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View Full Version : Give me a Reason NOT to start a Tau Army



Brother Muninn
14-11-2005, 03:25
I've been on the verge of starting a Tau force for several years. Now with the changes I'm seeing in the line I'm even More inclined to build my own grey skinned task force.

New Reasons PRO:

Commander Shadowsun (!!!!)

Sniper teams

Vespid (strength or no, AP3 is AP3)

Plastic Stealth suits (or was that a rumor?)

starlight
14-11-2005, 03:26
Sorry no help here, I'm headed in that direction myself...:(

Aurelien
14-11-2005, 03:35
Because you'll just be a dirty bandwagon jumper;)

kanluwen
14-11-2005, 03:38
Honestly, I don't see why people like Shadowsun so much. But, you want some reasons why not to?

If the new codex is even remotely like the old, gunlines are NOT the way to go. Armorwise, Fire Warriors are kind of frail, but incredibly good if used properly. Marine players, in abundance, will have more than enough bolters to put down almost everything your force in the first few rounds if you're not careful.
Overall? Tau are not an army to play like a hammer. Markerlights are your friend, Kroot are useless, and judging from what I've seen of the Vespids? Useless also. Note, this is all my own personal opinon, the few times I tried playing Tau I failed when I used anything except Fire Warriors and Devilfish, but once I got the kinks worked out of my lists and realized that I just couldn't stand using Kroot and went with an all Fire Warrior list, I started doing remarkably better.

Sir_Lunchalot
14-11-2005, 03:42
really, why would anybody want to play Tau>? thyr'e a more boring version of IG. you wnat shooty, IG can do that, and ISN'T totally scre3wed when you get into combat. you want mobile shooty, go Eldar. why? AP3. 'nuff said. Tau are horrible, they've got overpriced battlsuits, all too vulnerable speedbumps, and they're totally out of place in the 40k universe. I mean, they can just get downright happy sometimes. that's just not right.

also, we need more IG players. IG vs IG is the most fun you'll have with 40k.

disclaimer: the above post is not my fauilt. he told me to tell him not to start Tau!:chrome:

Brother Muninn
14-11-2005, 03:44
Honestly, I don't see why people like Shadowsun so much.

I don't even care as much for her stats, background, or playability, that model rocks my gourd. The only thing I'm not in love with on that model is the head, and the sprue comes with a helmet alternative. Army or no, I'm buying that model at least.

NorthernMike
14-11-2005, 03:49
This game is generally about playing with toy models of futuristic armies that you like the look/ story/style of play of. So you gave a bunch of reasons that i think are valid to start playing Tau.

So i have no reason not to play Tau. I have always liked them and was extremely jealous when my brother in law started them. Now I kinda live my Tau dreams out through him, haha. I am more excited to have my guard trounced by all these new rules and models than he is i think. That new assault 5 weapon should be perticularily nice against my troopers.

UN17
14-11-2005, 03:53
Don't succumb to Por Caste propaganda! The Greater Good is a Lie! Do not abandon the Emperor for these false creatures and their heretic technosocialite ways! You hear about the Gue'Vesa, human helpers, but you never see them do you? That's because they feed humans to their bird thralls! Yes! Don't join the Tau'va! Traitors to Mankind will be purged! :skull:

Seth the Dark
14-11-2005, 04:19
I would say that some people wouldn't want to play against for the sheer sake that all Tau do is sit back and shoot. I also think that, while you might win a lot of games, Tau would be a boring army to play since all that shooting would be monotonous.

Aurelien
14-11-2005, 04:23
Seth, you obviously have only seen a few Tau players...I dont have a static line, and my last game I charged my opponents lines:)

NorthernMike
14-11-2005, 04:26
Apparently a guy place 2nd in the last heat with Tau. Taking a tonn of kroot and only 6 firewarriors. I am guessing he took the fight to his opponents.

Seth the Dark
14-11-2005, 04:29
Wow. I have never played against Tau like that.

Brother Muninn
14-11-2005, 04:39
We have one or two Tau players locally. I'm pretty sure they both play pure Fire Warrior, and neither of them exploit min maxing. I already have a standing 1500 point Ravenguard, so I thought I'd take a step from the imperial.

Davian
14-11-2005, 04:54
I've heard good things about the Kroot-heavy lists, as well as ones with three Stealth squads, though I haven't tried either myself. I've had most of my success with a more balanced approach. I was able to get two massacres in a recent tournament with my list consisting of a lot of close-up firepower from Helios commanders, Stealths, Kroot, and Gun Drones. You're balancing on a razor's edge with that kind of list, but it's a lot of fun when it works.

Shas'o'Fior
14-11-2005, 04:58
I'm a Tau player so mostly no help, but most likely, you'll be spending quite some cash, as Tau are mostly played mechanized.

AgentZero
14-11-2005, 05:13
You have two options and neither are ours to make.
You get the Tau or you don't.
You're paying for them , you make the choice.

You're going to let people like Seth the Dark make up your mind?
He's not well versed in things "Tau".

Your money.Your time.Your choice.

Brother Muninn
14-11-2005, 05:56
Your money.Your time.Your choice.

Frank and empowering, thanks.

What I'm mainly looking for are the downsides to owning/buying/playing Tau.

Ubik_Lives
14-11-2005, 06:26
Downsides of playing Tau:

You constantly have to put up with people claiming that the Tau are poor anime ripoffs and belong in some fanboy collectors store. These attacks never stop, and it gets irritating after a while.

The army isn't all that customisable of versitile. There aren't weapon options in the squads, there isn't that much in the way of wargear, and there aren't many unit options. Combine that with the fact that the Tau units are all shooty types, Tau armies end up looking and playing fairly similar to each other.

It took me two years to remember that the Shas'O is initiative 3.

Since there are no weapon options, you'll find all your anti-armour weapons hiding in only a couple of squads. Should you lose your broadsides early on, or have a basilisk shell dropped on top of your crisis suits, you are going to have serious problems dealing with tanks and massed marines. Leadership tests in the form of break, pinning, or target priority for these squads are very important. They can cost you the game.

Indirect fire is a pain to deal with. It's hard to flush out those pesky whirlwinds and basilisks. We have no indirect fire weapons of our own, and no fast vehicles to close the distance quickly. Indirect fire tanks can easily make their points back before you'll shut them down (barring a complete lack of terrain).

Night fight is a massive pain to the Tau. Stealth suits will have a ball, the rest of your army will have assault units slamming into them.

Your crisis suits and broadsides will break at the ankles. Your broadsides will also break at the railguns. You'll have to pin them on.

That's all I can think of right now

cailus
14-11-2005, 07:15
I've played Tau for a while and can think of a couple of reasons NOT to play them:
1.) Lack of character - the army doesn't really develop personality as all the units are the same. Sure you could model them differently, but you're not really going to have heroes when you field 30-odd firewarriors all armed with the same weapon. In fact heroics are not part of nthe Tau style. The Tau work in a very integrated fashion.
2.) Lack of tactics - after a while you'll figure two things out - Crisis suits are really vulnerable to ranged shooting and close combat and the whole army generally wouldn't last 2 seconds in a fist fight. A certain tactic emerges from this - the yo-yo Crisis/Stealth suit where you jump in and out of LoS blocking terrain and pepper the enemy with fire. But as moving forward is suicidal you stay back and don't really move anywhere as you are jsut jumping in and out of the same bit of terrain. I'm not the only Tau player to do this. as I've seen it elsewhere. The second tactic is the Fish of Fury where you hide units of Firewarriors behind Dvilfish APC's (they don't block LoS but you can't charge through them). This tactic is near worthless in most situations (Hormagaunts, Jump Packers and of Fleet of Whatever models generally don't care about this).

3.) Painting - let's face it the Firewarriors generally all look the same, as do the Kroot as do the Stealths as do the drones. And giving your Crisis suits different weapon suits is retartedly inefficient. So you generally arm them the same so they too look the same. Overall this army gets tedious to paint really fast. Marines and even IG can all be extensively customised and you'll have different things to paint ("hey this guy has a heavy bolter!").

4.) The crapiness of most of the army list. Drone rules don't work, broadsides are borderline uesless (they generally get insta-killed by lascannons in turn 1), Kroot Hound and krootox are not really choices ad the Krootox sucks, and Crisis Suits are beyond the joke fragile and unreliable. Pathfinders have the millstone of the expensive Devilfish APC. These may change with the new codex....

onlainari
14-11-2005, 08:25
Kroot are useless
Kroot are great. Better shooters than fire warriors. They're only useless if you're assaulting with them (why would you do that :rolleyes:).

I've played Tau, here's why I'd say not to use them: people won't play you unless you take a weak army. People complain when they see 5-6 skimmers on the board, even if it's a very well balanced army.

Last night, my friend wouldn't play me. So instead, I changed my list until he would, losing the devilfish, a hammerhead, losing some stealths, and basically adding more fire warriors and an ethereal. I still won, but only just.

Minister
14-11-2005, 08:52
Why not play Tau? Because in order to create Game Setting Balance, everyone must have at least two 3000 point armies of Imperial Guard, Orks or 'Nids before chosing one of the lesser armies.

Psiweapon
14-11-2005, 11:40
Why not play Tau? Because in order to create Game Setting Balance, everyone must have at least two 3000 point armies of Imperial Guard, Orks or 'Nids before chosing one of the lesser armies.
*ahem*

Please go tell that to the marine players. Pretty pretty please.

Robot 2000
14-11-2005, 12:31
Why not play Tau? Because in order to create Game Setting Balance, everyone must have at least two 3000 point armies of Imperial Guard, Orks or 'Nids before chosing one of the lesser armies.


this should actually be the law :evilgrin:

can't really stop you on the Tau front seeing as I feel like fielding a crisis-heavy force myself once the 'dex comes out :)

feintstar
14-11-2005, 13:29
I agree with the sentiment of the minister wholeheartedly, but some excuses can be made for the marines - while there are many more guardsmen than marines kicking around the galaxy, the marines are fighting much more often, so arguably they could kick above their weight in terms of significance in the numbers scheme of things.

The same cannot be said of Eldar/Dark Eldar, but hey, they are cooler.

But back on topic, you just have to ask yourself, once the novelty wears off, why this army? Tau are getting a kick up to the same level as every other army. As a new and popular kid on the block, their list had fewer options than most others. Now, they're slowly catching up. Its just the contrast with the old tau that you'tr noticing. They aren't going to be particularly special once the hype is done.

When I collect a force, I try and figure a theme, a motif - in short a character of the army and of its constituent units. I try to think, who are they? How did they get into this army? What is their culture like? What is their story? How are they different to the 15000 other armies in my country alone that share the same race, stats, and often composition and paint scheme to a varying extent.

How can I make the army reflect character and personality?

The Tau do not lend themselves to this cultural exploration. They have virtually no varying/alternative wargear for heroic sergeants and tough specialists. They have no spirit stones/trophy racks/skulls taken/cultural iconography that can seperate them from their mass produced plastic colleages. Not like the Guard, Marines, Chaos, Sisters, =I= armies, Dark Eldar (Eldar less so) and even orks can have more personalised theme for that matter than Tau.

And what is with those ridiculous looking Vespids? JC! Where's the multifaceted eyes and insectoid wings?! where's the multiple segmented bodies and stingers? Why did they become so anthropomorphic?

night2501
14-11-2005, 13:47
disagree, tau can be personalaized, for example I have one of mi units of FW (the one carring 6 pulse rifles) personalized by puting them some kroot bits (not the hanging meat, but the others), these are tau that have been living and working with the kroot for a long time and use them for that agresive tactics, also mi armi colour scheme and selection is made for nightfight/scouting, a balanced list with little static elements, with lots of blaksun filters and use infiltration to it`s max (is funy to have 3 quadrants before the game even start).
ho by the way kroot are really good if used right :)
well reason not to play tau?
there is no one I can give you, they are a hard army to use but rewarding :)
gofor it and teach those marines that the new kid of the block is geting more and more people :P

Minister
14-11-2005, 13:47
There are more Fire Caste members out there than there are Marines. Remember that.

And yes, the Vespid are horrible models, and look like some sort of Power Rangers goon.

Davian
14-11-2005, 15:23
I think Ubik did a good job of objectively assessing the Tau army's main weaknesses. Keep in mind that a lot if it may be changing with the new book in a few months, though. In fact, for each point he mentioned, a something came to mind that, if true, would supposedly help fix the problem. It all depends on what does and doesn't turn out to be true, though Brimmy's comments the past few weeks have been getting more and more specific, and he's usually reasonably reliable.

x-esiv-4c
14-11-2005, 15:29
I will personally go to your local and beat you down with my glorious and somewhat pungant DeathGuard and laugh...a lot.

Jeru
14-11-2005, 16:44
yah i started Tau couple months ago, and am on hold for monetary reasons atm. I am still painting up my Tyranids (sob why did i pick such a detailed paint scheme(for me)).

now with these new models, my semi wood has grown again to: ultimatebreakneckwood(tm).

Eran
15-11-2005, 09:19
Tau => 40K Smurfs :eek: :chrome: ('nuff said :evilgrin: )

Other than that, I'm waiting to see the new Codex and we'll be talking then (that is, if I finish my rotation in the hospital in time, so as to finish a report in my research, which needs handing-out, and after a nice game of my IW vs. my friend's Tau, in which I will be busting him, again :evilgrin: )

Cheers,

Eran

kermit
15-11-2005, 16:58
Because by the time you are done painting them you will want to crush them into little pieces and start a bonfire in your backyard to burn them. Once this is done you will be so angry that you wasted your money and your time painting them that you will start to drink too much and then you will have to start to go to meetings... you know the ones... hence more waste of time.

Sorry for that rant, but I have had to paint Tau twice now and I hated every minute of it. Well except the Hammerhead, that was fun! That is my warning to you, fire warriors suck to paint and I HATE them.

Starchild
15-11-2005, 17:06
OK, I'll give you the best reason of all.

If the rumours are correct, Eldar will be released about six months after the Tau. The new Eldar will look so incredibly cool that you will wish you had saved your money for them! Plus, the new Eldar would be a good opportunity to go against the mainstream, filled as it is with numerous Tau/SM/Necron players.

Sanjuro
15-11-2005, 20:12
also, we need more IG players. IG vs IG is the most fun you'll have with 40k.


I keep telling people that, but very few agree with me.

RampagingRavener
15-11-2005, 20:20
Myself, I'm planning on putting a tau army together. After 4 decent sized CC based armies, I'm after some firepower.

I'm hoping that some of the problems people have mentioned will be adressed in the new codex when it comes out, though mostly its just because I love the new models.

From what I've gathered, the main drawbacks of the army are:

1. Unless you have a bucket full of kroot, combat will be deadly, though this is pretty obvious.

2. Synergy is essential. You can't play like marines, where each unit can essentially operate independantly of the rest of the army, but you've got to pair units together to help each other in covering their weaknesses. If you loose synergy, you loose the game.

3. Not going all-out on armour and suits ("mech" tau IIRC) can put a real hamstring on the army.

Still, Tau don't seem that bad overall, though I'm waiting for Tau Empires before actually buying a codex and just concentrating on the models right now.

DarkstarSabre
15-11-2005, 20:52
A reason not to start a Tau army?

Simple.

Because you'd be playing a race stupid enough to send peace negotiators to a Tyranid Hive Fleet.

Because you'd have to include obligatory anime references, perhaps by having a Battlesuited commander called Genkigengar!

Because....

I got nothing.....

Sorry.