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Fixer
25-09-2008, 19:34
I played against Necrons the other day and it shocked me how fragile they were in the new edition. The new assault rules mean that wiping out huge squads of necrons by a small unit of melee specialists (or in this last game a marine sgt with a powerfist that got lucky with armor saves when he assaulted a 16 strong unit of warriors, caused two wounds and then ran them all down) is remarkably easy.

The Necrons do need some new rules desperately to keep them in check with everyone else out there. However, I was also thinking perhaps now might be the time to change the profile of Necrons as well making them less like marines with WBB and more like a unique force of their own while also taking a little inspiration from their portrayal in DoW. As such, I present my first ideas for a new and improved codex: necrons.

Firstly, the current army rules for phase out and WBB are scrapped.

Necron special rule
Necrons are robotic killing machines inbued with the trapped souls of the Necrontyr. Their wills and souls dulled to the clamour of battle. They count as being stubborn and have the 'feel no pain' USR. However if they fail a morale test they do not fall back as normal, they are instead subject to the 'phase out' rule.

Phase out:
The necrons defeated in battle do not linger upon the battlefield. Instead they are pulled back to their tomb world immediately to be repaired by waiting tomb spyders so that they can be sent back to fight once more. A unit failing a morale test 'phases out'

A phased out unit is placed in reserve and can attempt to return to the battle at the beginning of the next necron player turn. Unlike normal reserves, phased out units have a chance to return to the battle depending on how many of the original unit are left by rolling on the 'we'll be back' table. Should the unit fail to return in this necron turn it has been summoned back to the tomb world for repairs and counts as being destroyed.

We'll be back
Unit remaining: Returns on:
100% 2+
75% or more 3+
less than 75% more than or equal to 50% 4+
less than 50% more than or equal to 25% 5+
less than 50% 6+

Unyeilding advance:
Many necron units march together as one slow merciless phalanx. These units count as being relentless. In the movement and assault phase they only move up to 4" instead of the normal 6" but are never slowed by difficult terrain. Necron units with this rule cannot run and may not attempt to go to ground. They also never gain the +1 attack benefit for charging.

Necron Warrior[b] 15 pts
WS: 4 BS: 4 S: 4 T: 6 W: 1 I: 2 A:1 Ld: 9 Sv-
Infantry
Special Rules: Necron, Unyeilding Advance

Wargear: Gauss Flayer, Disruption fields

[b]Monolith

Couple of changes to this one.
The monolith may still be used as a portal for reserves. In addition it can be used to recall a unit of infantry in 'phase out' without any need for a roll on the 'we'll be back' table.

Living metal rule changed. Weapon strength is defined as a ranged weapon or close combat weapon's strength after modifications for additional benefits such as furious charge or being doubled for being a powerfist. Attackers rolling to penetrate never roll more than their weapon strength plus one d6.
Any rules that would normallly give an additional dice or the lance rule count as giving the weapon +1 strength when attacking the monolith instead. (thus giving armies such as SoB and Eldar a decent chance of destroying it now the army cannot be entirely destroyed by phase out)




Well anyway, those are my basic thoughts. Of course lots of things to tweak on other units but the general idea is to have a slow moving mercilessly advancing army. Necrons having T6, FNP and no armor save makes them them tough and resilient but less like space marines.

keatsmeister
28-09-2008, 09:50
That makes a lot more sense. I'd considered suggesting having 4+ Invulnerable saves and Toughness 5 but then I can just picture a proliferation of Grey Knight allies with Incinerators being taken to counter it which doesn't seem right.

Necrons also need something other than Monoliths. There have been several shouts for a Dreadnought equivalent, but personally I think something closer to a Wraithlord would be more appropriate.

My two pennies worth ;)

Simon Sez
28-09-2008, 10:43
I've never really agreed with the Necron Warriors having S4, they've never struck me as possessing the same brute strength as a power-armoured giant.

I like Phase out, but We'll Be Back introduces a bit too much book-keeping for my taste

To counter the achingly slow Unyielding Advance, perhaps a unit upgrade should be available? For example:

Entombed: (3pts per model) Models with the Entombed special rule may Deep Strike if the scenario allows it.

keatsmeister
28-09-2008, 10:59
I've never really agreed with the Necron Warriors having S4, they've never struck me as possessing the same brute strength as a power-armoured giant.

I like Phase out, but We'll Be Back introduces a bit too much book-keeping for my taste

To counter the achingly slow Unyielding Advance, perhaps a unit upgrade should be available? For example:

Entombed: (3pts per model) Models with the Entombed special rule may Deep Strike if the scenario allows it.

I think STr 4 is about right, if they are going to take a pummeling in assault for their lack of initiative, it's only reasonable to assume it is because they are gathering what strength they have for a few devastating attacks. Besides which, for a race that predates virtually all of the known 40K races, you'd expect a bit of power.

I do like We'll Be Back, but perhaps it could indeed be simplified. How about once a phased out unit is removed from play, place all such units in one place, and treat them all as in Reserve, and must roll on 4+ each turn to arrive, as though each turn was Turn 2 for Reserve rolls?

Fear is the mind killer
28-09-2008, 22:16
I like your rules, but I would make the tweaks slightly different to how you've fixed them:


Firstly, the current army rules for phase out and WBB are scrapped.
Agreed. However, I think you'll find that your alternatives could be simplified further, in line with the trend for simplification in the new codices.


Necron special rule
Necrons are robotic killing machines inbued with the trapped souls of the Necrontyr. Their wills and souls dulled to the clamour of battle. They count as being stubborn and have the 'feel no pain' USR. However if they fail a morale test they do not fall back as normal, they are instead subject to the 'phase out' rule.
Replace with:
Necron: Stubborn, Feel No Pain, Phase Out

(No changes, just cutting down the paragraphs to make the unit entry shorter and sweeter.)


Phase out:
The necrons defeated in battle do not linger upon the battlefield. Instead they are pulled back to their tomb world immediately to be repaired by waiting tomb spyders so that they can be sent back to fight once more. A unit failing a morale test 'phases out'


A phased out unit is placed in reserve and can attempt to return to the battle at the beginning of the next necron player turn. Unlike normal reserves... SNIP... 5+
less than 50% 6+

Replace with:
Units with the Phase Out rule that are removed by being run down after losing a combat may be brought back as reserves if the unit has not been reduced to below half strength.


Unyeilding advance:
...SNIP.
Just say Slow & Purposeful. There's no necessary difference. The average roll for S & P is 4.5" anyway.


Necron Warrior[b] 15 pts
WS: 4 BS: 4 S: 4 T: 6 W: 1 I: 2 A:1 Ld: 9 Sv-
I'd say leave them as MEQs. Being like a space marine isn't a crime, just being yet another typical space marine army is. Necrons are very resilient and play in a completely different style to marines and provide a good rival to marines as all other xenos Troops are inferior stats-wise. Besides there are many times when toughness is ignored and an armour save is the only thing that'll save you, so their current profile in the codex should be fine.


Infantry
Special Rules: Necron, Unyeilding Advance

Wargear: Gauss Flayer, Disruption fields
I'd replace Unyielding Advance with S & P, and change the Gauss special rule to Rending, as they're effectively the same thing and would help counter their weakness against armies with decent armour saves and make AV 14 worth something for opponents.


[b]Monolith

Couple of changes to this one.
The monolith may still be used as a portal for reserves. In addition it can be used to recall a unit of infantry in 'phase out' without any need for a roll on the 'we'll be back' table.

Living metal rule changed. Weapon strength is defined as a ranged weapon or close combat weapon's strength after modifications for additional benefits such as furious charge or being doubled for being a powerfist. Attackers rolling to penetrate never roll more than their weapon strength plus one d6.
Any rules that would normallly give an additional dice or the lance rule count as giving the weapon +1 strength when attacking the monolith instead. (thus giving armies such as SoB and Eldar a decent chance of destroying it now the army cannot be entirely destroyed by phase out)

How about having the living metal rule count as a -2 modifier on the damage chart as well as ignoring shaken and stunned results?

Also the c'tan must be removed from the table if there are no units with the Necron rule left.

keatsmeister
28-09-2008, 22:43
I'd say leave them as MEQs. Being like a space marine isn't a crime, just being yet another typical space marine army is. Necrons are very resilient and play in a completely different style to marines and provide a good rival to marines as all other xenos Troops are inferior stats-wise. Besides there are many times when toughness is ignored and an armour save is the only thing that'll save you, so their current profile in the codex should be fine.

I'd replace Unyielding Advance with S & P, and change the Gauss special rule to Rending, as they're effectively the same thing and would help counter their weakness against armies with decent armour saves and make AV 14 worth something for opponents.

Also the c'tan must be removed from the table if there are no units with the Necron rule left.

MEQs are too common. The thing is, that it is more common in the current iteration of 40K to see weapons ignoring armour, whether as combat bonuses or the AP system, than it is to see Toughness ignored. Hence why I think the Toughness solution is preferable.

Slow and Purposeful has issues. First, with some damn good rolls, it is not a huge difference, and with atrocious rolling (remember that attempt at running with my Inquisition Stormies last game?) it can be a mega slow day at the office. Second, S&P also includes the Relentless rule. Whilst it may be suitable and fluffy, with the MEQ approach, you'd be fielding a Thousand Sons variant.

On C'Tan, if rumours from Bell of Lost Souls are to be believed (only when I see it myself...), C'Tan will become an Apocalypse game unit, with regular 40K games utilising just the Necrons and a variation of Lord types, including one with a Necrodermis to imitate their masters.

Fear is the mind killer
29-09-2008, 08:48
MEQs are too common. The thing is, that it is more common in the current iteration of 40K to see weapons ignoring armour, whether as combat bonuses or the AP system, than it is to see Toughness ignored. Hence why I think the Toughness solution is preferable.
There are tonnes of high-strength weapons out there, and it would make necrons more vulnerable to lasfire and things like poisoned weapons.

Current Necron vs lasgun: 1/3*1/3 (wound * penetrate armour) = 1/9
T 6 Necron vs lasgun: 1/6

Current Necron vs poisoned weapon: 1/2*1/3 (wound * penetrate armour) = 1/6
T 6 Necron vs poisoned weapon: 1/2

They need a solid armour save. If anything they could use the 2nd ed. stats and have a 2+ save as standard.


Slow and Purposeful has issues. First, with some damn good rolls, it is not a huge difference, and with atrocious rolling (remember that attempt at running with my Inquisition Stormies last game?) it can be a mega slow day at the office. Second, S&P also includes the Relentless rule. Whilst it may be suitable and fluffy, with the MEQ approach, you'd be fielding a Thousand Sons variant.
The running storm trooper is an unfair comparison because you were only rolling a single D6 per turn, whereas S & P involves rolling 2 dice and picking the highest, so you'd have to be rolling snake eyes every turn for a unit to be that slow. Besides, necrons can run too if they have to (or to be precise allocate more energy into themselves by draining it from their weapons).

They wouldn't be quite the same as a Thousand Sons squad. For one thing they aren't relying on a powerful leader, and another thing they don't have any protection against battle cannons and the like.


On C'Tan, if rumours from Bell of Lost Souls are to be believed (only when I see it myself...), C'Tan will become an Apocalypse game unit, with regular 40K games utilising just the Necrons and a variation of Lord types, including one with a Necrodermis to imitate their masters.
That's when the new necron codex comes out. Until then the loophole regarding banishing the c'tan needs dealing with.

avatar of kaine
29-09-2008, 12:27
i think 'crons should be T5 and 4+ save