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Lord_Crull
29-12-2008, 19:59
Several months after purchasing and putting together two land raiders I have noticed that I accidentily switched the lascannon sponsons and side hatches around so that the lascannons are in front and the hatches in the back.

I just noticed it and nobody at my gaming group has noticed it ethier. I can't think of how it has effected any of the past games I have played with them.

But what I am asking, is this a problem? I am prepared to take them apart and put them back togather again if needed.

Paul Nexus
29-12-2008, 20:03
The codex doesn't state which order the hatches and weaponry go. Seems logical to get a bit of extra range out of them.

Volrath
29-12-2008, 20:04
Well, it depends, do you want you marines to get blasted in half when they get out the hatches?? If so, then yes, change them around. But if you want the vehicle to be accurate to how it might actually be assembled...i'd assume the men would disembark BEHIND the guns blasting away....

GW has made Crusaders both ways in the past that i've seen, so its just preference on your part....whether they are lascannons or not, who cares.

Paul Nexus
29-12-2008, 20:07
i'd assume the men would disembark BEHIND the guns blasting away....

Good logic. It probably took the Tech-Adepts a few thousand corpses to learn that one.

Kaltenberg
29-12-2008, 20:28
If you use the Landraider as a assoult vehicle then your men or terminators migth be better of comming out in front of the guns, thus minimizing the distance to the enemy.
But I see no trouble in assembling the Land Raider as you see fit.

Inquisitor Engel
29-12-2008, 20:50
Both the Crusader and Redeemer have the guns placed in front of the hatches.

Hakkapelli
29-12-2008, 20:58
I can't understand why the redeemer has the guns in the forward position. Don't your assault troops want to step out into the line of fire of a s6 ap3 flamer :p

Sanctjud
29-12-2008, 21:46
Couldn't they have the simple solution to STOP firing when the dudes get out. Sm are known for not just holding their guns on full auto, they conserve ammo and take shots when needed. If dudes are in the line of fire, they'll either move to get better firing lines or wait til the guys get out of the way.

My 7 Cents.

Culven
29-12-2008, 23:51
Logically, it makes sense to have them in the front position so that the troops can disembark via the side hatches and be behind the guns.

In game, the forward position will give a slight range advantage to the guns, the rear positions make it easier to disembark a large unit in coherency since they don't need to go round the sponson. I prefer the Lascannons in the rear position for aesthetic reasons and to allow the unit to deploy forward of the sponsons.

Dach
30-12-2008, 00:29
I do prefer the forward position for the guns.

It has to many advantage compared to the other setup.

Better line of fire, longer range for the guns.

As for troop disembarking, well land raider do happen to have a FORWARD assault ramp so really no need to step out from the "front side door"

Having the rear door for disembarking get you a wider choice of range to disembark otherwise that simply having all the door to the front of the vehicle.

Go for the gun in front you won't regret it. ;)

the1stpip
30-12-2008, 00:34
Of course, when it comes to your men getting out, they could get out the FRONT hatch.

But my LR has the guns in front for the same reason has posted above, indeed in the building leaflet, it says it is up to you.

MajorWesJanson
30-12-2008, 00:59
I tend to do Las and Hurricane bolters to the rear, and flame cannons to the front.

Khornies & milk
30-12-2008, 03:32
I tend to do Las and Hurricane bolters to the rear, and flame cannons to the front.

Same here, and only because it looks better in my eyes. I'm not particularly worried about the extra 1"+ of range.

There's no 'must be in this position' rule.

Plastic Parody
30-12-2008, 03:42
Yeh, looks better at the back but totally understand the practical problems of that. My Redeemer is getting them at the front the rest will be at the back as said already.

Do the instructions not also show that either option is available?

Rioghan Murchadha
30-12-2008, 04:00
This is the Imperium of man, where nothing makes sense.

Besides, would it really be so hard to have one of those little thingies like are in car doors that make the lights come on when the door is open, but instead, have it shut off power to the sponsons when the door is open?

Grand Master Raziel
30-12-2008, 08:44
I've seen artwork with the guns in the front positions and with the guns in the back positions. Also, Forge World makes a LR conversion kit of an earlier mark of LR, with more built-up sponsons, with the side doors being in the rear part of the sponson. Leave your sponsons where they are.

mughi3
30-12-2008, 10:57
It's personal preference really. i prefer the look of rear mounted weapons, it looks to front heavy other wise and limits the assault area of the front of the vehicle. in 4th it didn't matter much where you put the guns because ranges were all measured from the models base AKA "hull".

But then some bonehead at the GW design department decided to bring back 3rd edition measuring ranges from the tip of the gun. we got rid of this rule for good reason. now it's back and it forces people to model a certain way to increase a weapons effective range and can lead back to customized models for range advantage issues.

It really won't matter all that much for a lascannon like it does for hurricane bolters given the range differences and size the of the barrels in question.

chromedog
30-12-2008, 11:04
I put all of my weapons on the rear positions for Land Raiders.
I even made up some custom decals for the front hatches, and have since made them look slightly more 40k-ish.
(The originals were shamelessly ripped from the forward fuselage of the vipers in Galactica and read "Danger. Do not stand in front of lasercannons"

The newer ones, in a gothic script, read: "Thou hath been warned. Thou shouldst not standeth before the laser cannons.". The ones for the crusaders just read "Commandment #1: Thou shalt duck."

MrBigMr
30-12-2008, 11:26
Doesn't the Forge World pre-Heresy LR kit come with the lascannons on the front and hatches at the back?

Only the Red Army has put guns behind their own troops. Deploying covering fire to the disembarking troops is a good thing and I don't think that silencing 2/3 of the tank's guns for the purpose of unloading passangers is in their best interest. It's just free for all for the enemy. But I do have to say that the guns in the rear look better than in the front. If the mounts were a little slimmer, then maybe.

At the moment I don't have any Land Raiders, but I've been converting one as a Vulcan Macharius and I was going to mount the sponsons heavy bolters to the rear.

Mangobreeder
30-12-2008, 12:17
Same here, and only because it looks better in my eyes. I'm not particularly worried about the extra 1"+ of range.

There's no 'must be in this position' rule.

quoted for truth, if the whole games come down to that extra 1", you need to revise your tactics :)

Mewy
30-12-2008, 12:45
It all comes down to personal taste. The FW Mk1 Landraider only has the hatches at the back I think because that's the only way they'll fit with that particular sponson design.

The Base
30-12-2008, 12:45
The guns behind might be safer.

Sure you don't want to get into the firing path of the guns, but then again your enemy wants to be in that path at lot less.

IJW
30-12-2008, 12:51
For what it's worth, the old Rogue Trader Land Raider model had guns towards the front and doors behind, with no way to swap them around.

adreal
30-12-2008, 13:39
For what it's worth, the old Rogue Trader Land Raider model had guns towards the front and doors behind, with no way to swap them around.

yeah but they were cute



to the OP my lascannon are towards the back of my raider, dont really remember why I did that, but I'm sure I had a reason.........maybe

Emperor's Grace
30-12-2008, 18:27
Well, it depends, do you want you marines to get blasted in half when they get out the hatches?? If so, then yes, change them around. But if you want the vehicle to be accurate to how it might actually be assembled...i'd assume the men would disembark BEHIND the guns blasting away....

But how do you determine "behind" when the gun has a 180' firing arc?

You're assuming that they fire forward more often than flank or behind.

MrBigMr
30-12-2008, 18:30
But how do you determine "behind" when the gun has a 180' firing arc?

You're assuming that they fire forward more often than flank or behind.
Well I must say that if your tanks spend more time firing behind them and in front of them, someone, and I'm not pointing any fingers, is doing something very wrong. Or the opponent is doing something very right.

Thylacine
31-12-2008, 01:56
The RT Land Raiders had their guns in front of the hatches, so does the pre-Heresy MKII B from FW. I always thought it was a strange idea to have the troops exiting/entering the vehicle in front of the guns.

AmBlam
31-12-2008, 02:26
Interestingly I had a chaos land raider for xmas.

The instructions said to put them in the front hatches and never gave any hint it was optional but all the pictues on the box had them on the back ones, which does look better. I was somewhat dissapointed by it.

spaint2k
31-12-2008, 03:46
The newer ones, in a gothic script, read: "Thou hath been warned. Thou shouldst not standeth before the laser cannons."

In the grim darkness of the far future, there is no grammar checker for early modern English.
:)

Steve

wolvenblade
31-12-2008, 04:33
Interestingly I had a chaos land raider for xmas.

The instructions said to put them in the front hatches and never gave any hint it was optional but all the pictues on the box had them on the back ones, which does look better. I was somewhat dissapointed by it.

I had the same exact issue with my x-mas chaos land raider. Luckly I had time enough after I noticed to switch them back around.

Lord Inquisitor
31-12-2008, 04:42
Couldn't they have the simple solution to STOP firing when the dudes get out. .
Or, conceivably, actually fire the weapons at enemy that aren't directly ahead...

Cuda
31-12-2008, 05:08
Hmnn? I converted my IW's Land Raider with the Las Cannons on the top of the hull. Got the idea from the Chaos Epic line. I just use may laser pointer and beam it as though they are still on the sides. I use the LR several times at GW and none seem to mind.

Cuda...

MrBigMr
31-12-2008, 05:20
I once had an idea of giving a Land Raider dual Predator lascannons on the sides, one pair pointing forwards and the other backwards. Don't know how one would go about using such a configuration.

Hashshashin
31-12-2008, 06:07
For my World Eaters the guns are in the back and the assault ramp in the front. Firstly the tank is in their to deliver the Chainaxes of doom, and secondly their World Eaters if a few guys die what ever, you can't make an omlete without breaking a few eggs.

For my Deathwing Crusader the Hurricanes are on the front, better range and all 6 Terminators can easily fit out the front if need be.

But definitely personal preference and as stated the FW MKIIb has the cannons on the front, and it look s sweet, but the normal sponsons, imho, look better in the rear.

Emperor's Grace
31-12-2008, 17:41
Well I must say that if your tanks spend more time firing behind them and in front of them, someone, and I'm not pointing any fingers, is doing something very wrong. Or the opponent is doing something very right.

Or you've broken through the enemy lines (as an assualt vehicle like the LR is said to) and have enemy targets available at all quarters....

(Well said, though, it's a fair point if you're fighting line to line)

chromedog
31-12-2008, 23:53
In the grim darkness of the far future, there is no grammar checker for early modern English.
:)

Steve

Yeah, well, the font is 1.5mm high, so unless you are looking closely, you won't really see it properly.

The older ones look like proper "danger" signs, and likewise, it's only when you look closely, that you notice the words.

ctsteel
01-01-2009, 02:59
Or, conceivably, actually fire the weapons at enemy that aren't directly ahead...

Exactly the reasoning I used when putting my crusader sponsons on the back - I imagined the sponsons swivelling outward and laying down suppressing fire on each flank, creating a cone of space ahead for the squad to assault into without worrying about being attacked from the side.

mtblock
01-01-2009, 05:02
You would think that space marines would coordinate when the got out of a tank, and when they fire their lascannons. One would think...

Epicenter
01-01-2009, 05:50
As some others have observed, getting a bit of distance out of your lascannons isn't necessarily "cheating" - it makes about as much difference as that situation where it might have been better for your troops to come out from the forward set of side hatches.

Now, if you magnetized the weapons sponsons and exit hatches, played normally with the guns forward, but just before you assault, you quickly move the hatch and the sponson to give you that extra bit of distance from the side hatches, people might raise eyebrows.

Warforger
01-01-2009, 06:22
Yah there is always this believing everything you hear about the rules over here, so a vet. made me fire my MM on my crusader from the farther vack hatch rather then the front one.