 'da Domestic.'

MrBigMr
07-09-2008, 02:31
orks natural brutal psychic field would break the wraitbone even faster then their meaty fingers.
Isn't Wraithbone suppose be stronger than adamantium?


You can convert things in game but oh, you Chaos Vets wouldn't be able to get their armored fingers to operate the weapons ment for the frail eldar, and they probably wouldn't even be able to reload.
She (http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=99111399055&orignav=300808) doesn't seem to have any problems sticking her fat fingers into the trigger guard. Neither does he (http://www.solegends.com/citcat912/c20260rcnpalanquin-h.htm), the third one of the riders, armed with a shuriken catapult. Besides, my vets (nor my other troops) are not Marines in fluff, so that brings their fat finger size down a peg. Even the Eldar have armoured gloves, so naturally they've made the trigger guards a little bigger than what would be expected to fit their skinny little fingers.


I would say only beings with similar proportions to the Eldar would be able to use eldar weapons, so no Orks or Astartes using them, and then the weapons would be limited in their effetiveness as you woudn't be able to gte more ammunition except by getting another weapon.
How is ammo a problem? They come in magazines, don't they (http://www.thewarstore.com/product26850.html)? Just loot the bodies for spares. Seeing how my force is mainly dedicated to eradicating the Eldar, getting their hands on some of their stuff shouldn't be that hard. The vets submerge themselves in Eldar culture in order to think like them and through it be more effective in fighting them.

Iracundus
07-09-2008, 02:44
In a fictional universe, what would the purpose of creating a fictional theory that is false?

Any sensible person will realize it is "true", as fictional universes go, otherwise there would be no point.


The purpose is in showing how superstition, dogma, and close mindedness are rife in the 40K universe and how they hamper the Adeptus Mechanicus from understanding xenos technology. The 40K universe is full of propaganda, lies, and outright refusal to believe for the sake of being dogmatic.

I already gave a prime example: The Necron Codex wherein a Tech-Priest cites a previous Tech-Priest who "proved" the theory of gauss weaponry to be impossible. The fact the Necrons are walking around with all sorts of gauss weaponry shows just how wrong the Tech-Priests are. Having a theory in a Codex doesn't make it true in any way whatsoever.

Other examples include the idea of "geno-fixed" Tyranid species which turned out to be an erroneous theory as well, and the original flawed classification of Tyranid spaceships in Battlefleet Gothic. The sensible person would read any subjective in-universe theory or statement with some skepticism.

djinn8
07-09-2008, 03:37
I however like to think an Ork would just hit them "pointy 'eaded eldar"
about the head with it/throw it at them or fire it from a Kannon :D

Firing guns out of guns :D Dat some propa dakka derr!

Tymell
07-09-2008, 09:39
I'd imagine Orks probably could, due to their psychic aura. Maybe in the heat of a battle, if nothing else is available, an Ork might pick up an Eldar gun and let rip. But most of the time, I'd imagine they wouldn't. As has been mentioned, reloading would be very difficult for some guns (though I thought shuriken ones had magazines as normal?).

Also, they probably wouldn't function properly outside of battle given the psychic effort needed and the focusing on the enemy. And finally, I doubt many Orks would want them: not enough dakka, they're pansy little things that'd probably get an Ork laughed out of the camp. After all, to Orks guns are just as much about the look as the actually killing.

Ork meks making their own versions of Eldar weapons, now that I could see :D

Burnthem
07-09-2008, 10:15
Having a theory in a Codex doesn't make it true in any way whatsoever.

True, many people seem to forget that Codexes (Codii?) are often written from different points of view, often with individual peices written within the codex from different points of view.

So just because a Codex says 'this is that' in no way means that this is the case, it just means that whichever character was meant to write that peice of fluff held that particular view. If more people realised this it would clear up alot of arguments. umm, i mean 'discussions' ;)

Pundabaya
07-09-2008, 14:04
I'm pretty sure that in 2e, the description for the shuriken catapult stated that it worked 'like Imperial examples of the type' but the technology behind it was a bit more sophisticated.

Implying that the Imperium can and does make its own shuriken catapults.

MrBigMr
07-09-2008, 15:05
Who knows. Doesn't the fluff say that Eldar laser weapons are "just" more sophisticated than Imperial ones, but in function they're the same? Doesn't the catapult use gravitonic fields instead of magnetic to propel the disks? That might be one thing different with the two designs, since I don't think Imperium has as advanced grav-tech.

testosteronicon
07-09-2008, 20:22
I already gave a prime example: The Necron Codex wherein a Tech-Priest cites a previous Tech-Priest who "proved" the theory of gauss weaponry to be impossible. The fact the Necrons are walking around with all sorts of gauss weaponry shows just how wrong the Tech-Priests are.

Thought i'll just mention a fascinating problem for leading physicists (techpriests) in our own real world (sorry for the sidestep though):

a MRI machine (magnetic resonance imaging) is a highly advanced (damn expensive) piece of equipment used in search for abnormalities in human bodies => particularily the fleshy parts which don't show up that well on CT scans or X-ray photos.

The fun part is that half of the technology can be explained by the "classical theory" and the second half by quantum mechanics. As any physicist would know => those two theories are difficult to incorporate within one cohesive model....

Basically we don't fully understand how a MRI machine funtions. Yet it performs wonderfully. (and makes a lot of noise too!!!!:D

Iracundus
08-09-2008, 02:07
I don't see where general relativity comes in at all with regards to MRI. MRI just relies on aligning the dipole moment of hydrogen atoms through use of a magnetic field. Granted there are some finer details and sometimes the use of image enhancing contrast mediums like gadolinium but we do understand how MRI's work. Are you getting MRI confused with PET? Those are the ones that utilize anti-matter in the form of positrons.

Neknoh
08-09-2008, 10:37
On the topic of "orks can do what they want"

we are forgetting that orcs wind down their windows in space fights in order to shout insults and the likes at their enemies as well as stretching far out and shooting. Think it's in the BFG books.


An orc would either refitt it, basically, take it to tha mech, mech opens it "Oi, dis fing aint got no propa dakka!" ¤inserts good old trigger, drumm loader, firing mechanism etc¤ "Now, dis be dakka! It might be pink, but it's got proppa dakka!"

testosteronicon
08-09-2008, 15:21
I don't see where general relativity comes in at all with regards to MRI.

I'm not a physicist myself, but I had one (also warhammer-player, damn his SM army) on msn messenger when I wrote this and I asked him again today. It's Classic theory and quantum mechanics that doesn't work, and according to him half of the MRI can be explained by one the rest by the other.

Sorry for the confusion.

he did recommend me this book:

http://www.poirrier.be/~jean-etienne/presentations/irmcrc/diapositive47.png

he he

olmsted
08-09-2008, 16:50
i believe that the theory of ork gestalt pyschic field is proven simply by "Da red ones goez tha fastest!" they believe it happens it happens and this is supported in the rule book as red truccks and what not can move faster.

Iracundus
08-09-2008, 18:11
we are forgetting that orcs wind down their windows in space fights in order to shout insults and the likes at their enemies as well as stretching far out and shooting. Think it's in the BFG books.

Cite and quote it because it certainly isn't in any of my BFG rulebooks or BL BFG books. In all BFG background that I know of (and I have most of them), the Orks have ramshackle but functioning spacecraft. Where their ships are not airtight through structural integrity alone, their mastery of force field technology keeps a breathable atmosphere inside.