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View Full Version : 500pts Starting armies... Deamons unfair?



Calious
01-12-2008, 23:16
Ok, so a fair few of my mates (some gw staff included) are going to be starting (or restarting i guess) some fantasy armies soon, mostly to get me and the others who dont play into playing the game.

So... I was choosing between Warriors of Chaos, Dark Elves and Deamons..

I (mistakenly?) chose Deamons. So... I'm coming to you guys for some advice on starting up my army.

I'll start by saying this isnt a "build me a list" post. I'm purely after advice on what would constitute a "fair" 500pts to begin with, because as I understand it Deamons are a little on the vicious side, I've got the choice of Mono-god or Multi-god lists...

My initial leaning is towards Tzeentch. I'm a huge fan of magic in WHFB, and The Changer of Ways is a favourite of mine.

I'm also thinking a Slaanesh based army could be pretty fun, as Slaanesh is my other preffered god.

BUT I definately get the impression that a mono-Tzeentch list, which would be a herald, scribes, 2 horror units in my rough mental calculations would be frowned upon or just less than fun to play against.

My other idea would be a fast moving Slaanesh army, although I am yet to come up with a basic list, purely because I'm a bit of a noob to fantasy and really fail to see whats good and what isnt due to experiance.

To me M6 S3 I5 A2 guys don't scream worth it for 12pts. Now this is the 40k side of me talking. For instance I know the whole ASF thing kicks bottom if i mix in a herald, and that Armour Piercing is pretty cool. But wizards are also cool, very cool, in a way that producing large amounts of painful glitter is cool.

So so so so so, I guess I want to know if I'll end up hampering myself if I take a mono-Slaanesh list, would i be advised to take a list that incorporated Slaanesh and Stzeentch deamons?


Note: the main reason I chose to do deamons was that I can, through clever use of magnets, allow them to be placed on both 40k and fantasy bases, thus making myself a 40k army in the process. As such, I'm keen on Nurgle in 40k, a little, mainly for objective taking, oh and Ku'gath. But my love with anything Nurgle based very fickle and (like today) I can feel incredibly apathetic to any Nurgle based units. In both systems I've never had any great love of Khorne, and probably won't field any of his creations without good reason, you know, like winning(lots).

Oh, and I think the other armies so far are.. VC(other noob), High Elves, Dwarves and Warriors of Chaos (maybe) that I know of.

rodmillard
02-12-2008, 00:10
Given the list of other armies, i wouldn't feel too bad about magic heavy, as all 4 are capable of putting out some pretty effective magic defense (although they may not thank you for putting them in the position where they have to).

Monogod is the way to go to start with, although there's nothing to stop you adding other forces later - start with 500 points of Tzeentch, then get 500 points of Slaanesh, then add 500 Nurgle...

Of the two, I would say go Slaanesh. The mobility is not to be sniffed at - consider that your daemonettes can move 6 and march 12, while your horror units would move 4 and march 8. The only one of your opponents who could possibly out manoeuver you is the WoC player (and then only if he goes all cav). Plus, the herald's ASF ability would make you the only force that can get the drop on the HE...

itcamefromthedeep
02-12-2008, 00:37
To be fair, that High Elf player could field a Dragon-Mage and a unit of 10 Archers. As far as uncool armies go, that one's up there.

I suggest a mix of units. If Tzeench, bring a Herald, some Horrors, and some Flamers. If Slaanesh, then a Herald, Daemonettes, and Seekers.

It's hard to go wrong with a good mix.

==Me==
02-12-2008, 00:39
Is there any points level where Daemons are fair? :p

A Tzeentch magic spam list would be horribly brutal at 500 points. Most armies are lucky to have 4 PD, Tzeentch armies roll up with 6 or so minimum (20 Horrors, Herald) leaving 145 points to spend on Flamers and gifts for the Herald. Master of Sorcery and 3 Flamers would be stupidly good, with the extra 15 points going to another Horror or musicians.

Mono Slaanesh would be nicer, but not by much. The Masque (or a normal Herald if you're nice), Daemonettes, Seekers with the "no flee for you!" banner, and Fiends will make a proper mess of anything short of Ironbreakers and heavy cav (hello Etherblade!)

lord marcus
02-12-2008, 00:55
To be fair, that High Elf player could field a Dragon-Mage and a unit of 10 Archers. As far as uncool armies go, that one's up there.

I suggest a mix of units. If Tzeench, bring a Herald, some Horrors, and some Flamers. If Slaanesh, then a Herald, Daemonettes, and Seekers.

It's hard to go wrong with a good mix.

noob sun dragon + tzeentch magic = "who wants thier elf leg crispy?"

Calious
02-12-2008, 01:45
ok, so apart from M 10? is the Masque any good? lol, I assume so due to the above comments. Deamonettes much good? overall I mean. Would a flank charge from seekers break a unit? I've got 6 of them, would that be enough?

I think that coming from a 40k background, the possible 500pts of slaanesh doesnt have the hitting power I'd feel it needs. That and master of sorcery seems godly at 500pts, for free range of spells, AND tailor choosing lore to combat enemy... Metal for cav heavy? etc...

Gonna be spending about 50-100 soon on Deamons, so am deciding my starting force. Also, looks like i'll be comming into a few Khorne units soon. bloodletters and hounds mostly i think. So feel free to suggest khornate ways to go now as well... (but in doing so, i'll drop the nurgle aspect, as i'd rather stick to 1-2 gods, but 3 is tolerable, 4 and i'm not so keen, don't ask why :P)

Nicha11
02-12-2008, 02:19
ok, so apart from M 10? is the Masque any good? lol, I assume so due to the above comments. Deamonettes much good? overall I mean. Would a flank charge from seekers break a unit? I've got 6 of them, would that be enough?


6 Seekers :eek: In fantasy Cavalry charges are very poweful and infantry find it to stand against them.

The seekers would lay down some serieous hurt.

I'd go with mono slaneesh, Daemonettes aren't bad and ASF is always brutal.

==Me==
02-12-2008, 03:56
The Masque has a solid statline, high M, and it's neat Ld/M affecting power. It's always a good choice.

Seekers may not hit all that hard, but with M10 they can hit when and where you want them to, so take out lightly armored units, war machine crews, or flank/rear charge in concert with your blocks. +2 for a rear charge and negating ranks can often win a combat all on its own, plus negating shield bonuses lets you kill even more.

Bloodletters are ok, probably the least effective Core unit (after Plaguebearers without a Herald) but still quite good against heavy infantry and characters. Flesh Hounds win so hard you may lose friends over them.

StormCrow
02-12-2008, 04:06
If it were me Id have a flying tzeentch herald, 2 units of horrors and a some flamers...yes it's probably frowned upon but tzeentch is awesome so sucked in. And if you face any form of fast moving combat army you're screwed so it balances out.

And as an aside one unit of dragon princes would beat the whole army

Calious
02-12-2008, 10:28
Hmm, all pretty compelling arguments, I'll draw up some Slaanesh lists today, with a tzeentch one or 2, and see how it goes...

Are there rules for 500pt games as far as composition goes?

Neknoh
02-12-2008, 13:08
Personally, I would go for a Herald, a unit or two of the baseline troops and some form of moving flanker/anti-flanker unit.

So, for Tzeentch, the suggested

Herald w gifts
20 Horrors
3 Flamers

seems a fairly decent list, not a lot in the way of combat though

For Slaanesh, I would say keep mask away untill higher points levels and go for something like

Herald (need to go get my book, but can he/She/it take Siren Song?)
12 Daemonettes
6 Seekers w Banner of No Charge Reactions

and use the points left over to add, perhaps, another six daemonettes to the unit or similar

Calious
03-12-2008, 00:47
Ok... So after buying myself a box of Deamonettes today, thats probably the way I'll end up going... (got my magnets on order too, 150 for 12... bargain!)

So, gifts depending...

Herald
Unit of Deamonettes
6 Seekers (only got 6)

I really should get the book out to add these things up. But I'll do that when it's not late and I'm not as tired...