PDA

View Full Version : 2000 Newbie OKs



==Me==
23-12-2008, 17:10
I bet y'all are sick of ==Me== by now, well too bad :p

I'm looking to start up another Fantasy army, but I don't want to get too spendy. I've considered Warriors of Chaos, Bretonnians, VCs and now I'm looking at OKs. I've heard you can make a good sized army from a Battalion and some extra bits, so I was intrigued. A good read of the army book has ==Me== enamored with these ugly brutes, so I wrote up a list and submit it for Warseer's approval.

Lords/Heroes (892)
Tyrant-heavy armor, brace of handguns, Tenderizer, Spangleshard, Greedy Fist, 2 Luck Gnoblars (322)
Butcher-Hellheart, 2 Tooth Gnoblars (190)
Butcher-Bangstick, Dispel Scroll, 2 Tooth Gnoblars (190)
Butcher-Cathayan Jet, Skullmantle, 2 Tooth Gnoblars (190)

Core (800)
Bulls-6, bellower (220)
Ironguts-3, bellower (154)
Ironguts-3, bellower (154)
Ironguts-3, bellower (154)
Gnoblar Fighters-20 (40)
Gnoblar Trappers-13 (78)

Special (230)
Leadbelchers-4, bellower (230)

Rare (75)
Gorger (75)

Total-1997
Models-57

The characters will go with the Ironguts while the Bankstick Butcher goes with the Leadbelchers. I've got a solid magic set up, some nasty anti-magic and a good array of hitty units with support. Do you think this will work? I had considered a Hunter instead of a Butcher, would that be a better choice or do I need the magic defense? Anythig here is up for changes, I'm a total newbie to OKs and looking for a inexpensive and competitive army so any advice is greatly appreciated.

Also any details on making a cheaper army would be most welcome.

Sarael
24-12-2008, 06:04
Ogres are the most difficult army to use properly. Just remember that you need to get in flank charges to negate their rank bonus so you don't auto-lose combat. Remember you cause fear (make them roll their LD tests), and remember bull charge if you get it (I think the unit needs to be 3 strong). If you can keep all those things in mind and use your MSU tactics then you should be fine.

Now then, on the list...

I don't like Belchers, but others have had success with them. Then again, I'm just now getting back into fantasy after a hiatus into 40k. Anyway, for their cost, belchers are too unreliable to me.

Bulls are too expensive, so I do only recommend one unit.

Ironguts are too expensive, but they're your best and most efficient unit.

I run Scragg, and his magic is just right, so I'd say that 3 butchers would be enough, especially with your mix of items. Consider the cookbook.

Don't start a fight that you can't win. Just because you have a 12" charge range doesn't mean you have to charge. Don't charge Swordmasters unless you can also hit them in the flank/rear, for instance. If you are only going to have one unit in the fight, don't fight, stay back. Only cavalry (and magic'd orcs) will charge you if you stand a foot away (though gunlines will shoot you, but you'll beat gunlines in CC). If the enemy is obviously superior to you and has ranks and you won't be able to get in a flank charge, then stay back until you can. OKs are really deadly when you take a finesse approach with them as opposed to the typical HULK SMAAASH approach.

Don't paint them green skinned w/ purple pants...

==Me==
24-12-2008, 14:03
Thanks, I figured they would be different from ==My== other armies. The MSU style is interesting and I'm used to low Ld anyway after playing an Eshin army for a while.

I was thinking of giving the Tyrant the Wyrdstone and "kill in challenge get back wounds" magic armor, would that be good?

I could drop 3 Bulls and the Gorger for a Scraplauncher, would that be a good idea?

Kadrium
24-12-2008, 17:37
Split your 1 unit of 6 bulls into two units of 3. Bulls do have their uses, but running in large units is not one of them.

Use bulls as flank charge support for your ironguts, for screening, and for charge baiting. They and leadbelchers are the next best thing we have to fast cav. They are the most expendable non-gnoblar unit we have, and the only one that moves fast enough to be useful. Gnoblar fighters are too slow to be useful for anything but claiming/denying table quarters, and are definitely not good bait against most armies. You simply don't have time to plod along next to some gnoblars, and expose yourself to another round or two of shooting or magic.

The name of the game while writing ogre lists is to minimize wasted points so you can maximize ogres on the board.

The brace of handguns on your tyrant is not worth taking. He's a terrible shot, and they won't do enough wounds to justify even their minimal cost.

The spangleshard is a terrible, terrible item. It is outperformed in every possible way by the Wyrdstone necklace, unless your tyrant happens to somehow take a wound from a str 5+ weapon and your opponent rolls a 4 to wound. Just take the Wyrdstone. The spangleshard is putrid.

The Greedy Fist really isn't a very good item either, though it is the cheapest way to get a modest armor save. It's special ability is flat out worthless. Even against chaos sorcerers, in a melee combat between any wizard and your Tyrant, you're just going to demolish them in one round with the Tenderiser, so why bother draining their spell levels? You're paying 20 points for 1 armor save. Not worth it. None of the Ogre magic armors particularly are.

You can only take 1 Luck gnoblar per character.

Your tooth gnoblars are 30 wasted points. If you're casting gut magic on a single die, a roll of 1 or 2 always fails, and a tooth gnoblar cannot help you. If you're casting on 2 dice, a 2 is a miscast and a tooth gnoblar cannot help you. They are mildly useful for making a spell a tiny bit harder to counter, but it's not worth the 30 points. Thats nearly another bull, or a unit standard + bellower.

The Hellheart is a crap item. If you want to shut down a magic phase that badly, take two more Dispel Scrolls.

The Cathyan Jet is similar. Just because we have items in our magic item list does not mean they are worth taking or that you should. Outside of a few gems, our list of magic items items are mainly crap, and wasted points.. Don't feel obligated to pick too heavily from our list. Dispel scrolls outshine nearly all of our choices, outside the wyrdstone, tenderiser, skullmantle, and bangstick.

I think your trapper unit is a little bit big for what it will be used for - screening, baiting, and dying. Even en mass, trappers don't kill much. That being said, a large unit can surprise you with sharp stuff, so if you're really happy with it, then take it.

I'm not wild about gnoblar fighters, but I admit they have 2 uses - a throwaway deployment and holding table quarters. Contrary to popular belief, they are of little use for flanking. They are far too slow to keep up with the Ogres when you're playing any infantry-centric army. They won't show up until at least a full turn or more after the Ogres started declaring their charges, and by then combat has almost always been decided. They have modest uses against armies like Brets where they usually come to you.

If you're going to take 4 leadbelchers, take them in 2 units of 2 and run them side by side. That way all 4 belchers are not required to shoot at the same time. Two can shoot and 2 can wait, they can shoot at two different targets, etc. Also, if one dies due to misfire, it does not panic all of your remaining leadbelchers. Just 1.

Find the points for a 2nd Gorger. They are the 2nd best unit in the army, behind Ironguts and just a hair above trappers. Having two is great.

Sarael
25-12-2008, 15:09
I haven't run a Tyrant in awhile, but when I did I never found a Tyrant build I liked. Not because Tyrants are weak, far from it. Rather, it's because of all the darned cannons I used to see. Now all those old gunline guys are playing DE & Chaos, so I'm going to start trying him out again.

I've never run a scraplauncher. I don't like to shoot things in Fantasy (that's what 40k is for IMO). That said, I'm sure a scraplauncher and belchers would be great for thinning down those few units which are actually better in a fight than your ironguts.

Like I said, I run Scragg w/ gorgers. IMO there's no such thing as too many gorgers. They make for an awesome pincher move!

Kadrium
25-12-2008, 21:33
Tyrant with Tenderiser and Wyrdstone is all you really need. If you're worried about cannonballs, get him in a unit of bulls or ironguts with a standard and lookout gnoblar.

I like the scraplauncher, but it is yet again just not as good as Ironguts.

With so many armies, the limitation on special choices is actually a limitation. Often when writing Chaos lists now, I find myself wishing I could take more than 4 specials, since I have Knights, and Ogres, and Dragon Ogres, and all those kinds of goodies to pick from.

With Ogres, there's really no reason to bother with anything besides Ironguts. Everything else is just for breaking up the monotony and not writing a purely cheesey list.