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40kdhs
24-01-2009, 17:15
People at my store call HE pansy and i don't know the reason behind it. Perhaps, it has to do with HE's models.

Will people stop calling HE pansy if GW releases new models? Pls vote. Thank you for participating.

Condottiere
24-01-2009, 17:17
No, but that is more a reflection on our socio-political culture, than on HE models.

40kdhs
24-01-2009, 17:28
No, but that is more a reflection on our socio-political culture, than on HE models.

All Elves are like that? I talked to DE and WE players and they don't consider theirs pansy even though they were HE.

If it's not about HE models, why do you think HE that way because it is bugging me right now?:D

Shamfrit
24-01-2009, 17:31
High Elves have been called Handbaggers since before time was born, I had to enjure it for 2 years back in 5th edition when I played HE...there's no reason for it to just vanish, it's a player perception, more so than the model range.

Arnizipal
24-01-2009, 17:33
Male Elves as a fantasy archetype are often depicted as effeminate and in GW lore this is no different. All Elves are slim, beardless and lack the ripping muscle you often see with the warriors of other races.

Condottiere
24-01-2009, 17:33
I'd rather be vague on this matter, since it could banish your thread to the wastes.

It has to do with the associations one places with the race of Elves; High Elves are easy targets being civilized, polite and appreciative of arts, Wild ones can be given pioneer status, while no-one will describe DE as being soft at anything.

Zarryiosiad
24-01-2009, 17:36
I think it has to do with the color palette GW uses on High Elf miniatures. If they painted an entire army in dark red, gold, and black (say, the colors of the Blood Elves in World of Warcraft) instead of white, baby blue, and silver, people would be less likely to think of them as "pansy".

Zarryiosiad

selone
24-01-2009, 17:39
Orcs call elves pansies, orks call eldar pansies don't they, isn't that where its from?

40kdhs
24-01-2009, 17:40
I'd rather be vague on this matter, since it could banish your thread to the wastes.


It's an interesting debate.




It has to do with the associations one places with the race of Elves; High Elves are easy targets being civilized, polite and appreciative of arts, Wild ones can be given pioneer status, while no-one will describe DE as being soft at anything.

I don't see how HE is going to be any different from DE because you can't be soft when you ride a Dragon and go to war constantly.

sulla
24-01-2009, 17:42
Orcs call elves pansies, orks call eldar pansies don't they, isn't that where its from?

Yup. It's a tradition in warhammer, just like dwarves being called stunties and marines being called beakies.

40kdhs
24-01-2009, 17:42
Orcs call elves pansies, orks call eldar pansies don't they, isn't that where its from?

you took ork's words seriously even though they are considered to be 12 year old kids?:D

40kdhs
24-01-2009, 17:46
I think it has to do with the color palette GW uses on High Elf miniatures. If they painted an entire army in dark red, gold, and black (say, the colors of the Blood Elves in World of Warcraft) instead of white, baby blue, and silver, people would be less likely to think of them as "pansy".

Zarryiosiad

GW needs to change HE's image because it's not right.

Condottiere
24-01-2009, 17:51
If it's a simple case of colours, that wouldn't be a problem, since you can paint your miniatures any way you want. It seems unlikely that GW will change their uniform colouring scheme, since it's meant to be a contrast to the other two sub-races.

Sir Charles
24-01-2009, 18:13
Orcs call elves pansies, orks call eldar pansies don't they, isn't that where its from?I'm pretty sure this is the reason, along with what Condo said.

Sir_Lunchalot
24-01-2009, 18:16
They're note even as tough as humans. The problem is what elf archetype does GW use? if they had gone with Tolkien style elves, then nobody would call elves pansies 'cause they're tougher than anything bar dwarves. Instead they chose the frail elf approach, which, when translated into orkish, is correctly pronounced "pan-zee."

Neknoh
24-01-2009, 18:22
The notion of calling the High Elves, despite being a standing army, pansies is an age-old tradition found throughout human cultures (mind you, elves have not always been the target).

We can compare the Elves to the Athenians of of ancient Greece. During the era of the Persian Wars, the City State of Athens was the strongest and most powerful of all of the city states, political influence beyond that of any other and with a military might rivalling that of Sparta on land and having the strongest fleet (on several occasions in greek history even) of the City States.

Now, the Athenians were STILL considered weak, or pansy by the Spartans for one simple reason, they were not warriors in their everyday life. They had a trained and daily training army, however, they were artists, poets and actors. Writers and musicians. They were, to a Spartan, pansies.


The High Elves are poets, philosophers, artists, musicians and actors, they lead a life of pansyness compared to other war-like cultures of the Warhammer world. Compared to the rest of elven kinn, despite the High Elven lineage of said elves, we are looking at an EXTREMELY wussy population.

W0lf
24-01-2009, 18:38
Good historical refrence Neknoh; Beat me to it, but thats spot on.

Thats why HEs and to a lesser extent Eldar are called pansies.

omgadinosaur
24-01-2009, 20:07
It's because of the whole "Glittering Host" thing. When GW described how an army likes to bedazel their gear it doesn't look awesome compared to orcs who go "WAAAAGHH!"

That's why my elves are not painted white, silver and blue.

IAMNOTHERE
24-01-2009, 20:24
It's down to stereotypes. People like stereotypes so dwarves are stunties, HE are pansies, marines are beakies and orks are fungus.

t-tauri
24-01-2009, 20:44
I can see this thread heading in the wrong direction. Let's remember homophobia isn't big and it's not clever. It's against the posting guidelines so please bear that in mind else the thread will be wasted and action will be taken against the offending posters.

t-tauri

The Warseer Inquisition

kurayami
24-01-2009, 20:57
My friends used to call my High Elves pansies until I started dominating regularly; now they just call them cheesy. If you want people to stop calling your HE’s wussy or pansy then you need to bring it and rub it in. If your big bad army can be beaten so easily by a bunch of weak and frail elves, you may need to get a better army big guy. They love that.

Drasanil
24-01-2009, 21:29
As stated before the reasons high elves and eldar are called panzies is that the males tend to represented in a rather effimenate manner (long hair, angular features, and proper hygene). The sterotype would also extend to dark and wood elves but for the fact they can be more easily associated with S&M and hippies respectively.

Of course the amusing part is that such accusations often come from player's who's armies consist of muscle bound leather clad barbarians, and power armored men with a strong greco-roman theme:angel:

Brother Loki
24-01-2009, 22:05
It's a fairly common term for elves (and occasionally Fae) used by lots of gamers. It crops up in LARP, D&D and all sorts. It's not specific to WFB Elves, and not worth getting upset over.

Condottiere
24-01-2009, 22:47
That's true, and Elves in lots of different settings have nicknames that refer to the same thing. In Shadowrun, one reference was Dandelion Eaters.

Frankly
24-01-2009, 22:57
The High Elves are poets, philosophers, artists, musicians and actors, they lead a life of pansyness compared to other war-like cultures of the Warhammer world. Compared to the rest of elven kinn, despite the High Elven lineage of said elves, we are looking at an EXTREMELY wussy population.

... and they wear a dress.

havoc626
24-01-2009, 23:00
It is also, as many have said previously, a 'nickname' for them. Dwarves are Stunties, Orcs are fungus, HE are pansies. It is mostly to do with their fluff (Unless you're a stunty, in which it is also the model). In 6th ed for instance, the general of a HE army was randomised, something along the lines of politics. So while all other armies would simply have the strongest leader as their general, they'd sit around and talk about it, before getting anything done. Didn't make much sense if you ask me.

And HE aren't the only elves that cop flak either. WE are the hippies and DE are either goths or emos. It doesn't have anything to do with the models or playstyle, just the background of the army.

Arnizipal
24-01-2009, 23:30
... and they wear a dress.
And Orcs wear skirts. :angel:

Shamfrit
24-01-2009, 23:50
Dandelion Eaters.

Thanks!

I've been looking for a name for my Slaaneshi/Khornate Chaos Space Marine legion for ages :D

TheDarkDuke
25-01-2009, 00:10
It has nothing to do with just GW, nor does it have only a HE attachment.

First most fans of elves don't call them this, but those who dislike or like other races over elves refer to them as panzies. When it comes to GW people refer to High Elf, Wood Elf, Dark Elf, Eldar and Dark Eldar as panzies. In LoTR people refer to them as panzies, its a term people use for elves period, no matter the source, so the answer can only be NO.

The Red Scourge
25-01-2009, 01:58
The only correct approach to people calling your panzies panzies, is to respond with a poem expressing your the affront to your soul and the mental anguish you suffer from this slight. And then follow up by challenging them to a duel ;)

My wood elf treehuggers usually retort by quoting the recipe with which we will cook and feast upon their fallen – and then I give my treeman a big hug ;)

Seriously, namecalling is part of the game, and the warhammer fluff is saturated in cliches and stereotypes, so there is a rich source of material for picking on all armies. Do not take it personally, as noone is questioning your sexuality – and trust me, being gay gives no advantages nor disadvantages for playing the game (though it might spook an immature tabletop gamer ;) ). So take the little blows like a man (no pun intended), and have fun playing the game and badmouth the lesser races.

MrBigMr
25-01-2009, 04:29
All elves are whoopsies and they make everyone else look super butch. That's the end of that chapter.

You can twist and turn the models, but it doesn't affect the core of the problem(?), which is that elves are, have always been, and will always be pretty people with big and bouncy hair and fancy things and a very, very snob attitude towards others, "less fortunate" people.

And why would you want to change that? Do you feel insecure playing with an army everyone else says is gay? You want an army of big strong men with beards, muscles, leatherware and a very, very butch attitude? Or do you want your women to actually be women?

Elves are what they are and we love them and love to hate them for it.

Johnnyfrej
25-01-2009, 04:36
Elves are what they are and we love them and love to hate them for it.
Especially the later half ;)

WhiteKnight
25-01-2009, 05:03
I've gotten somewhat less bashing on my HE ever since my color changed from dark green to Red, Gold, and White. When I had the dark green, I still had not the bashing Blue and white gets but still. Its tough being a T3 elf.

havoc626
25-01-2009, 06:05
Or do you want your women to actually be women?

Thanks a lot for reminding me of the female Maneater model they released. Easily the most disturbing model GW has ever made. It still gives me nightmares.

Condottiere
25-01-2009, 06:18
The only correct approach to people calling your panzies panzies, is to respond with a poem expressing your the affront to your soul and the mental anguish you suffer from this slight. And then follow up by challenging them to a duel ;)


Then, as you draw your sword, you hear a thunderous explosion and pain rip through your side.

And as you fall over, the last words you hear are, " ... bring ... knife ... gunfight."

The Red Scourge
25-01-2009, 06:25
And as you fall over, the last words you hear are, " ... bring ... knife ... gunfight."

"You humans and your big, big guns... <sigh> Seems like you compensate for something..." :angel:

isidril93
25-01-2009, 06:31
my friends used to say the HE had their cone heads to charge people with...i guess that why i always one, and they got beaten by conehead :)

starlight
25-01-2009, 06:33
It's all about talking trash, which is the arena of children and Professional Wrestlers. :p


If you talk trash and win, you're a jerk.
If you talk trash and lose, you're an idiot.


Deeds, not words. Let your armies do the talking and may Fortune favour the Bold. :D

Leogun_91
25-01-2009, 06:40
I rarely call them pansys anymore for a few reasons, 1) in first edition they were the best playable race the only thing they were worse than another in was T and then it was dwarfs that were better. 2) These guys goes out and kills lions with their bare hands 3) Their elites beats my elites (except when I play WoC in which case my chosen has a fair chance)

I do give them crap but thatīs for being low save T3 that even Arrer boyz has a fair chance of shooting to death.

isidril93
25-01-2009, 06:44
I do give them crap but thatīs for being low save T3 that even Arrer boyz has a fair chance of shooting to death.

and thats saying somthing

Condottiere
25-01-2009, 06:44
Deeds, not words. Let your armies do the talking and may Fortune favour the Bold. :D

Or the loaded dice.:p

bomblu
25-01-2009, 07:14
Well i do play high elves and i'm considered as the one with the 'gay army' in my circle of friends. Apart from it being a joke, and during games i come up with a few jokes about always striking first (homosexual connotation) and being the best at what elves do (once again...connotation) i dont mind having an army which is made up of thin blond men for the simple reason that their background's quite solid and they've got dragons, lions, gryphons, eagles...and they're v.good at close combat with a bunch of v.decent special units.

As for new models...they might reduce the ammount of 'pansy-calling' by 10% maximum, but you cant make high elves look 'bad ass' like say dark elves or chaos - High Elves are the epitome of Good, they dont have spikes and they're v.clean ppl :p

EdFireborn
25-01-2009, 07:41
No... HE will always be considered pansy, i personally don't, but most other people do, WE and DE are more ferocious than HE so arent considered pansy :D

40kdhs
25-01-2009, 16:13
WE and DE are more ferocious than HE so arent considered pansy :D

It's a double standard and it's unfair because we are elves.:D

MrBigMr
25-01-2009, 18:21
WE and DE are more ferocious than HE so arent considered pansy :D
ALL elves are pansies, be they amish, high, emo or space.

Dead Man Walking
25-01-2009, 18:26
Elves being called Pansies is a staple of fantasy stories, even in dragonlance dwarves call elves pansies. Why? Call an elf a Pansy and you usually get thier very agry attention.

Leogun_91
25-01-2009, 18:34
Just came up with the best way to taunt elfs

Taunter: Everyone who isnīt a pansy say no
Phoenix guard:...........
Taunter: Everyone who thinks Malekith isnīt great say no.
Phoenix guard::mad:......(Silent charge)
Taunter:Everyone who doesnīt die from bucketloads of shortbow shots say no
Phoenix guard::eek: (dies from bucketbloads of shortbow shots)

Rioghan Murchadha
25-01-2009, 19:07
I can see this thread heading in the wrong direction. Let's remember homophobia isn't big and it's not clever. It's against the posting guidelines so please bear that in mind else the thread will be wasted and action will be taken against the offending posters.

t-tauri

The Warseer Inquisition

Actually, I don't think there's anything in the way of homophobia here. High elves wear dresses. That makes them transvestites. If you look around most societally enlightened countries, you'll find vast numbers of TVs that aren't actually homosexual at all. Totally different connotation.

(Besides, if wearing a skirt or dress made one homosexual, the Scots would've become extinct a long time ago due to lack of reproduction :p)

AngryAngel
25-01-2009, 19:21
they just are, It's their whole better then thou attitude. Or the "I'm so sexy, smart and perfect" way of being. Least thats why I generally call them pansies. Maybe its not right, but it is what it is.

celdiruen
25-01-2009, 19:57
High Elves are pansy because they are haughty and full of themselves. Dark Elves can't be pansy because they are badass and evil and want to kill and enslave. Wood Elves live in forests and are awesome skirmishers/good at guerrilla warfare, so they can't be pansy either.

That's basically it in layman's terms I think.

Arnizipal
25-01-2009, 20:04
Wood Elves live in forests and are awesome skirmishers/good at guerrilla warfare, so they can't be pansy either.

They're treehugging hippies who want to appease the "spirits of the forest".
And their best fighters are dancers. Sure that's not pansy at all ;)

W0lf
25-01-2009, 20:07
Hey if some tall thin hunter could dance you to death you'd consider him weak?

Id say killing a bunch of people by dancing makes them pretty hard...

Arnizipal
25-01-2009, 20:14
Hey if some tall thin hunter could dance you to death you'd consider him weak?

Id say killing a bunch of people by dancing makes them pretty hard...
Consider a Swordmaster, who wields a double handed weapon faster than a regular man would wield a dagger. Do you think of him as weak?

W0lf
25-01-2009, 20:15
No but i think of him as pansy.

what witht he fact hes all 'good', 'pretty', 'proper' and has a elongated cone helm

Arnizipal
25-01-2009, 20:20
And War Dancers are half naked and wear loincloths while dancing gracefully (and killing you of course - but that's beside the point).
Fits in the 'pretty' category don't you think? Rather pansy even...

Condottiere
25-01-2009, 21:13
Most Elf factions will continue to suffer this form of name calling for the foreseeable future, possibly beyond.

Prince, Chapelle and Eddy Murphy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwC3Fi7afXQ), couldn't find the original.

SlaaneshSlave
26-01-2009, 01:03
Let's try this from another angle...

What about High Elves are macho?

Can't think of a thing. They don't even shave!

40kdhs
26-01-2009, 01:44
Consider a Swordmaster, who wields a double handed weapon faster than a regular man would wield a dagger. Do you think of him as weak?

How about a DP lance? It's said that a DP could kill 2 DEs with his lance. Somehow, we are still 'weak' and 'pansy'.:wtf:



Can't think of a thing. They don't even shave!


Yes, they do. Do you see 'beard' on HE's face? :)

Pulsks
26-01-2009, 03:31
Compared to dwarves, everything are pansies

Maskedman5oh4
26-01-2009, 03:40
Mods pls change the Poll question to "Will people stop calling HE pansy?"

Ward.
26-01-2009, 03:57
People at my store call HE pansy and i don't know the reason behind it.

All elves, in all settings are mocked for being pansies.

It has a lot to do with them being sues and perfect at everything, this has spread into warhammer.
Although warhammer elves are by and large considered slightly less effeminate then DnD or tolkien's, small victory there I guess.

loveless
26-01-2009, 04:52
I consider the High Elves to be "pansies" for one reason:

They are not Dark Elves.

AngryAngel
26-01-2009, 06:46
I have to say, I do consider all elves to be pansy. I've already said why for HE. DE are just a bunch of sucker punching little girls. Who talk all big and bad and evil, but when the chips are down will run just like a pansy would. While the wood elves are dancing through the forests, hugging tree's, praising the earth mother. When your most bad a** fighters are half naked feminine looking men and women, its a little pansy.

What can ya do right ? Only keep killing them on the tabletop.

Hulkster
26-01-2009, 07:11
ALL elves are panseys.

They always will be.

There are certain exception Drizz't for example, but generall they are soft skinny whiney panseys.

I play Dark elves and I want to play Wood Elves, but they are still panseys.

Wood elfs being the most pansey like

Condottiere
26-01-2009, 07:13
All elves, in all settings are mocked for being pansies.

It has a lot to do with them being sues and perfect at everything, this has spread into warhammer.
Although warhammer elves are by and large considered slightly less effeminate then DnD or tolkien's, small victory there I guess.No one could describe Tolkien's Noldor as pansies, though Silvan ones strike me as going closer to this stereotype.

Embalmed
26-01-2009, 08:48
Well

- They're slim
- They have long, well kept hair
- They have no facial hair

This makes them look effeminate. Add to this that:

- They are clean and neat
- They are sophisticated

and it's really not hard to understand why many think of them as, well, pansies. This is not to say that they aren't rock hard in spirit.

badgeraddict
26-01-2009, 09:04
I consider the High Elves to be "pansies" for one reason:

They are not Dark Elves.

LOL! Thats the best remark of this whole thread!

I started collecting High Elves after I'd finished my Dark Elves, and I did indeed find them wanting. Perhaps I should give them a chance. However they are no where near as much fun to paint as Dark Elves.

The Red Scourge
26-01-2009, 11:06
Wood elfs being the most pansey like

Yes, pansey murdering psychopaths ;)

But its definitely Dark Elves with their panzey emo attitude and imagery, who takes the prize as the pansiest of panseys – downright despicable :rolleyes:

Condottiere
26-01-2009, 11:12
How do you figure that? I would think twice before I'd imply that against anyone who has the means and inclination to disembowel people without hesitation.

Chiron
26-01-2009, 11:21
I just plum dont like Elves, which is probably a mix of Pratchett and not liking anyone who looks down on others (Ironic I know...)

Lord Malorne
26-01-2009, 11:24
ALL elves are panseys.

They always will be.

There are certain exception Drizz't for example, but generall they are soft skinny whiney panseys.

I play Dark elves and I want to play Wood Elves, but they are still panseys.

Wood elfs being the most pansey like

(We are not panseys...were's Orion when you need him...stupid winter ;))

I think (in regards to HE) its beacuse they are pretty and like pretty things.

Pretty obvious really, DE can be panseys if you squint your eyese a little :D.

MrBigMr
26-01-2009, 12:17
Ok, I'll admit it, dark elves are not pansies, they're just sad. There's nothing sadder in this world than an emo elf. What's the matter, emo elf, you gonna cry? You gonna run to your mommy and write an sad poem about how sad you are?

kurayami
26-01-2009, 21:34
My lawn is so emo that it cuts itself

Ward.
27-01-2009, 02:01
No one could describe Tolkien's Noldor as pansies, though Silvan ones strike me as going closer to this stereotype.
The Noldor are accounted the best of the Elves and all the peoples in Middle-earth in lore, warfare and crafts.
The above is a wikipedia quote, and it qualifies them for a sue status.
Being the best at everything naturally is also a good indicator of panziness.


Ok, I'll admit it, dark elves are not pansies, they're just sad. There's nothing sadder in this world than an emo elf. What's the matter, emo elf, you gonna cry? You gonna run to your mommy and write an sad poem about how sad you are?
What's so emo about dark elves?



There are certain exception Drizz't for example, but generall they are soft skinny whiney panseys.

For those who aren't aware, Drizz't is something like Anne Rices version of a dark elf. :D

English 2000
27-01-2009, 03:04
Yup. It's a tradition in warhammer, just like dwarves being called stunties and marines being called beakies.

Beaky isn't a name for marines - it's a helmet style that only a few marines wear (generally the most bad a$$ ones :P )

My elves are silver, baby blue and white. I happen to like that colour scheme. I also consider them to be pansies - really, why get upset over it? They are pansies!!! I probably make fun of pansy elves as much as the next guy. I call my elves far worse names all the time! Since mine generally fail more ld tests than a neutered goblin I currently refer to them as my army of cheese eating surrender monkeys. But hey, that's just me ;)

Rioghan Murchadha
27-01-2009, 03:50
Hey if some tall thin hunter could dance you to death you'd consider him weak?

Id say killing a bunch of people by dancing makes them pretty hard...
To be fair, they don't kill people by dancing. They kill people by distracting them with dancing, and then stabbing them with swords.


How about a DP lance? It's said that a DP could kill 2 DEs with his lance. Somehow, we are still 'weak' and 'pansy'.:wtf:


Ok.. c'mon. Talking about DPing someone with your lance isn't going to make you any more manly.. :p

Condottiere
27-01-2009, 05:49
I'm told White Lions are quite "manly".

Latro
27-01-2009, 08:28
Bring your dice in a handbag and have a good laugh about it, trashtalk is part of the hobby and not to be taken too seriously.


:cool: