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Forlorn
22-01-2009, 15:28
This Saturday will be the first time that I will use my new and still to be completed (painted) Daemon army.

It will be a 2000 point game. We'll have 5 objectives in a wasteland enviorment on a 7 foot by 4 foot table.

I have:

HQ: Bloodthirster, and -2- Mark of Khorne Heralds

Troops: 2 units of 10 plagebearers, 2 units of Bloodletters (-1- 9 man unit,
-1- 10 man unit)

Fast Attack: 5 man unit of Flesh Hounds

Heavy Support: -3- DP's, Mark of Khorne, mark of Nurgle, Mark of Tzneetch.

Elites -2- Blood Crushers (seperate units), -1- Spawn of Nurgle (not sure if that is the correct name)

I'l be splitting the army into the two halves: Thirster, Hearlds, Bllodletters, Crushers in one half and everything else in the other.

He has: A Green Tide


I have no shooting to speak of so I'll need to get in amongst him as fast as I can and create as much havoc as possible. I'm really looking forward to this fight and all the deep striking. The key will be my reserves and trying to get in close with as little casualities as possible.

For my paint scheme I refer you to my earlier WIP post. http://warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156739

Thanatos_elNyx
22-01-2009, 15:53
Would Slaanesh (Fiends, etc) and some Soul Grinders (w/ Phelgm) be better at taking an Ork horde?

Reaver83
22-01-2009, 15:56
Having played large infantry orks with daemons I wish you luck.

not what I'd take I'll be honest. If you do fight in hand to hand, fight on your terms over a narrow front (don't let him use numbers) and accept you'll take some damage at the start.

==Me==
22-01-2009, 16:12
Fiends and Grinders would be infinitely better against Orks. More attacks, higher speed, and template weapons (vomit or phlegm) will rack up a lot more kills against the lightly armored Orks.

If this is all you've got, then I'd recommend dropping all your big stuff first along with the PBs carrying an icon. That gives the enemy too many large targets to destroy at once, and you can begin going after his problem units. Nobs, Bosses, vehicles will be top priority for the big guys, while the little ones can come in later to go after his infantry. They will be a lot more susceptible to small arms fire so be sure to stay in cover or out of sight.

What gifts do your units have?

AfroCelt
22-01-2009, 16:12
f he does run a green tide, definitly focus all your deployment at one end, preferably one without the biggest blocks of boys....that way you can make him redeploy the chunky blocks of orks over difficult terrain and large distances. If you make him hit you in waves you have a chance.

Also, whenever possible charge him. He'll lose the extra attack and a full point of str, making him roll 5s instead of 4s with less dice...gigantic!

I'd reccomend a soul grinder with that blast upgrade and flamers as well, but your list should, with luck, win out.

Forlorn
22-01-2009, 16:33
Thanks for all the input. I really created this army to go with my play style. I'm an aggressive player and built the army accordingly. I also built units that interested me so that they would be fun to paint and assemble. All other considerations were secondary to be honest. All my troops have icons so this should help with the reserves deepstriking in to support the units already on the board. I figure the plaguebearers and DP with the Mark of Nurgle should be able to either hold and objective or contest an objective well. I originally intended to have a 20 man unit of plaguebearers but the size was concerning with regard to deepstriking so I broke the units into groups of 10.

Having never played this army I really have no idea what to expect.

My memory is failing me on the gifts I chose. Shh. I'm at work so I don't have my list handy. ;)

2 of my DP's have wings, I know I gave them iron hide. The nurgle DP will slog along with the 2 plagebearer units almost as a retinue. I know I gave the Nugrle DP the Aura of Decay.

Sorry to be vague.

The orks will have alot of troops, lootas, and vehicles. He has quite an extensive collection and unlike me, he has the ability to swap out units to fit the army he will be fighting.

I'm really excited about being able to game this weekend and seeing the fruits of my labor being put to use.

Bellygrub
22-01-2009, 17:48
You should probably watch out for truck units too. The mobility will allow your ork opponent to contest/capture objectives in the last turn of the game. Destroy them early on.

Wait...I'm the ork opponent! OH SNAP!

Forlorn
22-01-2009, 18:02
So we meet..again.

misterboff
22-01-2009, 18:15
As an Ork player, I think charging the Plague Bearers (I know they're slow, but you can try) would be a good idea, because S3 Orks will have a tough time against their T4(5).

I'd use the Bloodletters against anything without a 6+ save ('Ardboyz, 'Eavy Nobz, Meganobz) to make the most of their Hellblades.

Finally, I'd use the Bloodthirster and Daemon Princes against any vehicles.

misterboff

Reaver83
22-01-2009, 18:35
I'd use bloodletters against anything high WS + S4 possibly 5 will do far more damage!

The only problem with charging the orks with plague bearers is they hit first due to S&P, if you charged a 30 man ork boyz mob they'd still do on average 7.5 wounds! Now them charging you will do 20 Wounds to you, but you'll do more damage to them!

dal9ll
22-01-2009, 19:51
Daemons best options against swarms of Greenskins are:

--Daemonettes (always striking first, with a zillion attacks at a weak-armoured enemy)
--Fiends (see above reason)
--Bloodletters (it helps to get the charge too, so you wound on 3's)
--Flamers (pretty self-explanatory)
--Soul Grinders (Orks have trouble dealing with it)

Plaguebearers are not that great of a choice against huge Ork swarm armies. Yeah an Ork has trouble hurting a Plaguebearer but they win by drowning you in a deluge attacks. PB's have a disavantage against Ork swarms for the same reason Plague Marine armies do. Orks just have the answer to your resilience -- numbers.

Forlorn
26-01-2009, 13:21
Update:

The battle was fought. The Orks won with 3 objectives to the Daemons holding only 1, with 1 objective still contested. We played 6 turns.


The Ork nob unit was a juggernought. I didn't kill a single model.

Per Bellygrub:

My kill count was as follows

2 loota units
3 Killa Kanz
1-20 man slugga unit
1 unit of grots
1 Kopta
1-15 man unit of kommandos.
1- 20 man shoota boyz unit

For the Daemons: All I had left at the end was 1 Khorne Herald, 3 Bloodletters, and -2- Plaguebearer units at about 1/2 strength. Everything else was dead.

I made several mistakes with my deployment and leaving Daemon Princes un-supported and completely forgot about my icons. I killed many orks.
End report.

Bellygrub
26-01-2009, 15:07
Disregard one of those slugga units. I thought you killed it because I didn't remember using it...but then I realized it was babysitting the tank objective the whole game.

I only held 2 objectives at the end. You were contesting the one with your dude on the Juggernaught. It was close. Close.

AfroCelt
26-01-2009, 16:43
Update:
...
The Ork nob unit was a juggernought. I didn't kill a single model.
...
...I killed many orks.
End report.

You killed many Orks. That is the most important part :) .

Nobs are nasty, but keep using those power weapons, preferably the str8 or better type. The power weps take away any 'eavy armor and the FNP rolls, so its down to 5+ saves to keep wounds off. And the str 8 just leaves piles of goo behind...

Forlorn
26-01-2009, 17:08
Oh that's right Mr. Grub. I swung those crushers in to contest the one objective. I forgot in the haze of my defeat.

A good game none the less!

It came down to the last saves to keep the game even. But alas..I rolled poorly.

Vedar
26-01-2009, 17:13
Ya Playing Daemon can be very random. I think having everything deep strike is bad enough. The random half of your army coming in is unnecessary.

Good Daemon tactics are since you are only going to get half of your army is focus on one flank.

I've learned against orks deploying first is not really that bad a thing since they can't Wagggghhh first turn. That means if you are lucky enough to deploy outside of 12" orks on foot can't charge you and you can get the charge next turn. Either that or you can deep strike a squad of Plaguebearers as bait real close.

Orks are always an uphill battle. 6 points for an ork.... what were they thinking?

colmarekblack
26-01-2009, 17:21
Almost beat an 'horde' Ork player the other week. He had 90 Boyz and Gazghull with 8 Meganobz. I had less than 50 models to play with so I just massed them in in one place, waited for the boyz to come to me and then I would leap out in ambush! It worked I killed all 90 Boyz + Ghazghulls bodyguard! Shame my BT fluffed his attacks against old Gaz himself, otherwise I could have won the game!

I was mono-Khorne Daemons btw and it was KP's that destroyed me in the end :(.

Shipmonkey
27-01-2009, 08:54
The only problem with charging the orks with plague bearers is they hit first due to S&P

S&P hasn't effected iniative for a couple editions, the Plague Beaers and ork would hit at the same time.

CthulhuDalek
27-01-2009, 09:52
S&P hasn't effected iniative for a couple editions, the Plague Beaers and ork would hit at the same time.

I think he meant that, since you move as though you were going through difficult terrain you'd have reduced init.

But I think there's a difference in that it only does that if you actually are moving through the terrain?

Forlorn
27-01-2009, 15:23
Doing an objective based game for the first time was really interesting. Holding units back and making the final push to contest objectives really brought an additional level of gaming/tactics I've never had with relation to 40k.

I liked having a purpose.

It's the little things that really make all the difference. I had two units (Bloodletters and Plaguebearers) make an assault on a unit of grots and wiped them out. Then I pushed forward with the unit of Bloodletters the following turn to keep a unit of lootas from possibly advancing and contesting the objective. :p

Bellygrub also used his kopta to swoop in on the last turn to contest an objective which swung the battle in his favor. :cries:

I look forward to gaming additional battles/scenerios using objectives.

Znail
27-01-2009, 17:11
Objectives is the best part of 5e, its realy nice that they are all that matters so you can toss everything else aside in the end and go all out to capture or contest objectives. It wasnt nearly the same before when they were only worth a few points as then it wasnt worth it to take any risks to capture objectives.

Bellygrub
27-01-2009, 17:15
Plus it was really nice to be able to play a little more strategically then I normally would. I was pulling things back and rethinking moves based on what objectives I wanted.

dal9ll
27-01-2009, 22:02
Yeah it seems like Daemons have an inherent advantage in objective-based games (and Dawn of War </cackle>), where Orks have an inherent advantage in Kill-points games, due to their often huge unit sizes.