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Rydmend
04-02-2009, 19:39
Anyone else noticing the trend of people trying to cram 2834903 blast templates into their armies as of late? I know that 5th edition improved templates but I didn't see too many people altering thier lists until recently. Maybe it is because orks have become so popular with their new dex released? People may feel forced to take those templates to deal with 120 orks on the table?

At my local store it seems that everyone I play against has no less than 3 pie plates and a couple small blasts for good measure.

It is either 3 hammer heads or 3 vindicators or 3 whirlwinds or 3 defilers or 3 bonecrushers or 6 barbed stranglers or 3 fire prisms......

Anyone else notice this recently?

Invid
04-02-2009, 19:56
I take 3 thunderfire cannons. Does that count?

IAMNOTHERE
04-02-2009, 20:00
Yep, it's because blast weapons are not where they shouild always have been - in all lists!

They are incredibly effective and the new hit rules make them more so.

MrBigMr
04-02-2009, 20:14
What sort of a war is a war without big explosions? Always go with a blast marker. Always. That's why my Dwarfs dropped a cannon for a stone thrower. Or I decided that their cannon is a stone thrower. It was modelled so that it could work as either.


It is either 3 hammer heads or 3 vindicators or 3 whirlwinds or 3 defilers or 3 bonecrushers or 6 barbed stranglers or 3 fire prisms......

Anyone else notice this recently?
Tau players have always taken hammerheads, so that's not a new thing. 3 Vindicators too, I think. I mean, S10 pieplate is just good for all. Don't know many who run 3 whirlwinds though. Not many defiler users as of late, now that they lost their indirect and mutated hull. Don't know much about 'Nids. But 3 Fire Prisms I can answer. It's simple: Now that Falcon got its teetch pulled out, Eldar players have chosen the Fire Prism as their go to tank. I know one Eldar player who converted his Falcon into a Fire Prism.

Col. Dash
04-02-2009, 20:24
With the low BS armies finding it easier to hit with template weapons, the ridiculous amounts of cover saves (WHY GW!? WHY?!) and the no more partial hit thing, its no wonder why. From an IG standpoint, its exactly why mortars are being used now. I would be willing to bet the with frustration of the insane amount of cover saves, that FW is selling griffons, bombards, heavy mortars, and thudd guns as fast as they can mold them just so people can get around cover saves or just mass effect blasts.

MrBigMr
04-02-2009, 20:27
Not to forget that many missile weapons are very good at engaging various targets, especially these days when horde armies are doing a comeback, so they bring a lot of blast markers.

ZOMGBBQ
04-02-2009, 20:35
Not to mention Plasma Cannons are ridiculously uber now, wounding almost everything on 2's and ignoring armour. Fire that into a clump of guard or orkies and you have yourself a weapon that makes it points back every turn 5/6'th of the time ;)

ReveredChaplainDrake
04-02-2009, 20:54
Just as an observation, this is why I don't buy the Ork criticism that Orks are only very powerful because people gear their lists to fight MEQs. People are gearing their lists to fight Orks. And they're still losing!

As for the template, it largely depends on the template. It has to do with varying reasons, depending on the army:
-Barbed Stranglers: Venom Cannons suck. Really, really suck. Even worse than Deathspitters!
-Railheads: Always awesome forever. Even better as Tanks are tougher to kill, and Disruption Pods are literally twice as tough to even scratch. Furthermore, as the Support Weapon change nerfed the 9-shot Ionhead, the Railhead really came into its own.
-Fire Prisms: They've been good since the 4th Eldar Codex first came out. Remember back when they were BS3? Combined with their rickety metal model and the fact that Wraithlords were just plain better, it was like the dawn of a new era when Fire Prisms got brought in line with the Railheads. At least the Prism air force is more fitting than the Wraithlord factory to the highly-mobile firepower theme of Eldar Heavy Supports.
-Missile Launchers: The Imperial (or ex-Imperial) armies generally used to go with Lascannons. The problem now is that Lascannons can't crack tanks as well as they could, so a gun dedicated to that specific purpose isn't as good as a gun that can do ho-hum against tanks and still do decently against Infantry.
-Vindicators: Ordnance used to be (and in fact still is) one of the best things to take out tanks. Plus, nothing says "stand still and die" like a Str10 AP2 pie plate.
-Whirlwinds: Cover-ignoring pie plate. That is all.

the1stpip
04-02-2009, 21:07
We have always played as you get cover saves from any weapon except for TEMPLATE weapons, ie flamers.

Is there an FAQ saying this is not the case?

Count de Monet
04-02-2009, 21:12
We have always played as you get cover saves from any weapon except for TEMPLATE weapons, ie flamers.

Is there an FAQ saying this is not the case?

For barrage weapons (not all blast weapons) if there is no cover between the small hole and you, no cover save. So hiding behind a wall, barrage lands behind wall, out of luck. If in actual area terrain you still get the save.

Maine
04-02-2009, 21:16
Because scatter is fun!

Whirligig beetle
04-02-2009, 21:23
Well Sternguard marines can put a world of blast template fun with their hellfire shells, out they came from their droppod and then away my hormagaunts went! :(

ZOMGBBQ
04-02-2009, 21:29
Well Sternguard marines can put a world of blast template fun with their hellfire shells, out they came from their droppod and then away my hormagaunts went! :(

Sorry to tell you this but you've been had.

Sternguard dont have the Blast one, only Scouts do.

Sternguard have "Hellfire Rounds" not "Hellfire Shells"

Radium
04-02-2009, 21:29
Meh, I don't really see a blast marker trend, but everyone is taking more flamers now. Which is a good thing, cause flamers are what 40k is all about (fiery and inefficient death).

IAMNOTHERE
04-02-2009, 22:20
Flamers are a wonderful comment on humanity.

Once someone, somwhere said I want to set that guy on fire but I'm just not close enough.

Valo
04-02-2009, 22:31
Flamers are a wonderful comment on humanity.

Once someone, somwhere said I want to set that guy on fire but I'm just not close enough.


Thank you George Carlin

Vedar
04-02-2009, 22:37
I made a Chaos list based on Havoc missle launchers. It did quite well. I had like 6 havoc launchers, 4 on Rhinos. It was quite fun to see rhinos dish out some hot death.

MasterDecoy
04-02-2009, 22:45
I take quite a bit of dakka with my nids, To the point where some of my opponents seriously say "you fire [i]how[\i] many shots?!"

but seriosuly I only take 9 small blasts and 2 pie plates

Darkane
04-02-2009, 22:51
I love my tanks even more now. At first I was worried the new rules regarding blast weapons would hurt my guard more what with having to scatter 2d6 now rather than 1d6. But after the subtraction for ballistic skill and the fact there are no more partial hits more than makes up for the rare occasion a blast veers waaaay off target.

Despite this, in my personal experience I haven't noticed a considerable amount of blast weapons being used more than normal. Well maybe with the exception of plasma cannons. Rather, much like Radium has pointed out, it seems I see more folks taking flamer weapons now.

AngryAngel
04-02-2009, 23:12
As someone already said, things blowing up and big explosions are what wars are all about. Really they should have more of an effect of leadership checks seeing as how scary they can actually be. I know if I was standing there and all of a sudden its like the world has come to an end and it's just me and one other dude left standing, I'm going to seriously ponder getting out of dodge.

That digression aside, it is also more effective then it used to be damage wise. Though I always went a little blast happy I'm proud to say. It's like a box a choclates, ya just never know how many your goin to get.

self biased
04-02-2009, 23:32
i've actually pulled all my small blast markers out of my marine list. ordnance got a nice boost, and i've been tending toward my vindicator and whirlwind of late, but the plasma cannon is just downright unwieldy these days. that, and i always seem to scatter away from whatever i'm shooting at by lots, or at least enough for me to wish i had brought something else instead.

Bunnahabhain
05-02-2009, 00:17
Small blasts no longer suck. In 4th they did for most things, so it was rarely worth taking them for the small blast. Plasma cannons were the main exception due to marine killyness.

With increasing model count armies, every shot going somewhere and no partials, they're useful now.

However, if you think it's bad now, wait for the new Guard book. There will be LOTS of things there with all sorts of blasts, and a horde of infantry to provide targets for them. Artillery is king of the battlefield*, and the Guard are king of artillery.

* Or possibly a vet sarge marine power fist...