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trigger
15-02-2009, 01:16
Been thinking about doing this army for a while , but have not got the codex (a bit reluctant to due to having most of the codexi since 2nd)
So What i am asking is are they any good , do they make for good games ???

I know ppl cant post rules , but could you the warseers give a run down of the codex. In a round about way.

would these be a expensive army to do compared to a 2000pt marine army.

Thanks
Trig

Znail
15-02-2009, 01:27
You can find out alot in the tactics section I think. But some highlights:

-everything deepstrikes, so plays rather diffrently then other armies (both good and bad)

-low model count as its an elite army (somewhat less then marines on average)

-alot of stuff is still metal, so ends up costing about as much as marines I think. Asuming you dont compare with AoBR prices. Some army builds can get extremly expensive if you mass exepensive metal models, like Bloodcrushers.

-the units have alot of character and are fairly diffrent from eachother.

-There is more melee units then shooty units.

-The codex is pretty well balanced.

RampagingRavener
15-02-2009, 01:47
-low model count as its an elite army (somewhat less then marines on average)

This isn't quite true. Daemonic Infantry is quite cheap; while individual models all hover around the price of Marines, they have very few unit upgrades, and most of them aren't of great use. The list I've drafted up and am slowly putting together rounds off at 77 models at 2000 points, which isn't horrendous model-wise. If you don't dump a lot of points into Soulgrinders or Greater Daemons, then you can get even more; the above example has one GD and two Grinders. Certainly they're not a horde army like Orks or Tyranids, but I wouldn't call then 'elite' either.

Generally speaking, every unit in the codex is hyper-specialised. Pink Horrors kick out a huge amount of shots, but are worthless in melee. Plaguebearers are slow and unimpressive in combat, but are near-on impossible to shift from a dug in position so make excellent units to carry Icons and hold objectives. Daemonettes are cheap and get a horrendous amount of Rending attacks at a high I and can fleet, but are very fragile. Bloodletters are crazy good in combat, but lack fleet and aren't much tougher than Daemonettes. These themes carry over to their other choices. In general, Tzeentch is shooty, Nurgle is tough, Slaanesh is fast, and Khorne is strong. There are a few exceptions, but whatever. You need to take units from more than one god to ensure a balanced army.

The army is kinda random. The Daemonic Assault rule can screw you really badly if they go wrong, but if they go right can set you up in extremely good positions. It suffers from a lack of ranged anti-tank as well, but Tzeentch units are deadly at range against Infantry. As for expensive? It is, kinda. As Znail said, a lot of the models are metal, and pricey at that. There are mutterings of plastic Plaguebearers and Horrors on the horizon IIRC, so that'll help on the price front.

Overally, I'd say go for it. IMO it's a really interesting codex with a unique playstyle, well balanced, and looks good on the tabletop. Granted they are a niche army, and tactically an extremely aggressive one, but I like 'em a lot.

EDIT: Also, check out Redrivertears' battle reports up in the Batreps section. He plays with Daemons quite a bit and his reports show a lot of what the army is capable of.

Znail
15-02-2009, 03:07
This isn't quite true. Daemonic Infantry is quite cheap; while individual models all hover around the price of Marines, they have very few unit upgrades, and most of them aren't of great use. The list I've drafted up and am slowly putting together rounds off at 77 models at 2000 points, which isn't horrendous model-wise. If you don't dump a lot of points into Soulgrinders or Greater Daemons, then you can get even more; the above example has one GD and two Grinders. Certainly they're not a horde army like Orks or Tyranids, but I wouldn't call then 'elite' either.

I wouldnt consider your list a common list. Its not like the Troops choises are bad, but you get better value for your points in the other sections. So you need a decent number of scoring units, but going beyond that and almost only take Troops is a mistake in my oppinion, with the possible exception of the Tallyman and massed Plaguebearers.

Kalec
15-02-2009, 03:16
The list is very, very powerful but can get screwed over by poor scatter rolls. It has some of the best units for their points in the game, but having the game decided by scatter and reserves rolls is entirely possible and not much fun.

Azhrarn
15-02-2009, 08:13
-low model count as its an elite army (somewhat less then marines on average)

I'll have to disagree with this aswell.

With 4 troop choices (2x 12 daemonettes and 2x 15 horrors) I come out at 69 models in 1700 points which is the default tournament size here.
Those 4 choices make up around half of the points in the list, so it's not as if I went troop heavy either.

Daemon units tend to be a little cheaper in points than you'd expect given their capabilities, but that is due to the unpredictable nature of your army's entry on the battlefield. Mess up a few crucial scatters and a game can go very differently then when the scatters go your way.

As for the monetary model cost, the plastic daemon units are rather cheap (Daemonettes and Bloodletters) the metal ones add up rather quickly though.
If you find yourself needing metal troops quite a bit, it pays off to look on sites like ebay for lots of minis since you can save quite a bundle.
It's how I got most of my horrors, much cheaper that way. Units like Bloodcrushers also cost a small fortune (at €25 per model having a few of these hurts)

tbh, I really don't understand why GW discontinued the old 10 metal daemons in a box line, since the army would have been a good deal cheaper to buy.
(horrors and plaguebearers in boxes of 5 almost for the price of the old 10-man versions at the moment, which is a pain.)

holmcross
15-02-2009, 08:44
Soul Grinders are ridiculous. Get three: run three.

Zujara
15-02-2009, 09:11
It's a fun army to play, especially if you can laugh at your own misfortunes. Sometimes deep strike is your friend, other times you do like one of my first games with my army have have your 3/4ths of your primary wave scatter into enemy troops and impassable terrain and roll 1s and 2s on the mishap table.

I'll echo the check ebay, I got all my plaguebearers and horrors off there for a decent price.

Znail
15-02-2009, 10:27
I'll have to disagree with this aswell.

With 4 troop choices (2x 12 daemonettes and 2x 15 horrors) I come out at 69 models in 1700 points which is the default tournament size here.
Those 4 choices make up around half of the points in the list, so it's not as if I went troop heavy either.

I think that is pretty Troop heavy, you would get 5 full Tactical Squads for a similar cost and thats quite alot of Troops (and similar number of models too, so its not like marines would be fewer if they went nuts on grunts). I think 1/3rd ,or even slightly less, is a more reasonable amount of Troops then 1/2 of the army. I havent felt any lack of Troops when using less, so I dont think you need quite that much.

I wouldnt recomend using that large units of Horrors either as that leaves you very vulnerable to losing alot of points from a single assault as no matter how many horrors so are they easy to beat in melee. You also want to shoot when you deepstrike them and that means you cant run so you form a nice 'pie plates this way' formation.