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Delicious Soy
28-04-2005, 09:22
So I was reading the B&C guide to DIY chapters and I came across the bit about only the Unforgiven hunting the Fallen. Off the top of my head I have never seen this explictly stated. Could someone source me?

malika
28-04-2005, 10:43
IIRC only the 2nd founding chapters know of the Fallen, not the other foundings

Delicious Soy
28-04-2005, 11:09
See I see people say this, but I've never actually seen it stated that only the 2nd founding chapters know.

gunhed
28-04-2005, 11:20
Are there any 3rd, 4th etc founding successors of the DA? I've only heard of the three second founding ones.

malika
28-04-2005, 11:33
See I see people say this, but I've never actually seen it stated that only the 2nd founding chapters know.

Which sources did you look through?

Delicious Soy
28-04-2005, 11:43
Well the IA: DA, Whatever bits of the Angels of Death codex I can find on the net and the 3rd ed codex. It's enitrely possible its mentioned in the AOD codex but the closest I've seen is the phrase 'The secret is only known to the Dark Angels and their successor chapters.' Which doesn't rule out those formed after the 2nd founding. Which brings me to gunhed's question. The fact is beyond the 2nd founding we only know scant bits and pieces about chapters. The Howling Griffons are one of a few chapters that are of later foundings and have an identified source, in their case Ultramarines.

charlie_c67
28-04-2005, 12:23
Think the main problem is that the 2nd founding chapters had a definite parent chapter, but all the others since are founded using the tithe method therefore making it a lot more likely that they have a mix of chapters. That could be wrong of course!

Karhedron
28-04-2005, 13:14
Theer was a short piece of fluff last year about DA successor chapters. It said that when chapter X was founded (possible Angels of Absolution) that the Dark Angels decided not to induct them into the Deathwing and the secrets of the Chapter's past.

charlie_c67
28-04-2005, 13:22
Also. You might want to consider....


There are no know aberrations in the Dark Angels' gene-seed which makes the reluctance of the High Lords of Terra to utilise it in the founding of new Chapters perplexing. No doubt there are other successor Chapters of the Dark Angels, but their names and when they were founded are unrecorded.

Delicious Soy
28-04-2005, 14:06
Theer was a short piece of fluff last year about DA successor chapters. It said that when chapter X was founded (possible Angels of Absolution) that the Dark Angels decided not to induct them into the Deathwing and the secrets of the Chapter's past.
Can I ask where it was? Usually I keep an eye out for DA stuff but I've never heard about this. I hope its not the Angels of Absolution, they're 2nd founding and that would throw an extra spanner in the works


Think the main problem is that the 2nd founding chapters had a definite parent chapter, but all the others since are founded using the tithe method therefore making it a lot more likely that they have a mix of chapters. That could be wrong of course!Not entirely wrong. There are several chapters of mixed geneseed (Relictors most prominently) but there are many 'purebreeds' like the Howling Griffons. That other tidbit you mentioned was one of the things I had in mind as evidence that the DA's continue to add to the ranks of the Unforgiven. Having a large group of tightly bonded marine chapters would be problematic to say the least.

charlie_c67
28-04-2005, 15:21
It means you could have a mix of the DA and SW and end up witha chapter that has good CC skills and fangs in old age that have a deep dark secret they tell no-one and....oh wait, already been done ;)

Karhedron
28-04-2005, 15:30
Can I ask where it was? Usually I keep an eye out for DA stuff but I've never heard about this. I hope its not the Angels of Absolution, they're 2nd founding and that would throw an extra spanner in the works.
I will try to find it again, it was several months ago that I read it and I cannot remember where it was. It was probably not the Angels of Absolution in that case.

(trudges off to rummage through old WDs and get distracted in the process).

Karhedron
28-04-2005, 16:02
Ha, found it!

It is a piece of fluff regarding the Angels of Retribution.


+++The Angels of Retribution+++
After the Horus Heresy, the Dark Angels founded three chapters, to track the Fallen. These three chapters share in the secret of the Fallen. As the glorious light of the Emperor was shed on more star systems, the Space Marines needed to create more chapters, in order to better protect the believers from the traitors of Chaos. Thus, the Angels of Vengeance founded the Angels of Retribution. The Masters of the Unforgiven decided that it would be improper to share the secrets of the Fallen with this lesser chapter, and so the Angels of Retribution were not initiated into the secrets of the deathwing, or that of the interrigator-chaplains. The Angel of Retribution were gifted with two things:

The chapter standard

The secrets of the Ravenwing. The Angels of Retribution refer to this part of their chapter as "the Emperor's Fist".

The Angels of Retribution use The Codex Astartes standard markings to reflect their lack of knowledge of the Fallen, though this is unknown to them. The company itself emphasizes mobility and firepower, scattering the Emperor's Fist throughout the battle companies, so that each battle company might be self-sufficient, working together as a unit. In addition, the veterans are not separated out into a spearate company, but lead their companies, lending their expereince to the younger brother marines who are rising to veteran status themselves. The scouts are also attached to a company after they are implanted with the gene-seed of the Dark Angels, as passed to the Angel of Retribution. This overall effect of this is to create a strong sense of unity in the companies, making them into a complete fighting force that is accomplished at working together.

This sense of unity is directed into the Glory of the Emperor by the Chaplains of the Angels of Retribution. Unlike most other chapters, the Angels of Retribution have at least three chaplains in a given company. This scheme was originally decided on by the Master of the Dark Angels to prevent the blandishments of the Fallen from turning the Chapter from the Glory of the Emperor. That the Chapter still maintains a large number of chaplains is a tribute to both their devoutness and their steadfastness. Because the companies have diverse troop types, they are larger than the norm. There are only eight companies in the Angels of Retribution. There are the five battle companies and one reserve company for each of the major tactical types. The reserve companies serve as a home for Space Marines whose squads have sustained excessive casualties, or who left their original company to seek veteran status. The Chapter Standard is given for a fifty year period to the company that has distinguished itself most in the eyes of the Emperor in the previous period.

For a company to maintain the standard, it must excel beyond the level which allowed it to attain the standard in the first place, for the standard aids the marines in battle. In the history of the Chapter, only the second company has been able to retain the standard for a second fifty year period. In the end of the fourty-first millenium, the Angels of Retribution have been given the task to protect the world of Anduin. For reasons unknown, the Eldar seek something on this world. The Angels of Retribution have fought many campaigns across the forests of Anduin against the Fire Warhost of the Eternal Night, under the command of Eldrad Ulthran. His warhost has left the Craftworld and what he seeks in unknown, but it must be of great importance to the Eldar to cause Eldar to leave the craftworld at his great age. The fourth company has born the brunt of the fighting to date, since they are the current bearers of the Standard of Retribution.

Delicious Soy
29-04-2005, 00:02
I can't believe I missed that. What WD was it in?

Captain Stuart
29-04-2005, 01:44
I can't find the issue, but I beliee it came out of the Eye of Terror or it is post-EoT campaign.

Sorry I can't be of more help. IIRC it was an article about the Space Marine chapters after the EoT. May also have been on the EoT web site.

gunhed
29-04-2005, 17:44
May also have been on the EoT web site.

Does the link to this site still exist?