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Yves
04-09-2008, 14:07
A couple of questions:

I always play the same demonlist (spend lots of time paiting and basing etc)
and most of the time i play vs friends. They know my list and they try to make the best anti list possible.

Bloodthirster; immortal fury, armour of khorne, spellbreaker
Herald of Nurgle; lvl1, palanquin, slime trail, noxious vapors, BSB sundering
Herald of Khorne; armour of Khorne, juggernaut
13 plaguebearers; champ, banner of seeping decay
10 bloodletters; cham
10 horrors
5 flesh hounds
5 flesh hounds
5 flamers; pyrocaster

1) Anyway most of the time i get a pimped out dragon accross my BT, so meaning if i start i get charged and if i dont he justs moves it 3inch so i cant move my BT without getting charged.

f.e. a wood elf dragon+noble with annoyance of netlings so i only hit on 6s, even with reroll its hard to hit and even then he still has a 2+ wardsafe from a gem.
or i start hitting the dragon with 6 wounds, T6 etc.

Last time i ignored the dragon but he flankcharged my PB over my lureunit, challenging my Herald of Nurgle, and eventually with a unit of dancers and dryads in front my PB block+BSB crashed and burned.


2) Flamers follow normal rules about marching and shooting right ?
3) When you put heroes who has to go first etc?

thx

superduperkoopatrooper
04-09-2008, 16:29
Hi, your first point doesn't seem to be a question although you did say you only had a couple so many it's not meant to be ;)

2) Yes, flamers like everything else in warhammer have to march to move at double pace and can be march blocked. For shooting they can't do so if they march and they suffer -1 to hit for moving and/or long range etc. They don't have the multiple shots modifier however.

3) I assume you mean when you're deploying at the start of the game? A lot of people make this mistake, you deploy your characters at the same time after you've deployed everything else. You don't however wait until your opponent has got to his characters before deploying yours. The rulebook is a bit confusing on this. The 'at the same time' refers to deploying your characters as a whole rather than as 3 or 4 or whatever separate deployments.

Hope that makes sense.

Lord Dan
04-09-2008, 16:45
Koopa nailed it.

And I'm suprised you wouldn't take the charge from his Wood Elf highborn. Your thirster should smash the dragon into the ground, and I can't think of much the highborn could have had that would seriously threaten your thirster.

John Vaughan
05-09-2008, 04:26
I agree with Dan. Eat the Noble. Eat his head clean off.

As soon as you do that, the nettings go away, and all is well with the world.

Yves
06-09-2008, 17:55
Yes but he has 6attacks from the dragon and around 4-5 from the noble, thats 10-11 attacks against my BT, and a 3+as that get reduced by the str5-6attacks and a 5+ wardsave isn't invinsible.

If i attack the noble i hit on 6s with rerolls i did like 2, maximum 3 attacks to the noble, who could then as on a 6 and wardsave on a 2+
+ i get outnumbered so i gotta take demontest
So should i attack the dragon than to avoid the netlings?


thx about the deployment, i misread the manual then.

Jack of Blades
06-09-2008, 18:02
There's no 2+ ward save in the game except for special characters (although I can't remember whether even a special character has a 2+). The gem you're up against is a 3+ ward save and breaks the first time you fail its ward save. Trying to make the best anti-list possible, especially in a friendly game, doesn't seem very sportmanslike which leads me to believe that your Elven friend is very likely cheating with that 2+ ward save as well. I'd try to send in a unit of Furies to break that gem and then engage with the BT if you're feeling unlucky, but if not, just send in the BT straight ahead and take advantage of your new knowledge that it isn't a 2+ and breaks the first time it fails.

John Vaughan
09-09-2008, 23:00
When you attack the dragon, you are unhindered in your attack. You have 5(ish, whatever) attacks that all hit on 3+, and then would on a 3+ against the dragon. That means 2-3 wounds on the dragon at -4(ish, whatever). Oh, what? It doesnt get a save against that? Well, thats a 3+ combat res for you this turn.

Another idea: Try to run both the BT and the Herald of Khorne to attack it at the same time. He has to pick a target, so you can try to break the gem, and you could try to KB the noble with the herald. In my experience, dragons are brought down in 1 of 2 ways: Magic, or overload. If you can overload his dragon with models to fight, then he cannot win, simply because his character is an elf.

Alltaken
10-09-2008, 00:35
There's no 2+ ward save in the game except for special characters (although I can't remember whether even a special character has a 2+).

I believe lord kroak has that, untill febrary I guess when the new codex should be released

El Haroldo
10-09-2008, 01:19
Trying to make the best anti-list possible, especially in a friendly game, doesn't seem very sportmanslike.

It's a pretty balanced (and brutal) daemon list that can cause hurt with magic, shooting and combat, with a mix of fast and slow movers. If that list was brought all the time to my group, you'd have the option of enjoying the challenge of people 'tailoring' their list to be effective against it, or you could complain about it, we'd 'forget' to let you know about the next session.

On a side note, the DE amulet of Khaneath gives you a 5/6 chance of a ward, provided you're hit with strength 5 or above. Effectively a 2+

sulla
10-09-2008, 06:07
You might also want to change your BSB to the standard of chaos glory (if you can possibly spare the points) if you imagine your BT will be losing combat. Ld9 stubborn with a reroll should mean your BT will have to be killed in combat. A poor instability test will no longer be a factor.

Valaraukar
10-09-2008, 07:48
If I were you would give the BT obsidian armour + immortal fury + firestorm blade. Ignore the elf as even with a sick magic weapon it will now count as a normal one so can do sod all to your BT with at max S5 from a great weapon (as mounted only +1S). You will be S7 with re-rolls to hit on 7 attacks. Ought to take the dragon out in about 2 rounds of combat.

Rest of your army looks fairly sound assuming you use it right. Do you put the herald of khorne in the bloodletters out of interest? He can charge out further than them if necessary and if not gives them hatred making them much more effective.

Chicago Slim
10-09-2008, 11:10
Another idea: Try to run both the BT and the Herald of Khorne to attack it at the same time. He has to pick a target, so you can try to break the gem, and you could try to KB the noble with the herald.


No percentage in that: the Highborn (wood elf lord) is going to issue a challenge, which the deamons won't be able to refuse (since there's no "non-fighting rank" into which either of them could be moved). So, one of them will sit there doing nothing, while the other fights it out.

Now, you COULD put the Herald into your Bloodletters, so that you could refuse the challenge-- but that trick would work just as well without the herald, and it takes a bit of (ahem) rules interpretation to argue that he can't choose to make the BT not fight (situation: you charge front with Bloodletters with a champion, flank with Bloodthirster; he issues a challenge, you refuse. He nominates the Bloodthirster to move to back ranks, you argue that it doesn't have back ranks to move to, because it's on the flank and so should not be moved to the back ranks of the unit to his front. You might convince someone to follow you down that bit of severely questionable bit of rules interpretation, but if you pulled it on, say, ME, you'd only succeed in convincing me that you were a complete jerk...)

Anyway, the Bloodletters would never get off the charge...


Nope-- it's just a matter of killing that Noble, in the face. May I recommend that you consider changing Daemonic Gifts-- something in a S10, perhaps, will wipe that dragon off the map in short order. The noble himself has limited weapons loadouts-- he pretty much caps at S5 and A4, or S4 with A5-- so once you've rolled his Dragon, he's really not going to be a problem.

John Vaughan
10-09-2008, 23:11
I agree. The noble will be annoying to fight at best when hes on his own.