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View Full Version : Tank Shock -was 1500 Imperial Guard vs. Tyranids



SaschaKreiger
25-01-2009, 00:24
I was playing a game against a Tyranid player and already had disadvantage because of the mission rules and deployment as well as a phobia of losing tanks. Anyway, so my opponent has a Hive Tyrant with a Space Marine mounted behind the head, but you can't really see it because of the wings and head of the Hive Tyrant. Every turn of the game, this player tells me how the Hive Tyrant is going to destroy all my tanks. He finally gets me so worried that as soon as his OMG expensive model (he prided himself on his large unit of 16 point Termagaunts) got within movement range of one of my Leman Russes, I tank shocked it. He decided to do a death or glory thinking he would make all his attacks on the rear armor, but I decided to check the rules. It turned out he made one attack on the front armor, but he proceeded. He lossed his expensive model with all its saves and all its wounds in one moment. Than he said that since he hadn't known the rule before that he should be able to take back the death or glory; I never considered it.

Johnnyfrej
26-01-2009, 04:24
Sounds like a sore loser to me. I wouldn't have let him take it back.

Musabre
29-01-2009, 01:38
He should have read the rulebook :P

In my local group we always put it down to general's blunder (very realistic as a matter of fact, just look at every war in history) and get on with the game. Sans death or glory trooper if need be hehe.

M

Vote Kantor
29-01-2009, 07:11
Did you tell him he would make one attack on the front before or after he proceeded,
if before than he is a sore loser yes, if after than hes just ignorant, but he still had to go with it

t-tauri
29-01-2009, 21:15
Not suitable for battle reports as it barely reaches the level of anecdote. Moved to 40k general. Thread retitled.

Ganymene
29-01-2009, 21:25
Ignorance of the rules is no excuse.

Too bad though, if he'd just have moved it out of the way, he could have eaten that tank for lunch next turn.

Remoah
29-01-2009, 21:40
Should've just held fast and fired all guns.
Nids or not, anything coming out of a russ is gonna blast em 'good.

Well it depends, if he's a decent kinda bloke and he didnt make his attack already then fine, but if it's some arrogant little 12YO then i'd be happy to just let 'em cop it.

Gensuke626
29-01-2009, 22:19
If you inform your opponent of the rule and he doesn't immediately ask if he can take it back, that's his own fault.

Thraximus
30-01-2009, 03:35
Even so, I feel that your opponent should have looked up the Death or Glory rule himself since wanted to make that attack. I say its his own fault for not knowing the rule that he wanted to invoke.

Hicks
30-01-2009, 04:27
He made a poor decision in the first place out of ignorance, but then he decided to do it even after you told him the exact ruling. He made a truly stupid decision, it's normal he should pay for it. I mean, he could have just stepped aside and killed the tank on his turn... that was just really dumb.

LawrencePhillips
30-01-2009, 07:36
TBH - as a fair player, on checking the rules to find Death or Glory is against front armour and seeing the unit has no chance of doing that, i'd have said to him; "are you sure you want to do that, because it'll be against the front armour?"

If he still chooses to continue, he's had his chance and you were being a good sport.

PS. Did you mean geanstealers (the ones with rending claws) gaunts can't hurt AV 10 without hidious expensive upgrades and then they're just not worth it.

ctsteel
30-01-2009, 07:42
I hope you realise that with Tank Shock and Death or Glory, only one model can attempt that attack?

p69 of the rulebook, Death or Glory! section, states that one of the models can stand and attempt to destroy the vehicle, but the rest of the unit gets out of the way. If the model fails, that one model is destroyed utterly.

So if you tank shock his big unit of termagants, one of them can DoG, and only that model will die. The rest will move out of the way as per normal tank shock rules. Also note that it is only ever one attack, regardless of what weapon or CC attack the model is capable of.

LawrencePhillips
30-01-2009, 07:48
ctsteel: I think a lot of groups actually have house rules that over-ride that as its quite unnecessary. Well mine does at least.

Regardless, it's one attack for any model attempting DoG and attempting it with a valuable unit unlikely to succeed is a dumb thing to do.

Gensuke626
30-01-2009, 08:04
ctsteel: I think a lot of groups actually have house rules that over-ride that as its quite unnecessary. Well mine does at least.

Regardless, it's one attack for any model attempting DoG and attempting it with a valuable unit unlikely to succeed is a dumb thing to do.

I've NEVER heard of anyone House Ruling it to allow more than one model to attack during a Death or Glory. The whole point of Death or Glory is to be that last ditch effort to stop a tank. It's not supposed to be a legitimate strategy for taking down enemy tanks and it's supposed to dissuade people from Tank Shocking but not to the level where people will be afraid of a Squad of Chaos Chosen can toss 5 Melta Shots at an incoming tank...

Mojaco
30-01-2009, 08:23
Even if it was against rear armour, he'd still be ignorant to try. With extra armour you have 3 out of 6 penetrating hits results that still crush the tyrant utterly.

I did it once years ago too, for fun, as I figured the coolness would be remembered far longer then any victory yes or no. Coincidentily, I was reminded of it last wednesday :)

a squig
30-01-2009, 09:01
16 points per gaunt:wtf::confused::confused:

why on earth would you spend 16 points of termagaunts when you can use genesteler for the same points. If your gaunts even exced 9 or 10 points you have done sommething wrong to start with..

it sounds like he need to read his tyranid codex as well ;)

javgoro
30-01-2009, 09:55
Yum... The sweet sound of a massively expensive hive tyrant crushed under a Leman Russ´ tracks...

That said, he acted like an idiot. I´m glad you did this, and no, you shouldn´t have let him take his movement back.

inquisitor solarris
30-01-2009, 09:59
Oh How I love the classic "over- confidence"back fire :P If he wanted to be smart he could have simply ignore the test and walked around the rear.

Sholto
30-01-2009, 15:15
His choices were Death or Glory. He chose ... poorly :)

Sholto

SaschaKreiger
01-02-2009, 23:14
Did you tell him he would make one attack on the front before or after he proceeded,
if before than he is a sore loser yes, if after than hes just ignorant, but he still had to go with it

I told him I wanted to do a tank shock and asked him what kinds of attacks the Hive Tyrant had. He said it was something like four S7+26 or something like that. I considered whether or not to continue and asked if the attacks were made on the front since it was a death or glory. We went back and forth and I finally picked up the rule book. After reading the rule, I quickly made my choice and he rolled, failed, lost the Hive Tyrant, and asked to take back; I said "no."

Gensuke626
01-02-2009, 23:20
I told him I wanted to do a tank shock and asked him what kinds of attacks the Hive Tyrant had. He said it was something like four S7+26 or something like that. I considered whether or not to continue and asked if the attacks were made on the front since it was a death or glory. We went back and forth and I finally picked up the rule book. After reading the rule, I quickly made my choice and he rolled, failed, lost the Hive Tyrant, and asked to take back; I said "no."

Then it's his fault. If you Read the rule and he STILL rolled the dice, it has his misjudgment and not your fault at all. Now, someone's gotta find this guy. I wanna see how his tyrant stands up to a Deff Rolla!

Shadesfox
01-02-2009, 23:36
If he knew the rules and got his tyrant eaten then that is his fault. It also sounds like he was acting like a baby through the rest of the game, so good on you for crunching his tyrant.

Godgolden
02-02-2009, 00:07
its one auto hit remember, i felt i needed to put that in their.

and yes.. the name does say it all... kill it (or immobalise =P) or DIE!!! come on.. use ya noggin.

Codsticker
02-02-2009, 01:38
I told him I wanted to do a tank shock and asked him what kinds of attacks the Hive Tyrant had. He said it was something like four S7+26 or something like that. I considered whether or not to continue and asked if the attacks were made on the front since it was a or glory. We went back and forth and I finally picked up the rule book. After reading the rule, I quickly made my choice and he rolled, failed, lost the Hive Tyrant, and asked to take back; I said "no."

I notice that you didn't mention whether or not you told him that he was mistaken once you had the rule book open. It's one thing if he does something under under a false understanding of the rules with no prior disscussion, but in this instance there was an obvious dissagreement and it should be perfectly clear to both players before the action is pursued.

SaschaKreiger
04-02-2009, 14:57
Then it's his fault. If you Read the rule and he STILL rolled the dice, it has his misjudgment and not your fault at all. Now, someone's gotta find this guy. I wanna see how his tyrant stands up to a Deff Rolla!

His Hive Tyrant has a Space Marine on the shoulders, so you'll know if you see him. That assumes you actually manage to see the thing behind the head and wings. He'll probably tell you the part about how it died without the part about the rules. His previous story was about a Carnifex being killed by a bolt pistol on its last wound, which is extremely frustrating and the reason I took the terminators out of my army.

Firaxin
04-02-2009, 16:22
Hive Tyrants are Str6 max, and have +2d6 for armor penetration.

Alcibiades
04-02-2009, 17:54
His previous story was about a Carnifex being killed by a bolt pistol on its last wound, which is extremely frustrating and the reason I took the terminators out of my army.

You had termies in an IG army?