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View Full Version : Why did GW get rid of sacred spawnings?



mattieice
14-02-2009, 02:35
I've been looking for thoughts on this and I haven't found any so I figured I'd start a thread on it. So why get rid of sacred spawnings? It gave a great deal of customization to the lizardmen army. Why remove it? Anything that encourages balanced variety to a list should certainly be encouraged right?

Sarah S
14-02-2009, 02:38
Because they were almost totally unused except for Quetzl, Tepok and the Mark of the Old Ones on a Skink carrying the Cube of Darkness.

They didn't encourage variety in the slightest, because the rest were pretty much never seen.

ehlijen
14-02-2009, 02:59
All the spawnings I've ever seen were:
Quetlz on saurus and scar vets. That's still there (and compulsory now instead of leaving it as a 'are you silly enough not to take this?' option).
Tepok on all characters. It was too much of a no brainer. Spamming scar vets AND not loose on the magic defense? Why not?
...that's it. I've never seen spawnings other than those. Except for carnosaur riders, but old bloods could get so many spawnings it never mattered that they had to take it.

sulla
14-02-2009, 02:59
As Sarah S says, they definately didn't encourage variety, In fact they were one of the main reasons saurus were so rare... especially vanilla ones.

If only GW had gotten rid of chaos marks too, I might actually face tzeenchian marauders or slaaneshi sorcerors once in a while too.

Finnigan2004
14-02-2009, 03:03
My Sotek marked lizardman army begs to differ. Still, even if the rest of you are right, balancing the marks would have been far more interesting than getting rid of them totally.

theunwantedbeing
14-02-2009, 03:22
VC bloodlines....choose 1 of 5, then pick a heap of powers and items.
Sounds like alot of scope, unfortunately you ended out with only a couple of ways to customise your chosen bloodline.
So they ditched that system and opted for one that just allows you to pick a heap of powers from a combined group of them.

Not a perfect system by a long shot as you will only gravitate towards a few set builds for your character's anyway.

Chaos gifts, a cut down version of bloodline powers with little to no choice. Not very effective as only a few things are really worth having, and those aare taken most of the time...which the rest are almost never used.

It echo's how the sacred spawnings were used.

Seems GW took this as reason enough to scrap them and deny any choice in the matter.
Pretty sound thinking really.

No point giving people choice when they dont utilize it.
Easier to just ditch the choice altogether and keep things balanced in an easier to manage way.

StarFyreXXX
14-02-2009, 03:38
What they should have done is made them better to make more people want to use others.

I'm upset they are gone since i normally used other spawnings other than quetzl.

Choices damnit, choices....not less choices to make it easier to design. that is the wrong way to go...

I wanted them to be like, only 1 spawning unit (core or special) for each 1000 pts. The cost would be much higher for them to show how rare/better they are. BUt if you took a true sacred host, then the cost for entire army would be very high, even more than chaos, but army would be smaller and themed.

Makes sense, is fluffy, has more variability with people's desires for their armies, etc....oh well. Maybe they will do what they did before, and release sacred hosts in WD magazine.

Or, we can all hope for 8E.

Sanjay

TheMav80
14-02-2009, 03:42
I used all of them except for Tzunki and Chotec. Those were the only two not worth taking.

John Vaughan
14-02-2009, 04:12
In all fairness, the mark of Tzeentch does not generate an extra dispel die/make combat character into lvl2/4 wizard like it used to, therefore you shouldn't be able to generate dice when I cant. Besides, I wouldnt complain, because the saurus scaly skin was improved, putting them almost on par with chaos warriors. That annoys me.

Nicha11
14-02-2009, 04:23
I've been looking for thoughts on this and I haven't found any so I figured I'd start a thread on it. So why get rid of sacred spawnings? It gave a great deal of customization to the lizardmen army. Why remove it? Anything that encourages balanced variety to a list should certainly be encouraged right?

Sigh...

Because Games Workshop is an evil corporation that seeks only to exploit Lizardmen for its own game.

Spawnings was obviously ditched because it was a good thing, and GW has a strict no "good things" policy.

Feefait
14-02-2009, 05:30
as most people have already said that "variety" you could get amounted to what they gave saurus as standard anyway, extra scaly skin and what not. the rest of the stuff can be made up for in banners and items now mainly. look at vampire counts, they did away with how the bloodlines worked since people onyl ever did like 1 thing. but of course now we (lm) have less options, so aren't we all doing the same thing anyway... I loved the spawnings and wish they had stayed, even though they did need to change. I just think this was a convenience move on gw's part.

Kerill
14-02-2009, 05:47
Quetzl got given to everything
Rider spawning got given to every character for free
Tepok got replaced by the EOTG
Tzlatzcotl got given to the TG for free if they have a slann and got given to stegadons and ancient stegs too.
Sotek for characters is gone (and with blade of realities would have been too good) but there is an "inverse" sotek for saurus warriors (extra attacks when charged :) )

I don't think the loss of the spawnings is that bad (since they are not lost so much as given for free to specific units but not mentioned), but the loss of the alternative spawning lists is a bit of a shame since they could make the army play very differently for the occasional fun game.

The old spawnings with the current list would be quite overpowered as well I think.

Neckutter
14-02-2009, 06:03
GW does things to sell models. GW made the sacred spawnings and it was a good idea, as it made people repaint their models, or buy additional models to paint for the random spawnings.

when in doubt about a corporation, be pessimistic.

TheMav80
14-02-2009, 06:06
In all fairness, the mark of Tzeentch does not generate an extra dispel die/make combat character into lvl2/4 wizard like it used to, therefore you shouldn't be able to generate dice when I cant. Besides, I wouldnt complain, because the saurus scaly skin was improved, putting them almost on par with chaos warriors. That annoys me.

Two wrongs still don't make a right.

The True Mooseman
14-02-2009, 09:00
Because sacred spawnings would have to be represented on your models, and as we all now know, ALL LIZARDMEN ARE BLUE.
Hey, maybe if you chant it over and over it'll eventually sound true...

WarmbloodedLizard
14-02-2009, 10:09
Tepok got replaced by the EOTG


I agree with most of what you say, but that's quite a ridiculous statement. Saurus+Tepok are a wholly different thing than EotG.
EotG = all anti-magic-eggs in one basket
EotG = much more expensive
EotG = doesn't want to be in close combat
EotG = mostly support

I really share sanjay's opion about spawnings. they should have been adapted to the new army and made more balanced and interesting.

Famder
14-02-2009, 10:12
Because sacred spawnings would have to be represented on your models, and as we all now know, ALL LIZARDMEN ARE BLUE.
Despite the fact that you are being facetious I feel I should point out that all the Lizardmen with spawnings were still blue (except the Mark of the Old Ones who were albino), their backs and crests were just different colors.

Spawnings were obviously taken out because they were a headache taht was unnecessary. They had only recently been introduced as a game mechanic, they failed to bring anything substantial to the army, so they got rid of them.

Gorbad Ironclaw
14-02-2009, 10:23
GW does things to sell models. GW made the sacred spawnings and it was a good idea, as it made people repaint their models, or buy additional models to paint for the random spawnings.



I don't know if people actually did that. I've no idea what colour the supposed spawning might have been, but I also never saw anyone talk about it at all and generally people just said what spawning they had and then painted there lizards however they wanted.

Not saying some people might not have multiple options painted to match different spawning, just that I never saw it/noticed it.

W0lf
14-02-2009, 11:50
Have you seen all the WoC hate?

now imagine if tepok had stayed whilst khorne lost its extra DD.

That would have been pretty bad :P

Slaaneshi Ice Cream
14-02-2009, 12:00
VC bloodlines....choose 1 of 5, then pick a heap of powers and items.
Sounds like alot of scope, unfortunately you ended out with only a couple of ways to customise your chosen bloodline.
So they ditched that system and opted for one that just allows you to pick a heap of powers from a combined group of them.

Not a perfect system by a long shot as you will only gravitate towards a few set builds for your character's anyway.

Chaos gifts, a cut down version of bloodline powers with little to no choice. Not very effective as only a few things are really worth having, and those aare taken most of the time...which the rest are almost never used.

It echo's how the sacred spawnings were used.

Seems GW took this as reason enough to scrap them and deny any choice in the matter.
Pretty sound thinking really.

No point giving people choice when they dont utilize it.
Easier to just ditch the choice altogether and keep things balanced in an easier to manage way.

But wouldn't it be better if GW made all marks/spawnings useful and didn't leave any obvious no-brainer choices in the book?

theunwantedbeing
14-02-2009, 12:11
But wouldn't it be better if GW made all marks/spawnings useful and didn't leave any obvious no-brainer choices in the book?

Well obvious but as you can see from my post, GW has had several attempts to do that over various armies and has managed to fail on each and every occasion.

So there was little reason to try again and they didn't.
The book is better for it anyway.

The list is more diverse, characters do not a list make, troops do.

TheMav80
14-02-2009, 15:43
Have you seen all the WoC hate?

now imagine if tepok had stayed whilst khorne lost its extra DD.

That would have been pretty bad :P

Now imagine that because of this GW decides to just get rid of Marks all together. I mean it really is just a headache. Some are just so much better than others, it really doesn't seem worth. You can still just paint your army to look how you want though. So who cares?

StarFyreXXX
14-02-2009, 15:53
Exactly...if GW got rid of marks, people here would be yelling for blood...but since it's not chaos, oh it's ok that instead of redoing all the spawnings to make them all balanced, just get rid of it and increase the AS on some units. *rolls eyes*

Sanjay

Sarevok
14-02-2009, 16:37
Why did Lizzies need spawnings in the first place, though?

Gaargod
14-02-2009, 18:21
Because spawnings were cool and useful. There was tons of rumours before how spawnings were going to turn out, then suddenly they all changed and said no spawnings, leading me to think that perhaps spawnings were planned, but then dropped. Or maybe not, who cares.


Why do chaos need marks? Why not just paint chaos warriors green and say they're nurgle? Why shouldn't EVERY army lose their representation of the background in the rules?

Horus38
14-02-2009, 18:46
Saurus got the Quetzl spawning for free, this more then makes up for the others being dropped in my mind :D

On the flipside we do use a few tools to upgrade stuff, I almost never used marks on anything but characters, so I'm not too worried about it. We got enough buffs in other areas that the marks are something that bogs the list down rather then diversify it.

mattieice
14-02-2009, 18:47
Because spawnings were cool and useful. There was tons of rumours before how spawnings were going to turn out, then suddenly they all changed and said no spawnings, leading me to think that perhaps spawnings were planned, but then dropped. Or maybe not, who cares.


Why do chaos need marks? Why not just paint chaos warriors green and say they're nurgle? Why shouldn't EVERY army lose their representation of the background in the rules?

my point exactly. when you get rid of the special rules that truly make each person's army unique you get very vanilla games. why not make every single army list exactly the same but you can still buy the models for your favorite army? that way there's no balance issue. just have every army have 'infantry', 'heavy infantry', 'cavalry', 'hero', and 'artillery'. i don't buy this whole 'oh it's too hard to balance' nonsense.

sulla
14-02-2009, 18:50
Now imagine that because of this GW decides to just get rid of Marks all together. I mean it really is just a headache. Some are just so much better than others, it really doesn't seem worth. You can still just paint your army to look how you want though. So who cares?

I'm still hoping they will do away with marks for beasts when they come out. That way, my army will function the same, no matter what my backstory is and I don't have to compromise by putting certain marks in to compensate for army weaknesses.

Coram_Boy
14-02-2009, 21:15
my point exactly. when you get rid of the special rules that truly make each person's army unique you get very vanilla games. why not make every single army list exactly the same but you can still buy the models for your favorite army? that way there's no balance issue. just have every army have 'infantry', 'heavy infantry', 'cavalry', 'hero', and 'artillery'. i don't buy this whole 'oh it's too hard to balance' nonsense.

Lizardmen are not defined by spawnings - Chaos are defined by marks, fluff-wise. get a grip, and get over it. if you think that no spawnings will really take the character out of lizardmen armies, try playing something else. spawnings just add a layer of tedium to lizardmen - most of the marks were never used. MotOO, + 1 AS, and Tepok.They were the ones that were used. I recall debates about lizardmen tactics, but most of them weren't 'which mark is best?'. People knew which were best, and wisely, used them.

Sarevok
14-02-2009, 21:39
Why do chaos need marks? Why not just paint chaos warriors green and say they're nurgle? Why shouldn't EVERY army lose their representation of the background in the rules?

Well then why shouldn't every army get a Spawning/Bloodlines/Marks/Vows or whatever?

High Elves gained vows and lost vows and people don't really care. Sacred Spawnings were never that important in background and weren't needed for balance either.

StarFyreXXX
14-02-2009, 21:48
ACtually spawnings are quite important in background...it's mentioned in somany fluff stories it's not even funny.

Sanjay

decker_cky
14-02-2009, 22:04
Yea...marks ARE chaos, while spawnlings were a little perk for lizardmen. I agree with others that the list is actually more diverse now in spite of losing the spawnlings.

Valtiel
14-02-2009, 22:57
Actually GW could have gotten rid of the marks for units but kept it for Characters. It was like that during 4th and 5th edition but at that time I guess units didn't matter too much. Back in the Realm of Chaos books there were Warriors, Knights and War altars as far as I know dedicated to the 4 Gods but you could also have normal ones in your army. It would have made sense to me if GW did get rid of marks of the units instead of making them so foolish like they are now but well you can't get anything. I do love Chaos with Marks (only on few units though, Marauders, Ogres and Giants shouldn't really not be marked fluffwise). But I am rambling...

I do feel slightly sorry for the loss of Spawnings but they really do seem to have gotten a decent armybook but GW can't seem to please everyone.

thegreenknight0
14-02-2009, 23:02
I love how all these newbs to the game make claims such as "quetzl's now free" or " the fluff of the army always supported armies of mostly Saurus". Wrong, Wrong, and Wrong on so many other topics. GW has turned back the clock on the Lizards and anybody who has played them since their inception will recognize that immediately. Guess what, Saurus started off w/ a SS save of 5+ in the beginning, and skinks even had a SS 6+ (and those saves could never get worse than 6+ do to str modifiers). Saurus were originally stated to be more difficult to spawn than skinks which explained why the majority of an army was ussually skinks, just look at the original book and compare the number of saurus based units and skink based units available (skink Cav anyone and southlands armies).
The last edition lizardmen book did a lot to add some variety and character, and a lot off people had complaints then too and some for good reason. When an update is released gamers expect the developers to weigh the good and bad aspects of previous editions and "improve" upon the army and when that doesn't happen because they decide to go simple it is a real let down. It is very obvious that GW has decided to lower the bar on the complexity scale for game play and that also means army construction. I'm sure they have their reasons, perhaps they are trying to appeal to a simpler audience, that's fine just be up front about it and say "This is our new strategy, we are simplifying our core games and no longer supporting any of our secondary games in hopes of appealling to a larger market". It is what it is, It sucks and I'm sad to see the game dumb down so much in recent army releases but thats the way it is. Their is more strategy involved in putting together a Magic T.G. deck using only one set than there currently is putting together a recent Fantasy army (and I hate Magic).

W0lf
14-02-2009, 23:16
I cant believe people think spawnings=marks.

You cant be serious.... people only ever took Tepok or Quetzl and even then.

6th edition lizzies-> Most people took a mix of spawnings on heros (tepok/quetzl) and rarely even took saurus, let alone marked them. Oh and if they were marked it was Quetzl or rarely Tepok. Hell all i saw was skinks+krox with a slaan and a scar vet or 2 with Tepok/Quetzl.

6th edition hordes - Your mark on general determined your army. Mono-God all played vastly diffrently (well Tz + Khorne did)

Atzcapotzalco
15-02-2009, 01:29
Personally, I'd say that its something of a balance issue. Between basic heavy armour, a points decrease, and getting to use spears with 2 attacks per rank, saurus infantry has improved to the point where adding any more power through spawnings would be unbalancing. As a lizardman player, I'm certainly happy to use saurus as they are.

Rioghan Murchadha
15-02-2009, 03:39
Why did they get rid of sacred spawnings? Could be because GW hates you, wants to kill your dog, sleep with your wife, steal your pickup truck, and get you fired from your job.

Or... that could be the formula to every country song ever written.

TheMav80
15-02-2009, 04:21
Plenty of people put Sotek on their characters. I put Mark of the Old Ones on my Priest carrying the Cube every time. I took Saurus Warriors with Tlazcotl to guard my Slann instead of Temple Guard sometimes. I took a minimized Saurus unit with Huanchi several times to protect myself from the old Banshee and root out Skirmishers.

There were only two I never took.
Tzunki: We've never had enough water terrain for my normally aquatic units to take advantage of it. And +1 I when your Initiative already sucks so bad is not worth the points.
Chotec: I probably should have taken this more often because my pursuit and flee rolls are notoriously horrible. But I never did.

And I don't think anyone is trying to say everything should have gotten Quetzl PLUS the option for more Spawnings. Just that keep some of the Spawnings would have been nice.

TheDarkDuke
15-02-2009, 05:30
In general they were overpriced, 90% of them were not used, and they actually made Saurus Warriors worse by starting to take overt special and rare slots. Really the new rules have given the only used ones for well free.

Famder
15-02-2009, 09:59
I love how all these newbs to the game make claims such as "quetzl's now free" or " the fluff of the army always supported armies of mostly Saurus". Wrong, Wrong, and Wrong on so many other topics. GW has turned back the clock on the Lizards and anybody who has played them since their inception will recognize that immediately. Guess what, Saurus started off w/ a SS save of 5+ in the beginning, and skinks even had a SS 6+ (and those saves could never get worse than 6+ do to str modifiers). Saurus were originally stated to be more difficult to spawn than skinks which explained why the majority of an army was ussually skinks, just look at the original book and compare the number of saurus based units and skink based units available (skink Cav anyone and southlands armies).
I've played since the 5th ed days, and I know you're spouting a bunch of bull. I've got my 5th ed book right here where it clearly says, "As soldiers to guard the Temple Cities, the Saurus were however exactly what the Old Ones needed." Doesn't sound to me like they Saurus were supposed to take a back seat to skinks in the army. The reason given for Saurus not riding cavalry was because they were too stupid. Skinks are also described as being a compliment in battle to the Saurus for their ranged capabilites, not the primary warriors. The skinks are described as more numerous because they are expected to be the workers in society as well as serving in a military role, so even though they were more numerous overall their entire numbers were not represented in battle like the Saurus were.

Spawnings were also non-existant in terms of importance and were mostly superstition. As was pointed out earlier, spawnings/=marks or bloodlines. All vampires belong to one of five bloodlines fluffwise, all chaos worshippers belong to one of five designations of chaos worshippers, the same statement is not true of all lizardmen. Spawnings are meant to be a rare premonition of the gods, Marks and Bloodlines are the result of what made them a part of that particular army.

thegreenknight0
15-02-2009, 17:37
Spawnings were also non-existant in terms of importance and were mostly superstition. As was pointed out earlier, spawnings/=marks or bloodlines. All vampires belong to one of five bloodlines fluffwise, all chaos worshippers belong to one of five designations of chaos worshippers, the same statement is not true of all lizardmen. Spawnings are meant to be a rare premonition of the gods, Marks and Bloodlines are the result of what made them a part of that particular army.

Try not to be so ridiculous. If you want to continue to go way back in the WFB history than your arguement is unfounded. When the VC were actually just part of the undead army, vampires were just vampires with no mention at all or even implication of bloodlines whereas the lizards may not have mentioned SS but the statements were made that some warriors were marked for greatness and that was evidents by color variations such as being albino. That being said I found the bloodline idea to be a flavourful and fluff-ful addition/improvement to WFB vampires just as I found fleshing out of SS to be for lizards. If you want to argue who has the historical right to such options I can think of ONLY Chaos since they have had them as far back as I can remember (somewhere around 4th ed. maybe even longer) but how boring is this game gonna get if they fail to build upon what was laid down previously. My point is that Lizards were just as qualified, if not more so based on their background, an army to receive such options as any other. At least as qualified as VC. GW decided to do away with that flavouful aspect of Lizerds and thats their choice, players still have the right to lament that choice, we all don't have to fall into lock step.

zak
15-02-2009, 17:52
As a LM player I can't say that I miss the spawnings. As previously stated some ahve been added for free and others have gone. It may leave less choice, but for me I am happy with my new saurus without spawnings.

Coram_Boy
15-02-2009, 18:14
Try not to be so ridiculous. If you want to continue to go way back in the WFB history than your arguement is unfounded. When the VC were actually just part of the undead army, vampires were just vampires with no mention at all or even implication of bloodlines whereas the lizards may not have mentioned SS but the statements were made that some warriors were marked for greatness and that was evidents by color variations such as being albino. That being said I found the bloodline idea to be a flavourful and fluff-ful addition/improvement to WFB vampires just as I found fleshing out of SS to be for lizards. If you want to argue who has the historical right to such options I can think of ONLY Chaos since they have had them as far back as I can remember (somewhere around 4th ed. maybe even longer) but how boring is this game gonna get if they fail to build upon what was laid down previously. My point is that Lizards were just as qualified, if not more so based on their background, an army to receive such options as any other. At least as qualified as VC. GW decided to do away with that flavouful aspect of Lizerds and thats their choice, players still have the right to lament that choice, we all don't have to fall into lock step.

You are being ridiculous. Surely you can't care that much? All SS did was make Armies all the same, with MotOO on the priest, and then Tepok and Quetzl. Admit it, it wouldn't have mattered if you had only had those three, your lists wouldn't have been that heavily affected. If the marks had all been equally balanced, then it would have been a shame to lose them. But given the lack of variety they inspired, this is not a problem. Quetzl is still there, so be glad about that. And you still haven't admitted that in the CURRENT fluff, Spawnings aren't very important. In some ways, the Vampires have the same thing (although to be fair this is because the Von Carsteins were the only army building vampires).

Drayken
15-02-2009, 18:36
Spawnings were great, but most of them weren't worth it. GW should have made them better, more useful, instead of ditching them completely. At the worst, it would just have been an add-on players wouldn't use, but think of the variety it adds to the game for those who will use them. Plus, as arch-nemesis of Chaos, the lizards ought to have marks from their gods too, just to outcool them.

thegreenknight0
15-02-2009, 18:46
I'm sad to see SS gone as it also removes SH armies as well. The variety offered by the SH armies included variation in spell choice as well as SS for your core choices. Rarely were any of these game breaking options but they were just that, OPTIONS. You can't honestly argue that having more optional play styles means that everyone plays exactly the same. Sure, one or two options may be selected w/ more frequency or may be more common on the tournement circuit but show me an army that doesn't have an army build that does this anyway. I can only speak for my experiences and YES I had a favourite SH list but I did play them all and I continued to play them all because it was variety. The joy of gaming was to figure out how each one worked best and they did all play differently.

Now we have an army book that has cut those options down and I contend that in the coming months we will see those one or two army builds emerge, certain units will be shelved only to be fielded in massive battles to fill those needed points, just as we see w/ all armies. My main point stands that GW continues to lower the complexity of this game and they are not lowering those standards on the battlefield element but in the army building realm. I look forward to the coming months when THE established Lizardmen list has been determined and all the adolescent players download it and buy their own brand new toy Lizardmen army (much like what is done w/ CCGs), until of course the next army gets their new book in the coming months.

ViVa la Variety

Chicago Slim
16-02-2009, 13:13
Exactly...if GW got rid of marks, people here would be yelling for blood...but since it's not chaos, oh it's ok that instead of redoing all the spawnings to make them all balanced, just get rid of it and increase the AS on some units. *rolls eyes*



It might be worth noting that Marks of Chaos have been a central part of Chaos armies for the entire 15-20 year span that there's been Chaos armies. Sacred Spawnings, on the other hand, were introduced in the immediately prior army book, and removed 4 years later.

So, yeah, I'm okay with the idea that totally ripping out a long and storied central theme of an army would get a more vigorous response than dropping a new rule that hadn't really worked out.

someone2040
17-02-2009, 03:04
Personally, I'd say that its something of a balance issue. Between basic heavy armour, a points decrease, and getting to use spears with 2 attacks per rank, saurus infantry has improved to the point where adding any more power through spawnings would be unbalancing. As a lizardman player, I'm certainly happy to use saurus as they are.
See, I think that's fairly spot on. Saurus needed a buff, and the obvious one was to boost their armour save to put them more in line with elite infantry such as Chaos Warriors. But if you can suddenly increase that armour save further? Why take Temple Guard for example, as most people think Saurus with Spears are the new thing (And really, if they could get a 3+ armour save along with all those attacks...).

And yeah, most weren't even used. Characters had a little bit of variety (some by necessity like Itzl), but it was either. Tepok because you want to run magic lite. Quetzl to give our units/characters more armour. Sotek on Jaguar Saurus/Flying Skink of Doom/Mounted Saurus. Tlazcotl if you were tailoring your list for fear causers. Tzunki, Huanchi, Chotec were almost never used. Old Ones if you wanted reliability.

Personally my oppinion after much consideration is. I think it may have been interesting to have them go back to being only on characters. Would've been much easier to balance them, if Saurus/Skinks can choose one and only one. Skinks Chiefs/Tehenhauin could really use Sotek back (Why Tehenhauin didn't just keep it anyway, I have no idea). I think there was fluff in the new book, about sacred spawnings usually being only a single one spawned for greatness (or perhaps that was just Priests).

John Vaughan
18-02-2009, 03:25
Bingo Chicago Slim!
Spawnings=Marks, and that's a Chaos thing. Don't steal it from me, or I will slice some heads.

POST 666! HAIL CHAOS!!!