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Octavius_Maximus
21-09-2008, 12:42
Hey there!

Ive been working on a little Guard Codex here and i would like to you all to take a look and tell me what you think!

and yes, it is a work in progress, you will see that many units are missing and some things just halfway finished. Too see a list of the units i will be including check the summary at the end.

Now, the idea i have for the codex is simple:

The Guard is seperated in many ways.

You have the Officer Cadre, all with different methods of leading, fighting and winning.

You have the guardsmen, with different regimental variances depending on homeworld, previous history, etc.

To work, the Imperial Guard needs Officers to use their highly drilled commands in the right situations to work together with their troops fighting style.

To put this in rules terms, i have made all Infantry able to take Doctrines, most of the old favorites are there, and with less restriction too! Any unit which wants to take them, can take 2 per unit (this means you can have specialists in your army if you wish).

Officers can use these, and they also have a number of other Officer Doctrines. Little things which make them a vital part of the army and make the army work better in different situations. The standard officer Ld rule is one of these rules, and so you can have Officers running around NOT providing Ld, but ruthlessly allowing squads to shoot into combat, waiting till the last moment to force a devastating fusilade, or even telling units to provide covering or strafing firepower.

In addition to this, Treadheads will find that there is a Tank Commander HQ which have TANK doctrines, meaning that you can use them to Crush and grind, warning nearby tanks to brace for Impact, or making a group of nearby tanks rush into the enemy, guns blazing to break their line.

Now, here is a quick unit by unit review:

HQ Command Squad

Not much of a change here, there are only Heroic Senior Officers, and they have veterans as bodyguards. They have access to 3 Officer Doctrines. They also have access to the master Vox, which make Artillery strikes available.

Tank Commander

An Expensive Leman Russ with a veteran commander has access to a single Vehicle Doctrine, and also makes a single totally mechanised Platoon Outflank

Commissar

The Commissar has become a tad cheaper and his Execution rule has been expanded to allow him to fire upon nearby squads to make them shoot better.

ELITES:

Sniper Team

The sniper team is 1-3 6 man sniper squads all of whom have Bs4, Sniper Rifles and Infiltrate. They also have access to Camo Cloaks and Deathworld Toxins.

Tank Ace

A veteran Tanker in a tricked out Russ for all you treadheads who want an armoured Army. Its possible to tank an army with 14 Russes, 3 Hellhounds and 45 Chimeras (although by then its most definatly Apoc!)

Stormtroopers

Everyones favorite team is a difficult one to make sense of. Ive made them into incredibly honed soldiers, increased in potency through augemetics and bionics. Their BS has been raised to 5 and their Hellguns are Rending. They also always count as stationary while using them. This means that they can move while pouring Horribly accurate fire into the enemy, until they can get stuck in close with a wide range of Close ranged damaging weapons such as Meltas, Heavy Flamers and a Demo Charge!

Ogryn Mob

Ogryns have had a simple lift with a Toughness of 5 and a powerfist Bonead. This should be enough to make them the blunt instrument they are meant to be, very difficult to wound or kill, and strong on the offensive.

Infantry Platoon

The Infantry platoon is very varied. The Command squad comes with a Junior Officer with a single Officer Doctrine. He is part of the squad, so they are only 1 Kill point. Although he can be upgraded to a Senior Officer allowing for better stats, a second Officer Doctrine, but higher visibility, making the squad count as 2 Kill points then.

The Infantry Squad has been tweaked with a Heavy Stubbers being added as a special weapon choice, the option for a second special weapon in place of a Heavy weapon, or even a Heavy flamer. They also come with Lasguns, Frag grenades and Laspistols standard (just like the Infantry Primer says they do). They can also, like all other infantry, take Doctrines such as Close Order Drill, Chem Inhalers, Carapace armour, and Drop Troops.

The Veteran Squad has been added to Infantry platoons aswell, making more veteran squads possible. They can take multiple special weapons as now and their high Ld allows them to operate outside the influence of most Officers. They also come with a huge range of weapons options as befitting these Grizzled Vets.

Chimera

The Chimera was a difficulty to work with due to the model. I believe that the original intention of the Chimera was for it to be a slow moving heavily armed and armoured Infantry Support vehicle, with the option of allowing the squad inside to fire out with almost impunity (as can be deduced from its points cost, the 6 lasguns+2 Fire points and the Heavy weapons).The problems with this lay in that the weakness of the weapon options and the placement of the Lasguns made this useless. This has been changed by making the Chimera heavier armoured (side armour 11) and with weaker original weapons (twin linked and normal Stubbers) and much cheaper. Then the weapons options have grown much more varied and powerful (with things such as Quad Stubbers, Twin Linked Lascannons and Quad Autocannons in the turrets) while giving it a special rule allowing the squad inside to count the Chimera as open topped for firing out for their turn, but it lasts through the enemies.

Sentinel Squadron

Sentinels have been made cheaper and start with a twin linked Heavy Stubber, There are a number of new options such as rocket pods and Multimeltas and also the option to take 2 Hunter Killer missiles each Sentinel. You may also take up to 5 in a squadron, which can then split up into smaller teams.

Hellhound

The hellhound has gotten a small change, with it becoming a Fast Vehicle and choosing which type of Flamer Cannon it will use for the game. The Inferno cannon is exactly as before, while the Cerberus Cannon uses the rules the Hellhound used to have in 3rd edition. It is a normal Flamer weapon with S6 ap4, but any unit which takes a casualty from the cerberus, and isnt fearless, automatically flees.

The Hellhound will become a major unit to fear from the guard.

Leman Russ Squadrons:

The Basic Russ has a small points drop with the addition of ALL of the Imperial Armour Variants, each with their own strengths. A squadron of 3 Russ Exterminators can give a Hellish Maelstrom of Firepower, while a unit of 3 Demolishers can destroy almost all in their path. Also, the Leman Russ Storm has been added which is a varient which includes a Turret Mounted Thudd gun! a unit of 3 Storms can drop 12 Small blasts on an enemy unit on the move (18 when standing still and with Plasma cannons!!!)

Heavy Weapons Platoon

A large boost in choices here, with the Infantry Heavy Weapons being Complimented with Medium and even Heavy Artillery and Emplacements! The Basic Fire Support squad begins with Heavy stubbers and can upgrade to all the weapons they usually take now. But also added are Medium Artillery squads (with Thudd guns, Heavy Mortars and Rapier Laser Guns), Heavy Artillery (with Hydra cannons, Medusa emplacements, Earthshaker and manticore heavy guns) and Gun Emplacements (with Quad Linked Stubbers, twin linked Heavy bolters and other weapons)

Support Vehicles

All the Artillery vehicles reside here, with Hydra tanks mixed in with Griffons, Earthshakers, Medusas and also the Mighty Bombard! (with the only 10" Template in the whole of normal 40k, with a highly slow rate of fire)


So those are the units done so far! I hope everyone reads and enjoys, but feedback would be highly appreciated!

Octavius

shutupSHUTUP!!!
21-09-2008, 19:25
I think it goes overboard with superflous options and suffers from the DIY rules problem of every squad having a special rule.

This caught my eye for instance, the turret options for a Chimera:


The Turret mounted Heavy stubber may be upgraded to one of the following weapons:

Twin linked Heavy stubber- 5
Heavy Bolter- 5
Heavy Flamer- 5
Multilaser- 5
Quad Linked Heavy stubber- 10
Twin Linked Heavy Bolter- 10
Twin Linked Heavy Flamer- 10
Autocannon- 10
Missile Launcher- 10
Lascannon- 15
Twin Linked Multilaser- 15
Twin Linked Autocannon- 20
Twin Linked Missile launcher- 20
Twin Linked Lascannon- 30
Quad linked Autocannon- 30

I think you need to show more restraint. Individual models, squads and even the army list as a whole is defined not only by what it can do but what it cannot do.

You need to consider that limiting weapon options to certain units is sometimes good for game balance, good for internal balance to make a wider variety of unit attractive and sometimes good for balancing the options available so there aren't any no-brainers. In my view the Chimera is fine with a multilaser, heavy flamer and heavy bolter options. The addition of an autocannon would be nice, at most.

I'd drop the heavy stubbers from the army, they are a forge world speciality in my view. The standard anti-infantry weapon of the guard is the heavy bolter. Similarly I'd try to limit the overall Forgeworld involvement in the codex. That's why the Imperial Armour books exist.

I'd try to trim the unecessary special rules. On the subject of Storm Troopers I think the rules are pandering. They are only the best of the best when it comes to guardsmen, which is why they are BS4 instead of 3. Are they more elite than space marines? Pathfinders? Dire AVengers?

That might seem quite negative but I want to convey a very useful notion, which is elegance in simplicity!

Octavius_Maximus
21-09-2008, 23:02
I think it goes overboard with superflous options and suffers from the DIY rules problem of every squad having a special rule.


I dont get what you mean, the only squads with "special rules" at the moment are Tank Commanders, Commissars, Storm Troopers, Snipers, Veterans, Chimeras and Gun Emplacements. Thats not many compared to some.

Lets consider the New Space Marine Codex, with Chaplains, Masters of the Forge, Techmarines, Sternguard, Ironclad Dreads, Venerable Dreads, Scouts (Telion), Vanguard Veterans, Scout Bikers and Land Raiders (all variants, with Chronus as an option). it hardly seems bad.



I think you need to show more restraint. Individual models, squads and even the army list as a whole is defined not only by what it can do but what it cannot do.

Oh? Can a Chimera Move 12" and Disembark a unit which then assaults like an Ork Trukk?

Can a Chimera Protect its troops as well as a Falcon? Or a Land raider? or a Devilfish with Disruption pods?

On the other hand, what can't a razorback do? It can take Las and plas, it can take Twin Lascannons, it can take an Assault Cannon.

The Chimera is an ubiquitous vehicle, one which needs more power if its going to be useful.

a Chimera is good at one thing, Getting a squad close and doing ALOT of damage once they get there. After that, though, its in trouble. 5 Krak Grenades can easily destroy an Open Topped Chimera.



You need to consider that limiting weapon options to certain units is sometimes good for game balance, good for internal balance to make a wider variety of unit attractive and sometimes good for balancing the options available so there aren't any no-brainers. In my view the Chimera is fine with a multilaser, heavy flamer and heavy bolter options. The addition of an autocannon would be nice, at most.

Why so dull?




I'd drop the heavy stubbers from the army, they are a forge world speciality in my view. The standard anti-infantry weapon of the guard is the heavy bolter. Similarly I'd try to limit the overall Forgeworld involvement in the codex. That's why the Imperial Armour books exist.

No way! The Heavy Stubber is one of the most Interesting weapons the guard have! It shows them who they are, a special weapon which has the same strength as most armies Basic Weapon. Also, using a Heavy bolter as the basic is dull, and also it means that there is no Linking weapon between the Lasgun and the Heavy Bolter.

The Heavy Stubber is one of the precious few Guard Only weapons left, i doubt ill get rid of it.



I'd try to trim the unecessary special rules. On the subject of Storm Troopers I think the rules are pandering. They are only the best of the best when it comes to guardsmen, which is why they are BS4 instead of 3. Are they more elite than space marines? Pathfinders? Dire AVengers?

If they are only the Equivilent of other armies basic troops then there is no point in taking them. In some ways they SHOULD be more Elite than Marines, Pathfinders and Dire Avengers. Eldar do not add bionic enhancements to their body like the Imperium of Man do, and Marines do not fight like a squadron, they fight like a Phalanx of warriors, not soldiers.

Stormtroopers are supposed to be incredibly disciplined with some of the best weapons a soldier can get and the training and enhancement to prove it. From a rules perspective they need something to make them the equivilent to Ogryns, Snipers and the Tank Ace in the game. Making them mobile Ranged Anti Infantry is different than the rest of those choices.



That might seem quite negative but I want to convey a very useful notion, which is elegance in simplicity!

Simplicity is all well and good, and needed in some places. If there was a simple way to show every different Guardsmen Variant there is then i would like to see it.

So far this is the simplest way i can do it.

shutupSHUTUP!!!
22-09-2008, 00:06
I guess we just have different hopes for the upcoming guard codex. Having read through the marine codex a few hours ago I can see how they seem to have changed tack somewhat over their past few codex releases and that's worth bearing in mind. But still, I'd caution against expecting every Forgeworld variant to appear in the IG codex.

Octavius_Maximus
22-09-2008, 03:16
This isnt a Wishlist for the Upcoming Guard codex, its an idea for how the guard should work. If any of these ideas are in the new codex, then i will be glad though.

So, is there anything else you could laud/criticize?

shutupSHUTUP!!!
22-09-2008, 09:37
Well the costs seem to be in order, they are what I would pay which suggests you understand the inherent worth of many of the IG squads. Also I'm assuming the lack of a multilaser options for Sentinels is a typo.

CAPTAIN KOSTAS
22-09-2008, 19:22
Well,IMO Veterans in Command Squad could have Bs 4 or 2 Attacks and where are the Vevicle Upgrades?