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Necrotyr18
09-12-2008, 02:31
Well this list is mainly for fun, I'm not really intending on starting it, unless I am told here that it is a good list, which I doubt. Well let's dive right into it:
________________________________________________
Kairos Fateweaver
__
Herald of Tzeentch:
-Banner of Hellfire
-Winged Horror
-Power Vortex
__
22 Horrors
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22 Horrors
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23 Horrors
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23 Horrors

Total - 1995

It has 21 power dice and one bound spell. Just to repeat something, TWENTY-ONE power dice, with the possibility for more with the Boon of Tzeentch spell. The idea is to have the two flying casters fly up along the edges of the table and stay out of line of sight while causing havoc. Have the four horror units stay back and shoot magic missles each turn.

All comments appreciated.

Nicha11
09-12-2008, 04:49
This army is about as one dimensional sometimes powerful sometimes not so.

This list would get destroyed by anthing with decent magic resistance (Flesh Hounds of Khorne).

At the end of the day its just a one trick pony.

Lord Dan
09-12-2008, 04:55
To answer the question posed in the thread's title, this would be too much.

fubukii
09-12-2008, 12:25
id combine 2 of the horror untis and go for a 40 man horror block then add some furies :)

I recently ran a 40 man horror block in a 3000 pt game, and wow did it work well!

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 03:15
Alright well just an attempt to make this more competitive I dropped one 22 man unit of Horrors for 6 Flamers. The list looks like this:

Kairos Fateweaver

Herald of Tzeentch - Banner of Hellfire, Winged Horror, Power Vortex

23 Horrors

23 Horrors

23 Horrors

6 Flamers


This should let me keep a dominate hand in the magic phase along with the ability to take out Magic Resistant units.

Asmodai48
10-12-2008, 03:41
So easy to counter not funny.

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 03:44
So easy to counter not funny.

The point of forums is to provide ideas and/or suggestions for the OP, now this does neither but tell me it really isn't a good list, which is fine but at least state why.

Easy to counter because:
-Any melee will destroy me
-Magic resistance will cause a problem
-dispel scrolls will ruin my day

Something to that line is more acceptable.

Asmodai48
10-12-2008, 04:00
Just from the 3 armies i play from what i can think of off the top of my head...

Dragon princes? Wont be fun
Vampire counts in general can probly take the beating while keeping there units alive to reach you.
Dwarfs wouldnt mind having a shoot out with there excelent magic defences.

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 04:06
You know and I completly agree, though with all lists there is a negative and all you need to do is exploit it.

Dragon princes: The beast cowers from Kairos could make him almost inactive for the game or a Bolt of Tzeentch from the Horrors could end his day OR he could shred me into pieces the question is which is more likely?

Vampire Counts make me a little nervous my only real thinking is to dispel all summoning spells and just take massive amounts of magic missles.

Dwarves also with their artillery, I could probably only stand for 2 two turns if I didn't kill off most of the ranged attacks.

Of the three presented I feel Dwarves would cause the most problems. Going back a bit, are the Flamers better or the Horrors?

Lord Dan
10-12-2008, 04:06
You have an army consisting entirely of Dragon Princes? It's a good thing they have magic resistance against all those magic missiles. Oh wait...

VC would be smashed into the ground. You'd never get a spell off, and he'd quickly rip through the units you wouldn't be able to raise back up.

Dwarves are the one army I would admit to have a decent chance of standing up to this list. However anything that "Sits there and shoots while you move up" isn't something I'd brag about winning with anyway.

EDIT: The horrors were a good substitution.

Asmodai48
10-12-2008, 04:09
Vc never get off a spell with 17 pd plus bound spells? kk
Also dragon princes with BSB with magic banner immune to all spells with there armour protecting them from the flamers not much would stop them..

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 04:12
Vc never get off a spell with 17 pd plus bound spells? kk

No they maybe would have 8-9 PD with maybe 1-2 bound items. I have 11 Dispel Dice. Also keep in mind the numbers for the VC above are being generous considering they are magic heavy.

EDIT: Lord Dan to be clear you think that the Flamers are better than the Horrors?

Asmodai48
10-12-2008, 04:15
You think 8-9 pd is magic heavy for VC? lol..

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 04:17
You think 8-9 pd is magic heavy for VC? lol..

Again with not explaining you reasoning.

If the VC is combat heavy he may not have that much magic though he may make it to my lines, at least his magic will be in check.

If he is magic heavy I don't really need to worry about the charge and his magic may be a bit harder to keep in line.

Just my thinking.

Havock
10-12-2008, 04:44
High Elves: Assuming you tailor to each other, he brings a certain items that blocks off your entire magic phase for one go; then his stuff hits you. Hard.

Current mortals; because even with all those PD; Kairos will fail -or even miscast himself- to cast a spell at least once per turn. In comes the black tongue with once more a good possibility of: losing a level, shutting down the magic phase or dying.

Asmodai48
10-12-2008, 04:48
From what VC lists i have vsed and the VC lists i have used 17 is pretty normal think 14 is the least i have ever used and whats wrong with dwarfs sitting there and shooting them to bits.

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 04:53
@Havock: That would certainly be an interesting game would it not? That is another thing that worried me was miscast, but I'm pretty certain it won't happen to Kairos. He has the Tzeentch's will ability which let's him re-roll one di used in a spell, which allows a irrestable force or denial of a miscast.

@asmodai48: How many points are you talking, this is a 2k list for the army that can the most power dice if it tried the hardest and in 2k for VC you're telling my you can come 1 di shy of that. I'm sorry but I do believe you are yanking my chain. Do mean 14 PD + 3 bound items, which is possible and would just make for an interesting game.

I'm not looking for a beat all list, all I want to know is if this list would match it's points at least half the time?

Asmodai48
10-12-2008, 04:55
In 2k vamp lord 6 pd then 3 per vamp plus the 2 base thats 17 then theres bound items thats going heavy magic.
Although if you add the special char for tzeentch (cant remember his name one that flies on disk) for only 80ish pts every time vamps succesfully cast a spell you gain another power dice :P

Havock
10-12-2008, 05:07
@Havock: That would certainly be an interesting game would it not? That is another thing that worried me was miscast, but I'm pretty certain it won't happen to Kairos. He has the Tzeentch's will ability which let's him re-roll one di used in a spell, which allows a irrestable force or denial of a miscast.

he can still fail his to cast roll, and that means my lvl2 wizard takes a wound and you take a miscast ;)
That and i'll adjust that miscast by D3, if -I- don't like it (enough)
Roll 5 or less and you are at serious risk of a severe case of death :p

Zarahemna
10-12-2008, 08:52
Further to this I would point out that the Black Tongue is a generically useful item and is likely to appear in plenty of WoC armies as a magical defence.

fubukii
10-12-2008, 12:12
id suggest a larger horror unit, gettin bolt of change and added Durability in combat is a huge plus. Id also think about taking master of sorc and spell breaker on your herald its a bit more reliable.

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 12:58
You think I would be better off setting up my Herald differently, If I did this should I still keep the banner of Hellfire as the the only reason it was there was to cause havoc in the lines with flight.

If I was to set him up differently he would become cheaper in points and I should use that make one Horrror squad larger.

I'll playtest it both ways and see which works better, though do we think the Flamers are better or the Horrors?

fubukii
10-12-2008, 19:35
flamers are good, better then horrors in some ways and not in others. Flamers can always do damage, but can not hurt targets imune to fire. In addition flamers generally have to get within9 inches to be extremely effective and are decent in combat. Horrors are more durable in large units and wont go anywhere fast.

Both have different uses. A horror unit with bolt of change and gift of chaos though is a nasty unit :) both have thier uses and i wouldnt say you were wrong for taking either. for the herald i suggest master of sorc, because if you play a cav heavy army you can use lore of beasts and get beast cowers, or if you play a different army you can use xxx lore to counter them it gives you alot more choices.

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 20:16
I was thinking the same thing about master of sorcery but then I realised that Kairos would be able to. So the next thought in my mind was how can I cause the most damage with him since he can only be level 2, then I saw the Banner of Hellfire with the combination of flight if I get him into the lines for even only one turn it can help immensly with the destruction of units. It can also be cast into combat and help any unlucky horrors.

With master of sorcery it does offer more options but the Lore of Tzeentch gives pure carnage in the way of damage. I will probably try it both ways though.

I think I will keep the flamers in because I was thinking with Kairos, if I can get lucky enough to get Doom and Darkness off then the Flamers will pick apart that unit.

fubukii
10-12-2008, 20:25
a nasty little trick i like to do is take the lore of light spell dazzling brightness and make a unit ws1, then as my flamers to hit on 3+ in combat :)

Necrotyr18
10-12-2008, 20:32
Another good idea.

So the list stands:

Kairos Fateweaver

Herald of Tzeentch - Banner of Hellfire, Winged Horror, Power Vortex or Master of Sorcery.

23 Horrors

23 Horrors

23 Horrors

6 Flamers


It has 18 Power Dice with one bound item and 11 Dispel Dice. On a side note, can a pyromaster? My book is away from me but my army builder is telling me no.

fubukii
11-12-2008, 04:41
can a pyromaster what?