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Latro
18-11-2005, 11:17
I have been using the same list now for about 10 battles against very different types of army with some degree of succes ... but especially after previous tournament I have a feeling that my army as it is too vulnerable in certain aspects:

The Tempest of Blood, a Khornate raiding party of 999 pts

Exalted Champion of Khorne @ 157 pts
- barded chaos steed, shield, great axe

5 Chosen Knights of Khorne @ 320 pts
- full command

2x 5 Marauder Horsemen @ 81 pts each
- musician, flails

Chariot of Khorne @ 150 pts

3x 5 Warhounds of Chaos @ 30 pts each

8 Chaos Furies @ 120 pts

2 power dice
5 dispel dice
40 models, 9 units to deploy

There are ofcourse also a lot of points about this list that I like (and therefore don't wan't to lose while tweaking it):

- It has a very strong theme: it is a fast moving Khornate raiding party. This means that any changes made must fit in this theme. It has to be fast and the Mark of Khorne should have a strong presence in the list.

- I don't have to waste points on things I don't really want (but do need to be competative). Don't you just hate wasting points on scroll caddies? Playing Khorne means you get them as a bonus when you take the Mark.

- It guarantees a lot of action on the battle-field, because I will be aiming my Chosen of Khorne at the most worthy prey on the board.

On the downside of it all:

- The double-edged sword called Frenzy. In a 2000 pts battle I can handle that without too much problems: having multiple threats makes it a lot harder for my opponents to avoid them all. In 1000 pts however I only have one really dependable unit-killer: The Chosen of Khorne. If they get distracted I have a real problem to get them in position again before the battle is over.

- The Chariot hasn't performed up to it's reputation so far (while performing great in 2000 pts). Again the size of the army is the problem here. The Chariot simply hasn't got the speed to arrive with the first wave, and after that it either isn't needed anymore or it's faced with a situation it cannot handle.

So after studying the armybooks, I came up with several options. The short-term options are easy to get ready for next tournament, and the long-term options are a more dramatic change in the list requiring me to buy new stuff and do more converting and painting.

Option 1 (short term)

Aspiring Champion of Khorne + 4 Knights of Khorne (standard+musician)
Aspiring Champion of Khorne + 4 Knights of Khorne (standard+musician)
2x 5 mounted Marauders (musician)
2x 5 warhounds of Chaos
6 Furies

By downgrading several units and scrapping the Chariot I get another character-lead unit of Knights. This gives me 2 fast and deadly units instead of one fast and very deadly and one slower less deadly unit. It also offers me 6 dispel dice. The downside would be that I have even less supporting units to keep even more fast frenzied lunatics under control.

Option 2 (short term)

Aspiring Champion of Khorne + 5 Knights of Khorne (full command)
Aspiring Champion of Chaos
Chariot of Khorne
2x 5 mounted Marauders (musician)
3x 5 warhounds of Chaos
6 Furies

Several units are downgraded to get me an Aspiring Champion of Chaos Undivided. The htting power of the list hasn't changed much, but now I have a reliable character to guard against annoying enemy units or to join a marauder unit and pose a serious and very flexible threat on the flanks.

Option 3 (long term)

Aspiring Champion of Khorne + 5 Knights of Khorne (full command)
2x 5 mounted Marauders (musician)
3x 5 warhounds of Chaos
8 Furies

and one of the following:

+ a Chaos Giant
+ a unit of Minotaurs (maybe of Khorne)
+ a unit of Dragon Ogres
+ maybe no Knights at all and just more of the above?

Any thought and experiences on the subject are very welcome. Let's make this the most flexible and competative Khorne list out there! ;)


:cool:

Killax
18-11-2005, 15:05
Great toughts on the Knights.

I do have to say i think list the new list 1 is the best of all. It would really be a sirieus treath to not be able to take out all the knights.

I do have to say the weakness in your first list was that it focussed to much on the chosen knights, one stonetrower or Reapeter BT would really thin them out.

The chariot still is a good option I think, but you really should take 2 instead of one.

TheDrugLordX
18-11-2005, 15:44
I would go with option #1.

Your first list focuses to much on one unit (as said), that's your biggest weakness. With those 2 knight units, you've split your strength to two units. Atleast one of these units should be able to wreck havoc, instead of the otherwise: none!

I like the list, hope it works for you!

Savnock
18-11-2005, 16:12
Agreed- option 1 tops it. Good versus shooting, magic etc. Defintiely not anything that still incorporates the chariot. Chariots don't really belong in cav lists, except TK and Gobbo wolfrider hordes- they're infantry-supplements.

The giant could be fun for friendlies. Always a good thing to have, and the new plastic kit is amazing.

Latro
18-11-2005, 16:13
Thanks for the replies so far!

At first I was kinda limited to one unit of knights due to the unpainted status of the rest. They became Chosen because the cost of just 60 points could not be spent on anything else that was useful.

... but now I have more knights! :evilgrin:


I am however having doubts about the first option when it comes to reliability. It has two knightly hammer units, but it only has 2 warhound units and sometimes some Furies to keep them under control. Most of the time the Marauders and the Furies are at the flanks putting early pressure on missile units and war machines ... one shooting phase could take out all my screens easily. :(


:cool:

TheDrugLordX
18-11-2005, 23:26
Chariots don't really belong in cav lists, except TK and Gobbo wolfrider hordes- they're infantry-supplements.
I don't agree with you. Sure, they might perform best in infantry armies. But they still have their uses in other cav armies. Also, they add a great deal of variation to the army, they fit the theme and are just oh so cool:cool:


I am however having doubts about the first option when it comes to reliability. It has two knightly hammer units, but it only has 2 warhound units and sometimes some Furies to keep them under control. Most of the time the Marauders and the Furies are at the flanks putting early pressure on missile units and war machines ... one shooting phase could take out all my screens easily.
Yeah, well. You can't excell on every aspect of the game with an army (especially this small). This is simply somthing you have to play-test in order to achieve the right balance. Anyways, I got a suggestion for ya:

If you get rid of one of the Aspiring Champions (now, I dunno how many points you've spent on them, but I think it should be enough no mather how many...). You then uppgrade 'his' (considering as you remove him it's not 'his' unit anymore) unit to chosen knights. This should still make the unit roughly as good as without chosen/with champ. This will (if I got my numbers right) save you some points, allowing for another unit of warhounds (or whatever you see fit).

I'm not sure It's actually a good improvement, but you said you wanted more support units and this was one idea that I came up with.

Latro
19-11-2005, 19:51
If you get rid of one of the Aspiring Champions (now, I dunno how many points you've spent on them, but I think it should be enough no mather how many...). You then uppgrade 'his' (considering as you remove him it's not 'his' unit anymore) unit to chosen knights. This should still make the unit roughly as good as without chosen/with champ. This will (if I got my numbers right) save you some points, allowing for another unit of warhounds (or whatever you see fit).

That would work! An Aspiring Champion of Khorne is roughly enough points for:

- upgrading a unit to Chosen
- buying one extra Knight
- adding one extra unit of 5 warhounds

Me being me I decided to go for another option anyway. It's going to be option 2, with the extra Aspiring Champion of Chaos. It may not be the most deadly/effective option, but it has several advantages I really like:

- It adds more diversity to the list, which is always a good thing in my opinion.

- It's gives me the possibility of using a very fast, very flexible and not-frenzied (=reliable) flanking unit, something I haven't got it this moment.

- It gives me a great excuse to convert a mounted Marauder Chieftain (which he basicly will be) ... the WD article about the Norse of Skeggi gave me inspiration!

:cool: