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Driazine
08-10-2008, 13:08
hi,
i wanted to know, what is the most destructive special units/warmachines build for a dwarf SAD army?

what combination of cannons, stone throwers and bolt throwers would you use. generally at my gaming club people have one big powerhouse unit or two of cavalry and some sort of big bad lord usually flying around causing mayhem.
no concern on being too cheesey, my area reeks of cheddar which is why i quit tomb kings because it was impossible for me to win a game. thanks for your advice

Frankly
08-10-2008, 13:12
Actually, just a horde of warriors and 8 B.thrower in pretty nasty.

Anvil + miners is pretty hard to counter as well.

EndlessBug
08-10-2008, 13:25
I'd def include 1 or 2 bolt throwers with +1 strength and the ability to hit on a 2+ once during the fight (obv give the 2nd one rune of burning to get past the 2 machines with same runes on them setup). On top of them an Organ gun is almost a must as the auto hit at high strength is very decent!

1 cannon could be handy for anti war machine killing too.

So:
1 cannon
2 bolt throwers
1 Organ gun

should be ample war machines, think that's about 350 to 400 points.

Ironbreakers and hammerers are very very decent as well.

bork da basher
08-10-2008, 13:27
anvil, loads of thunderers n xbows, 2 organ guns, 2 cannon and 4 BT is horrendousy powerful, if u like to make friends or keep the ones u have id steer clear of gunlines. there boring to play with and against

Driazine
08-10-2008, 14:40
im not out to make friends as they arent making any. de, chaos dwarf, empire gunlines are things i face pretty often. the others have a fully mounted chaos army with a lord on dragon and a hell cannon or de monster mashes. that should give a pretty accurate idea of the problems i had to face with my tk and allways got slaughtered. since nobody else plays dwarves i thought i might give them a shot, liking the fluff and all.
:cheese:cake is nothing new there, its expected.
almost like an eternal GT with a lot of power gamers.
all i wanna do is win every once in a while :P

thanks for the help

Kohhna
10-10-2008, 17:02
How about a big gunline with a unit of Miners to go behind the lines on a suicide mission and start denying marches and tying down their dangerous/annoying stuff and even hitting thier warmachines? Is tying down stuff with Steam Copters still a viable strategy?

What I like about dwarfs is that their base stats make them pretty solid in combat, even when they aren't specifally geared towards combat.

Von Wibble
11-10-2008, 10:58
Odd that noone mentions the stone thrower with rune of accuracy and rune of penetration. It hits more than half the time at S5, meaning one of my elven units is pretty much neutered every other turn. Considering elves don't beat dwarfs in h-t when severly outnumbered I would think 2 of these (find a cheap rune to add to make it legal) plus crossbows, thorek, gyrocopter, 2 x bolt thrower and lots of 3+ save warriors would do the job.

Bran Dawri
11-10-2008, 11:52
all i wanna do is win every once in a while :P

thanks for the help

If that's the case, then steer clear of dwarves. They're currently so far behind the powercurve it isn't funny (slightly ahead of O&G and OK, and roughly equal to Tomb Kings in powerlevel).

If you wanna win in a cheesefest environment, go daemons or VC.

Von Wibble
12-10-2008, 18:23
Really? Apart from Daemons and wood elves they are the only army my high elves worry about!

Frankly
12-10-2008, 18:53
If that's the case, then steer clear of dwarves. They're currently so far behind the powercurve it isn't funny (slightly ahead of O&G and OK, and roughly equal to Tomb Kings in powerlevel).



'dusting off old dwarves as I type'.

The problem is that armies like dwarves and O&Gs attract 'fluffy' players who generally like the whole back ground of the stunties and green skins more than the playable side of them.

Well thats not a real problem is it, its actually perfect for the hobby.

Kohhna
14-10-2008, 00:14
'dusting off old dwarves as I type'.

The problem is that armies like dwarves and O&Gs attract 'fluffy' players who generally like the whole back ground of the stunties and green skins more than the playable side of them.

Well thats not a real problem is it, its actually perfect for the hobby.
Personally I consider Powergaming and Fluffy play to be different but equally valid ways of approaching the hobby. As long as everyone's on the same page then both are cool, but when the two clash there's problems. I have a few theories about this issue, particularly in relation to other games like Magic, and I might write something on the subject one day.

SuperArchMegalon
14-10-2008, 08:28
Dwarfs are middle-of-the-road, in your average pitched battle. I love my Dwarfs. But when it comes to holding objectives, you pretty much need an anvil, and you still suck at it. That explains poor tournament results.

Frankly
14-10-2008, 11:33
Personally I consider Powergaming and Fluffy play to be different but equally valid ways of approaching the hobby. As long as everyone's on the same page then both are cool, but when the two clash there's problems. I have a few theories about this issue, particularly in relation to other games like Magic, and I might write something on the subject one day.


I'm 100% in agreement with you.

I totally agree.


I dusted off my dwarves the other day and took 8 B.throwers to gaming night, people were fine with because everyone was on the same page, new their were going to be some hard match ups etc, etc.

I can't do the same down at the club on a sunday, walk in there play little Timmy 2 cannons and his themed armylist and expect everyone at the table to have a good time.

Theres a time and the place for everything .... even 8 B.throwers.



Funny enough dwarves are just one of those armies that I actually do suggest constructing more powerful list with. Because losing a phase in your turn(magic) and being restricted in another(movement) means that dwarf players shouldn't feel bad about relying alot on the shooting phase to support their list and/or getting in those runes that d the damage for you in combat.

gortexgunnerson
14-10-2008, 18:07
I think Dwarfs poor performance is in massacre in tournment which are required for top position, I took dwarf to the GT qualifies 2 years running and qualified with 3 wins 3 draws in both. Good solid and played correctly difficult to beat,

My Artillery combo is
3x10 Crossbowmen
stone thrower rune of accuracy
cannon rune of forging
organ gun.

Would love 2 bolt thrower in their as post 6ed list has cannon, stone thrower, 2 bolts and sometimes organ gun!

But I take a small miner unit to challenge table quarters and attack opposing artillery.

Have found the set up very good but also requires a good guess range to get the best out of them, I expect to hit the model i am aiming at with my guess on a stone thrower and so you need a big scatter to actually miss the unit and hence they pay for them selves very quickly. They are also very good against multi wounders as the d6 wounds is a wounder!

Frankly
15-10-2008, 00:26
Yeah getting soft scores in tournaments is a problem.

I think taking brutal lists to GTs isn't something I see alot of dwarf players doing as well, why not around my neck of the woods anyway.

I'd almost certainly take 8 B.thrower(it's actually 400pts of pretty brutally shooting)or 6 B.throwers and a miner unit to grab and table edge. And fill out the rest of the list with basic warriors, thats if it was a Gt type of tournament. I'd try to leave the guess weapons at home and go for the solid average dice rolls.

but hey, I'm not a big dwarf player so I'm taking out my a$$ to be honest.

i'd also like to start running 3 x miner units and the sprinting banner of coolest and run a solid combat armylist out of the dwarves book and see if you can't make a serious combat dwarf list. It on the books as a future project, thats for sure.

Tsen
15-10-2008, 02:24
I havent played my old dwarf powergaming list in ages, but I played it for nearly a year consistanly till i ran out of people willing to play me, I never lost with it. It was something along the lines of:

Thorek
Master Engineer
3x 10 Thunderers
10 quarrellers
3 Cannons w/ Engineers
2 Bolt throwers w/ engineers w/ brace
Organ Gun
Gyro

the cannons all had the rune of forging i think, and the neccisary runes of burning and something else random, to make it legal, and i dont remeber what was on the BTs but its all personal choice. but be prepared to loose a fair number of friends if you through it around too much, people seemed to start using my name as another word for cheese. Pretty much only ever wrathed with thorek, mostly to half move stuff while the guns drilled everything into the ground, and used the gryo to march block what thorek couldnt hit, i even had 2 or 3 games that went to the fifth turn before i killed every enemy model on the table. Had a few games that i killed everything at the end of turn 3. Either way, having mad guessing skills for cannons really helps.

Lord Dan
15-10-2008, 07:07
A broken Dwarf list? It pretty much runs like this:

Step 1: Thorek.
Step 2: Fill in the rest of the points with whatever you want. It doesn't really matter.

DeathlessDraich
15-10-2008, 09:53
Wow! It's good to see there is still enthusiasm for Dwarves.

Some other pts not mentioned so far:

1) The beauty of a Dwarven gunline is - their shooting units (Thunderers) can hold their own in combat and could even charge and win combat if necessary.

2) I would prefer 2 Bolt throwers with Rune/s of penetration, Master Rune of skewering plus maybe Rune of Burning instead of a Cannon - more or less the same points.
Guaranteed one lethal hit at S8 and no chance of a misfire at all plus lots of shooting in later rounds with the probability of missing halved (from having 2 BT).

3) The Rare unit slot is probably a matter of taste. Gyrocopter is useful if there are no Miners. Flame cannon - used if there is no other template shooting or multiple hit shooting. Organ Gun - same as Flame cannon but also provides a 'hail of shots' at 1 unit tactic when supported by quarrellers etc.