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vamp
21-02-2009, 05:13
Personally i think dispel scrolls can ruin a game. All a person has to do is spend 25 points to stop something that could change the outcome of the game. Potentially you could load up with many of these things as is possible and shut down any of the more terrible spells thrown against you.

How many dispel scrolls is about average per game?

How many do you guys take?

When do you personally start to consider the scrolls to be being abused?

devolutionary
21-02-2009, 05:22
One. I use it for emergencies only. This is true in both my Bretonnian and Wood Elf lists.

Urgat
21-02-2009, 05:30
I take none. I take the staff of sorcery and the staff of sneaky stealing instead :D

Genrazn
21-02-2009, 05:36
4 in 2k games because people love to out magic me like jerks

mattschuur
21-02-2009, 06:02
I take at most 2 or 1 if i have a magic item that gives me an additional dispel dice. However, a friend of mine hates them so much he will never bring them. Personally i think the common items should be capped at one per character. it allows more than 1 to be taken but not 2 with the same model. I played a guy in a tournament a while back who took a Great bray shaman, kept him at Level 3 and gave him 4 dispel scrolls. This was in addition to another bray shaman with 2 more. The rest of his army was Chaos Warriors and Knights with the tactic of nullifying magic for 3 turns at which point his army was chopping you up in Combat. Luckily i only had a caddy myself so he had 150 of wasted points, but a magic heavy list would have gotten nothing done.

matt schuur

Kayin
21-02-2009, 07:41
I do not take any. I feel that they take the random element out of warhammer. There are very few things in the game that are a "sure thing". As long as the spell is not cast with irresitable force, then it can be stopped without rolling a single die. When I cast a spell, there is a chance that I will miscast(and as an orc player, that ends poorly). The fact that a risk is taken to cast a spell that can be nullified without any risk to the oppoent just seems silly.

If they were the same as almost every other magic item out there, where someone could only take one per army, then I would be ok with them, but as they aren't, I avoid them on principle.

At my club, people rarely ever take scrolls, and if they do, it is normally only 1(we have a few new guys who need to be broken in). I have found that i have enjoyed these games alot more than I used to when scolls were commonplace.

long bow
21-02-2009, 07:52
i take them in my dogs of war army because i would never have anti magic at all if i didant. other wise none because i play dwarfs as my mine fantasy army

Braad
21-02-2009, 08:35
When I take 1 shaman, I give him 2. When I got more shamans, its usually less (1 for emergency) and some other dispell things.

vamp
21-02-2009, 08:57
Personally I hate anything that is a sure thing. It hardly seem's balanced to just say " no I forbid this spell to happen". But if I find that players commonly bring them then I fear in order to compete I must do the same.

At my home table we I may put it to the group and see if we wanna exclude their use in an army. Much like we did with Lucky Charms in Mordhiem. A game ruiner if you ask me. I agree for game balance issues they should only allow one of any type of item to be carried by a character this is a common magical item.

The Red Scourge
21-02-2009, 09:04
People look at scrolls and go "Whaaaat? 25 points for ruining my expensive magic? Thats blatant cheating brokenness!"

Just try to remember that the caddy carrying the scrolls around usually costs a few points too – usually you average out on 70 pts/scroll, and thats a bit steep in my book.

For my magic low and vulnerable wood elves, I usually bring 1 – if I even do that.
For my magic heavy WoC and VC, I usually spend the points elsewhere in a more offensive way :)

Coram_Boy
21-02-2009, 09:50
I take 1 scroll and 2 wizards, with the other one having an item like the diadem of power - and I never, ever use the scroll until the last turn unless there is something that will quite probably cause me to lose the game , like pit of shades on a treeman, and so on.

Lupinbell
21-02-2009, 10:06
No scrolls. EVER. If I've run out of dice stopping basic Magic Missiles before the big spell comes out I'll take it like a man and not make the same mistake again.

Deacon Bane
21-02-2009, 10:40
I don't take any in friendly games, but in tourneys I load up. Hey if some armies wouldn't bring 10+ PD, I wouldn't max out on scrolls. Limit the PD to 5 and I'll leave the scrolls at home.

W0lf
21-02-2009, 10:55
I always include 1 scroll.

Rarely more, rarely less. Its nice to have that 1 scroll for a suprise bound or a casting of 15+ that can change the game.

Necromancy Black
21-02-2009, 11:28
I usually have 1 minimun. It's a great back up.

But I'm not afraid to take up to 4 or so, espicially against undead armies or even Elves. I tend to use them for the spells I see doing alot of damage and for sneaky stuff my oponant pulls out once my disple dice are gone.

Onidan
21-02-2009, 11:55
Usually 1, 2 max at 2000+ point games.

I usually play magic heavy enemies and a way to stop one or two major spells is essential, but more is overkill. He should have some way to use his spells afterall.

Kill-Freedom
21-02-2009, 12:06
I take 1 to 2, depends on if theres better magic items to take

Chicago Slim
21-02-2009, 12:38
Zero to four, depending on the size of the game-- I frequently play 3000 points, and typically get a 5000-pointer in once a year or so...

In 2000 points, usually zero, sometimes one or even two; in a take-all-comers tourney, I might bring 2 scrolls on a caddy, if I don't have a lot of other anti-magic. In a friendly game where we've agreed to build out armies specifically tuned to face each other, I might bring 2 scrolls on a caddy, if I know that my opponent is likely to bring heavy magic.

Mostly, though, at low points (2500 and under), zero or maybe one.

Shiodome
21-02-2009, 12:49
i take 3, because i play bretonnians and get dumped all over in the magic phase otherwise. being on the receiving end of 5 spells a turn, i don't think three 'vetos' in the entire game is anywhere near 'denying' the opponent their phase. especially with bound spells flying about (sucking up DD dice, or wreaking havoc) which i can respond with in my phase using... oh wait, nothing.

i'd probably take less with most other armies, where magic was more of a duel, and the opponent needs to worry about my magic in return (then i'd spend the points on offensive castiness) but as it is... there's nothing else really worthwhile for my damsels to take.

Bel Anathar
21-02-2009, 12:52
It does seem like an expolit, they should be capped at 1scroll per mage imo but im a HE player so I'm probabaly biased. There are ways to counter it though, Book of Hoeth means every spell casts with irresistable force :) Its expensive though and only an Archmage can wield it.

EvC
21-02-2009, 13:01
Most 2K lists of mine have but a single scroll in them. If I'm playing a certain style of army, I might take a single scroll caddy with two scrolls. So we're talking 3DD or 5-7DD + 1 scroll usually.

I really hate facing armies that bring loads of scrolls though. One poster says: "4 in 2k games because people love to out magic me like jerks"- omg, people take 800 points of magic users, and dare to try and cast magic? What utter cads! If I'm playing someone with 4 scrolls (or sometimes even six- at 2K!), then I know they're the kind of player who doesn't like their game being a two-way thing, which is a shame.

It's also folly to say a scroll's "real" cost is on average about 70 points- note that this is the cost when you buy an Elf Mage and two scrolls- Elves being the most expensive basic Mages in the game. So no, it is not the average cost of a scroll- and furthermore, you don't just get the scrolls for 70 points, you also get a dispel dice (which usually costs 30 points) and if you're smart you can get other utility from the model. My Chaos Scroll Caddy for example costs about 170 points, but he's on a horse for a 2+ save, has the very decent stats of a Chaos Warrior, and has Bloodcurdling Roar for 2D6 S1 no armour hits on one enemy unit a turn. Now, if I could just get past this "unable to roll 6s" thing, then this mere caddy would actually be a fantastic tool in my army... (Seriously! Yesterday I had three games, and rolled approximately 16 D6 dice for the Bloodcurdling Roar, each and every time at prime targets like Assassins, Cold One Knights, Wardancers. I managed a grand total of 3 wounds)

Darkangeldentist
21-02-2009, 14:32
I rarely take scrolls. Mostly because I use Vampire counts and am used to being able to raise stuff back.

I don't load up on magic particularly and treasure my space for magic items and therefore tend not to think about making space for scrolls. If I took a necromancer more I might.

Dispel scrolls a neccessary evil. Magic has the potential to win the game in one spell and that is borderline unfair. Since irresistable force can beat even a scroll it might not pay off taking scrolls but they need to be there for most as the threat of magic can be so great.

The main flaw with the magic system for me is that it is like for like. To counter big magic armies all too often you have to invest heavily in magic as well and that is not good. A couple of scrolls isn't a terrible thing although more is mighty annoying and frustrating as without a serious magical threat they just shut down the magic in the game for the opening turns which are the most important.

Emeraldw
21-02-2009, 17:10
I have taken 2 at 2k. Thats about all. I personally don't mind scrolls, as spells can be really really powerful. My HE archmage blasted two units out of existence with 2 fury of khaine's a turn. Then I had another mage using curse of arrow attraction. If my opponent didn't have a lot of magic of his own it could have been worse. So single scrolls to stop those truly devastating spells (like beast cowers on your dragon) can make the game. I think they are fine, besides there is still the chance your enemy will roll double 6's and your scroll is useless.

all_seeing_eye
21-02-2009, 17:19
I usually take 1 per 1000 points. I find it keeps the winds in balance and keeps the game fun.

bork da basher
21-02-2009, 20:17
if i use magic it's all out full on magic and i generally have about 7 DD to my name which to me is adequate defense. i rarely feel the need to take scrolls.

Oberon
21-02-2009, 20:21
With skaven I take 2 or 3 scrolls in under 2k, 3-5 in 2k armies. 1 or 2 per warlock, one for the seer. People here play TK, HE, and lizardmen. VC take 2-3 scrolls, WoC 1 or 2, dwarves 2 or 3.

Leth Shyish'phak
21-02-2009, 21:29
In my current 2k Lizardmen list, my magic defense consists of two lord level wizards (one skink on engine), 2 scrolls, the diadem, the cube of darkness, the plaque of dominion and becalming cogitation.

So 6-8 DD, 2 scrolls, 1 scroll that can end a magic phase, all wizards within 18" and LoS of the Slann are stupid and a wizard within 24" of the Slann discards all 6's.

I am seriously fed up with invocation/vanhels spam. There are lots of other magic heavy armies around here too, often using magic as their main damage dealer.

Guy Fawkes
22-02-2009, 04:38
I take as many as I need.

If my army and list is particularly vulnerable to magic, I load up on scrolls and dispel dice. It's the same with every phase of the game - if you're playing Dwarfs, you need a way to compensate for M3, and that typically boils down to taking shooting. If you're playing Warriors of Chaos, you typically need to mitigate shooting and static combat resolution, so players take faster units like Hounds, Knights, and Marauder Cavalry, and some extra cheap units. If you play Elves, where T3 and poor armor means that even the most expensive skirmishers (Shades, Shadow Warriors, etc...) will kick the bucket against auto-hits from magic missiles, you typically need to find a way to stop magic.

For example, when I play my Vampire Counts, every Vampire is a Wizard - so I can get 6 dispel dice, just by taking 2 Vampires and a level 3 Vampire Lord. With that many dice, and raisable, cheap models like Zombies (Grave Guard, Varghulfs, etc... are pretty resilient), I don't have much pressure to take dispel scrolls. I take none at all, because I can roll with magic missiles on non-ethereal units and only need to stop those "game-winners" like magical movement, or some character-sniping spells.

With my Dark Elves on the other hand, I'll typically take a scroll or two, but only if I'm taking a Sorceress anyways. With the Seal of Ghrond and the Ring of Hotek, I can get 3 dispel dice and a zone of defense where I need it, and this is typically sufficient to deal with the worst. This setup allows me to dispel two light spells or bound items or a single big spell per turn, along with stopping all 3-dice spells within 12 inches (and all spells once I get close). If I think I'll need extra defense, magic resistance on a defenseless unit is often more tempting than a 150 point Sorceress with two scrolls. Sorceresses, however, are unique in that Power of Darkness and the Druchii Sorcery rule basically allow Sorceresses to be offensively powerful with minimal investment in offensive items.

With my Ogres, who are big and expensive and particularly vulnerable to magic, I'm usually stocking up on dispel scrolls. Sadly, Butchers are very expensive, but they can fight alright as well, so even if they don't cast they are useful. My Empire is a little different - I only take Scrolls (since I normally have an extra dispel die or two from Warrior Priests) if I have expensive and vulnerable units that I must protect - like Inner Circle Knights, Greatswords, the Steam Tank, etc...

Jericho
22-02-2009, 05:04
It's nice to see that many people here are playing with 1-2 even in tourney lists. Personally I rarely take more than one. My Dogs of War often take 2, due to a lack of other magic items. My Woodies usually take one plus Ranu's Heartstone, being able to re-roll when you botch an easy dispel (like 4+ on 2 dice) can be huge. Avoiding a miscast is of course another good ability for the Heartstone.

With my current army, the Warriors of Chaos, I take none. I play with 9PD, 5DD, and no scrolls, and people still trash my army on soft scores for being too magic-heavy. 6 levels of magic and the Book of Secrets on a BSB hardly seems game-breaking, but oh well.

Draconian77
22-02-2009, 05:52
I take around 9.

I find being able to stop half a Vampire Counts magic phase to be really useful...

Kill-Freedom
22-02-2009, 06:29
I take around 9.

I find being able to stop half a Vampire Counts magic phase to be really useful...

How many points and how many wizards you take?

VC magic is nothing compared to dark elves LOL

Chiungalla
22-02-2009, 06:39
Personally i think dispel scrolls can ruin a game. All a person has to do is spend 25 points to stop something that could change the outcome of the game.

Yes, and having those 300 points mage winning your game for you, without a real chance for your opponent to do anything about it is better.

Magic is broken in Warhammer if you field a descent amount of it, and yes, this is despite the high point cost of most mages. And this is even more true if you go very magic heavy.

It's very much harder to gain many dispel dice then it is to get many power dice, and as you allready mentioned a spell at the right place can decide the game.

So dispel scrolls are the only thing that keeps magic halfway balanced.

I take at least two, most of the time I would prefer three.

madival
22-02-2009, 06:58
in a 3k game against a friend who uses Magic heavy lizards with 3 stegadons, I run 6 scrolls. At the same time I am running 6th edition vampires. a blood dragon vampire LORD with KB and Sword of unholy power.

Lord Dan
22-02-2009, 07:01
I usually take 1 per 1000 points. I find it keeps the winds in balance and keeps the game fun.

This is my rule of thumb when creating lists, though in all of my most recent lists for any given army I've only been taking one (and in my Bretonnian list I don't have any! I don't even have a spellcaster.).

Draconian77
22-02-2009, 07:03
How many points and how many wizards you take?

VC magic is nothing compared to dark elves LOL

Erm...that went over your head didn't it?

Vampire magic is a lot scarier than DE magic for several reasons.

(The main one being; "What is so great about Druchii magic?")

Lord Dan
22-02-2009, 07:05
He takes whole regiments of mages in a 2000 point game, Kill-Freedom. I still can't figure out how he does it.

Aelyn
22-02-2009, 09:10
It depends how much magic I'm running and the size of the game.

In less than 2,000 points, I generally run no scrolls. This is because I'm either not running magic at all, or I'm running enough magic that I have 4 or 5 dispel dice anyways - and if I can't take enough care of my dice to dispel the major threats, then I deserve to be punished for it.

In 2,000+ I normally run one - it's too large a game to risk going magic-free, and it's far more likely there'll be a high-cast spell which you need to dispel, and you can't risk either a double one or a simple failed dispel. But it is an emergency measure, and where possible I prefer a "specialist" scroll which is at least slightly more in keeping with the army.

I'll happily play magic heavy, magic light or somewhere in between, so I'm very flexible. Also, I play against a number of different armies and never tailor my list to the enemy, so I like to keep things varied to prevent my opponents (who do sometimes tailor) from getting too much of an advantage.

Draconian77
22-02-2009, 09:27
He takes whole regiments of mages in a 2000 point game, Kill-Freedom. I still can't figure out how he does it.

Well, as a starting point...

"Each head of this Hydra counts as a Lv2 mage.

From there you work your way down...the Sorceress is a mage...the Cold One she is riding is a mage...the Skink that the Cold One is digesting was a mage so lets add another dice for that because we can...

So far I have only had one objection and that was only caused by the opponents lack of knowledge concerning the Cold Ones metabolism."

Axis
22-02-2009, 11:20
I will have one at 2000 and an additional one for each 1000 points past 2000. I guess it is more of a maximum system since maybe a quarter of the time i only take one at 3000 anyway.

Powerstones don't have the same quota system. I just take as many as a i feel like.

Draconian77
22-02-2009, 12:07
Generally I take 1 at 1k and 2 at 2k if I'm playing with a magic light force.

When I play magic heavy I double the amount of scrolls.

This is because when I play magic heavy(With my Dark Elves) I run all the Sorceress' mounted on Dark Pegasii and magic missiles or psychology spells can really hurt these models. As a trade off, magic is one of the only things that can hurt these units as 4 castings of Chillwind and/or Word of Pain and 20" movement deals with the other two phases.

Guy Fawkes
22-02-2009, 15:22
I tend to find that additional dispel dice are generally more useful than additional scrolls, when I have the choice. If I'm running more than a single wizard, for example, I generally have a handful of dispel dice (and power dice to dispel RIP), and rarely find myself wanting for more, if I keep track of what spells are rolled, guess well at the bound items, and look at my opponent's power dice numbers.

Scrolls are really filler to me. If I take a Dark Elf Sorceress with the Darkstar Cloak, I have 25 points to spend anyways, and nothing better to spend it on. If I already have a scroll or two, I might use the points to buy a power stone, but I try not to leave too many points unspent on Wizards, because arcane items are so useful and being able to take them is worth quite a bit.

Draconian77
23-02-2009, 10:29
I think most people would prefer extra dice over scrolls, but army books generally include about 1 item that produces an extra Dispel Die so its not really a valid option.

Warlord Ghazak Gazhkull
24-02-2009, 14:59
I take up to three scrolls in games from 2250pts, combine that with 9dispell dice and not much spells are getting trough, please note this is my tourny build;).

Greetz
G

kramplarv
24-02-2009, 15:58
the thing with scrolls is that I think all chars should be able to have them.
Why? because there should be a way to defend against magic without having wizards.

magic are to powerful in the game, especially all those "move this, move that, you may not move, you got lesser ld" etc which are all to common, more scrolls for fighter characters will bring the game to a more balanced game i say. Oh, and the cost of 25 is quite silly, make it 30.

dsw1
24-02-2009, 15:59
It depends on the game, I have been known to take 8 scrolls in 2k if my magic items are pants and i'm facing some form of uber magic army. Normally I would deal with 5 or 6 though.

Keller
24-02-2009, 17:21
I rarely seem to take them. When I do, 1 at most for a 2k game.

fastcarfreak
24-02-2009, 19:53
In our groups games, taking at least 2 scrolls seems to be the right way to go about it. I think everyone uses a lot of magic lately.

madival
24-02-2009, 20:01
In 2k games, I run 2 corpsecarts with balefire and still run 2-3 scrolls depending on h ow much I hate my enemys magic.

Lord Dan
24-02-2009, 23:09
In 2k games, I run 2 corpsecarts with balefire and still run 2-3 scrolls depending on h ow much I hate my enemys magic.

Wow. That's just so heartless.

Jericho
24-02-2009, 23:27
I'm guessing 7DD as well?

vamp
24-02-2009, 23:45
Ghazak how in the world do you get nine dispel dice? What size game Are you playing?>

Lord Dan
25-02-2009, 00:15
9 dispel dice isn't as hard as you think. A 2,000 point Empire army with a wizard lord and 3 battle wizard is bringing 7, and considering that many armies have ways to boost their dispel pool the thought of tacking on 2 more isn't too unrealistic.

vamp
25-02-2009, 00:53
My army does not have any ways to boost dispel dice that I know of. I wish it did.

Jericho
25-02-2009, 05:13
Which army exactly?

Re: 9 in 2k it can be done by a couple armies. L4, 3xL2 and 2 items that give/steal/store dice will do it. Stuff like Familiars, Seal of Ghrond, Diadem, Staff of Sneaky Stealing, Mork's Spirit Totem... I'm sure there's more.

Lizards can be pushed to generate a ton of DD. Engine makes L2's count as L3 right? That means they could theoretically have 8DD generated by characters, 2 in the pool, and 2 from the Diadem for 12DD per phase total. There might even be other ways of getting DD that I don't know of yet (doubt it tho).

MarkC
25-02-2009, 05:27
In a Dwarf army with the Anvil of Doom you start with 7 dispel dice. 4 because you're Dwarfs, 2 for the Runelord and one for the Anvil. With this config I normally take a single dispel rune.

I'm taking the AoD for the movement affecting powers. Dwarfs only move 3 so I have to have something to counter that.

I actually enjoy the game most when the opponent has 9 or 10 power dice when I have 7 dispel dice. I prefer having to make decisions about what I try to dispel rather than just be able to dispel everything.

I have the dispel rune for those once off cases of a spell that I simply have to stop. Even when you have a handful of dice left, the chance of rolling double 1 becomes significant once you go to more than 4 dice.

Regards

Mark C

Devon Harmon
25-02-2009, 06:31
I don't take any. I try to rely on MR, extra dice, or a bonus to all dispel attempts. If I get burned with a little magic, so be it. To me it is part of the fun of the game.

My personal feeling is that dispell scrolls should cost 30 points, and only work on a dr of 2-6.

Jericho
25-02-2009, 07:24
That's a neat idea, adds a bit of randomness back to the phase.

Maetco
25-02-2009, 07:32
I play DoC, WoC and Dwarfs and in 2k games I usually have 0 - 2 scrolls depending on my enemy and the type of my own army. I think I have once taken 4 scrolls and few times 3. I also think that scrolls should cost a bit more. Even 26 would be better because then a hero couldn't take two and lord four.

nosferatu1001
26-02-2009, 11:23
I tend to have 1 or 2 at 2k - 2250, however my skyre skaven have none (L4 and 3 l2 equiv help :) ) and i like to take extra warpstone tokens to batter my spells through.

The DE army im playing around with at the momment (proxy a bit, in my head for some of it lol) has none, relying on powerstones galore - i dont htink DE would care too much about your puny magic, when they can cast theirs more effectively. Although druchii magic is a bit "meh" at times, i love having the little miss's flying about the place being a general nuisance :D

ROCKY
26-02-2009, 12:24
it really depends on the situation, most of the time i have 5DD and 2 scrolls but recently have been running 7DD and 2 scrolls. i find it that 2 is enough especially with MR and loads of DD. think of it this way against armies with 6 DD u basically can shut them down completely, same with 7 dd and against 8-10 they MAY pull off one spell. now if ur opponent has 12-16 or more u will be able to block half his spells thus u NEED more DD or scrolls. and dont forget its not only about resiliance, its about how fast u can destroy ur opponents strengths. in this case if hes packing major magic u MUST survive until u get to CC and then attempt to seize his advantage. NEVER play to try to adapt to someones strenght. play to his weakness and your strength.

Neknoh
26-02-2009, 12:28
In games of around 2k points? Where magic is either nonexistant or of such immense might there is no real stopping of it? Where my two level twos either get shut down or can quite happily do what they like?

I never take a single dispell scroll, not one, not two, not ten. I simply see no point in bringing them when the magic coming from the other end of the table will either be of such devastating might that they are burnt through in one turn, or where the magic on the opposing side will be of such piddling futile size that there is no point. I've got four dispell dice, it can stop that one big awesome spell if I prepare for it, and it can stop adequate ammounts of lesser awesomeness from armies that lack said awesomeness.

It gives me more room for items on my casters

ROCKY
26-02-2009, 12:35
In games of around 2k points? Where magic is either nonexistant or of such immense might there is no real stopping of it? Where my two level twos either get shut down or can quite happily do what they like?

I never take a single dispell scroll, not one, not two, not ten. I simply see no point in bringing them when the magic coming from the other end of the table will either be of such devastating might that they are burnt through in one turn, or where the magic on the opposing side will be of such piddling futile size that there is no point. I've got four dispell dice, it can stop that one big awesome spell if I prepare for it, and it can stop adequate ammounts of lesser awesomeness from armies that lack said awesomeness.

It gives me more room for items on my casters

well u could still have items AND scrolls: give one the book of secrets, and scroll, and give the other powerfamiliar and a scroll thats 8power dice and 4 DD as well as 2 scrolls. and btw nice seeingu again my old friend heheeh

Neknoh
26-02-2009, 12:42
the 25 points yoinked from my magical item allowance is not compatible with the tasks I put my mages to.

The current list I'm building is deviced with a level four undivided book carrier wielding the puppet and a useful item which I cannot remember at this time :p Not a scroll though

then two level two casters, one with a spell familliar and the Armour of Morrslieb, and one with the Enchanted Shield and the Blood of Tzeentch. One of these have the Third Eye, the other the Homonculus. These have the Mark of Tzeentch and are geared to actually being able to cast spells with higher casting values should I obtain said spells and need to cast them. I don't have room for them.

With two level twos, I am still not looking at 25 points free, besides, once a scroll is used, it wont protect you anymore, and many of the game-breakers can be cast on units engaged in combat, so that wont really protect you either.

theunwantedbeing
26-02-2009, 12:44
I don't take any usually.
Then again I take "middle of the road" magic levels (a level 4 and a level 2), so I like doing strange unusual things that make no sense :P

That and with no scroll caddies my opponents have a hard time figuring out where my points are and it makes them more likely to think there is an assasin hiding in one(or more) of the units.

I don't always take the ring of hotek....it get's in the way of my own magic users.

Neknoh
26-02-2009, 12:46
I don't take any usually.
Then again I take "middle of the road" magic levels (a level 4 and a level 2), so I like doing strange unusual things that make no sense :P

Good to see someone else thinking like that

Nerhesi
26-02-2009, 14:40
1000 - 1
2000 - 2
3000 - 4
4000 - 6
5000 - 8
etc ;) That is my guideline - then again, I may go for more than 10 at 6k... it really depends.

g0ddy
26-02-2009, 18:40
Archmage led Generic HE army : 1-2 scrolls
Movement/Combat DE army : (no wizards) zero scrolls
Generic Ghoul Vampire Army : zero scrolls

~ zilla

Dead Man Walking
26-02-2009, 22:39
With Lizzies I take 1 scroll. If I have points left over in the end I will take two.

With O & G I take 2 to 3.

With Dwarves I take 3 and lots of magic resistance. Mine are marchy and I have to shut down the magic phase to get bodies across the table alive to win.

With last edition slaanesh I used 3, as with a lord I had room and not so many good magic items to spend them on. I refuse to play WOC now because I have 1.5k mortals, 500 points Daemons and 250 points beastmen. I am not going to reward GW for splitting up my army by buying more models from them.

With High elves I take 1 on each of 2 mages.

Regardless what I field I spend them in the first half of the game as a dead mage with a dispel scroll is just as useful as a dead mage without a dispel scroll. :skull:

MordainThade
27-02-2009, 04:02
As a Daemon player, the number of "scrolls" I take is entirely proportional to the number of Bloodthirster(s) and Heralds of Tzeentch in my given army list :P

We usually play at the 3k level, and I find I take 1-2 with 50/50 on the Standard of Sundering if playing Tzeentch, 0-1 (rarely 1) and the Standard 90% of the time if Khorne with no Tzeentch, and obviously none with a near-100% chance for the Standard if non-Khorne + non-Tzeentch.

And for the record, I'd really, really like for the Spellbreakers to be a bit more common; if they were, then maybe that BSB + Sundering anti-magic "combo" would see a bit less use.

snyggejygge
27-02-2009, 09:21
In my games with my gaming group (1999 pts) I take one, my 3DD & single scroll isn't much of a defense though, so I try to get the Collar of Khorne somewhere too.

In tournament games (2250 pts) I usually bring a sorcerer lord with Staff of Sorcery & 2 Scrolls along with the Collar somewhere, this usually amounts to a decent magicprotection against everything but the most cheezy builds.

With my other armies I get a few more DD so I don't bring any scrolls in games with the group & only a single one in tournaments.

I prefer items that can give me extra DD, sadly most of my armies don't have such items...

samwise
01-03-2009, 13:34
One. For the nasty surprise.

I prefer to spend my points on more casty things, or things that have utility all the time. As a LM player, I'm lucky to have access to the diadem, and if running a slann, have the option of wizard-hate anyways. (50 points for discarding 6's on opposing wizard>>2 scrolls) and have never been a fan of one use style effects.

Under 200o points I might run with none, as the magic coming my way isn't going to be that crippling, saving my dd for the nasty spell coming my way, and just take a few magic missiles here and there.