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ussa
07-10-2008, 17:25
I will join a game which held for new players, and additional rule is use 4 units to build army. My army is as followed and hope someone can give me suggestions.

[Hero]
Master x1 (80+20+50=150)
Repeater crossbow(10)
Heavy armour(4)
Shield(2)
Sea Dragon Cloak(4)
Pendant of Khaeleth(35)
Sword of Might(15)

[Core]
Dark Elf Repeater crossbow x12 (120+10=130)
Guardmaster(5)
Musician(5)

Dark Riders x5 (85+25+21=131)
Repeater crossbow x5(25)
Herald(14)
Musician(7)

[Special]
Black Guard x20 (260+35+35+15=345)
Tower Master(14)+Null Talisman(15)
Standard Bearer(14)+Standard of Hag Graef(35)
Musician(7)

Cold One Knight x6 (162+40+25+15=242)
Dread Knight(16)+Null Talisman(15)
Standard Bearer(16)+Banner of Murder(25)
Musician(8)

Total:998pt


My design is to build a all-purpose army.

MalusCalibur
07-10-2008, 20:02
Alright, I can't say I'm an expert on the new DE at all but I'll give it a look.

First things first though, individual point costs=BAD. Post the total costs of units/characters, but don't post the individual costs of upgrades or items.



Master
Repeater crossbow
Heavy armour
Shield
Sea Dragon Cloak
Pendant of Khaeleth
Sword of Might
Alright, lets start with this guy. For this points level, I think you would be better off giving him a simple Great Weapon and the Armour of Darkness. It makes him a bit cheaper, while remaining effective and not too easy to kill.
He'll make a cheap general. I assume that he goes with the Black Guard? If so, then you might get a bit of 'eggs-in-one-basket' syndrome with that unit. I'll come to that later.


Dark Elf Repeater crossbow x12
Guardmaster
Musician
Again, reasonable enough to begin with. However, I would drop the Guardmaster, and possible the Musician as well: these guys are a missile unit primarily and so the command is not so valuable for them. I would also think about giving them shields: light armour+shield+HW/S bonus means they'll have a respectable 4+ save in combat.


Dark Riders x5
Repeater crossbow x5
Herald
Musician

Dark Riders are great and you've got a good size there: I'd take 6 over 5 but that's more a personal choice. I'm not certain how valuable the RXB's are on them, but would suggest dropping them to keep them expendable. Also, definetely lose the Herald: he's a waste of points. Musician is fine though: handy for rallying after flee-baiting.


Black Guard x20
Tower Master+Null Talisman
Standard Bearer+Standard of Hag Graef
Musician

Ok, so the Black Guard. They are a very potent unit (especially with that ASF banner), but I would be concerned about having so many points in one place at 1K points. This one unit alone right now is over a third of your points, and if the general is here as well that's his points AND another 100 (he's the general) if the unit is destroyed. Essentially, your games will revolve aroiund the BG, and I don't believe they will withstand the full attention of your opponents army. For this reason, I think they need toning down. Don't put the general in here, cut them down to 15 (3 ranks of 5), and cut out the Null Talisman. The unit will still be effective (ASF banner, Eternal Hatred etc) without being the utter focus of the army.


Cold One Knight x6
Dread Knight+Null Talisman
Standard Bearer+Banner of Murder
Musician
CoK's are awesome and you've taken a good cavalry unit size (IMO, anyway). However, they too suffer from over-accesorising, making them very expensive. In this size game I'd reduce them to 5, and cut out the Null Talisman, the Banner of Murder, the Standard and Champion, to reduce their cost impact. For the role they should be in (support charges and attacking weaker units (skirmishers, missile units etc) they shouldn't need them.

With the points saved, I would recommend getting a unit of 15 (3 ranks of 5) Warriors with shields and full command, to support your Black Guard, and put the general with them. If things get dicey, you can always sacrifice the warriors to get your BG or CoK into a combat they can win (though take the general out before you do). You can use your Dark Riders to flee-bait units into a position where your infantry can charge them, and both should perform well (BG are powerful alone, and Warriors+general). Also, I would add a level 1 Sorceress with the Seal of Ghrond, to provide some magic defence, and also to give you some magic to play around with. She would be best placed near or in the RXB unit, to keep her out of harms way.

As I say, I'm not very experienced with the new DE, but I think the improvements I have suggested should help you :)


MalusCalibur

Lennart.nevanoja
07-10-2008, 21:33
Hey ussa,
I agree with MalusCalibur, you do suffer from all eggs in one basket syndrome. the blackguard is going to die painfully ageinst any shooty army, because they are elf's with a not so great sv after all and T3. on these kind of points every elite army suffers because they cannot arrange proper support for the killer units. You need to have one more infantry unit to give some more back up to the blackguards. IMO you should drop anything that is not necessary for the general to get more troops, perhaps you could consider harpies to deal with cannons and other similar stuff. The biggest concern i have is that you gonna be shoot to pieces. but good luck ( i like the new dark elf's ) so use them wisely and victory is youres to claim

Cheers

ussa
08-10-2008, 20:12
Thanks for MalusCalibur and Lennart.nevanoja!

I agree your opinions, but have a big problem about "additional rule". Additional rule request players use 4 units to build their army, or use units which from Battalion Box. So the max number of unit is 4.

Cheers