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Gharof von Carstein
10-02-2009, 13:59
so i got a tourney coming up, since its 2009 the point limit is 2009. which is the scarier army?

vamp lord
-extra magic level
-master of the black arts
-forbidden lore
-summon ghouls
-the flayed hauberk
-crown of the damned
-helm of commandment
= 445p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-book of arkhan
= 185p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-rod of flaming death
= 190p

vamp thrall
-dark acolyte
-summon ghouls
-black periapt
= 160p

Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 14 = 120p
Ghouls+ghast x 10 = 88p

Corpse cart = 75p
Corpse cart = 75p

Black knight x7, barding, standardbearer, + banner of the dead legion = 237p

Varghulf = 175p

total = 2006p


or!


vamp lord
-extra magic level
-master of the black arts
-forbidden lore
-summon ghouls
-flayed hauberk
-crown of the damned
-helm of commandment
= 445p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-book of arkhan
= 185p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-rod of flaming death
= 190p

vamp thrall
-dark acolyte
-summon ghouls
-black periapt
= 160p

Ghouls+ghast x 16 = 136p
Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p

Dire wolves x5 = 40p

Black knight x7, barding, standardbearer, + royal standard of strigoi = 247p

Varghulf = 175p

Varghulf = 175p

total = 2009p

critique away plz! the army that gets the most points ill play on the tournament :) im done with my indecision skills so you guys choose for me :P

Master Stark
10-02-2009, 14:06
2008 points is a very odd limit.

Anyway, I vote for list 2. I think it is a bit friendlier.

D.E.E. Tom
10-02-2009, 15:54
2008 points is a very odd limit.

Anyway, I vote for list 2. I think it is a bit friendlier.

2009 isn't, considering what year we live in. Also it is a tournament named after the Siege on Haarlem (which is where the tournament is held).

It really depends, if you really want to win go unfriendly. If you just want fun well just take a really nice looking and balanced force.

Neckutter
10-02-2009, 20:39
i voted for more corpse cart and ghouls FTW, but i would really not like to see other people playing my army and winning more anyways. :)

anyways, i would take list one, drop the wolves, and balefire and take another cart. 2 corpse carts=win all over the place.

Gharof von Carstein
10-02-2009, 21:27
also a decent option ill play around with that as well. its just i want to know how this will work out. double carts costs me my screening unit do. i dont know...

id say something like this:

vamp lord
-extra magic level
-master of the black arts
-forbidden lore
-summon ghouls
-the flayed hauberk
-crown of the damned
-helm of commandment
= 445p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-book of arkhan
= 185p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-rod of flaming death
= 190p

vamp thrall
-dark acolyte
-summon ghouls
-black periapt
= 160p

Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 14 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 14 = 120p
Ghouls+ghast x 10 = 88p

Corpse cart = 75p
Corpse cart = 75p

Black knight x7, barding, standardbearer, + royal standard of the strigoi = 247p

Varghulf = 175p

total = 2008p

Gharof von Carstein
11-02-2009, 09:16
added another list based on a good idea by neckutter. could perhaps be the most competitive but i dont know anymore :P

D.E.E. Tom
11-02-2009, 09:23
Like it, not to play against but it is a good solid list.
I would make a very small adjustment to make it just a little more reliable that is drop Dark Acolyte from the Lord and give him Forbidden Lore instead this guarantees you will have at least one vampire with Vanhels. you can free up the points by dropping one ghoul.

Good luck with the tourney

Gharof von Carstein
11-02-2009, 09:27
i was worried about that a little indeed. it just happened to be a better fit this way. getting a extra power dice and rolling for 4 spells would guarantee me vanhels. thing is if you roll 1, or drop a roll for 1 and you roll another, you should get a reroll from your opponent. seeing as raise dead can be cast over and over this is a pretty decent way to almost assure yourself vanhels. unless you roll 3 and higher with the 3 other dice.

D.E.E. Tom
11-02-2009, 11:05
I know you will almost always get it with 4 spells, but if you cannot afford to not have it at all. One battle without it means you will most likely lose that battle. Agreed you have a very high probability to have it in your army like a 67% change on the lord and 3 times 33% percent chance on the other vamps. Still this is not 100% in total. I would agree it is a risk you can afford to take unless you absolutely want to go for the win in the tournament. So the next question is do you have a completely painted army that scores at least 15 points in painting, if not I wouldn't worry about details like this in your army list.

Gharof von Carstein
11-02-2009, 11:43
my army is completly painted and scored 17 out of 20 points last time :)

which i consider to be pretty good seeing as iv only been painting for a few months now.

regardless of the mathhammer, i think ill still change this up to still get forbidden lore. its too bad that this will cost me a PD but at the very least ill be sure to get vanhels

Gharof von Carstein
11-02-2009, 11:58
edited. ill also change the 1st list to this one so people can vote on that.

Aeolthir
11-02-2009, 13:41
Take the second list without question!
The first one is quite good but two varghulf if really scray and tough. They are also fast on the board with M8.

Count Demandred
11-02-2009, 13:52
What about an upgrade on those Corpse Carts? Unholy Lodestone Cart camped behind your Ghoul squads + IoN spam = massive units.

And just out of interest - why the Doom Wolf? I play VC and have never taken a Doom Wolf, yet I never leave home without my Dire Wolves (2-4 squads each game).

Gharof von Carstein
11-02-2009, 14:09
simple, a doom wolf adds more power to a dire wolves unit. that humbug aside i just had 10 points left and nowhere to sink it into without falling short of maximising my points :P i could have used those same 10 points to give the book of arkhan vamp talisman of the lycni as a sort of trump card (move 9 out of unit to help with book casting. but thats still very very iffy.

about the corpse carts, i can not afford the upgrade, i cant open up 50 points for them anywhere...

Gharof von Carstein
12-02-2009, 07:29
bumpity! bump bump

Neckutter
12-02-2009, 08:17
also a decent option ill play around with that as well. its just i want to know how this will work out. double carts costs me my screening unit do. i dont know...

id say something like this:

vamp lord
-extra magic level
-master of the black arts
-forbidden lore
-summon ghouls
-the flayed hauberk
-crown of the damned
-helm of commandment
= 445p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-book of arkhan
= 185p

vamp thrall
-avatar of death
-dark acolyte
-rod of flaming death
= 190p

vamp thrall
-dark acolyte
-summon ghouls
-black periapt
= 160p

Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 15 = 128p
Ghouls+ghast x 14 = 120p
Ghouls+ghast x 10 = 88p

Corpse cart = 75p
Corpse cart = 75p

Black knight x7, barding, standardbearer, + banner of the dead legion = 237p

Varghulf = 175p

total = 2006p

screening unit? pfft. VC units can get shot all day, they just raise more. anyways, you need ghoulkin on one of your characters. this lets you march before the game and makes you absolutely WIN against shooting armies(not HE). HE are cheaters and strike before you, which kinda hurts, but you can out-attrition them so its ok.

youll love the dual corpse carts. keep them off to the left and right to the center block of ghouls and make sure everything strikes first most of the time. its amazing how people dont like your army, and all of a sudden bretonnian generals are like "uh, your whole army strikes first? /sigh i guess i charge, then."

things i dont personally like are helm of commandment, and the small unit of ghouls. maybe but those 10 ghouls into the other units to bulk them out, and make one of your vamps mounted so he can chill with your black knights? black knights having hatred banner is awesome, btw. forbidden lore is win, dont you dare take it out. then again, everyone else like the other army, so i dont know.

Gharof von Carstein
12-02-2009, 11:04
im basically going to playtest because im getting heavy mixed signals. the 10 bunker ghoul unit stays no matter what. i had my core planned this way:

G+vamp, G+vamp, G+vamp
Corpse cart, Bunker+general, Corpse cart

the reason i need that screening unit is the black knights, if they get shot up healing them back is going to be extremely hard. im thinking your right about the strigoi banner in this list, i need the black knights to be a flanking support, not just something that can make units flee on its own. ill probably drop a ghoul and add the banner.

Edited.

Neckutter
12-02-2009, 11:14
how are 10 ghouls a bunker? :P
i was saying more along the lines of spread those 10 ghouls into the other three units, and make one of your vamps a dreadknight so he can beat people up in the black knights unit. :)

but yeah, definately playtest things to see what you like and dont like. i dont play with my varghulf anymore because i dont like it.

Malorian
12-02-2009, 15:52
Being that your vampires are all fairly solid in combat I went for the second list with out a bunker (although the wolves could fill in if needed).

Gharof von Carstein
13-02-2009, 08:49
i just found out that of 30 people 6 will be playing daemons with possibly even more. a lot of the new lizardmen seem to be pretty popular as well and the rest is a mixed bag of skaven, wood elves, high elves, dark elves, warrriors of chaos, and several empire players. varghulfs would totall wreck stanks and would help me beat up big on a lot of these races. unfortunatly vs daemons theyd pretty much be smoked salmon right off the bat... corpse carts have the same stinking problem of course, yet i could free up points to outfit both with balefire to counter the strong magic capabilities of these armies.

so what is the best list i can choose for this situation?

Gharof von Carstein
13-02-2009, 18:42
id like to hear some criticism on my post above this one plz (bumped)