PDA

View Full Version : Best Troops / Scoring Unit Discussion



Prefect
30-01-2009, 21:12
The weekend is upon us and I'd like to have a friendly discussion on the best scoring unit in the game. Now obviously everyone has an opinion on this, but the idea is to see some of the overlooked units as well as the obvious ones.

Please respond with your selection and justification.

IE: my submission to start things off goes as follows:

Best Scoring Unit:
Death Guard

Reason:
Statistically they're tougher than terminators when it comes to taking straight up hits. (I love anything with FNP:evilgrin:)

aaaand ... go

Johnnyfrej
30-01-2009, 21:31
Wow, a "what unit is teh best" thread! Never seen one of these before :rolleyes:

edit: Oh, what the hell.
10man Grey Knights squad with twin Incinerators would be my bet.

ZOMGBBQ
30-01-2009, 21:35
20 Man Necron Warriors with Attached Lord.

Bodysnatcher
30-01-2009, 21:43
Nob biker unit (with warboss to make them troops).

Silly, silly good.

Frep
30-01-2009, 21:45
Full size conscript platoon with attached commissar, hard to burn 50 guys off an objective if they're essientially fearless. Of course the have roughly as much hitting power as a sock full of kittens.

Mozzamanx
30-01-2009, 21:46
Plaguebearers, going to ground in heavy cover, with Fateweaver nearby.

Apparently, it takes something like 72 Bolter shots to get even a single kill.

blackroyal
30-01-2009, 21:47
20 Plaguebearers. They deepstrike onto an objective in cover and go to ground. They then get a 3+/4+ save. Go ahead and try to remove them from a distance.

This is of course from a "scoring" perspective.

*Ninja's... they kill you dead*

Lame Duck
30-01-2009, 21:49
Scouts in a land raider, behind a building, surrounded by more land raiders.

rooster27
30-01-2009, 21:54
20 noise marrines with blast master and a s*** load of sonic blasters

Llothlian
30-01-2009, 21:55
10 Battle Sisters, Vet w/ Book, Heavy Flamer, Melta Gun, Rhino w/ EA, Smokes for 209pts. Best troops choice in the game.

slasher
30-01-2009, 22:09
Eldar Pathfinders (untill some-one comes along with a flamer/equivilant)

Flinch
30-01-2009, 22:32
Best scoring unit:
ANY SCORING UNIT!

Capturing an objective is still an objective ... caught...

.. maybe i missed the point of this thread ;)

captainramoz
30-01-2009, 22:44
termies in land raider great if u want to conquer and objective just send the land raider to the objective and them deploy the termies easy tactic and really effective

Irondog
30-01-2009, 22:45
You guys have all made some good points, but there's one theme I see in these posts. The units you're talking about are expensive as hell.

Here's my unit of choice...

wait for it...

Grotz!

For 40 points you get an 11 wound unit with a 3+ cover save if they go to ground (and why wouldn't they). They're also small enough to stay out of LOS for the most part, so they may not have to make many of the cover saves anyway.

I know, I know.."the whole mob will get wasted by the first flamer or lone assaulter that gets to them!" This is true. That's why they're so damn cheap. While 40 points is holding an objective (as opposed to well over 200 for some of the other units mentioned) the rest of your army's points are used for big, nasty, stompy things to knock the enemy flat and take their lunch money.

Providence
30-01-2009, 22:49
Best troops for capturing objectives is Plaugebearers for sure, going to ground with them is insane and like someone said with Kairos nearby are completely immovable, that objective is pretty hard to contest with 20 models too good luck getting within 3"

Bran Dawri
30-01-2009, 23:59
15 Blood Claws with a wolf guard leader, and an IC with full complement of wolves to keep them from running. Enough bodies (and attacks) to keep an objective, and enough hitting power to take it from just about anything, too.

Either those, or genestealers.

zealot!
31-01-2009, 00:02
Nob bikers hands down. Make each one different and you can spread wounds. T5 w/4+ cover, feel no pain, and a 5+ invul. save... turbo boosts and can have multiple power-fists and kombi-scorchas...

only drawback is that they're a bit pricey..

Creeping Dementia
31-01-2009, 00:05
Tau firewarriors with a... ummm... with something nearby... umm... and ethereal bodyguard... and... dang...





nevermind.

Emperors Tears
31-01-2009, 00:06
SM Sterngaurd with droppod and Kantor in the list, kiss anything with wounds goodbye

Hicks
31-01-2009, 00:23
Ork Nobz on bikes get my vote. They are very killy in the shooting and CC phase, they can move really fast, they don't die

Orkeosaurus
31-01-2009, 00:25
How about Chaos Spawn?

They're pretty good.

starlight
31-01-2009, 00:40
10 Battle Sisters, Vet w/ Book, Heavy Flamer, Melta Gun, Rhino w/ EA, Smokes for 209pts. Best troops choice in the game.

Rather have twenty Battle Sisters w Frag/Krak, Heavy Flamer, Melta Gun, Imagifier, Vet w/ Book/Plasma Pistol/Combi-Flamer/Meltabombs/Auspex.:)


Although if it was *my* choice, no one has ever trumped my favourite...:D

A Maxed Out IG Mech Platoon with Carapace, Camo, and Sharpshooters. 55+ IG, with 4+/?+ backed up by six Chimera pouring out Str6/7/8 shots and Templates every turn...:eek:

Bunnahabhain
31-01-2009, 01:51
I second starlight.

Best in terms of efficiency for a sensible points value: Sisters or Dire avengers. Both get very good, fairly cheaply.

Best in terms of filling a FOC slot , without a practical points limit.: The Maxed out Guard platoon. Easily 2000 points, maybe 3000 -- can't be bothered to run the numbers exactly due to beer-- 6 independent scoring mechanised units. Ouch.

MrBigMr
31-01-2009, 02:01
Although if it was *my* choice, no one has ever trumped my favourite...:D

A Maxed Out IG Mech Platoon with Carapace, Camo, and Sharpshooters. 55+ IG, with 4+/?+ backed up by six Chimera pouring out Str6/7/8 shots and Templates every turn...:eek:
Nah, man, try this on for size:
Full platoon, carapace, camo, mechanized, abhuman and Afriel Strain. Ok, you can't reroll the ones, but you get ATSKNF. On Guard. You'll have to be annihilated to the last man. Don't forget the Honorifica JO to give them Ld. 9.

EDIT: Did the math.
Command Platoon:
-JO, Master-Crafted PF, SB, Bionics, Honorifica, Frag & Krag
-4x Vets, MC PP, MC SB, 1x Medic, Bionics, Frag & Krag
-Chimera, TL HB, Hull HB, Extra Armour, Hunter-Killer Missile, Heavy Stubber, Smoke Launchers

5 Squads:
-Plasma, Lascannon, Frag & Krag
-Veteran Sergeant, MC PP, MC SB, 1x Medic, Bionics, Frag & Krag
-Chimera, TL HB, Hull HB, Extra Armour, Hunter-Killer Missile, Heavy Stubber, Smoke Launchers

All comes to total of 2189pts.

starlight
31-01-2009, 02:04
Don't know those Doctrines/Characters. :( *feels so out of it...*

ZOMGBBQ
31-01-2009, 02:09
I second starlight.

Best in terms of efficiency for a sensible points value: Sisters or Dire avengers. Both get very good, fairly cheaply.

Best in terms of filling a FOC slot , without a practical points limit.: The Maxed out Guard platoon. Easily 2000 points, maybe 3000 -- can't be bothered to run the numbers exactly due to beer-- 6 independent scoring mechanised units. Ouch.

I actually did run the numbers today :p

Command Platoon and 2 Maxed out Infantry Platoons, taking all the most expensive upgrade (Command Squad having attached Sental unit etc etc) worked out to 2360 points or so

Filthy O'Bedlam
31-01-2009, 02:21
Plague Marines. T5 + FNP = a unit that's impossible to move

Shield of Freedom
31-01-2009, 02:48
For those of you talking about the Nob bikers... remember 90% of the objectives are going to be placed in area terrain, good luck.

10 Wraithguard led by a Spiritseer with Enhance.

-sit in cover, get the 4+ cover save. We already have T6 and 3+ armor.
-Enhance means we have WS5 and I5, we already have S5, try and move us with assault, go ahead.
- Our guns can kill anything, ANYTHING, within 12 inches.
-our previous defenses (T6, WS5, 3+sv) plus fearless means no matter how determined your counter assault is, chances are we'll hold long enough for reinforcements... if we need them.

FYI for those of you didn't know, so long as it's a Spiritseer leading them, minimum 10 Wraithguard is a TROOPS choice.

FashaTheDog
31-01-2009, 03:35
I've always been fond of Dark Eldar Raider squads. They're a good bargin and can kill most any model shy of a monolith even without a single upgrade at minimum size while having excellent mobility. For holding objectives, and I use that term loosely, they shoot over on their Raider and stake a claim. If something comes along that will kill them and take the objective, they hop back on the Raider and fly off. The rest of the army zips in, hoses the offending enemy, and the Raider returns to task. Usually this happen in the last turn or two so the objective is already clear but random game length does allow for it. I know the way they "hold" objectives is cheating by the quotated word as it is more a kin to "steal" but with Dark Eldar, isn't that the point?

There are plenty of other great ones out there, 10 Wraithguard with Seer, 15 Bloodclaws with all HQs (3 at 1,850) each with 4 wolves and three Rune Priests, maxed Necron Warriors, Plague Bearers and Daemon character attached or nearby, maxed out Infantry Platoon, or my other favorite, Grots. The only real issue I have with Grots is when something gets through. At least Raiders can potentially deal with it, whereas Grots really need burly Orks between them and stabby death. After all, an 8 strong Bloodcrusher unit and attached Juggernaut riding Herald is going to plow through them Dynasty Warriors style. At least the Raiders can fly two feet away and stay alive since they're not gonna stop that unit either.

Speaking of Bloodcrushers, three 6 strong units of Bloodletters would likely make for great scoring units as you could devote the rest of your 1,850 points to Skulltaker and three Heralds all on Juggernauts attached to three 8 strong Bloodcrusher units. I would think the Bloodletters on the objectives will be the last thing on your foe's mind after turn 2.

505
31-01-2009, 04:57
well holding objectives nob bikers is not my vote. you totally take away their main power...uh mobility. take objective yes hold no.

and for the IG if the obj has any cover save you don't need caprice just use chameloline and close order drill.

hard to shoot them out of the objective (though assult should deal with them...but thats why they have the rest of the platoon)

not as cheep as grots but more sustainable. and cheaper then 20 sisters (my second choice)

AfroCelt
31-01-2009, 05:29
Why does no one say my favorite...shootaboys? sub 200 points buys you a shooty little unit that has decent staying power when parked in cover, and can dakka and assault the crap out of things?

Prefect
31-01-2009, 06:23
Awesome reply's

Remember, it has to be a Scoring unit, and you have to justify why.

The one that I find really interesting is the GK with incinerators...

What do you guys think about Stormtroopers? Inquisition / Grenadiers?

Straker
31-01-2009, 06:40
Nob Bikers = #1
Plague Marines = #2
10 Wraithguard, Spiritseer w/ Conceal = #3

(of things that haven't been said, but for nob bikers because they are they best, unfortunately)

Shield of Freedom
01-02-2009, 05:05
On Wraithguard Conceal is pointless when the cover I'm going to be in already gives me a 4+ cover save. Enhance is the way to go.

As stated before, Nob bikers are going to have to get through cover most of the time to get to objectives (I know when I play most of the objective markers end up inside buildings or area terrain), there's a 1 in 6 chance per biker that enters the cover that he will be destroyed, he won't lose a nob wound, he'll be removed. Also, the nob biker unit is great for TAKING the objective, but defeats the whole purpose of having them in your army if you let them sit there the rest of the battle HOLDING it.

Taking AND Holding:

Wraithguard #1
Plague Marines #2
Nob Bikers #3

Orkeosaurus
01-02-2009, 05:08
there's a 1 in 6 chance per biker that enters the cover that he will be destroyed, he won't lose a nob wound, he'll be removed.Are you sure? I'm pretty sure Dangerous Terrain is only a wound.

(In which case he'd get his invul too. No FnP, obviously.)

jobi
01-02-2009, 07:46
30 shoota boys with 3 Big Shootas. They are fearless for the first 20 wounds there is a lot of them and they are cheap. That squad weighs in at a whopping 195 points. Get them on an objective and use their mass fire to slow down enemy. Throw in a 55 point Weirdboy for fun and go to town.

Deus
01-02-2009, 08:04
Full size conscript platoon with attached commissar, hard to burn 50 guys off an objective if they're essientially fearless. Of course the have roughly as much hitting power as a sock full of kittens.

Haha

"Take this you evil ork *mreow!**

My bets on the IG platoons. Too many bodies to wipe out.

Radium
01-02-2009, 08:09
For those of you talking about the Nob bikers... remember 90% of the objectives are going to be placed in area terrain, good luck.

10 Wraithguard led by a Spiritseer with Enhance.

-sit in cover, get the 4+ cover save. We already have T6 and 3+ armor.
-Enhance means we have WS5 and I5, we already have S5, try and move us with assault, go ahead.
- Our guns can kill anything, ANYTHING, within 12 inches.
-our previous defenses (T6, WS5, 3+sv) plus fearless means no matter how determined your counter assault is, chances are we'll hold long enough for reinforcements... if we need them.

FYI for those of you didn't know, so long as it's a Spiritseer leading them, minimum 10 Wraithguard is a TROOPS choice.

And because nobz get an hq to go with it (their not troops without it...), the wraithguard get a farseer with fortune. And guide.

@Orkeosaurus, yes they only lose one wound. But as we all know, once the nobz are wounded, they start to go down pretty quickly.

Laser guided fanatic
01-02-2009, 12:11
maxed out terminator squad with apoc for 2+/4+

Phenomenon
01-02-2009, 16:39
Squad of 5 destroyers- 15 shots, str 6, 36"

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

Laser guided fanatic
01-02-2009, 16:52
Squad of 5 destroyers- 15 shots, str 6, 36"

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

It's not a scoring unit though is it?

IrishDelinquent
01-02-2009, 17:10
10 man deathwing terminator squad in an army lead by belial (all with TH/SS)

10 models with a 2+/3+ save is not going to be easy for anyone to shift...ever.

robnixon
01-02-2009, 17:16
the deathwing with ss would only have a 4+invun, there not the new codex space marines gear.

i would probably go with the full battalion thing myself, on the grounds that its the largest body of troops with the most guns, so it will take a long time to kill, and can dish out some pain itself...

ninjas, there where its at, if only we had more ninjas

starlight
01-02-2009, 17:18
We do, they're called Assassins, and they don't count because they aren't Scoring. :p


I'll stack an IG Platoon up against *any* other unit anyone can care to put forth and they can match points. :D If you take an HQ to *qualify* as Troops, then so do they, but it only pushes the balance further in the IGs favour. :D

Orkeosaurus
01-02-2009, 17:21
@Orkeosaurus, yes they only lose one wound. But as we all know, once the nobz are wounded, they start to go down pretty quickly.:confused:

Well, yeah, if they all failed their Dangerous Terrain test.

kabum
01-02-2009, 18:36
Plague marines.

They can get cover save in case its necesari, thought as hell, good normal armor and in close combat the plage granades makes the charge less letal. Then still they hit back.

Laser guided fanatic
01-02-2009, 18:39
Plague marines.

They can get cover save in case its necesari, thought as hell, good normal armor and in close combat the plage granades makes the charge less letal. Then still they hit back.

Meh everyone uses plague marines. Grotz are better because for 90pts you get a 30 man unit that your enemy has to waste fire on to kill and who cares when they die it's 90 pts not 480 for some wacked up DW unit that will get blown up when my vindicator says hello.

Rydmend
01-02-2009, 18:57
For 275 points you can get a 29 strong boyz squad with 3 rokkits or big shootaz, stickbombs, and a nob with PK........That has got to be one of the best deals for a scoring unit in the game.

Taking Kor'sarro Khan and using his ability to make SM bikers scoring units seems pretty nice. An 8 strong SM biker squad with flamers and a PF seems like it would rock at taking objectives,I dunno about hold them though. The only problem is Khan and the squad would cost 450 points by themselves....I rather just have 5 assault termies and a LR for the same amount.

IrishDelinquent
01-02-2009, 19:46
the deathwing with ss would only have a 4+invun, there not the new codex space marines gear.

True enough, my bad. But still, a ten-man squad with a 2+/4+ save isn't that bad either.

Radium
01-02-2009, 19:49
:confused:

Well, yeah, if they all failed their Dangerous Terrain test.

Yeah, of course. But I thought I saw someone say they would die, instead of suffer a single wound. But That might have been my imagination this morning...

Laser guided fanatic
01-02-2009, 19:50
For 275 points you can get a 29 strong boyz squad with 3 rokkits or big shootaz, stickbombs, and a nob with PK........That has got to be one of the best deals for a scoring unit in the game.

Taking Kor'sarro Khan and using his ability to make SM bikers scoring units seems pretty nice. An 8 strong SM biker squad with flamers and a PF seems like it would rock at taking objectives,I dunno about hold them though. The only problem is Khan and the squad would cost 450 points by themselves....I rather just have 5 assault termies and a LR for the same amount.

Never, ever take stikkboms on boyz its as pointless as translating how to learn french into french.

Xenobane
01-02-2009, 20:43
Full size conscript platoon with attached commissar, hard to burn 50 guys off an objective if they're essientially fearless.

:eyebrows: Of course, the moment you reach them in combat you'll absolutely maul them and cut them down when they flee.


10 Battle Sisters, Vet w/ Book, Heavy Flamer, Melta Gun, Rhino w/ EA, Smokes for 209pts. Best troops choice in the game.

:D Seconded. Except chuck in a combi-flamer on the VSS for a little extra firepower.

Beyond that, anything with the word "plague" in their name has always proved a real thorn in my side. There's rarely a quick way of getting them off an objective.

Linkdead
01-02-2009, 20:57
Squad of 5 destroyers- 15 shots, str 6, 36"

:evilgrin::evilgrin::evilgrin:

Only 1 problem with that...they can't capture objectives...

Rioghan Murchadha
02-02-2009, 03:57
Only thing about the IG platoon, is that it's multiple units. The question wasn't 'best troops / scoring FoC slot, but best unit. Given that a minimum IG platoon is 3 units, it hardly qualifies as the best :p

My horribly biased opinion is of course, the Thousand Sons squad. always rapid fireable AP 3 bolters put the hurt out pretty good, the 3+/4+ that isn't negated by flamers or power weapons, or Instant Death or what not makes them, in some situations, more surviveable than plague marines, and the Sorc can take BoC to deal with vehicles, or wind of chaos for flame template goodness, or gift for the joys of spawning.

Sure they ain't great in CC, but I've had a squad roll up a unit of stealers + broodlord before. (personal anecdote FTW!!!! ;))

Reinholt
02-02-2009, 04:38
Ignoring Points:

Ork Nobz Bikerz or Eldar Wraithguard, depending on how they are used and the rest of the army around them.

Considering Points:

I would be inclined to say Plauge Marines or Plaguebearers.

Things I have seen mentioned I don't agree with:

Grots: yes, they are cheap, but yes, they are trivial to annihilate.
Dire Avengers: good, but not great.
Deathwing: not as good as standard space marine terminators, and you pay for what you get and then some.

Things I am surprised I haven't seen mentioned more often:

Space Marine Bikes (8 bikes, 1 attack bike is actually a fantastic troops choice now that they are only 25 points a bike - marginally more expensive than plague marines in a rhino with more hitting power)

starlight
02-02-2009, 04:46
I'd take a Ravenwing Assault Squadron (trade two bikes for a Land Speeder:)) over regular bikes...but that's me. :)


As far as *single* units (vs FOC *Troops* choices ie IG Platoon) I'd still take the maxed Battle Sisters Squad. :D

20 Bolters with Divine Guidance and 3+ Saves (and the rest of the Faith goodies)? Yes please. :D

Providence
02-02-2009, 05:23
Im not too sure why everyone keeps saying Plaguemarines when Plaguebearers are insanely better at being a scoring unit, a unit of 20 costs 300pts and is not going to be removed unless your opponent shoots everything at them and you suck at rolling dice, going to ground in cover makes them immovable, then all you need to do is fill the rest of your army with units that contest enemy objectives and wipe out their units, which is easily possible with a Daemon Army.

Ill also note that Nob Bikers arent too bad for a last turn objective grab, just hit the enemy hard with them and then in the later turns of the game turbo-boost onto an objective, doesnt matter about terrain tests unless you only have a few Nobs left.

Linkdead
02-02-2009, 05:29
You can stretch a Nob Bike squad to cover more then one objective in some cases.

genestealer_baldric
02-02-2009, 14:11
as much as i feel dirty in saying this, a monlith with a large squad warriors who jump out on last turn and sit on it, and we all know monliths currentley have real sticking power.

Emperors Tears
02-02-2009, 14:49
For those of you talking about the Nob bikers... remember 90% of the objectives are going to be placed in area terrain, good luck.

10 Wraithguard led by a Spiritseer with Enhance.

-sit in cover, get the 4+ cover save. We already have T6 and 3+ armor.
-Enhance means we have WS5 and I5, we already have S5, try and move us with assault, go ahead.
- Our guns can kill anything, ANYTHING, within 12 inches.
-our previous defenses (T6, WS5, 3+sv) plus fearless means no matter how determined your counter assault is, chances are we'll hold long enough for reinforcements... if we need them.

FYI for those of you didn't know, so long as it's a Spiritseer leading them, minimum 10 Wraithguard is a TROOPS choice.

Ironically my brother takes the same against me. I've accually made him stop taking them due to my Sterngaurd squads. I don't care how high your T is, saving 12-15 wounds with only a 3+ armor is not gonna happen.:p

Democratus
02-02-2009, 14:51
Ork Nob Bikers. There's no contest.

d077Z
02-02-2009, 15:59
Im not too sure why everyone keeps saying Plaguemarines when Plaguebearers are insanely better at being a scoring unit, a unit of 20 costs 300pts and is not going to be removed unless your opponent shoots everything at them and you suck at rolling dice, going to ground in cover makes them immovable, then all you need to do is fill the rest of your army with units that contest enemy objectives and wipe out their units, which is easily possible with a Daemon Army.

Plague marines deploy normally... What happens when you don't get your bearers in a reasonable time??

Shield of Freedom
03-02-2009, 00:36
Ironically my brother takes the same against me. I've accually made him stop taking them due to my Sterngaurd squads. I don't care how high your T is, saving 12-15 wounds with only a 3+ armor is not gonna happen.:p

How the hell is his return fire not wiping your Sternguard out in two shooting phases max?

He's doing something wrong. Hit on 3+ (sometimes guided) and wounding on 2+ with your only a coversave to stay alive, your Sternguard should be wiped out. If you're staying at 24" then you're not getting as many shots either plus the other stuff in his army should be able to reach out and touch you. Wierd indeed.


Ork Nob Bikers. There's no contest.
If the Wraithguard get in one shot you would lose half of the squad, some would even be insta-killed with the wraithcannon rule. I'm still sticking to Wriathguard.