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Rookie1986
21-10-2008, 09:36
Are there any rules/regulations that dictate the smallest army you can field?

Also what do you guys feel is the smallest you would go and still consider it a worth while encounter?

/Rookie

kroq'gar
21-10-2008, 09:37
750, no magic & no magic items. Keep the same minimum core etc.

Leogun_91
21-10-2008, 09:52
500pts works out less is only worth it if it is a character deathmatch and those are hardly worth it anyway. The smallest you can field......hmm say two units of 10 orcs thatīs 100pts for both and then a nightgoblin bigboss for 30pts to lead the army, thatīs 130pts and itīs not easy getting less (it is probobobly possible thou)

Rookie1986
21-10-2008, 10:00
So in real terms lower then 750 would be hardly worth it but it is easy to assemble an army for a lot lower then that,

So i guess that brings me to a different question,

"What is the cheapest unit available in the world of Warhammer?"

Leogun_91
21-10-2008, 10:30
So in real terms lower then 750 would be hardly worth it but it is easy to assemble an army for a lot lower then that,

So i guess that brings me to a different question,

"What is the cheapest unit available in the world of Warhammer?"
Well a squig herd is 30pts, a spearchukka 35pts, a pumpwagon 40pts,10 gnoblars 40pts, 10 orcs 50pts, 20 goblins 60pts 10 dwarfs 80pts. There are alot of cheap units but they have to be core in order to give you a small pts army.
500pts battles are actually worthwhile as well thou they are the kind you play when you donīt have much time.

Sidorio
21-10-2008, 10:31
i'm pretty sure that clanrat slaves are 2pts a model, though you'll need to correct me if i'm wrong and some of their other units are really cheap.

kroq'gar
21-10-2008, 10:35
Yeah, a slave is 20 points (so 40points for 20).


Every army has some cheap options (even HE have the old regiment of 10 archers).

At this level points and with characters restricted, small units have large roll to play (such as a regiment of 5 greatswords becomes viable)

Lordsaradain
21-10-2008, 10:43
As leogun mentioned, 2x10 orcs and a night goblin big boss as general is a perfectly legal army to field and comes down to only 130 points.

The second closest army in cheapness would be 2x10 halberdiers/spearmen/free companies and an empire captain @ 150pts.

Warriors of chaos; 2x10 marauders and a chaos sorcerer is 165 points.

Lizardmen; 2x10 skinks and a skink cheif is 175 points.

Beasts of Chaos; 2 Beastherds (5 gors, 5 ungors) and a wargor is 180 points.

Dark elves; 2x10 warriors and a master is 200 points.

Personally, the smallest I would field would depend on which army I played, but definetly not below 500.

yeancientone
21-10-2008, 10:51
I still use the Border Patrol rules -

500 points
minimum one core unit
maximum one special/rare unit
maximum four units in army
maximum one war machine (ratling guns / warpfire throwers count as war machines)

One hero character for general - there was a maximum points cost, but I don't recall how much.

The rules are not on the new site, but I think they're still valid (though possibly not 'official')

W0lf
21-10-2008, 11:03
500 pts lowest.

Though im a predominantly chaos player and i usually play only 2K.

Below 2K and i tend to play wood elves, people dont like woodies in small pts games, cant say i wonder why tbh.

BigbyWolf
21-10-2008, 11:33
Games around the 100-200pts mark can be quite fun. I do remember GW talking about it many years ago (I believe it was in an issue of WD), their idea was for people to play "lunchtime" games with a 30 minute time limit. This was using an older edition rules though, so I'm not sure how it would work now.

Lordsaradain
21-10-2008, 11:42
One hero character for general - there was a maximum points cost, but I don't recall how much.



125 was the limit I believe.

Condottiere
21-10-2008, 12:34
High Elves - 1 core unit of 10 Spears plus champion, 100 points.

Kahadras
21-10-2008, 13:40
Depends. One idea my club was thinking over a while back was 500 points with champions being allowed to lead the army (so no heroes are needed). TBH though some armies don't work very well at less then 2,000 points so the idea kinda got canned. Small point games are a lot of fun though and don't take much time to play either. I tend to sugest starting newbies off in small 500 point games then raising it to 1000, 1500 and finaly 2000+. Helps them grasp the rules and such without becoming overly complicated.

Kahadras

Lordsaradain
21-10-2008, 17:09
High Elves - 1 core unit of 10 Spears plus champion, 100 points.

You need a hero as general.

Aurellis
21-10-2008, 17:18
I had a 300 point game once with my Dark Elves, it was pretty pointless and not very tactically challenging. Due to the low points level it is hard for any tactical flexibility so you might have one side just charging in, while the other side shoots to the death. This is the main reason small games don't work. They don't feel 'complete' and lack depth

TheRaven476
21-10-2008, 18:18
I would say that 500 points is too small unless it's your first few games and you're just trying to get the rules down. For a real game I would definately say 750 points is the minimum. The reason I don't like 500 point games is because some armies (Horde armies mainly) are just so much better when compared to elite armies. I was in a tournament that started at 500 points once and big supprise the Orc Goblin army would completely dominate. I know it's only supposed to be for fun but elite armies just can't beat a horde army at that low amount of points, they just get overwhelemed.

I played high elves and I was unable to beat out the orcs, the only way I could compete was hoping my mage had a good day. 5 silverhelms, 1 bolt thrower and 11 spearmen (This was back when ranks only needed to be 4 long) with my mage leading came to the 500 points, while the Orc Goblin player had 2 units of goblins a bolt thrower a unit of orcs and an orc champion leading a unit of boar boys that was 62 models to my 17 (Bolt throwers not included). Horde armies just completely overwhelm elite armies at 500 points.

Harwammer
21-10-2008, 19:22
500 points is good, but warhammer becomes a completely different game at this point.

Rather than beating up the enemy army your objectives should be controlling the board and containing the enemy within one quarter. Additionally you should be using cheap 'assasination' units to strike your opponents general.

Simply haveing two more uncontested table quarters and killed the enemy general will put you at a massacare at this points level.

Doing things like only taking 2 units that can claim table quarters and taking a fragile general (e.g. T3, no armour) at this level just shows you haven't thought about strategy unless you expect to completely remove the enemy off the table with brute force.

Condottiere
21-10-2008, 19:30
You need a hero as general.I thought the Champion qualified at this level? Never mind.

Hero general - High Elf noble with great weapon, Dragon Armour and shield, 101 points.

Spear regiment with 10 models, 90 points.

Grand total 191 points.

Harwammer
21-10-2008, 19:47
PS 185 points seems to be the min DoW army; 2x8 duelists, 1 pay master, 1 captain.

As a side note how do DoW work for border patrol? under usual circumstances they are required to take a pay master AND a second character to act as the general. Apparently his would break the border princes rules unless there is an exception.

Ward.
22-10-2008, 04:16
I would say that 500 points is too small unless it's your first few games and you're just trying to get the rules down. For a real game I would definately say 750 points is the minimum. The reason I don't like 500 point games is because some armies (Horde armies mainly) are just so much better when compared to elite armies. I was in a tournament that started at 500 points once and big supprise the Orc Goblin army would completely dominate. I know it's only supposed to be for fun but elite armies just can't beat a horde army at that low amount of points, they just get overwhelemed.

I played high elves and I was unable to beat out the orcs, the only way I could compete was hoping my mage had a good day. 5 silverhelms, 1 bolt thrower and 11 spearmen (This was back when ranks only needed to be 4 long) with my mage leading came to the 500 points, while the Orc Goblin player had 2 units of goblins a bolt thrower a unit of orcs and an orc champion leading a unit of boar boys that was 62 models to my 17 (Bolt throwers not included). Horde armies just completely overwhelm elite armies at 500 points.

Thats last edition when high elf infantry sucked and O&G didn't. It's different now that most elites units have 2 attacks.

@Harwammer: Yes there is an exception in the border patrol rules, it's a shame that they're so hard to find now because they really do make games interesting at low points levels (so long as you don't take a fighty character or more then a level 1 mage, that will quickly sap all the fun out of it).

gorenut
23-10-2008, 05:57
If you go to GW's website, theres rules for Warbands. Which are 250-500 pt games. I find them pretty fun. It allows you to do things like field units of infantry with a minimum of 3 models and cav as 2. I think maximum points spent on characters is 150 pts (you can have more than 1, just that both added can't be over 150 pts).

destroyerlord
23-10-2008, 11:49
Path to Glory rules for chaos warrior warbands are very fun, and would translate to <200 points (at least to start with), although they resemble Mordheim more than warhammer.

Lotho
23-10-2008, 13:39
Warbands is definitely the way to go 500 or less. Because all my friend are slow collecters we play this often 2v2, its a heap of fun and allows you to collect a unit you like regardless of rare or special. Theres still some tactics to it, 2model cav units allows it.

badgeraddict
23-10-2008, 13:55
The smallest possible army size for Bretonnia is a massive 318 points!

General - Paladin on Barded Warhorse 74pts

BSB Paladin on Barded Warhorse 74pts

Knights of the Realm x5 120pts

Men-at-Arms 10 50pts

Lordsaradain
23-10-2008, 14:00
They're almost right up there with daemons:

10x2 Lesser daemons (any of the core)
Herald of Slaanesh

330pts