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Nightsword
12-02-2009, 12:45
Anyone who says with dice and models will feel the wrath of Nightsword's pointed chaos stick.

I was thinking, would you play WOTR with the history, books and film in mind, or would you just include the heroes you want/have?

For example, I'm constructing an elvish army, and I have two formations of 24 high elves (one swords, one bow), gil-galad and elrond. If for example, I decided that I wanted to include the white council, the twins and have my force led by glorfindel, yet use my gilgalad and elrond models, would people see this as acceptable (Not withstanding the fact that I'd have a hell of a lot of heroes!) or as defying the fluff too much.

I hope the question makes sense.

Baggers
12-02-2009, 13:03
I'll be using a tape measure and one of those wooden things you see in Historical films about WW2 when they push troops around :P

Seriously, i'll be using the book (or books) as my main point of reference.

David.

Joewrightgm
12-02-2009, 13:33
I would like to play War both ways, just to see the difference in playing. I would definitly like to play the battle of Gladden Fields, or maybe even the final battle on the slopes Orodruin.

Chad Gamington
12-02-2009, 13:43
I had a flip through the book today at my local gw and i can say this.

If you want to play WoTR historicaly then its very well placed to support that. All the scenarios tell you which characters etc are available based on those present, but allow for some flexibility in the details.

that said, if you just wanna have a big ole game, nothing stopping you from mixing and matching timelines, and histories to suit your collection instead.

BTW: Cavalry rock the casbah!!! +6 dice per company if they charge

Nightsword
12-02-2009, 14:34
+ 6, or +D6? And per company! So a rohan cavalry formation of 2x2 companies would get 12 free dice if they charge! Interesting to see that there is scenarios in the book too, don't think that's been mentioned yet.

I was just musing with Putty over this list... I've gone a wee overboard I think XD

The White Council (6 heroes...)
24 Elven Swordsmen w/elrond, gil galad
24 Elven Bowmen
2 units of 16 Woodelves w/spears/hand weapons
16 We W/bows w/Legolas
24 Rangers of the North w/Aragorn and Halbarad

Maybe some Galadrium knights and elven cavalry when they arrive...

Hows that for mixing and matching timelines XD XD

Throngil
12-02-2009, 15:30
I'm playing it mostly historical, Boromir, Faramir and Gandalf the Grey being my heroe's they may not have been mentioned as having been all in the same place at the same time. But its plausible, I wouldn't, for example take Gandalf the White at the same time as Boromir.

I've really been considering a Rohan army, and I'm still in two minds about it.

Free Spirit
12-02-2009, 16:46
Both ways. I made a force with models i liked and wich go pretty well together, but i wouldn't know fluffwise. I've read the books and seen the movies, but there is so much more backstory and i'm not a hardcore fan enough to know all that... so maybe it's fluffy... but probably not.

On the other hand, the book gives huge amounts of info about recreating famous battles in the third age and before that.

Nightsword
12-02-2009, 17:16
Gah, has everyone seen the book or something XD Any info on the elven legendary formations? :D

Cheeko
12-02-2009, 17:37
i am an ameture lotr player and i found play to the fluff is way to boring to play to

DrMabutu
12-02-2009, 18:46
Im going with good old Modor.

It will be a Pellenor Field themed force with Gothmog and the nine nazgul.

jedideinos
12-02-2009, 19:17
I'm firmly on the side of "historical." IN 40K and Warhammer, I can field any combo of troops I like, so I play historical for the challenge.

Nightsword
12-02-2009, 19:20
Interesting, interesting. So there's a fairly varied opinion for either side. I think I'm most likely to collect and paint what I like, especially since the army lists seem so broad. Keep it coming though, I want to hear more.

Free Spirit
12-02-2009, 20:13
Gah, has everyone seen the book or something XD Any info on the elven legendary formations? :D

I'm sorry, can't give you any details (i hope you understand). I can only tell you what i'm allowed to tell other people. I can give you enthusiasm though. Each and every faction/army in the game has heroes and a cool variety of formations. So whatever you play... you'll get acces to cool heroes and units (wait till ya see what the elves do!)

Lunar
12-02-2009, 20:20
I'd personally keep to the books, a huge Osgiliath battle would be awesome, and fighting up Minas Tirith. But the one i'd like to do the most would be the reclamation of Moria, hordes of Goblins, Spiders, Cave Trolls and of course the Balrog, all against Balin and a highly outnumbered Dwarf army.

The only problem being time, big enough battle fields, money for all the models, paint, glue and countless other things.

Nightsword
12-02-2009, 20:47
I'm sorry, can't give you any details (i hope you understand). I can only tell you what i'm allowed to tell other people. I can give you enthusiasm though. Each and every faction/army in the game has heroes and a cool variety of formations. So whatever you play... you'll get acces to cool heroes and units (wait till ya see what the elves do!)

Of course. I know some select things any way, such as terror. Some things are leaking through, but thank you XD

AdeptusOverton
12-02-2009, 21:55
Isengard all the way hordes of armoured Uruk Hai warmachines and Wargs and a couple of trolls.

perhaps a small allied Mordor contingent... I dunno too many 40k projects on the go atm

W0lf
12-02-2009, 23:46
3 Balrogs and 244 gobbos (2K).

^^

Seriosulythough im not sure atm. Its ether an army with 2 Balrogs or one with 3 mumaks :D

Nightsword
13-02-2009, 07:10
*lol* Wolf. Jesus christ!

destroyerlord
13-02-2009, 10:22
I don't even have enough painted models for a SBG battle yet, but I'm still looking forward to WoTR.
And from the preview page on GW.com it seems the White council is only 4 characters, Saruman, Gandalf, Elrond and Galadriel, so you won't be able to take Elrond with the high elves (but you can put Erestor or Glorfindel in there instead).

Nightsword
14-02-2009, 00:14
I can't find what preview you are talking about. I see nothing about the white council ??? Wasn't thranduil (the wood elf guy...) and cirdan in the white council box set?

Cheers geezer.

destroyerlord
15-02-2009, 11:45
Preveiw page is here: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?categoryId=cat210006&pIndex=2&aId=12800002&start=3
If you blow up the WoTR pic on that page you can see the legendary formation 'The White Council' contains only Gandalf the Grey, Saruman the White, Galadriel and Elrond. It seems they went with the Tolkien veiw of the White council rather than the contents of their boxed set.

Nightsword
15-02-2009, 11:53
Ahhh, I see it now. Thanks alot, great eyes by the way!

destroyerlord
15-02-2009, 23:43
I wont take the credit for it as it was posted on TLA a week or two ago. There is pics of most of the new models there now as well.

LordKhaine
17-02-2009, 16:29
hey nightsword, did you know that all elves cause terror and have a movement of 8 in WatR

and also glorfindel can only be mounted and he goes about on his own and moves as if on a flying creature (same speed) because of his horse

thorgrim
20-02-2009, 19:02
I'll be using an army based on the books. But i see no reason to restrict myself to just the fights in the books. Therefore i will also be using alternate storylines that i make up.

I'll be using the elves as my main force (i have all the charactors) and ally them with the wizards council and a gondorian army led by aragorn the king.

Lordkhaine: and also glorfindel can only be mounted and he goes about on his own and moves as if on a flying creature (same speed) because of his horse

I'm pretty sure that Glorfindel can still join units of infantry just like other charactors can (they do have a pic of him on foot in the WotR book after all)

Throngil
22-02-2009, 00:27
Glorfindel can't join other units, ie infantry because he's not an Epic Hero. He, himself is a Legendary Formation and classes as a Monster. He's also very hard to kill. Fun times to be had there.

Crovax20
22-02-2009, 16:13
elves all cause terror?

Does every army have some special rules? I am starting an Isengaurd army, and a friend of mine rohan (so we can also play the SBG two towers)

Joewrightgm
22-02-2009, 22:29
generally speaking, each army in War has a core competency; something that only it can do better than the others.

With Isenguard, they're very tough, great fighters with room for monsters abound and generally unpleasant surprises, but the trade off is numbers.

Rohan is going to be a very hard army in War, because a basic Oathsworn Rider (Rider of Rohan) has a bow, shield, throwing weapons, and is cavalry.

So they can dance around the board, sticking you with projectiles until the almighty charge that has the potential for serious devestation.

Also, Rohan has access to characters and cavalry that cause Terror on the turn they charge, which gives them the potential to reduce the enemy to fight 0 because of a failed Terror check.

Gaargod
23-02-2009, 17:55
I think one of the coolest things is that you're allowed up to 25% in allies. So you could quite legimiately field a historical allied battle. Quite fun.


As for me, i think i'll just go with an army themed around type of troops, rather than timeline.

DrMabutu
23-02-2009, 20:23
elves all cause terror?

Does every army have some special rules? I am starting an Isengaurd army, and a friend of mine rohan (so we can also play the SBG two towers)

All the factions have some great advantage over the rest.

GOOD:

Gondor and Arnor: They have a huge range of units. Heavily armoured infantry and cavalry, rangers from everywhere, some of the best characters (Elendil is Fight 10!!!!) and war machines, which rule!!

Rohan: They are mostly a cavalry force. Even the basic rider is dangerous (Royal Guard are common units) and they get several new types of riders such as Erolingas, and helms guard.

Elven Realms: They all cause terror now!!!!! Their heroes are the scariest out of the good side( Gil-Galad is fight 10 and his unit gets +2 to hit!!!) Glorfindel is pretty wrong: High Fight Value, Spirtbane, Trollbane, Orcbane(+1 to hit respective units) and is a flying monster. They also have powerful archery, stupidly powerful.

Dwarves: Really high defence (8 is most common) and even some defence 10 units they are very hard to hurt. They are all now at least strength 4 with khazad guard being strength 5. They also get some tasty legendary formations.

Free-Peoples: Even though they can only be taken as allies this list does contain the ents, eagles, wizards and Bombadils for the good side. The wizards council is a very harsh formation as they know all of the spells in th ebook and can do 10 of them a turn.


EVIL:

Mordor: They have a huge selection of unit types with rubbish but cheap orc mobs to elite Black Guards (Mordor Uruks in heavy armour). They get Castellans in units of 8, trolls, trolls and Shelob. Shamans can be everywhere in this list. And if you want you can take all nine named ringwraiths.

Isenguard: Cheap enough to have lots of them, defence 7 with shields strength 4, uruks are very good. To back them up you can have isenguard orcs, ruffians or wildmen. They have crossbows in abundance, and balistas and bombs, sappers carry these and are very destructive if they detonate near the enemy army: D6+4 Str 10 hits for every formation within 2D6 inches. They also get the very nasty berzerkers who can get up to strength 10 on the charge.

Misty Mountains: They get a huge variety of monstous units. Cheap movement 8 goblins can, but don't have to form the core of this force. They do have wild wargs, giant spiders and bats as common units. They get various types of monsters: Spider Queen, Stone Giants, Cave Drakes, Cave Trolls, Dragons and Balrogs(Yes Balrogs, more than one).

Fallen Realms: All the evil men from the evil side are in this list. Harad are there with the cool new hasharin models. Easterling are the best thing in this list. With a base fight value 4 and the option of having Dragon Knights leading them (Gives the unit fight 7) and the option of pikes, which could give them a combined fight value of 8 is fighting on the front!! They also get some cool new characters such as Amdur Master of Blades which is a monster in a fight as for every hit they cause they get an extra attack.

Angmar: This is my personal favourite list as it gives us evil player a chance to use the new Army of the Dead models as the Angmar Ghostly Legion. They also get Spectres and units of barrow wights. They also get my favourite unit in the whole book: Werewolves. These are a truly beastly unit. With Fight 7, terror causing, with+D6 attacks on the carge and strength 5 they can tear units apart. Also with their movement of 10 they can get into the thick of the action with minimal damage taken (They do have 2 resiliance each).

The Adept
24-02-2009, 08:24
Free-Peoples: Even though they can only be taken as allies this list does contain the ents, eagles, wizards and Bombadils for the good side. The wizards council is a very harsh formation as they know all of the spells in th ebook and can do 10 of them a turn.



A friend of mine is wanting to do a pure ent army (6 ents, Treebeard and Quickbeam at 1k, I think). Does the "only be taken as allies" thing stop him doing this?

DrMabutu
24-02-2009, 10:09
A friend of mine is wanting to do a pure ent army (6 ents, Treebeard and Quickbeam at 1k, I think). Does the "only be taken as allies" thing stop him doing this?

Yes. But there is a scenario in which he could use that list. Its called the last march of the ents.

Nightsword
25-02-2009, 09:23
hey nightsword, did you know that all elves cause terror and have a movement of 8 in WatR

and also glorfindel can only be mounted and he goes about on his own and moves as if on a flying creature (same speed) because of his horse

I knew the terror bit, but damn, me and you will both be fielding Glorfindel XD Shame I don't like the model so much, but our armies are going to be so similar in construction it'll be unreal.

DrMabutu, that info is really helpful. Nice one XD So,

lorelorn
25-02-2009, 09:32
Did anyone see what a typical game size might be for WotR? I was thinking 1200 points, but honestly I'm not sure.

The scenarios look like a lot of fun, I'm going to try and play through all of them, even if the forces on each side change "slightly" - nothing wrong with 'last march of the trolls' now is there? ;)

juicytomatoes
27-02-2009, 03:33
Heeeey nightsword! just joining in the discussion here...

Forgive me if my questions are a little inane, but i have been out of touch with LoTR.

I know the size of the game is meant to be huge in WoTR. However, are the core rules the same? what i mean are things like: Roll initiative at start of turn, riders can fall off their horses, each model (or stand) square off in combat and roll off a number of dice to see who rolls a higher score regardless of ability(as in the case of whfb and 40k) etc. etc.

My gaming group is intrigued but are wary of putting in any amount of investment in a new game that we're not too sure about, so we're seeking some advice.

Joewrightgm
27-02-2009, 04:11
Heeeey nightsword! just joining in the discussion here...

Forgive me if my questions are a little inane, but i have been out of touch with LoTR.

I know the size of the game is meant to be huge in WoTR. However, are the core rules the same? what i mean are things like: Roll initiative at start of turn, riders can fall off their horses, each model (or stand) square off in combat and roll off a number of dice to see who rolls a higher score regardless of ability(as in the case of whfb and 40k) etc. etc.

My gaming group is intrigued but are wary of putting in any amount of investment in a new game that we're not too sure about, so we're seeking some advice.


K, in ord in which you asked them:

There are some superficial similarities to LoTR; priority phase, magic is done in movement, etc.

Riders are treated as Resistance 2 (think of it as wounds,) and can't be 'unhorsed'; when a rider is killed, you remove the whole model.

You don't roll off for combat like LoTR, instead, you get a number of attacks equal to the number of companies touching the enemy, with various bonuses for flanks, supporting companies, etc. But you just roll to wound basically, and if your side causes more casualties, then you have won the combat and the enemy tests courage.

Nightsword
27-02-2009, 07:12
Yo JuicyT, heads up:

http://www.thelastalliance.com/index.php?pid=view_replies&thread_id=61742&forum_id=59&page=36

If you can do about halfway down the page, look for the post with Linky 1, Linky 2... Linky 7 in it and have a gander at that ;)

C-Coen
27-02-2009, 09:47
In terms of timeline, I won't get far of, except for quite likely 'what if?' scenario's.
For example, Gil-galad was killed during the Battle of the Last Alliance, but if this hadn't happened, he would probably still live around the War of the Ring. It's not like he'll die of age or so.

A friend of mine came up with another pretty good idea yesterday, when we were talking a bit about those rules during a battle. He suggested using, say, Imrahil in an army with pretty much just Numenoreans, led by Elendil and Isildur. This way, you can simply call Imrahil Anarion (Isildur's brother), and have him at last!

alexh
27-02-2009, 09:52
Well, I for one would be fine with that idea C-Coen.

Goruax
28-02-2009, 23:52
I'm gonna be playing with a wierd army, it's based off of Azog's Force who has banded lots of Goblins together who have each 'tamed' a beastie.
So I have a horde of Goblins (about 230), a Goblin King (Durburz, or 'Azog'), a Stone Giant, a Cave Drake and a Spider Queen.
Monsters are very nasty, generally have a few nifty rules (to keep things interesting) and are also just plain awesome.

I wouldn't mind if people don't stick to the books, though it is very cool to see themed armies.