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lector#1
21-12-2008, 11:19
hey guys i used to play dark elves and was curious about the new rules and models, how would you guys arm a lord for instance to make him combat heavy.

and how would you arm a hero level melee to make him combat heavy.
is there a way to make them ranged attacks like a bow or magical bow.

is a 500point list made out of corsairs, xbowmen and a unit of coldone knights good or too small.??
how would you make a 500point balanced list or a 750point balanced list as i need a 500-750 list to help teach my little cousins how to use their armies??

cheers guys
.lector#1.

W0lf
21-12-2008, 11:46
Corsairs suck imo. Spearmen are just better for the cost/role.

20 corsairs with Fc = 220 pts whereas 20 Spearmen with fc = 155 pts. The corsairs get 2S3 with a 5+ in combat. Spermen get the same with spears but get the option of shields and you only lose 1 attack per model killed. Corsairs get +1 AS against shooting which in actual game turns translates into very little. I really dont see the point of them.

Best units in the whole book point for point: Dark elf spearmen and Hydra.

For a lord level character i use:

Dread lord
Great weapon, shield, Pendant of Khaleth armour of eternal servitude, potion of strength.
255 pts

he has a 4+ Armour save, reversable ward save (which is a 2+ against S5+) and regen. Pretty unkillable. Then with 4 S6 and 4S9 for 1 full round hes set. I use the potion against knights/T5+ stuff etc.

For a hero i like:

Noble
Armour of darkness, crimson death
130 pts

Hes got a 1+ save and crimson death allows him to strike at I7 with 3S6 attacks; which is a form of protection itself.

For 500 pts id run soemthing like:

Master
Armour of Darkness, Great weapon
119 pts

19 spearmen
FC
148 pts

10 Crossbowmen
100pts

5 Cold one Knights
135 pts

502 pts. (drop the spearmen mus if your desperate for points.)

This gives him a little of everything to get a real feel for the army.

to expand to 750 pts just do something like:

Hydra
175 pts

Fc, warbanner for coldones
65 pts

lector#1
21-12-2008, 13:07
that has just answered my question well but, a few things,
i like the corsairs because they can shoot and if need be run into combat i used to use them as a support unit, a counter assault unit, or a body guard to my sorceress,
for the lord i like the ward save thingy but what i usually go for is,

dreadlord, heavy mundane armour, shield, best offensive magic weapon and a ward save
so for your build i would take out the potion and the armour and with those points buy the best possible weapon to make him able to take down knights, characters, chariots in a unit of course.

another question i wanted to know in larger games where would you stick the dreadlord, and is he better on foot or on a coldone??? or a cold one chariot, im not aiming for large flying monsters for the lord but i am looking at a hydra or 2 and forget about the bolt throwers

==Me==
21-12-2008, 17:26
You've got to be joking. Corsairs are awesome. They've got superior armor, more attacks (spears don't get extra attacks when they charge), Slavers, and the Sea Serpent Standard. Frenzy makes them as good as Witch Elves barring poison with armor to boot. All you really need to do is throw in an Assassin to deal with harder troops. I wouldn't run Corsairs ranked up either, 6 or 7 wide with 18 or 21 works just fine with the frenzy banner.

A fighty Dreadlord could use the Armor of Darkness (or Blood Armor if you want to save points), Pendant of Khaleth and Soulrender or Crimson Death. You can't combine shields and armor when using a great weapon so I just spring for the 1+ save and uber ward. Regen is simply overkill in this case and I'd rather get it on another character anyway (like a BSB). He weighs in at 215 with the Soulrender, 225 with the Crimson Death. S6 and AP is really all you need, anything bigger can be gunned down with Bolt Throwers.

For a Master, full mundane, a Cold One and the Pendant is great. Comes in at 149 and is extremely good for the cost. 1+ save, super ward and a lance keeps him alive and kicking.

For 500 points you would be fine with 20 spearmen with shield, musician, and standard (148), 10 crossbowmen (100), 5 COKs (135) and a Master on a Cold One with shield, heavy armor, cloak, and lance (114). Just under 500 points and you've got a big block of static combat res, some ranged firepower, and the insanely good Cold One Knights with your 1+ save Master.

For 750 I'd give your Master the Pendant, give your crossbowmen a musician, add a lordling to your spearmen and pick up 2 Bolt Throwers. That gives you your big combat blocks as before with the added firepower of a Bolt Thrower. Gotta love it.

Ultimately it is your army so the choice is yours. There are a lot of potential builds in the DE book so you really can't go wrong picking units you like and working it out. Give it some test games, find what works, and we'll see if we can offer any further assistance.

DeathlessDraich
21-12-2008, 18:02
how would you make a 500point balanced list or a 750point balanced list as i need a 500-750 list to help teach my little cousins how to use their armies??

cheers guys
.lector#1.

Learners? - Expose them to the necessary basics in every phase. Sequence is all important.

List should include Cold one Chariot (test for Stupidity and Impact hits), Sorceress lvl2 (w Dagger of Hotek), 10 Xbowmen, 10 Spearmen (fight in 2 ranks; w Manbane Assassin for 750 pts) Reaper bolt thrower (or Hydra for breath/template weapon) and Harpies ( for flying moves)

Draconian77
21-12-2008, 18:22
Corsairs are certainly not awesome...

They have limited capabilities compared to Spearmen/RxBmen.

==Me==
21-12-2008, 19:10
Are too :p

I've said ==My== spiel on the awesomeness of Corsairs, try them out in some games and see how they work. Theoryhammer only goes so far.

lector#1
21-12-2008, 23:54
thanks guys ill be starting the army in 2009 not to far away just need some money to get in, but for a lord is he better on foot in a unit of corsairs, blackguard, executioners or better on a cold one??

El Haroldo
22-12-2008, 02:13
thanks guys ill be starting the army in 2009 not to far away just need some money to get in, but for a lord is he better on foot in a unit of corsairs, blackguard, executioners or better on a cold one??

Black Guard. It's fluffy, they're hard as nails, he'll confer his LD10 to their Stubborn, and take advantage of ITP. ASF banner is almost a no-brainer (no points for originality though) and suddenly a cheap lord with a great weapon and magic armour is going to cause a disproportinate amount of hurt. Screen the unit, they're still pretty squishy.

Corsairs are good troops, alright for your lord if you want a pirate dark elf theme, but besides relatively good defense against shooting and a decent number of S3 attacks, they aren't special. A huge block of spearmen might be a better choice...if your lord can stand the howls of derision when at court in Naggaroth for going to war with the lowborn, which mine can't.

Executioners: Khanite, no characters for them. Even if they could, I wouldn't. The little bit extra paid for Black Guard is worth so much more. Oh how times have changed...

On a cold one, his unit will be small and very vulnerable to shooting. Cold One units seem to work better in 5-6, assisting your elite infantry with flank charges etc. If you want a "frontal charge smash everything COK unit", give a BSB with Hydra banner a go, and screen them well. Will devestate all but the toughest tarpit.

Marwynn
22-12-2008, 09:01
Yes, but who deploys Corsairs in blocks?

I mean giving them the flexibility to do so would be nice but it's not necessary. The Warriors are there for the cheap CR, the Corsairs are there to slice the other guys up.

I'd go for the basic units. One block of infantry, one Hero, one cavalry unit, and perhaps a shooting unit and warmachine. As you increase in points add a Wizard to bring magic into the game, once they've got combat down.

lector#1
22-12-2008, 09:15
yeah i will probably just buy the batalion a hero model to start with then ill probably add in a sorceress and a hydra.

what are your different combinations for dreadlords, what units do they work well in and what do you gear them for ( character hunting, troop hunting ,etc)

and what are your oppinions on witch elves and hags?
are there witch elf hero and lord options??? special characters included

Dark Rider Elite
22-12-2008, 12:03
Fistly i always but my lord in a unti of 13 BG with ASF and the tower master who has Crimson death this has worked well for me in the past.

As for Charachters i keep mine built to a low point cost and add more troops.

whitch elfs are IMO a bad choice because they dont have and armour save , i just leave them.

==Me==
22-12-2008, 13:55
Dreadlords typically have some way to get good armor (either mundane armor on a Cold One, Blood Armor, or Armor of Darkness) and either Regeneration or the Pendant. After that, a cheap magic weapon (Crimson Death, Soulrender, Death Piercer, Whip of Agony) and you're all set. Where you stick him depends on your army. I either go for Cold One Knights, Black Guard, or a Manticore/Dragon. He's very killy, very survivable, and ends up relatively inexpensive.

Witch Elves are cheap Frenzied troops with poison attacks, they have no armor and T3 so they'll die in drove, but if they hit they will cause some damage. I'd either run them in large units to soak up casualties or go MSU to draw a lower profile. Death Hags are a good her choice, they get access to the Cauldron (amazing piece of kit) or can be a BSB with Gifts of Khaine (good for Executioners). Their biggest downside is frenzy and lack of armor. Hellebron is the same deal, hits extremely hard but no armor. She's great in a Khainite list as she makes Witches Core, but she needs an Assassin to protect her.

El Haroldo
22-12-2008, 22:43
Fistly i laways but my lord in a unti of 13 BG with ASF and the tower maste who has Crimson death this has worked well for me in the past.

As for characthers i keep mine built to a low point cost and add more troops.

whitch elfs are IMO a bad choice because they dont have and armour save , i just leave them.

For our sake and yours, please run a quick spell check before you post.

To the OP, do you even have the army book? If you'd given it even a quick read, you'd know about witch elf characters and so forth.

If you don't have it, asking for detailed character/item combos isn't going to do you much good.

lector#1
25-12-2008, 11:43
no i dont have the book just yet and im not going to buy it until im totally sure that i want to do dark elves because i dont have money to just throw around at the moment,

is it a good idea to have a lord/hero choice run with corsairs because i was thinking of converting lokhir so that he looks like a custom lord not squidface from pirates of the carrabians

for this lord i was thinking of maybe
Dreadlord: Pendant of Khaeleth, Armour of Eternal Servitude and Crimson Death build with shield, and sea dragon cloak, but im not sure that he really needs the regen, maybe swap that for the best mundane armour, and use those points on more troops or the like, and for the unit of corsairs 23 with the ASF banner, and with the lord that would go 6x4 or ill bump it up to 24 and have it 5x5 or is that build for a lord better in a different unit???

==Me==
25-12-2008, 16:57
Corsairs are too expensive to be worry about rank bonus, get spearmen if your want ranks. Corsairs mulch infantry like there's no tomorrow, so gear up for that.

Crimson Death is 2 handed, so shields won't do you much good. If you've got ASF the Soulrender is better for less points.

lector#1
25-12-2008, 22:02
yeah but at str 4, str 4 isnt good at taking much down


if i stick him in a unit of black guard, or spearmen is it worth giving him the seedragon cloak????

so because of hatred with my build he will have 4 str 6 attacks and rerolls on the charge is there any way to get more attacks on him???, because i dont think he will need the regen with a 2+ AS and a awsome ward save so how can you maxmize him on attacks without dropping bellow str 5 or 6

Lord Aislinn
26-12-2008, 10:30
w0lf speaks sense as ever it seems.

lector#1
26-12-2008, 15:57
what are your oppinions on a unit of executioners with banner of hag graeth with a lord screend by harpies???