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Whitehorn
13-10-2008, 10:22
Here's the diagram:
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/6796/21974062vx3.jpg

The question is, once the Black Orcs died, of which the Warboss was a part of the unit, who moves?

Does the Black Coach move sideways to remain in contact with the Warboss?
Does the Warboss move across to maintain contact with the Graveguard and Coach?

theunwantedbeing
13-10-2008, 10:30
Assuming neither side breaks.
You'll end out with 2 combats.

1 where the goblins and the orcs are fighting the grave guard
1 where the warboss is fighting the coach and the unit of skeletons.

So the coach has to move forwards and diagonally and the warboss is moved slightly the opposite way.

mattjgilbert
13-10-2008, 10:37
The alternative is that the coach is no longer locked in combat but I think theunwantedbeing is correct.

Whitehorn
13-10-2008, 10:37
How can you say the warboss has to move and yet disregard the fact its unit is/was engaged with the graveguard?

mattjgilbert
13-10-2008, 10:43
I think that moving the Warboss was just to keep the lines tidy. If he was still in contact there shouldn't actually be a need to.

The Red Scourge
13-10-2008, 11:22
Assuming neither side breaks.
You'll end out with 2 combats.

1 where the goblins and the orcs are fighting the grave guard
1 where the warboss is fighting the coach and the unit of skeletons.

So the coach has to move forwards and diagonally and the warboss is moved slightly the opposite way.

Absolutely correct :)

theunwantedbeing
13-10-2008, 11:53
How can you say the warboss has to move and yet disregard the fact its unit is/was engaged with the graveguard?

The warboss is no longer part of that unit.
You cannot be part of a unit that doesnt exist.

Feel free to argue against this by all means. I could do with a laugh.
(meant in jest of course, your clearly too clever enough to think that he's still part of the unit)

Braad
13-10-2008, 12:29
That's impossible!

The black orcs should have easily slayed those puny bone-men...

I agree with unwantedbeing. Though I have to add, the only way I can see why the warboss would be moved is to prevent clipping.

Lordsaradain
13-10-2008, 13:58
Hmm, well the orc warboss wa indirectly in combat ith the graveguard, so I think he should be placed B2B with the skeletons with one edge touching the GG. And the Black coach should have a rear charge on him.

This is where WHFB gets very messy and stupid though. Not being able to turn units in subsequent turns of combat or be able to bring as many moels into conact as possible is neither fun or realistic. warhammer isnt designed for these situations so there is no good way of handling it IMO. Hopefully this will be looked at i the 8th edition rulebook.

BEEGfrog
13-10-2008, 17:37
If you slow the situation down and remove the casualties one-by-one then you would end up with the warboss on boar contacting the skeletons but in corner to corner contact with the graveguard and the coach in contact with its rear.

The coach would have to keep moving forward as the rear ranks of the black orcs died. The black orc unit would have to maintain contact with the enemy units while removing casualties if it is possible to do so, this would cause the warboss to move left, filling gaps in the line caused by dead orcs.

It is arguable if the warboss on the boar has to touch the grave guard or be no more than a black orc base width from contact with the grave guard. The spirit of the rules says touching.

If the undead won the combat then the skeles would be able to turn to face. The graveguard, however, couldn't turn even if they had won as they are engaged on two sides.

If it is the O&G turn the Orc boss can to move to a fighting file.

DeathlessDraich
13-10-2008, 18:07
I'll base my answer on an army FAQ** but I can't remember which one:

In the next turn:

1) Goblins and Orcs are in combat with the Grave Guard

2) Warboss is in combat with the skellies

3) Black Coach is disengaged from combat and may charge if it is the VC turn.

**The FAQ explains the unit status of characters in a unit if the unit is wiped out.
IIRC the character counts as a separate (i.e. new) unit *at the end of the phase*.
I reserve the right to a misread! :p

Is that your answer too matt?

Festus
13-10-2008, 18:17
Hi

I would've played as unwanted suggests - without refering to the rulebook in the game - but it is not the rules exactly, I have to add. :cries:

By the Rules, the Warboss has to fight Skellies and the GG and the Chariot .
p.46 of the BRB details this.
As the Warboss is part of the unit of BOs until the end of the CC phase, he has to be moved into contact with all units the BOs were fighting (if possible, of course). So he has to touch both the Skellies and the GG, and as such the chariot can move forward to contact him as the last member of the unit.

Remember that the CC phase is not over when blows were struck but after flee/pursuit and redress ranks has been made.

That's how I read the BRB on the matter...

Cheers
Festus

mattjgilbert
13-10-2008, 22:52
Is that your answer too matt?I'd considered it might be which is why I said the coach might be no longer locked in combat :) However, without a book to refer to I couldn't say for sure and felt the propsed answer was fairly convincing ;)