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-Grimgorironhide-
15-10-2008, 04:42
As many of people like myself are un happy with how the HE were treated in this edition. Throwing out Honours, ASF (Bland army rule), useless units (eg. silver helms), Tampering with the composition chart.
So I have started to create a redux for the HE using ideas from the 7th and 6th edition with a few tweaks here and there.

Here it is.

Redux High Elf Army Book 7th Edition

Army Composition
Less than 2000pts:
-Core: 2+
-Special: 0-3
-Rare: 0-1

2000pts+
-Core: 3+
-Special: 0-4
-Rare: 0-2

Each 1000+pts
-Core: Min +1
-Special: +0-1
-Rare: +0-1

Units: Lords

High Elf Prince

Points Cost: 130

M-5
Ws-7
Bs-6
S-4
T-3
W-3
I-8
A-4
Ld-10

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon

Options:
-May choose either a lance (+6pts), a Spear (+4pts), a Great Weapon (+8pts)
, a Halberd (+4pts), or an additional Hand Weapon (+4pts)
-May also choose a Longbow (+10pts)
-May wear either Light Armour (+3pts), Heavy Armour (+6pts) or Dragon Armour (+8pts), and may also carry a shield (+3pts)
-May ride either an Elven steed (+18pts), which can have ithilmar barding (+6pts), or a Great Eagle (+50pts), a Griffon (+200pts), a Tiranoc Chariot, replacing one of the crew (+85pts), a Sun Dragon (+235pts), a Moon Dragon (+300pts), or a Star Dragon (+400pts)
-May have one Honour selected from the Honour List.
-May choose up to 100pts worth of Magic items from the Magic item List.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.


High Elf Archmage

Points Cost: 215

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-3
I-5
A-1
Ld-9

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon

Magic: An Archmage is a Level 3 Wizard. He may choose either High Magic or any one of the common eight lores of magic.

Options:
-May be upgraded to a Level 4 Wizard +35pts.
-May ride either an Elven steed (+18pts), which can have ithilmar barding (+6pts), a Tiranoc Chariot, replacing one of the crew (+85pts), or a Great Eagle (+50pts).
-May have one Honour selected from the Honour List.
-May choose up to 100pts worth of Magic items from the Magic item List.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.



Units: Heroes

High Elf Noble

Points Cost: 75

M-5
Ws-6
Bs-6
S-4
T-3
W-2
I-7
A-3
Ld-9

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon

Options:
-May choose either a lance (+4pts), a Spear (+2pts), a Great Weapon (+6pts)
, a Halberd (+4pts), or an additional Hand Weapon (+4pts)
-May also choose a Longbow (+8pts)
-May wear either Light Armour (+2pts), Heavy Armour (+4pts) or Dragon Armour (+6pts), and may also carry a shield (+2pts)
-May ride either an Elven steed (+12pts), which can have ithilmar barding (+5pts), a Great Eagle (+50pts), or a Tiranoc Chariot, replacing one of the crew (+85pts).
-May have one Honour selected from the Honour List.
-May choose up to 50pts worth of Magic items from the Magic item List.
-May be the Battle Standard Bearer for +25pts, and can choose a Magical banner of any point size. He cannot be mounted on an Eagle or Tiranoc Chariot and if he takes a magical banner he cannot take any other magical items.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.


High Elf Mage

Points Cost: 90

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-2
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon

Magic: An Archmage is a Level 1 Wizard. He may choose either High Magic or any one of the common eight lores of magic.

Options:
-May be upgraded to a Level 2 Wizard +35pts.
-May ride either an Elven steed (+12pts), which can have ithilmar barding (+5pts), or a Tiranoc Chariot, replacing one of the crew (+85pts).
-May have one Honour selected from the Honour List.
-May choose up to 50pts worth of Magic items from the Magic item List.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.


High Elf Dragon Mage of Caledor

Points Cost: 330

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-2
I-6
A-2
Ld-8

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon

Mount: Rides a Sun Dragon

Magic: An Archmage is a Level 1 Wizard. He may choose either High Magic or any one of the common eight lores of magic.

Options:
-May be upgraded to a Level 2 Wizard +35pts.
-May have one Honour selected from the Honour List.
-May choose up to 50pts worth of Magic items from the Magic item List.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Reckless: A Dragon Mage must use an extra ‘free’ Power Dice when casting any spell, and does not generate an extra +1 to dispel bonus.
-Warrior Mage: A Dragon Mage may exchange any fire lore spell for Flaming sword of ruin instead of Fireball.


Units: Core

High Elf Spearmen

Points Cost/Model: 9

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 10+

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon, spear, light armour.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with shields for +1pts/model.
-Upgrade one Spearman to a Musician for +4pts.
-Upgrade one Spearman to a Standard Bearer for +8pts.
-Upgrade one Spearman to a Champion for +8pts (Has +1 attack).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 25pts.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Spear Phalanx: When the unit is charged by an enemy unit in the front the unit with the higher initiative strikes first.
-High Elven Spears: High elf Spearmen fight in three ranks.


High Elf Archers

Points Cost/Model: 10

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 10+

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon, longbow.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with light armour for +1pts/model.
-Upgrade one Archer to a Musician for +4pts.
-Upgrade one Archer to a Standard Bearer for +8pts.
-Upgrade one Archer to a Champion for +8pts (Has +1 Bs).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 25pts.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-High Elven Archers: High elf Archers fire in two ranks.


High Elf Lothern Sea Guard

Points Cost/Model: 12

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 10+

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon, spear, light armour, bow.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with shields for +1pts/model.
-Upgrade one Sea Guard to a Musician for +6pts.
-Upgrade one Sea Guard to a Standard Bearer for +12pts.
-Upgrade one Sea Guard to a Champion for +12pts (Has +1 attack and +1 Bs).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 25pts.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Spear Phalanx: When the unit is charged by an enemy unit in the front the unit with the higher initiative strikes first.
-High Elven Spears: High elf Sea Guard fight in three ranks.


High Elf Sliver Helms

Points Cost/Model: 19

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 5+

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon, lance, light armour.

Mounts: Barded Elven Steed.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with shields for +2pts/model.
-Any unit may upgrade to heavy armour for +2pts/model.
-Upgrade one Silver Helm to a Musician for +6pts.
-Upgrade one Silver Helm to a Standard Bearer for +12pts.
-Upgrade one Silver Helm to a Champion for +12pts (Has +1 attack).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 50pts.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.


Units: Special

High Elf Ellyrian Reavers

Points Cost/Model: 17

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 5+

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon, spear, light armour.

Mounts: Elven Steed.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with bows for +4pts/model.
-Any unit may exchange their spears for bows for +2pts/model.
-Upgrade one Reaver to a Musician for +6pts.
-Upgrade one Reaver to a Standard Bearer for +12pts.
-Upgrade one Reaver to a Champion for +12pts (Has +1Bs).

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Fast Cavalry


High Elf Dragon Princes

Points Cost/Model: 31

M-5
Ws-5
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-6
A-2
Ld-9

Unit Size: 5+

Weapons and Armour: Hand Weapon, lance, dragon armour.

Mounts: Elven Steed with ithilmar barding.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with shields for +1pts/model.
-Upgrade one Dragon Prince to a Musician for +8pts.
-Upgrade one Dragon Prince to a Standard Bearer for +12pts.
-Upgrade one Dragon Prince to a Drake Master for +12pts (Has +1 Attack).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 50pts.
-The Drake Master may choose up to 25pts of magic items.



Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Dragon Armour: Counts as Heavy Armour. The wearer is immune to all breath attacks, and any fire-based attacks (Include spells from the Lore of Fire).
-Ithilmar Barding: Give a +1 to the models armour save like normal barding but there is no movement reduction to the model.


Swordmasters of Hoeth

Points Cost/Model: 14

M-5
Ws-6
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-2
Ld-8

Unit Size: 10+

Weapons and Armour: Two-handed sword (Great Weapon), hand weapon, heavy armour.

Options:
-Upgrade one Swordmaster to a Musician for +4pts.
-Upgrade one Swordmaster to a Standard Bearer for +8pts.
-Upgrade one Swordmaster to a Bladelord for +8pts (Has +1 attack).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 50pts.
-The Bladelord may choose up to 25pts of magic items.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Swordmasters: Instead of striking last in any turn they don't charge, they strike in Initiative order. The Great weapon gives the Swordmasters +2 Strength.


Shadow Warriors

Points Cost/Model: 15

M-5
Ws-4
Bs-5
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 5-15

Weapons and Armour: Hand weapon, long bow.

Options:
-Any unit may be equipped with light armour for +1pts/model.
-Upgrade one Shadow warrior to a Shadow-Walker for +12pts (Has +1 Bs and +1 Ws)

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Skirmish
-Hate Dark Elves
-Scouts


Tiranoc Chariot

Points Cost/Model: 85

Chariot Crew Steeds

M - - 9
Ws - 4 3
Bs - 4 -
S-5 3 3
T-4 - -
W-4 - -
I - 5 4
A - 1 1
Ld - 8 -

(1-2 Tiranoc Chariots count as only one Special choice)

Unit Size: 1

Crew: 2 High Elves

Weapons and Armour: The crew are equipped with hand weapons, spears and bows.

Drawn by: 2 Elven steeds.

Armour Save: 5+

Options:
-Any Chariot may include one or two additional steeds for 7pts each.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Chariot


White Lion Chariot

Points Cost/Model: 125

Chariot Crew Lions

M - - 8
Ws - 5 4
Bs - 4 -
S-5 4 5
T-4 - -
W-4 - -
I - 5 4
A - 1 2
Ld - 8 -

Unit Size: 1

Crew: 2 High Elves

Weapons and Armour: The crew are equipped with hand weapons, great weapons and lion cloaks.

Drawn by: 2 White Lions.

Armour Save: 4+

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Chariot


Units: Rare

Pheonix Guard

Points Cost/Model: 14

M-5
Ws-5
Bs-4
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-6
A-1
Ld-9

Unit Size: 10+

Weapons and Armour: Halberd, hand weapon, heavy armour.

Options:
-Upgrade one Phoenix Guard to a Musician for +6pts.
-Upgrade one Phoenix Guard to a Standard Bearer for +12pts.
-Upgrade one Phoenix Guard to a Keeper of the Flame for +12pts (Has +1 attack).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 50pts.
-The Keeper may choose up to 25pts of magic items.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Cause Fear
-Sacred Beings: Pheonix Guard have a 4+ Ward save.


White Lions

Points Cost/Model: 13

M-5
Ws-5
Bs-4
S-4
T-3
W-1
I-5
A-1
Ld-8

Unit Size: 10+

Weapons and Armour: Great weapon, hand weapon, light armour, lion cloak.

Options:
-Upgrade one White Lion to a Musician for +6pts.
-Upgrade one White Lion to a Standard Bearer for +12pts.
-Upgrade one White Lion to a Guardian for +12pts (Has +1 attack).
-A Standard bearer may carry a Magic Standard worth up to 50pts.
-The Guardian may choose up to 25pts of magic items.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Woodsmen: White Lions may move through wooded terrain without penalty.
-Bodyguard: White Lions are stubborn.
-Lion Cloak: Gives a 2+ armour save against all shooting attacks.


Repeater Bolt Thrower

Points Cost/Model: 100

Crew Bolt Thrower
M-5 -
Ws-4 -
Bs-4 -
S-3 -
T-3 7
W-1 3
I-5 -
A-1 -
Ld-8 -

(1-2 Repeater Bolt Throwers count as only one rare choice)

Unit Size: 1

Crew: 2 High Elves

Weapons and Armour: The crew are equipped with hand weapons.

Special Rules:
-Stotic: When fighting Against Dark Elves, all High Elves are immune to Panic.
-Repeater Bolt Thrower
-Volley: If using the multiple shots option then the Repeater Bolt thrower shoots six shoots in each Shooting phase. These shots are worked out exactly like shots from bows or crossbows, using the crews Ballistic Skill. All shots must be directed towards a single target. Multiple shots have a range of 48”, a Strength of 4 with a –2 to armour saves.


Great Eagle

Points Cost/Model: 50

M-2
Ws-5
Bs-0
S-4
T-4
W-3
I-4
A-2
Ld-8

(1-2 Great Eagles count as only one rare choice)


Unit Size: 1

Weapons and Armour: Talons (counts as a hand weapon).

Special Rules:
-Fly


Mounts

Elven Steeds

M-9
Ws-3
Bs-0
S-3
T-3
W-1
I-4
A-1
Ld-5


Great Eagle

M-2
Ws-5
Bs-0
S-4
T-4
W-3
I-4
A-2
Ld-8

Weapons and Armour: Talons (counts as a hand weapon).

Special Rules:
-Fly


Griffons

M-6
Ws-5
Bs-0
S-5
T-5
W-4
I-5
A-4
Ld-7

Weapons and Armour: Talons (counts as a hand weapon).

Special Rules:
-Fly
-Terror
-Large Target


Sun Dragon

M-6
Ws-5
Bs-0
S-5
T-6
W-5
I-4
A-4
Ld-7

Weapons and Armour: Claws (counts as a hand weapon).

Special Rules:
-Fly
-Terror
-Large Target
-Breathe Fire: Breath Weapon. It is Str 2 and units who suffer casuealties must take an immediate panic test.
-Scaly Skin: 3+ Armour save



Moon Dragon

M-6
Ws-6
Bs-0
S-6
T-6
W-6
I-3
A-5
Ld-8

Weapons and Armour: Claws (counts as a hand weapon).

Special Rules:
-Fly
-Terror
-Large Target
-Breathe Fire: Breath Weapon. It is Str 3 and units who suffer casuealties must take an immediate panic test.
-Scaly Skin: 3+ Armour Save


Star Dragon

M-6
Ws-7
Bs-0
S-7
T-6
W-7
I-2
A-6
Ld-9

Weapons and Armour: Claws (counts as a hand weapon).

Special Rules:
-Fly
-Terror
-Large Target
-Breathe Fire: Breath Weapon. It is Str 4 and units who suffer casuealties must take an immediate panic test.
-Scaly Skin: 3+ Armour save


High Elf Honours

Each character may take only one honour each once. However, more than one character can have the same honour if you wish.

Pure of Heart: This Honour must be given to exactly one High Elf Character. The Character and any unit he joins, is immune to panic. If the character is killed the High Elf player loses 100 Victory points from their total at the end of the battle. If a scenario is not using Victory points than the demise has no affect.

Points: 0

Lion Guard: The character comes equipped with a lion cloak. The character and any unit he leads are stubborn. The character can be mounted on a lion Chariot for +125pts but uses up a special slot. One unit of White Lions becomes a special choice (Only one special unit per army). The character cannot be mounted on a dragon of any kind.

Points: 50

Swordmaster: the Character is equipped with a great weapon and may not take a magic weapon. Instead of striking last in any turn he doesn’t charge, the character will strike in Initiative order. The character also has the Killing Blow ability and +1 Ws.

Points: 40

Phoenix Keeper: The character causes fear and has a 4+ ward save. Also the character is Immune to Psycology. One unit of Phoenix Guard becomes a special choice (Only one special unit per army).

Points: 60

Loremaster: The character is a level 1 Wizard. He may not cast spells while wearing armour (Barding excluded).

Points: 40

Seer: Mage only. May choose his spells instead of rolling for them.

Points: 25

Channeller: Mage only. May cast with a maximum of +1 more Power dice than normal.

Points: 10

Shadow Stalker: The character has the scout rule and hates all Dark Elves. Also enemy units shooting at the character or fighting the character are at a –1 to hit.

Points: 30


Thats it so far.
Cheers

Octavius_Maximus
15-10-2008, 09:08
So...um...you took away all of their Always strikes first ability...

So, um, why would anyone play high elves when they will just be smashed into the dirt?

Hellebore
16-10-2008, 07:28
So basically every other army in the game always gets smashed into the dirt too, considering they don't have ASF either? :rolleyes:

I think it has to be one of the DUMBEST rules put in an army book EVER. Even 40k has realised that you don't make binary extreme rules, replacing Always strikes first with Strikes at I10.

Apparently though Warhammer thinks it's ok to still have a system like that. Personally they should just chuck out always strikes first and make everything Initiative based, with positives for charging/spears/lances etc.

That way the elves can still strike first against most things but against BLOODTHIRSTERS they will strike in the order they really should, ie last.

Hellebore

theunwantedbeing
16-10-2008, 08:04
So basically its a mishmash of the old book and the new one....
Not sure it's actually better though.

You also seem to be ignoring certain rules that seem to appear in 7th edition.
Like mounts and such not using up special slots anymore.
Also your command upgrades seem rather cheap.
Not to mention certain abusive combo's seem available...stubborn star dragon on ld10 for one.

theradon
16-10-2008, 14:37
Just a few things I thought was 'wrong' with the book that I wanted redone:

* Make Barding optional for Silver Helms instead of Shields. Medium cavalry at Mov9 just might compete with Dragon Princes, or at least see them in play once in a while.

* Make Archers better, either by shooting in two ranks or perhaps no -1 to-hit for long range. They pale in comparison to other elf archery units.

* Weapon options for Shadow Warriors.

* Able to take a Dragon Mage without the Dragon. Weird, I know, but that's the only instance I would consider taking one I think. :P

* Bring back honours!

All-in-all I'm satisfied with the current book. ASF gives a unique defensive advantage, although I will admit it's a bit strange that Archaeon charging in with his horse of doom will still take some stabs in the eye from the High Elf Archers before he gets to do anything.

Octavius_Maximus
16-10-2008, 23:35
So basically every other army in the game always gets smashed into the dirt too, considering they don't have ASF either?

Use your brain, not all other armies wear predominantly light armour and have To3 with such high points costs.



I think it has to be one of the DUMBEST rules put in an army book EVER. Even 40K has realised that you don't make binary extreme rules, replacing Always strikes first with Strikes at I10.

Apparently though Warhammer thinks it's ok to still have a system like that. Personally they should just chuck out always strikes first and make everything Initiative based, with positives for charging/spears/lances etc.

That way the elves can still strike first against most things but against BLOODTHIRSTERS they will strike in the order they really should, ie last.


Why is that?

Hellebore
16-10-2008, 23:45
Use your brain, not all other armies wear predominantly light armour and have To3 with such high points costs.

Why is that?

:rolleyes:

Insults get you nowhere.

MOST armies in this game wear predominantly light armour and are T3. Their points costs are not anymore higher than most other armies either, because they have OTHER stats that are superior.

Dark Elves are T3
Almost all Daemons are T3
Wood Elves are T3
Empire T3
Bretonnia T3
Half the orc army is T3

Of the above, the first 3 aren't cheap and Bretonnia and Empire troops suck in every other department compared to elves (M, WS, BS, I, Ld).

The arguement is complete crap used to justify a stupid rule.

I also explained WHY ASF is a stupid rule, so if you didn't read it well I can't help you.

Hellebore

-Grimgorironhide-
19-10-2008, 08:43
Magic items part 1.

Magic Items

Common:

Sword of Striking: +1 to hit (Weapon). 15pts

Sword of Battle: +1 Attack (Weapon). 15pts

Sword of Might: +1 Strength (Weapon). 10pts

Biting Blade: -1 to enemy armour saves (Weapon). 5pts

Enchanted Shield: 5+ armour save (Armour). 15pts

Talisman of Protection: 6+ Ward Save (Talisman). 10pts

Dispel Scroll: Auto dispel of an enemy spell. One use only (Arcane) 25pts

Power Stone: +2 dice to cast a spell. One use only (Arcane) 25pts

Staff of Sorcery: +1 to dispel (Arcane). 40pts

War banner: +1 Combat resolution (Banner). 25pts


Magic Weapons:

Sword of Undying Wrath: The bearer gains additional attacks equal to the unit strength of which it is in contact with and the bearers’ attacks are at +1 strength. In addition if the bearer is killed before it can strike back the unit/ character who killed it suffer hits at the strength and attack number of the bearer + the unit strength number the bearer was in contact with.
Points Cost: 80

Sword of Hoeth: All hits wound automatically. Enemies suffer a –2 to their armour saves.
Points Cost: 60

Bow of The Seafarer: Longbow. Resolve hits like a bolt thrower. You can still stand and shoot with this weapon.
Points Cost: 55

Blade of Leaping Gold: The bearer gains +3 Attacks to his profile.
Points Cost: 50

The Star lance: +3 Strength and ignores armour saves on the charge. (Can only be taken on mounted characters and only works while mounted. Treat as a magical hand weapon if on foot after you’re monstrous mount dies.)
Points Cost: 45

Reaver Bow: Longbow. The Bearer may shoot three times in each shooting phase and hits are resolved at Strength 5.
Points Cost: 40

Blade of Darting Steel: The Bearer Always Strikes First. In addition all attacks by the bearer hit automatically.
Points Cost: 35

Blade of Sea Gold: No armour saves may be taken against wounds caused by this weapon.
Points Cost: 35

The White Sword: The bearer gains +2 Strength and the Killing Blow ability.
Points Cost: 35

Foe Bane: All hits on targets with 3 or more wounds will always wound on a 2+ no matter what its toughness is. Armour saves are modified by the strength of the bearer.
Points Cost: 25


cheers.

Octavius_Maximus
19-10-2008, 09:54
Insults get you nowhere.

Good, now neither of us should resort to it again.



MOST armies in this game wear predominantly light armour and are T3. Their points costs are not anymore higher than most other armies either, because they have OTHER stats that are superior.

Dark Elves are T3
Almost all Daemons are T3
Wood Elves are T3
Empire T3
Bretonnia T3
Half the orc army is T3

Dark Elves have army wide Hatred, lots of extra attacks and a huge amount of powerful shooting.

daemons have heaps of very fast moving, very strong troops

wood elves have large amount of Skirmish formations and the ability to move the terrain while ignoring it.

Empire have Cheap troops with powerful and cheap shooting.

Bretonnia have speed, power on the charge, very heavy armour and the blessing

Goblins are incredibly cheap and have access to things such as fanatics. There are also Squig hoppers and herders who make up for their Toughness with pure damage potential.

High Elves have high stats which are redundant in this game (Ws and Initiative), they are expensive, their shooting is average (archers, Shadow warriors, Sea Guard and Bolt Throwers, all expensive for what they do) their armour is weak, they lack a huge speed advantage.

What they do have, is Always strikes first. Its what gives them an edge in combat, and in the game.

Without it, they are expensive empire swordsmen.



Sword of Undying Wrath: The bearer gains additional attacks equal to the unit strength of which it is in contact with and the bearers’ attacks are at +1 strength. In addition if the bearer is killed before it can strike back the unit/ character who killed it suffer hits at the strength and attack number of the bearer + the unit strength number the bearer was in contact with.
Points Cost: 80

Elves arnt known for their numbers, i would have an extra attack for the rank bonus the enemy is claiming.

theunwantedbeing
19-10-2008, 10:22
Weaponskilll....higher than most, hardly redundant.
Initiutive? You get ASF Initiutuive is irrelevant 99% of the time.
Average shooting? it's no worse than the dark elves..just less volume and more accurate.
Expensive? 9pt warriors...12pt daemons, dragon princes are cheaper than flesh hounds yet hit HARDER.
Weak armour eh? DE suffer the same problem, daemons are lucky to get armour..wood elves have nearly no armour.
Lack huge speed?mv5 infantry, mv8-9 cavalry....not sure how that's lacking huge speed.

Without ASF they're not even remotely crippled, the difficulty curve just increases a lot and they become very unforgiving.

You can make any army sound rubbish by spouting a bunch of bad points about them while spouting a bunch of good points about other armies. Especially if you slightly exaggerate things in favour of everyone else and not in your own favour.

Anyway about the items....
The sword of undying wrath seems rather powerful, it would be worth making it an on foot only item as you can easily gain +4(or rather a lot more) attacks with it...giving you 7+ st5 attacks easily.

You appear to have just cheapened a lot of the items, not sure that's overly fair.

Octavius_Maximus
19-10-2008, 11:31
Weaponskilll....higher than most, hardly redundant.

Really? most base warriors are Ws4 at least, 9 races basic troop have Ws4 (or 5)



Initiutive? You get ASF Initiutuive is irrelevant 99% of the time.

Which is different to normally how? You charge, or you dont. Most combats are ended on the first turn. Most things which are tough enough to survive your charge are slow anyway (like Dwarfs)


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Average shooting? it's no worse than the dark elves..just less volume and more accurate.

Dark Elf shooting is much better since you can have more shots from less models. Thats the important ratio.


Expensive? 9pt warriors...12pt daemons, dragon princes are cheaper than flesh hounds yet hit HARDER.

Dragon princes are easy to kill with the right tools, a Flesh Hounds ward save always works

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Weak armour eh? DE suffer the same problem, daemons are lucky to get armour..wood elves have nearly no armour.

Daemons have ward saves, Wood elves can avoid being shot/hit and the ones which you do hit probably have a ward save.


Lack huge speed?mv5 infantry, mv8-9 cavalry....not sure how that's lacking huge speed.

Mv speed is hardly an advantage like that. Cavalry is fast, the differences in speed are hardly worth caring about. (im a dwarf player)




Without ASF they're not even remotely crippled, the difficulty curve just increases a lot and they become very unforgiving.

I would like to face this army with my dwarfs. It would be good fun, for me that is.



You can make any army sound rubbish by spouting a bunch of bad points about them while spouting a bunch of good points about other armies. Especially if you slightly exaggerate things in favour of everyone else and not in your own favour.


You can make any army sound rubbish if you ignore their main saving rule. The problem is that without ASF, high elves really are rubbish!

theunwantedbeing
19-10-2008, 11:44
Your dwarf army often gets to charge high elves then?
If not then ASF or not, your troops fight last. So no ASF makes no difference whatsoever to your army.

Octavius_Maximus
19-10-2008, 12:06
Your dwarf army often gets to charge high elves then?
If not then ASF or not, your troops fight last. So no ASF makes no difference whatsoever to your army

1. Im not selfish, i like to think of the High Elf army against other players, as well as me.
2. I do get the Charge off against High Elves occaisionally due to the Anvil of doom, i know that if i do this, that Elf unit is as good as dead. At least now they have a chance at killing a Dwarf or 2 and holding.