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lector#1
25-09-2008, 05:33
this is just based on rumors but its a basic idea of what the army would look like.

kolek-605

sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 DP -180-200

sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 DP -180-200

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

5 horsemen, flails-75

5 horsemen, flails-75

3 dragon ogres, unit champion ?240?

3 dragon ogres, unit champion ?240?

i was thinking of just having the dragon ogres without the unit champion and maybe cut a unit of marauders for another unit of dragon ogres or another champion what do you think??

this is an army based on the shaggoth lord.... i have always liked the shaggoth just never beastmen.. and now that he can lead the army and with the str, t, a, w he has he looks insane.... what do you think

thanx in advance.
Lector#1

LION
25-09-2008, 07:51
;) I would go for 3 Dragon Ogre Units with Champions to go with your General / theme. Cut out another unit. LION

lector#1
25-09-2008, 08:46
what should i add into the army to make it stronger???

if i take out the 3rd unit of marauders i loose numbers.... but if i take out the foot marauders and a unit of horsemen, i have about 200 points left what do you think???

Valaraukar
25-09-2008, 09:47
You're original list looks like a good core idea to me, you have some large blocks of static CR with GW for killyness, two big units of hard hitting fast dragon ogres and two units of fast cavalry for re-directing and harrying or war machine/wizard hunting + some magic defense and a hard as nails lord.

lector#1
25-09-2008, 10:40
[a hard as nails lord.] ... he is harder than nails LOL

thats why i made the list that way so that it was balanced ... slightly themed with the dragon ogres, but not going overboard with them the other list i came up with is


LEADERS

Kolek Suneater -605

Chaos Sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 dispell scrolls - 160

Chaos Sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 dispell scrolls - 160

Exalted Champion, battle standard bearer, banner of dispair - 195

CORE

20 Marauders, great weapons, full command - 120

20 marauders, great weapons, full command - 120

SPECIAL

3 Dragon Ogres - 195

3 Dragon Ogres - 195

3 Dragon Ogres - 195

55points under
idea for this one is medium sized anvil and huge hammer... the BSB runs beside or close to kolek.. -2 leadership is fun when u have terror and fear causing units running arround =D the 55points will either be spent on bulking out the marauders or some warhounds...

cheers in advance
Lector#1

Valaraukar
25-09-2008, 11:26
Would give the battle std. bearer a mount then or he will get left behind, don't you need 3 core for 2000 points though? So I think you will need to do a bit of rethinking I think the other list worked better but with the addition of the std and removal of champions etc.

lector#1
25-09-2008, 11:35
howz about this:

kolek-605

sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 DP -160

sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 DP -160

exalted bsb, banner of despair - 195

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

5 horsemen, flails-75

3 dragon ogres -195

3 dragon ogres -195

still 55 points under not sure on mount cost for bsb.... what do you think of this one??

Valaraukar
25-09-2008, 12:06
looks good you have three static CR units and three flankers bit small considering it's not that elite but that's more or less a given in 2k with kolek as general. I would guess daemonic mounts will be around the 50 point mark so that should sort him out and your points defecit.

lector#1
26-09-2008, 09:23
so out of the 3 lists what one do you think will work the best and what can i chop and change to make the list more effective????
i just bought my shaggoth today converted him a bit to make him look more armored ...

yeah so any advice on improving one of the above lists would be very helpful

Kalec
27-09-2008, 02:17
Drop the marauder champs, buy a MoK and juggernaught (60 total) for the BSB. Gives him good offense and 1+ AS and 7M, which should be enough to ensure he gets into combat and makes a mess of things. Stick him with a flail or halberd or Fury of the Blood God and he will be good to go.

lector#1
27-09-2008, 02:55
im not sure on the BSB because i have kolec!! he will do plenty of damage on his own... basically i need something that is inexpensive and draws attention from kolec.... or more numbers, maybe stronger units, the army is kind of based around kolec.... so when kolec and 6 other dragon ogres charge forward there needs to be something that can keep up with them and also help keep them alive

cheers in advance.
Lector#1

Kalec
27-09-2008, 04:36
You could drop the marauders for horseman to fill out your core, and swap the BSB for a unit of knights and a chariot. This will let everything keep up with Kolek and the dragon ogres, but you do sacrifice the BSB, the banner of despair, and all your static CR.

Also, giving the dragon ogres extra hand weapons or great weapons would do them a world of good. Not cheap, but a worthy investment for such a pricey unit.

lector#1
27-09-2008, 04:49
how many points are extra handwepons or GW i was wonderng that but couldnt find the points cost for them

yeah i was thinking of chariots for the added damage

i was thinking of something like

kolek-605

sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 DP -160

sorcerer, lore of fire, 2 DP -160

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

20 marauders, GW, FC -120

5 horsemen, flails-75

3 dragon ogres -195

3 dragon ogres -195

either 2 chariots or some chosen or something to add more damage

Your Mum Rang
27-09-2008, 09:57
You have two choices:

- Combined arms with slower and faster units retaining your fast DO's and some CR.
- Super-fast with no CR but speedier units like Knights + Marauder Horse.

I'd look into the second as you're leaving no units behind and you can really apply pressure in a big way.

So how about Kolec, 2 Chariot mounted Sorcerors, a BSB in a unit of Knights, Marauder Horsemen. Hounds, more Knights and DO's?

lector#1
27-09-2008, 15:00
i dont want to loose kolek that is the focus of the army but i am thinking of giving the sorcerers mounts and then they can join a horseman unit..... i dont want them in chariots because that will lead to over 1k points just in leaders... i was sceptic of having 2 sorcerers to keep points down... even if i didnt have kolek the lord would be around the same points anyway probably more.

i do agree with adding in more speed, i have kept 2 units of marauders for the static CR.

this is what i currently have"

Kolek -605
(smoosher of stuff)

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 2, 2 dispell scrolls, steed - 188
(anti-magic)

20 marauders, great weapons, FC - 120
20 marauders, great weapons, FC - 120
(numbers)

5 horsemen, flails - 75
5 horsemen, flails - 75
(speed flankers)

3 dragon ogres, great weapon - 215
3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 215
(keeping with the army)

now there is still 387 points left.... now im not sure on what to add in to make this list more effective i was thinking some hounds with poison attacks.. maybe..... a chariot or 2, so knights or chosen knights for power... maybe some more dragon ogres im stumped on this one
quick question can kolec or any shaggoth join units??? if so better for me
help is good cheers in advance
Lector#1

Kalec
27-09-2008, 15:26
You could fit in a unit of 5 knights with mark of tzeentch, blasted standard, and a chariot, and some xhw's for the DO's (8 a piece, 12 for the GW's).

I just can't see the footslogging marauders ever making much of a difference. Too slow to keep up with your offense, and warhounds are better for protecting flanks. All your armorless T3 models will do is give your opponent an easy out when in combat with your bigger baddies, who will break rather easily if they lose dut to the lack of a BSB.

lector#1
27-09-2008, 16:16
this is more fast paced and it worked out to be a cheaper army to build as well

Kolek -605
(smoosher of stuff)

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 2, 2 dispell scrolls, steed - 188
(anti-magic)


5 hounds - 30
5 hounds - 30
5 horsemen, flails, standard bearer, champion - 99
5 horsemen, flails, standard bearer, champion - 99
(speed flankers)

3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 219
3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 219
(keeping with the army)
5 knights, lances, full command - 260
5 knights, lances, full command - 260
(speed hitters)
can kolec join a unit???
i think the knights teamed with the marauders and hounds flanking will fit in great with this army =D

Your Mum Rang
27-09-2008, 16:30
I see you make symmetrical armies like I do. Be warned, sometimes an asymmetrical army with a few good tricks beats our style of armies.

Look into some more synergy when it comes to items/characters/spells.

lector#1
27-09-2008, 16:44
I see you make symmetrical armies like I do. Be warned, sometimes an asymmetrical army with a few good tricks beats our style of armies.

Look into some more synergy when it comes to items/characters/spells.


hahahahaha!!!!!! i didnt even realise i did it until you mentioned it... wow thats hilarious, i dont intend on it it just happens..... but in my previous armies where that has happend i find that in pairs they work well.... im hapy to mix up the core choices but i dont want to loose the dragon ogre units... and i think that 2 units of knights with lance, kolec and 6 dragon ogres would scare the pants of most combat armies.... woodelves will be my downfall, what do you think i should change.

keep in mind i am now aiming for a fast paced army aiming to hit charges on turn 2

Your Mum Rang
27-09-2008, 16:58
My only worry about your all-cav list is space. That many cav units will take up a LOT of space. I'd suggest consolidating one of the Knight units into an uber-unit with some goodies. Something that can take on all but the very very toughest enemies to the front and break them with ease.

lector#1
27-09-2008, 17:03
problem with 10man chaos knights unit is its got a bigger target on it than kolek... thats why i have them in 2 seprate units so that one unit can run down the right side and one down the left side if i have the DO's running towards the opponents prized unit it will do some nice damage there and kolek well kolek will just run around and smash anything in his way and my horsemen and hounds are going to be my warmachine and ranged units hunters cause thats probably the only thing that could take down kolek.... well that and if i roll hoplessly

Kalec
27-09-2008, 18:15
Warhounds won't be able to fill your minimum core requirements, so you need one more unit of horsemen. Maybe give them a musician and javelins or throwing axes to plink off ranks without committing to combat.

lector#1
28-09-2008, 09:46
ok this leaves me with 24 points left maybe throw some musicians in the marauders so they get that +1 rally or some shields or light armor...

Kolek -605
(smoosher of stuff)

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 2, 2 dispell scrolls, steed - 188
(anti-magic)

5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 75
5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 75
5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 75
(speed flankers)

3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 219
3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 219
(keeping with the army)
5 knights, lances, full command - 260
5 knights, lances, full command - 260

Kalec
28-09-2008, 16:36
A single level 2 isn't going to get off any spells. Drop him down to a level 1 and grab some warhounds or a few more horsemen, or mark some horsemen or grab a champ for the DOgres.

lector#1
29-09-2008, 10:07
ok hows about this


Kolek -605
(smoosher of stuff)

Sorcerer, lore of death, 2 dispell scrolls, steed - 153
(anti-magic)

5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes, mark of slaanesh - 85
5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes, mark of slaanesh - 85
5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes, mark of slaanesh - 85
(speed flankers)

3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 219
3 dragon ogres, additional hand weapon - 219
(keeping with the army)
5 knights, lances, full command - 260
5 knights, lances, full command - 260

was thinking.... take out a unit of knights for some more sorcerer/s or some more marks on the troops any help is greatly appreciated

LION
29-09-2008, 12:35
;)Dragon Ogre Champions have almost hero level Stats & can roll on the Tabe of The Gods After wining challenges. A must with your theme & will ensure your very $costly DOrgre units can deal with Hard Targets. LI0N

lector#1
29-09-2008, 12:51
what should i change for the champions...... i was thinking of giving them mark of slaanesh if they can have it so that they are ASF and i was wondering does kolek have a mark or can he be given one?

LION
29-09-2008, 13:07
:) Go Have a quick look at Chamber of The Ever Chosen. If you get a couple of Dragon Orges units crazy near a WarShrine then it would be a fine sight LION

lector#1
29-09-2008, 13:15
howz about this its more dragon oriented... not a fan of the warshine type things never used them they seem to never work for me .... ( cauldron of blood.... sigh)

Kolek -605

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 1, 2 dispell scrolls, steed - 153

5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes, mark of slaanesh - 85
5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes, mark of slaanesh - 85
5 horsemen, flails, throwing axes, mark of slaanesh - 85

3 dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239
3 dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239
3 dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239
5 knights, lances, full command, mark of slaanesh - 270

(maybe should chop and change to add in another sorcerer or does the list look good like this??)
marks of slaanesh is just for the ASF i would rather stick it on kolek and the DO's but it seems you cant.... the throwing axes are there for the fact that they can attack a unit without the commitment to combat unless they really need to which is when MOS kicks in

LION
29-09-2008, 15:25
:(I like it, but sadly I am informed that the new mark of Slaanesh benefits normal units by giving them immunity to fear, terror and panic and only gives ASF to rare choices as an extra bonus.

:DMaybe you should go HIgh Elf!! LION

lector#1
30-09-2008, 00:12
ahhh yeah i see that now but still its good for 10 points so im going to keep it..... cant wait to get started on the drasgon ogres =S

Kalec
30-09-2008, 01:35
You could drop the command and MoS from the knights and give them MoT and the Blasted Standard. 4+ ward vs shooting and a 6+ ward in combat is nothing to sneeze at.

lector#1
30-09-2008, 01:41
ahhhhh yeah thats a good idea i like it ill change it up later at work at the moment =D

lector#1
30-09-2008, 03:33
:DMaybe you should go HIgh Elf!! LION

funny you should say that i have a 1250 point chrace army.... good fun for those team games and the small bordom games.... and korhil on a lion chariot is like pwnage for 270 points and i love him but im sick of t3 panzies dropping like flys to arrow fire/combat... which is why im getting back into chaos and this is a total new style army for me.... i never had a all cav list and this will be fun to work out the tricks and the strengths of this army..... wait a second... i know what the strength of the army is HAHA kolek

lector#1
30-09-2008, 13:15
ok so this should be more effective???? i want this list to be fun to play with but i want it to have a competative edge at the same time which is why i had mark of slaanesh on the horsemen and knights but i was thinking of making the sorcerer lvl 2 tzeentch sorcerer for the added ranged power.... what you think???

lector#1
01-10-2008, 11:47
so a more killy sorcerer or a more defensive knights unit????

bork da basher
01-10-2008, 12:12
personnally i'd rather take a shaggoth as a seperate rare choice and take a lord or sorcerer lord to lead your army. kolek is nice and fits your theme but he's a very large target and not all that difficult to kill, at least a regular shaggoth wont take down your general and monster in one go if it dies.

also you havent paid for the mark of slaanesh with your horsemen, they cost 85pts without the mark.

lector#1
01-10-2008, 12:39
ok firstly the kolek isnt meant to fit the list the list fits him =D thats the reason the army looks like this if i had a sorcerer lord it wouldnt be an all mounted army it would be a mostly infantry army so my sorcerer can hide in a big block of troops, its not meant to be a total competative army its more a fun army with a competative edge.

oh and the horse men thats a mistake i forgot to take off the flails but now looking at it im thinking to keep the flails and loose the mark.

this is the first list of the options

Lords
Kolek -605

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 2, mark of tzeentch,1 dispell scroll, steed - 181

Core
5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

Special
3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

5 Knights of Chaos, lances, standard bearer - 242
(2000pts)
this is the second

Lords
Kolek -605

Sorcerer, lore of death, mark of tzeentch, level 1, 2 dispell scroll, steed - 171

Core
5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

Special
3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

5 Knights of Chaos, lances, mark of tzeentch - 250
1998

and the third

Lords
Kolek -605

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 1, 2 dispell scroll, steed - 151

Core
5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

Special
3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

5 Knights of Chaos, lances, standard bearer, champion - 270
(1998)

Kalec
01-10-2008, 13:58
The second, but drop the mark from the sorcerer for some command in the knights.

Also, consider keeping the knights with their magic +1 S swords. They give you your only magic attacks in the army, which could prove valuable against WE forest spirits and ethereal creatures. Give one unit of DOgres some great weapons to compensate if you do this (not to mention having an entire unit that can smash chariots is always handy).

Defender of Ulthuan
01-10-2008, 14:08
The only thing I really think you need is to give you DO's GW.

They ALWAYS do better with GW, especially if you give them the MoS.

lector#1
01-10-2008, 14:09
ok so like this

Lords
Kolek -605

Sorcerer, lore of death, level 1, 2 dispell scroll, steed - 151

Core
5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

5 Horsemen, flails, throwing axes - 85

Special
3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

3 Dragon ogres, champion, great weapons - 251

3 Dragon ogres, champion, additional hand weapon - 239

5 Knights of Chaos, full command - 260

total 2000

oh and i cant give them great weapons with mark of slaanesh because it doesnt give them asf anymore thats only to rare choices....(disapointment but what can you do)

SlayerMonka
11-10-2008, 23:20
Having read through the entire thing. the thoughts that came to me were;

1 either dropping the knights for a gaint with MoS. he will get ASF, plus you will have fun tagging teaming him with Kolec, also free up some more points. for a throw away screening unit of hounds.

2 or dropping the knights again in flavour of a warshine with a MoT. high T, 4+ sv, 3+ ward. and allows some more point for champion in the DO units. meaning they get a roll on the eye of the god table. with isnt shabby.

either way it your oppents another large and worrying target to shoot at. hopefully causing them to splilt their fire between the DO, kolec, and the other large target.

Having played with a beastmen army for about a year with DO. I have alway found GW more useful than additional handweapons.

hopes that help a little more.

Kalec
12-10-2008, 03:06
Great weapons are more effective against everything except very light infantry. Against heavier infantry, cavalry, and models with 4 or 5 T, the GWs are far superior.

Really, the DOgres don't need champs unless you are bringing a warshrine, because they don't get to roll on the eyes of the gods table without it. You could cut the champs to upgrade all 3 units to great weapons, grab musicians for the maraduers, and pick up some warhounds for screening or grab a warbanner for the knights.

Steeleheart
13-10-2008, 01:03
i made a thread about my slaanesh warriors list, please check it out and help!

Steeleheart
13-10-2008, 08:06
why not take another shaggoth with those extra points?