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View Full Version : What I believe to be the very first Lizardman Whine!



Kyte
21-02-2009, 15:07
WTF? OMG! The New Lizardmen are soooo overpowered, it's so unfair, they'll always win, they're impossible to beat, and I'll burn all my models and never play a game of WFB again!!!!111!!!!one!!!!!

No seriously. I had a game earlier today using the new Lizardmen against a Wood Elf Army.

We played at 2500 points, and the lists looked somewhat like this:

I had:

Oldblood on Carnie with Blade of realities (pass one unmodified LD-test for every hit or die with no protection allowed), Light Armour and Enchanted Shield.

Priest on Engine of the Gods with extra spell

Nike Saurus with Jag Charm (Bound lvl 5 steed of shadows cast on self), LA, Shield and Great Weapon

2x10 Skink skirmishers

2x 12 Saurus Warriors with Full Command, Shields and Spears

2x 6 Cold One Knights with Full Command, Shields and Spears

2 Standard Stegadons with bolt throwers

He Had

Wardancer Lord

Lvl1 BranchWraith

Spellsinger caddy on horse

2x10 Glade Guard Archers

2x10 Dryads

2x5 Glade Riders with Musicians

3 Treekin

5 Warhawks

10 Wardancers

2 Treemen
__________________________________________________ _____________

The Armies were deployed like this:

----------------------------------------------------------------- Nike Saurus-----------------------------------------------
----------Skinks---Saurus---Cold Ones---Stegadon---Carnie---Engine---Stegadon---Cold Ones---Saurus---Skinks



-----Dryads-------Cavalry+Mage-------Treeman---Treekin---Wardancers+Lord---Treeman
------------Dryads+Wraith----------------------Warhawks-------------------Cavalry

Or something like that

On turn 1, I marched forward with my monster-horde, not taking a single wound from shooting due to the ward save provided by the engine. My Bolt throwers poisoned the treeman taking away 2 wounds.

On turn 2, My first cavalry unit charged the treekin, My first stegadon had charged a treeman, my lord had charged the unit of wardancers with his lord, backed up by the nikesaurus, my engine and other steg had charged the other treeman in the front, while the other cavalry unit had the treeman in the flank.

Without particularly lucky rolling, All he had left after the combat phase was a Treeman with 1 wound, 2 wardancers and 1,333 treekin.

All I had lost was 2 wounds on a normal steg, and 2 cold one knights.

Then he gave up, as his one cavalry unit with the singer was getting eaten by skinks, and his dryads wouldn't be worth a lot.

I must say that the engine is close to overpowered. The burning allignment killed a lot of wardancers and even wounded a treeman.
Blade of realities took care of a LD10 Lord after 3 tests, and the carnie chewed through wardancers with ease. Treemen are easy enough to kill, if you stegabomb them.

It wasn't even fun to play, and a Slann would have been even more boring, Methinks. What would you think?

Thanks

- Kyte

Foegnasher
21-02-2009, 22:54
WTF? OMG! The New Lizardmen are soooo overpowered, it's so unfair, they'll always win, they're impossible to beat, and I'll burn all my models and never play a game of WFB again!!!!111!!!!one!!!!!

No seriously. I had a game earlier today using the new Lizardmen against a Wood Elf Army.

We played at 2500 points, and the lists looked somewhat like this:

I had:

Oldblood on Carnie with Blade of realities (pass one unmodified LD-test for every hit or die with no protection allowed), Light Armour and Enchanted Shield.

Priest on Engine of the Gods with extra spell

Nike Saurus with Jag Charm (Bound lvl 5 steed of shadows cast on self), LA, Shield and Great Weapon

2x10 Skink skirmishers

2x 12 Saurus Warriors with Full Command, Shields and Spears

2x 6 Cold One Knights with Full Command, Shields and Spears

2 Standard Stegadons with bolt throwers

He Had

Wardancer Lord

Lvl1 BranchWraith

Spellsinger caddy on horse

2x10 Glade Guard Archers

2x10 Dryads

2x5 Glade Riders with Musicians

3 Treekin

5 Warhawks

10 Wardancers

2 Treemen
__________________________________________________ _____________

The Armies were deployed like this:

----------------------------------------------------------------- Nike Saurus-----------------------------------------------
----------Skinks---Saurus---Cold Ones---Stegadon---Carnie---Engine---Stegadon---Cold Ones---Saurus---Skinks



-----Dryads-------Cavalry+Mage-------Treeman---Treekin---Wardancers+Lord---Treeman
------------Dryads+Wraith----------------------Warhawks-------------------Cavalry

Or something like that

On turn 1, I marched forward with my monster-horde, not taking a single wound from shooting due to the ward save provided by the engine. My Bolt throwers poisoned the treeman taking away 2 wounds.

On turn 2, My first cavalry unit charged the treekin, My first stegadon had charged a treeman, my lord had charged the unit of wardancers with his lord, backed up by the nikesaurus, my engine and other steg had charged the other treeman in the front, while the other cavalry unit had the treeman in the flank.

Without particularly lucky rolling, All he had left after the combat phase was a Treeman with 1 wound, 2 wardancers and 1,333 treekin.

All I had lost was 2 wounds on a normal steg, and 2 cold one knights.

Then he gave up, as his one cavalry unit with the singer was getting eaten by skinks, and his dryads wouldn't be worth a lot.

I must say that the engine is close to overpowered. The burning allignment killed a lot of wardancers and even wounded a treeman.
Blade of realities took care of a LD10 Lord after 3 tests, and the carnie chewed through wardancers with ease. Treemen are easy enough to kill, if you stegabomb them.

It wasn't even fun to play, and a Slann would have been even more boring, Methinks. What would you think?

Thanks

- Kyte


the saurus oldblood on the carnifex with the B.o.R. is the new Bloodthirster, that thing is sick.

oth, you were killing pansey wood elves, so maybe not the best choice, your list is hard, 4 terror causers is a bit much. steggies are cool, but if you are bringing more than two, it smells a bit of gouda, imho.

good game though.

neXus6
21-02-2009, 23:40
I don't really know how to react...I've always seen Dual treeman as a bit over the top...but seriously 3 stegs and a carni and you playing with almost minimum core.

You're army isn't exactly built to win friends but the guys Wood Elf army and tactics needs a lot of work. A fair few of his units are far from the best sizes, the army looks like it will count on the treemen far too much and can't really support itself. And that deployment it's just all over the place.

Not much of a surprise your army battered his really.

Neckutter
22-02-2009, 04:02
EotG steg is the powerhouse. i played my first game today against it, and it cleaned my clock. it didnt even charge into combat much. it just got into position near where all the combats were happening and BOOM. no more DE. :)

nice pwnage surgency. :)

a note on your list. i dont think it is too min/maxed. you have 2 ok units of saurus, and 20 skinks. maybe if you dropped one unit of sarus, he could have cried. but as it is, it isnt too beardy.

blackjack
22-02-2009, 15:35
EotG steg is the powerhouse. i played my first game today against it, and it cleaned my clock. it didnt even charge into combat much. it just got into position near where all the combats were happening and BOOM. no more DE.

nice pwnage surgency.

Wow wish I could get that kind of result with my EOTG. It usually gets a turn or two with a 7 inch range area effect attack that kills maybe 3 enemy models in one unit per turn. Then the EOTG gets charged, priest dies and the engine grinds in combat for a few turns. Hardly worth 405pts....

Roxors45
22-02-2009, 16:15
The key with the engine is to reign in your desire to want to charge, cause impact hits, and Burning Alignment the beejesus out of everything. The priest is a fairly weak (in that its low WS and Toughness) model and shouldn't be subject to extended combats. Or frontal charges. There's not much worry in the ancient, because of high T, W and stubborn so they can stick it up, but make sure you got your fill of the engine (and priest) before charging in.

How many PD does the opponent still have? Is there's a character B-lining for your priest? Is there still a lot of shooting?

I know it can hard to not just run up and run into their main line, but the Engine Steg is really reserved for magic offense/defense and flank attacks or to support a unit of saurus already in combat. I only (if I can help it) charge my Engine in combat when my saurus are holding up a unit with sword and board or my TG has engaged.

Feefait
22-02-2009, 23:47
Well the issue I think is that the list was not a good Wood Elf list for what you brought. And he was facing a lot of unseen stuff. I don't know how with We he gave up so many charges on turn 2, but would like to know.

The issue is We don't seem a good fit to fight lizardmen. Too many high toughness, fast movers and AoE from thing slike the Engine. I played a game against De my first run with the new list and that Engine was unstoppable. He had to throw so much at it to HOPE to hurt t6 5 w that everything else went untouched. And getting into combat with impact hits and US10 is ungodly.

Your opponent needs to just calm down and reformat I think though. It seems like this is something we will see a lot from LM. MOre missle fire and more magic and you'd have a harder time.

championofkhorne
07-05-2009, 07:22
I've never lost against the lizardmen, I play as the WoC.

I will admit that I do tend to powergame when it comes to them, my knights and Cannon tend to clean out any big engines because a S5(10 if im lucky) is pretty good.

anything else is ripped apart by my awesome warriors.

Fear is almost useless agaisnt them... They get 2 attacks, scaly skin and spears. Not to mention their awesome magic. They are a pretty big menace to my destroying the world.

Also, Wood Elves are Hippie Wusses, they couldnt kill a 14 year old girl that lived in the chaos wastes, so its no surprise the couldnt kill the lizardmen.

(I'm just busting WE players dont get mad its just cuz I'm chaos I hate everyone :P )

Staurikosaurus
07-05-2009, 08:32
Live in Ontario? I'd be happy to give you your first loss from Lizardmen :angel:

PeG
07-05-2009, 17:49
what about terrain? If you played an open board with these armies WE have no chance at all to survive but throw in a few woods and some other terrain features that the stegs doesnt want to go into and it would be a different game.
I have played WE a few games against Lizards and I rarely get charged by anything. When they try I usually run away.
Also bringing a couple of standard WE hero or lord builds would have helped. I have found that 3D6 S4 arrows hitting on 2+ in long range + S3 shooting from glade guards usually makes some damage also on engine stegs. The ward save is good but unless yo are really lucky its not that good.

championofkhorne
07-05-2009, 18:29
Live in Ontario? I'd be happy to give you your first loss from Lizardmen :angel:

I live in Tampa, FL, US. so yeah :P