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zeep
20-01-2009, 20:40
Myself, I love the sentinel model. If pressed, It would be extremely difficult to tell you the exact reason why.

Given that, What would it take for you to start fielding more of them?

Is it the look?

Is it the Cost? (about $25)

Is it the points?

Would you field it more if they gave an up armored version (say 11 on front and sides?)

Is it weapon selection or quantity?

Necrotyr18
20-01-2009, 20:42
The weapons and armor are fine along with the model but to have a model that is relatively cheap in points to cost a lot of money, those models aren't fielded en mass. Around me the Imperial Guard players usually use around three but they cost quite abit so not much more than that.

RCgothic
20-01-2009, 20:52
They're a good source of multilasers, but they're a little costly considering how easily they die.

Lord Wasa
20-01-2009, 20:53
I'd say the rules, never played one, but to me it seems that the hellhound is a better chise for the FA-slot. I do however have some lovely ideas for converting, so when the new codex is out, if I decide I can use them, they'll be the first thing I'll buy.

tuebor
20-01-2009, 20:54
If they were to cost less points I'd likely field more of them. As it is, like most of the IG book, they're rather overpriced.

Bookwrak
20-01-2009, 21:01
Sentinels are pretty awesome as is, especially with multi-lasers. The only issue is that I also love hellhounds and rough riders, so I only use the HQ support squad of sentinels.

jason_sation
20-01-2009, 21:04
I love the look of the models. I always loved the At-At and AT-ST in Starwars, so I really think that does it for me. Plus they are presented as "wild mavericks" in the Codex, similar to Goose and Maverick in Top Gun. The only reason I don't have any is the price in dollars. I really want to get the Steel Legion ones, becuase I like the look of the armored compartment. I'm trying to decide if I should get them now, or wait and hope the new ones come with all the armor, and all the weapons.

Hicks
20-01-2009, 21:17
They cost way too much money especially if you want the steel legion ones. Also, they aren't all that great on the TT either.

Khornies & milk
20-01-2009, 21:22
I have 3 Squadrons in my Armoured Battlegroup list which is only used for Apoc-sized games. I love the model, especially the FW ones.

Sure, they're not hard to destroy but ALL Vehicles can be rendered ineffective if the enemy tries hard enough. On Terrain-heavy boards they can last for a few turns and can be a pain for the opponent to deal with.

Price-wise not cheap, but hopefully GW will bring back the 10-boxed set again as that was a great buy.

boogle
20-01-2009, 21:31
I believe in gaming terms, they are going to come down in points cost in the new codex, and the sprue itself is going to contain all weapons available to the Sentinel in plastic.

for me personally, it's the look of them that i like, in my Steel Legion and Elysian Armies i often fielded 3 squadrons of 3

Wotansspawn
20-01-2009, 21:37
Sentinels are cool but hsould be a little tougher. IG units dont cost too many points they should just be a little tougher.

The humans are the greatest and most adaptable species in the galaxy and in the game they are comparatively rubbish. They need better rifles and body armour for a start.

Bookwrak
20-01-2009, 22:04
We already have those. They're called Space Marines.:D

Faeslayer
20-01-2009, 22:07
the greatest and most adaptable species

When did we start talking about Tyranids?

Frep
20-01-2009, 22:10
Greatest and most adaptably has to be orks, well sorta.

In my opinion sentinals are overcosted both in $ and in points, bring those down and we'd see a lot more sentinals on the board.

Lewis
20-01-2009, 22:13
The models, the models, the models. Gorgeous dynamic things they are. I'm fairly certain that my army will drop in points with the new codex as my tricked out command squads loose their war gear and all of those points are going to be tipped in to sentinels. I'm on three for 1,500 pts but I hanker for more.

Am I alone in making that ATAT/ATST walking sound whenever I hold one of the models?

Reflex
20-01-2009, 22:27
lets not go down the 'who is the coolest species route'.. thats a long and dark road where people dont return.

sentinels are the shizz. a guy i know has enough to field 2 recon troop apoc formations.

ive used three in the past for a FA slot, only thing that stops me from getting more is the price of the model.

jason_sation
20-01-2009, 22:28
The models, the models, the models. Gorgeous dynamic things they are. I'm fairly certain that my army will drop in points with the new codex as my tricked out command squads loose their war gear and all of those points are going to be tipped in to sentinels. I'm on three for 1,500 pts but I hanker for more.

Am I alone in making that ATAT/ATST walking sound whenever I hold one of the models?

Haha! I hope you make that laser gun sound when you have them fire!

Bunnahabhain
20-01-2009, 22:42
The points and other rules is the problem. They're rather too expensive for what they do on the tabletop. Small points break, and maybe a special rule to give them more flexibilty.

They look good. Yes, they're expensive to buy, a box of 3 at a significant discount would be good, especially if the sprue gets recut to include all weapons and extra armour.

TheDarkDuke
21-01-2009, 00:46
$$ Involved. If it wasn't for the cost of the IG army I want to make, I would have. I have made 3 full armies with the same price tag of the IG army I wanted to make. It contained several Chimera, Sentinels and Leman Russ'... way to $$!

RichBlake
21-01-2009, 00:55
I use three, one lascannon and two autcannons with hunter killer missiles.

They outflank and hunt tanks, the reaosn they are so good at this is because they cannot be shot at until they appear and shot stuff.

In big games I'd take two squads like that probably, outflank them both and wreck enemy amrour. In cities of death i take 3 with heavy flamers.

Other then that they just cost too many points for what they can do. Eldar War Walkers are more points but since they can have two weapons and those shield thingies they aren't really worth it.

35 points with a multi-laser or heavy flamer, then upgrade that mutlilaser to an autocannon for 5 points or a lascannon for 10 points seems about right.

noobzor
21-01-2009, 00:55
When a 55 point model costs $40 you know something is wrong :p
Especially when you get 120 base (guard box) for $35

TheOneWithNoName
21-01-2009, 01:02
Is it the points?

Yes it is. Like a lot of things in the IG codex they are greatly overpriced.

Lord Cook
21-01-2009, 01:12
Just overpriced. Sentinels really aren't worth the points unless the rest of your army consists of vehicles, and even then they're not amazing.


They need better rifles and body armour for a start.

The Guard already has a good rifle, and body armour.

RichBlake
21-01-2009, 01:20
The Guard already has a good rifle, and body armour.

Yeah it's just that everyone else's weapons are so good :P

starlight
21-01-2009, 01:24
Cost in the shop.:( I already have six with swappable weapons, but I'd get more if they weren't overpriced. For the same slot I can get a more useful Hellhound for less money...

AngryAngel
21-01-2009, 03:10
Well maybe the recut sprues for them will go down in price or the like when the new IG book comes out ? Even if it doesn't I'm totally going to be rocking at least a couple squads of these guys. As a starting guard player I'm looking to have a couple stormtrooper squads with a valk when its out. At least a couple squads of sentinels with multi lasers and lascannons. The basic infantry and some LRBT's running around. It's going to be sweet. Even if it doesn't win all the time.

Vaktathi
21-01-2009, 03:23
If they were worth their points I'd have 9 or 12 of them. I *love* the Steel Legion sentinel model. My big problem with sentinels however is that for a 45pt Multilaser sentinel, one can get an Eldar Warwalker with two shuriken cannons (less range, double the firepower) for 5pts less, or a double scatterlaser (more than double the firepower, equal range) for 15pts more.

A multilaser or Autocannon sentinel shouldn't cost more than 30 or 35pts. The Autocannon shouldn't cost more than the ML version either, as against anything but 4+ save models (not 6+/5+/3+/2+, only 4+) and T8/9 (not T7 or T10) MC's, or AV11+ vehicles, the ML is the better weapon statistically, and the extra range doesn't come into play *that* much.

A Lascannon sentinel shouldn't be more than 45pts tops.


And, while expensive in terms of $$$, if they were well worth their points cost, this really wouldn't be an issue.

Rioghan Murchadha
21-01-2009, 03:39
For me (before I sold my guard) it was the 4th ed squadron rules. (Not sure if they've changed in 5th as I usually just use my 40k stuff for Stargrunt II). Having to spread the hits around to every sentinel in a squadron made them just die horribly every time someone so much as looked at them funny.

bigbauske
21-01-2009, 04:10
Cost in money and then the fact that every times I turn around the legs break on me!!!

olmsted
21-01-2009, 04:54
wait hold on a sec. how much are yall buying yours for?

at my hobby town im seeing sentinels for 18 usd.

galahad67
21-01-2009, 04:55
I really like the model.

just picked up my 10th in a trade (it needs major repairs) andalong withthe armoured canopy bits I bought a year ago I can now do up a recon apoc formation.

I don't know if I'll ever use them

a recon group OR a baneblade...

the blade will usually win...

someday I'll get to use the WHOLE army. Then the sentinels will see the table...

Eldoriath
21-01-2009, 09:05
Point drop, it's sub-par with the killa kan in all respects, and the kan is cheaper point-wise.

laudarkul
21-01-2009, 14:11
I wait for the new codex. I bought one and I'm going to assembly and test it on the game (I will choose w/AC). But if I see a drop in points I'll definetely grab at least 2 for a Squadron.
Why? I like the model:), is definetely fluffy and in an Apoc battle with outflank+some drop ST I think (not test this combo yet;)) will bring some nightmare to my opponent.

razormasticator
21-01-2009, 14:18
Love the sentinel, I have 10 myself. They are great models, overpriced in games terms and through GW but there are deals to be had in secondary markets.

I think the Emperor's Talon recon group boxed set was a steal.

I run 3 with lascannons, 3 with autocannons and have 3 with heavy flamers and 1 command sentinel with a HK missile and a multilaser.

Thats a full Emperor's Talon group right there.

EVIL INC
21-01-2009, 14:28
The cash cost of the model is what gets me and keeps me from fielding more then 3.
I love them. They have good weapons with range, scout ability with outflanking works wonders. Would like for better armor but for no more then what they cost points-wise and thier usefull ability/armaments thats not a big deal especially when you can also add in a hunter killer missile on each one.

Count de Monet
21-01-2009, 14:40
Points cost. If base cost and armored crew compartment were both cheaper, would be more tempted.

Competition. When looking at FA slots, would generally rather use Hellhounds and Rough Riders. Even if have one slot left, at that stage points are usually too tight to throw another FA unit in.

Variety. For my IG forces usually have a bit of everything, so points are tight. The 3 I can use from the HQ slot are often all I can fit in.

Lord Cook
21-01-2009, 15:12
razormasticator - Me being an annoying nitpick I know, but couldn't you have edited your previous post (#34) to add in the extra information, rather than double posting?

Khornies & milk
21-01-2009, 19:43
I run 3 with lascannons, 3 with autocannons and have 3 with heavy flamers and 1 command sentinel with a HK missile and a multilaser.

Thats a full Emperor's Talon group right there.

I have the exact same as you, plus a squadron of the FW ones...2 ML's, 1 MRP.

3 Plasma Cannon ones would be :cool:

Nym
21-01-2009, 20:21
If you compare them to Eldar Warwalkers, it's easy to spot that something is wrong.

A Warwalker gets 8 shots (dual Scatter Lasers, S6 AP6) when a close-topped Sentinel only gets 3 (Multilaser, S6 AP6), for the same point cost. Plus, the WW is I4 and gets 2 base attacks when the Sentinel is I3 and A1.

Even people who argue that you can't compare point costs between codexes can't say that everything is fine here. No unit should have nearly 3 times more shots and a better profile for the same point cost as another.

Lewis
21-01-2009, 20:26
Competition. When looking at FA slots, would generally rather use Hellhounds and Rough Riders. Even if have one slot left, at that stage points are usually too tight to throw another FA unit in.



Well according to one of the rumours about the new codex the heavy duty sentinels are going to be Heavy choices so you shouldn't have to worry about that anymore. Afterall what else is an IG player going to want to put i those slots more than a squad of chicken walkers?

zeep
21-01-2009, 21:09
Well according to one of the rumours about the new codex the heavy duty sentinels are going to be Heavy choices so you shouldn't have to worry about that anymore. Afterall what else is an IG player going to want to put i those slots more than a squad of chicken walkers?

Its a shame that even when they seem to get it right (heavy sentinels)... they get it wrong.

Clearly Sentinels should be troop slots, in squadrons of 3 - 12... with outflanking. :D (I think I have to get wipes after that thought.)

Khornies & milk
21-01-2009, 21:19
Its a shame that even when they seem to get it right (heavy sentinels)... they get it wrong.

Clearly Sentinels should be troop slots, in squadrons of 3 - 12... with outflanking. :D (I think I have to get wipes after that thought.)

3-12....12, damn I hope they do away with the 'all sentinels in the squadron are targetted as one' if GW ever allow that many in a squad.

That would make you :cries:.

Lord Cook
21-01-2009, 23:04
Frankly I'd rather have heavy sentinels in Elites, instead of Heavy Support. If you're making a mechanized army you don't want much in the way of Elites, so the slots are free. But you pretty much have to have all of the heavies for main battle tanks.

vman
22-01-2009, 00:06
i agree with Lord Cook

If the new dex has sentinals as heavy choices i will cry. I like to keep my heavy slots for basilisks and lemans

Hopefully we can still bring them as HQ support

oh and by the way i think the cadian sentinals are crap, purely because i have 3 and the models themselves arent that great... mainly due to the fact that its a metal/plastic kit. Metal is really starting to annoy me these days it just cannot be compared to plastic for a high level of accuracy, detail, and straightness... the metal components come out warped, and in my unfortunate case it appears as tho the molds for the canopy pieces have shrunk and GW are still casting from a shrunken mold... no matter how i try and sit them on the sentinal chasis, it just doesnt look right

starlight
22-01-2009, 00:30
i agree with Lord Cook

If the new dex has sentinals as heavy choices i will cry. I like to keep my heavy slots for basilisks and lemans

Hopefully we can still bring them as HQ support

It won't be so bad if the rumour of 1-3 per FOC for Russes and Basilisks turns out to be true. :)



oh and by the way i think the cadian sentinals are crap, purely because i have 3 and the models themselves arent that great... mainly due to the fact that its a metal/plastic kit. Metal is really starting to annoy me these days it just cannot be compared to plastic for a high level of accuracy, detail, and straightness... the metal components come out warped, and in my unfortunate case it appears as tho the molds for the canopy pieces have shrunk and GW are still casting from a shrunken mold... no matter how i try and sit them on the sentinal chasis, it just doesnt look right

It's funny, because for *years* people were complaining about the exact opposite...:eek:

Claudio
22-01-2009, 01:36
I love the sentinels. But i hate the fact that they can be destroyed by a bolter. I wish they raise the frontal armour to 11. Or at least make it cheaper.

Sleazy
22-01-2009, 08:24
really nice models, I have 9 of them.

I wouldnt raise the armour, something as light as a sentinel should be at risk from a bolter and at serious risk of a heavy bolter or autocannon.

Maybe drop points a smidge and move them to troops (1 squadron per platoon perhaps).

razormasticator
22-01-2009, 15:00
really nice models, I have 9 of them.

I wouldnt raise the armour, something as light as a sentinel should be at risk from a bolter and at serious risk of a heavy bolter or autocannon.

Maybe drop points a smidge and move them to troops (1 squadron per platoon perhaps).

I love this idea, and I agree. They are a light scout walker and should be treated as so. I hope they price them in the Eldar War-Walker range point wise. Just because it has a heavy weapon does not mean it needs to be in the Heavy FOC slot.

firehippo
22-01-2009, 18:41
I love the look of the models. I always loved the At-At and AT-ST in Starwars, so I really think that does it for me. Plus they are presented as "wild mavericks" in the Codex, similar to Goose and Maverick in Top Gun. The only reason I don't have any is the price in dollars. I really want to get the Steel Legion ones, becuase I like the look of the armored compartment. I'm trying to decide if I should get them now, or wait and hope the new ones come with all the armor, and all the weapons.

I have to say this is the exact reason I love sentinels as well. I also had a blast painting and building the one I have. The first model I have ever done so that I painted as I built it. Awesome detail even if no one else will ever see it. :)

Lord Solar Plexus
22-01-2009, 19:08
I have a couple of sentinels, even an FW one with the missile launcher but they cost so much points-wise for so little discernible effect (three autocannon are 95 points, two multilaser sents are 90 points) that I rarely even touch the rather nice models.



The Guard already has a good rifle


I believe lasguns are more or less smoothbore.

Although rifling would explain the strength characteristic quite well.

Vaktathi
22-01-2009, 19:17
really nice models, I have 9 of them.

I wouldnt raise the armour, something as light as a sentinel should be at risk from a bolter and at serious risk of a heavy bolter or autocannon.

Maybe drop points a smidge and move them to troops (1 squadron per platoon perhaps).

The problem isn't with their AV10 so much, it's the Open Topped coupled with the Squadron rules and their horrendous overcosting.

A sentinel in a squadron is killed by a bolter glance on a 5+, a heavy bolter pen on a 3+, whereas another single AV10 non open topped vehicle would be nigh immune to death by a bolter and only destroyed by an HB pen on a 5+.

coupled with their horrendous overcosting (take a sentinel with a multilaser and an enclosed cockpit and you can get a double scatterlaser warwalker with almost triple the shots and double the CC attacks for the same price) this makes them horrendously poor units right now.

If sentinels lost their open topped and dropped to about 30-35pts with an ML instead of 45, they'd be worth it, as is, they simply are too vulnerable, and too expensive for what they offer.