PDA

View Full Version : The Journal of Aethric the Withered (lizards)



Kerill
28-02-2009, 19:10
Posted in right place this time ;)

Well I've bought a lizardmen army but they will be chaos themed and led by a Sorceror of Tzeentch. Being converted and glued now and will have their first battle this week. For now here's the fluff and the list I plan to try:

The journal of Aethric the withered.

2276 From the auguries I have cast for the last 50 years, the most auspicious time to strike has finally come. With the bloated slann occupied with the great war in the north now is the time to strike Goqhui. Hidden deep in the southlands, east of the great mountains. My guard now take to their ships from the southern wastes, the time has come!

2277 We have made landfall, despite the massive influx of magic energy it has proven difficult to ward my force from prying magic but despite a few strikes the barriers have held. We are approaching the city now, my forces will attack towards the temple of the sun in the east of the city whilst I will cloak myself with magic and head directly to the great pyramid at the centre.

From this point forward the journal is written in a far more crabbed, spidery hand.

Ahhh, the pain! It courses through me. I reached the pyramid under cover of magic and diversion and launched a bolt of writhing change at the slann, somehow the creature managed to deflect most of the magic. We dueled with mighty forces, I have dueled many a mage in preparation for this, yet it’s thought and magic was so different from anything I have encountered. The raw energy of chaos filling the skies was all that allowed me to defeat the creature, yet not without cost. It managed to strike me with a cold white fire that blasted my flesh and seared my bones. Were it not for the aid of the great Changer I surely would have perished. My warband has been cut to pieces, fallen to the last, yet they served their purpose. I have sealed the pyramid with magic and none of the lizard creatures has sought to break through the barrier, strange but I am glad for the relief, my powers are barely a dim glow at present.

2278 The treasures! The potency of the relics of the slann is now mine, whilst I have still not discerned the use of some my arcane powers have greatly increased, even though my body has not recovered. Running or even walking for a long time brings pain and even unconsiousness. I have been forced to summon a sky shark to allow me to move around more easily. I have learned the language of the slann through a daemonic pact and have studied the lizard creatures here. It seems without their bloated toad they lack purpose and will, in 6 month none have attempted to attack the pyramid, they are a race of slaves, now I must discover how to bend them to my will.

2280 At last, success! I have managed to imprint my will upon them, they follow me now as they did their slann master, obedient and useful. A race designed to follow unquestionably, once they have been imprinted once it seems they follow blindly from then on. All that remains is to continue research into their spawning, that I might create a larger force.

2284 By adding warpstone into the spawning pools and researching further the slann archives I have managed to spawn both skink and saurus although one of the saurus pools, to which I had introduced the most warpstone, has produced mostly mutated things that squirm and flop and resemble miniature chaos spawn more than anything else. Apart from these however another kind of saurus has spawned. These have thicker skin than any of those from the other pools, and many clearly bear the taint of chaos. They are also more aggressive and more loyal than the others, from these I will form an elite guard. I will not further taint the remaining pools however, I need numbers to form an army. The kroxigor pools have as yet failed to spawn anything, I may need to add more warpstone.

2286 I have decided to mimic the forces of the lizardmen as far as possible, relying on their inbred proclivities to maximize their effeciveness. However a new frustration has appeared, despite being able to subjugate the wills of the great lizard beasts of the jungle easily they cannot be imprinted like the lizardmen and I cannot control too many beasts at the same time, certainly not whilst using other magic. Some other way must be found. The Kroxigor have still failed to breed despite the increase in warpstone in the spawning pool. I have summoned a lesser daemon of change and bound it to the pit in the hopes that the essence of change can stir life.

2292 At last, success with the Kroxigor, although I think perhaps it is no longer appropriate to think of them in those terms. The creatures that have been spawned bear only a little resemblance to Kroxigor spawned by the slann. These ones I have created bear the mark of Lord Tzeentch in many ways, their heads are often very avian in nature and many of them have a disc-like lower body that floats above the ground rather than legs, a strange disc-ogre. They are also much more cunning and intelligent than the dumb brutes of the slann, a further sign of Tzeentch’s will. Their disc nature suggests a solution to another problem, hmmm

2293 My attempts to allow skinks to ride sky sharks to battle has failed. Not only does contact with the daemons cause the skinks great pain, they also sicken and die within days or weeks, there must be a way around this! A further cause for concern is that one of the skink pools has only brought forward a single spawning that has not yet hatched. The other pools are spawning normally, but this is a cause for concern if it should spread.

2293 Ahh, understanding comes, when the skink was finally hatched it bore the marks of one of the lesser sorcerers of the lizards. It’s first action was to attempt to strike me down with a bolt of lightning. Amazing that these things can wield magic even from birth! I tried and failed to imprint it for many days and was forced to annihilate the creature as the other skinks were becoming restive and less obedient when near it.

2303 The great war in the North ended and the slann struck at my wards with incredible force and they were shattered, I was forced to transfer my essence to the warp to avoid their attack. I have now created wards of incredible power around he city using the lizardmen artifacts, monoliths and my own magic. Nevertheless my presence here is no longer a secret, they are certain to launch an attack with their forces here, and I must prepare for war.

2304 My skink scouts brought word of a large force of lizardmen marching across the great mountains towards my city. Scrying has shown me they are led by a saurus of incredible age, initial skirmishes have show that this creature fights with a power and ferocity that outmatches even my chaos touched bodyguard and bears a weapon of power that might even be able to penetrate the warding runes of my armour. My army is also much smaller in size and lacks the 3 huge terror lizards that this “oldblood” brings with it into battle, this will be a true test of my worthiness in the eyes of Tzeentch.

2304 The battle is over, and won, albeit at incredible cost. I led my host to battle in the plains before the city, which almost proved my undoing. As I marched my bodyguard into position they smaller flying terror-lizards with skink riders appeared in the skies above and rained rocks upon us. I lost fully half the bodyguard before finally blasting them from the skies with magic. The plains also allowed the giant horned terror-lizards and their skink crew together with the smaller horned ones, a species similar to the cold ones that dark elves ride, to use their speed to hammer through my lines. Two whole regiments of saurus were cut down by them before one of the giant creatures were brought down by the poisoned throwing spears of skinks. A second was brought down by a mixture of poison and magic, the final one however ploughed through the lines and charged my bodyguard. Many were trampled or gored to death by the great beast and I was forced to summon a gateway to the realm of chaos to deal with the beast before my bodyguard was utterly destroyed. This feat drained me for much of the battle and whilst a regiment of spear-armed saurus managed to defeat the horned one cavalry my forces were still overmatched. The “oldblood” and his retinue broke through the line, the creature even butchering one of my disc-ogres, and advanced against my bodyguard. Whilst my bodyguard were stronger than the other saurus the oldblood with his magic blade was cutting through the press towards me, it was only my reserve disc-ogres charging in from behind that managed to kill him. After his death many of the opposing force lost heart and I used magic to trick and confuse the creatures into attacking one another, eventually they broke and were fled but my forces were too exhausted or slow to be able to hunt them down, of my bodyguard unit only two remain alive, one I have named Dhaak Fhor, the other Kwhar-tzu, one will lead my bodyguard once it is restored, the other I intend to groom for leading raiding forces and armies and I have granted him the enchanted weapon of the old-blood. There is no doubt that my forces, for all their ferocity are tactically inferior to those of the lizardmen, infantry alone cannot carry the day and I must find some way to neutralize my opponents advantage. Today magic turned the tide, yet if a slann had been present there is no doubt my army would have been defeated. As it is my army is decimated and it will take me a long time to rebuild them to their former level.

2330 I have finally discovered a way to allow the skinks to ride the sky-sharks without dying, by forcing the creatures to wear warpstone amulets of increasing size after spawning they have become inured to the forces of chaos. More than half still die during the process, but the remainder are able to ride sky sharks successfully and I am confident the speed and manoueverability of the discs is far superior to that of a clumsy flying dinosaur brute. Skinks have also found a clutch of 5 terror-lizard eggs (and dealt with the terror-lizard who had laid them), I must find a way to use them.

Kerill
28-02-2009, 19:14
2348 Once again warpstone has proved the key, by injecting warpstone powder into the eggs, when they hatch they are far more chaotic but also are sufficiently intelligent to be trained. Of three eggs not wasted in experiments, three bore fruit, but one of the creatures was so mindlessly aggressive I was forced to put it down. The remaining two are hexapedal and whilst they lack the tough scales of the terror-beasts their skin is harder than iron. As of yet they are still far too small to bear a howdah but if they continue to grow they will be a force to be reckoned with.

2360 Raiding and scouting forces of lizardmen have continued to intrude upon my territory, most of which I have had a comfortable advantage of numbers over. For the last engagement I allowed Kwhar-tzu to command the engagement and was impressed with his performance, it seems I have chosen well. My elite bodyguard grows slowly, currently less than a score have been spawned, and the spawning of saurus seems much slower than that of the skinks despite my effort. The warriors lost in the first battle are proving difficult to replace quickly. The disk riders have proven very useful for keeping watch over my territories and have proven useful also in battle, the spawnbeasts from the terror-beast eggs continue to grow and are now taller and more massive even than my disc-ogres.

2365 From my scrying I have managed to locate the existing lizardmen cities in the southlands, although I am unable to penetrate the city wards. My main threats appear to be to the West from a city named Zlatlan and to the north where there is a city named Teotiqua. Not only do both cities regularly send forces to raid my territory, I am unable to move against one city without opening myself entirely to the forces of the other. At present it is an awkward stalemate and if both cities were to move against me at once in force I would be crushed. I must hope that the destruction of the forces of Zlatlan sent at me sixty years ago will have weakened the city enough to prevent this from happening, meanwhile I am bending my scrying to prevent a surprise attack from either quarter.

2380 Ahh, foolishness indeed, little did I think of an attack from the south, yet it was from there that I came. The warband of Krong the bloody landed a fleet upon my shores and it was only through a disc-rider patrol that I was able to prepare for it. Krong himself rode forth on his mighty daemon steed to demand I surrender. I immolated the fool for his presumption and gave his forces a similar ultimatum- join me or die. Many stayed loyal to their weak war god and were cut down by my forces, some, however, have joined me and now I have a fleet of warships although I lack crew. Even better there was a smith amongst the survivors and he is crafting better weapons and armour for my bodyguard, whilst I am enscribing the armour plates with runes of protection. In truth I was growing weary of enslaved skinks for company and may have been going slowly insane, it is good to have human followers again, although I must be aware that they can not be imprinted to serve like my skinks or saurus.

2367 I sent my raiders south and augmented the crew with skinks. Strangely although naturally aquatic they are unable to swim the seas well, the salt in the water appear to burn through their breathing membranes and even those who stay aboard ship seem to have ill effects. They also grow torpid in cold weather and all in all skink crew seems to have been a failed idea. Nevertheless raids have brought more slaves and livestock and women for breeding. They also managed to capture some firewyrms which the skinks have proved adept and prodding into combat and to release their flames. The last raid also saw a fellow sorcerer of Tzeentch,Menlath, join my followers, and although of lesser power than myself, he will doubtless be a useful tool. Menlath has proven adept at managing and commanding the marauder encampment, and I am well pleased so far.

2380 Another of the skink magic users was spawned and this time, with the aid of Menlath managed to imprint it. Galling though it is, it was Menlath who ascertained that the telepathic link between the skink and the nearest slann is what prevented imprinting it. By severing the link it can be imprinted, although apparently this also permanently breaks the skink’s ability to use its telepathy. Perhaps now with a force of magic I can finally move out of my disadvantageous stalemate.

2381 Treachery! Menlath and the skink mage attempted to destroy me whilst I was scrying. Fools to even try! With my magic might and the artifacts in my possession the two combined were unable to defeat me. I may be withered in body but not in mind or power! Menlath had also suborned a large part of my human forces and used them to attack the pyramid. They were cut down by the disc-ogres before they reached the top. I have lost both followers with sorcerous talent and almost half my marauders. Still should another magic user be hatched I know now how to bend the creature to my will, and I know also that their telepathy is not destroyed by doing so. My spawn beasts are finally big enough to carry a howdah and have been trained to obey both myself and the skink crew the search for more terror-beast eggs continues but none have yet been found. Still Menlath has taught me a lesson, by retreating to my sanctum of magic and divorcing myself from what was happening around me I had become almost slann-like.

2390 The attack I had been dreading finally came, both cities sent forces to attack me and I was forced to split my army, the larger slower force being sent with Kwhar-tzu to deal with the lizardmen from Goqhui whilst I took the faster forces west to deal with those from Zlatlan. Mindful of my previous mistakes I used the jungle, poison and magic to wear my opponents forces down before engaging and defeating them, the spawn beasts and disc ogres proving too powerful on the battlefield. I planned to march on Zlatlan and attempt to sack it to finally gain the upper hand. Unfortunately my the force led by Kwhar Tzu was soundly beaten and broken, mostly by the unopposed magic of the skink astromancers who summoned a rain of comets upon the army. I was forced to turn back and deal with them although they retreated before my combined forces and returned to their city. Once again I have won and lost, although I have punished Kwhar Tzu I know the lack of magical defence for his force was the real problem.

2450 The bloody stalemate continues with the cities and raids from the south by marauder tribes have also increased. One was defeated in a decisive naval engagement, the other was defeated on the shores and more slaves were taken. Finally a new skink mage (who I have named Vilreth) has been spawned and by blocking it’s telepathy I was able to imprint it. With my now three-way war he may prove vital. I have managed to get the skinks to tame some of the smaller lizard beasts in the jungle for the saurus to ride, progress is slow but these “cold ones” should prove useful.

2462 Another clutch of Terror-beast eggs has been found, Vilreth’s power have grown, although he seems limited to Azyr and is unable to make use of dark magic. I am slowly gaining the upper hand and the southern shores have beaten off many warbands for little losses. My fleet is harrying the coastline near Goqhui to keep the city occupied. My forces have swelled to the point that I can now field two armies with a balance of troops.

2463 The terror beast eggs have hatched, this time with three surviving spawn-beasts, although it will take time they will be a vital addition to my forces.

2490 There has been a lull in engagements these last few years with fewer lizardmen incursions into my territory although any attempts I have made into theirs have been repulsed with heavy losses. Saurus are still too few for my needs and I have been training the skinks and disc-ogres to fight together, early results seem promising since they mesh together well, still I would prefer the more reliable saurus regiments and have to hope that the lizardmen cities are having the same troubles I am having with their creation.

2499 Two more skink mages have been spawned and imprinted and also a strange white skink that I was forced to destroy since it seemed to affect the other skinks in the same way as the first mage that was spawned, even though it had no magical ability I could discern.

2521 The stalemate may well be over, my raiding fleet was attacked by a slann from Goqhui, four ships burned to the water in the face of his magic and the remaining three limped home and will take weeks to repair. More and more scouts of the enemy are attempting to enter my lands and one skink disc rider patrol was blasted from the sky by lightning bolts, there can be no doubt that this war will remain cold no longer. A stranger has appeared in my lands, who also claims to worship lord Tzeentch, I will watch him carefully, perhaps the Great Changer wishes to aid me, but doubtless there are deeper schemes afoot.

The list:

Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, The draining amulet, 2 power stones, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery.
(Slann mage priest with 2 power stones, cube of darkness, bane head, bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, drain magic, know all spells)
-480
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG)
-405

CORE:
18 Saurus, spears, standard, musician 234
10 skink cohort 50
11 skink cohort, krox, musician 116 (just to try it out)
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70

SPECIAL
3 Disk riders 90 (terradons)
3 Disk riders 90 (terradons)
16 Warp Tainted Black Saurus, standard, champion 284 (Temple guard)
6 Saurus Cavalry 210

RARE
Firewyrm (salamander) 75
Firewyrm (salamander) 75

Total: 2250
PD: 9 base
DD: 6

First game tomorrow hopefully :)

selone
28-02-2009, 19:32
Interesting background you've got there, nice work, have you had a chance to do much painting yet? Gl with your first game.

ScalySkin
28-02-2009, 22:01
Great background, I look forward to seeing pictures of the army and battle reports from your first battle. Good luck.

Kerill
01-03-2009, 15:17
Well, I went to the store today to find no players and that the owner has gone away for a month so my eager army of lizards and their even eager owner didn't get a chance for a first test. Bum.

No painting done yet, still not finished converting everything although if anyone wants to see I'll pop them up, don't get your expectations too high though ;)

blackjack
02-03-2009, 19:42
What is the "drain magic" slann ability? I play Lizards and can't seem to place it.

Malorian
02-03-2009, 19:44
What is the "drain magic" slann ability? I play Lizards and can't seem to place it.

It's an ability the slann had in their last rule book. It's not in the new one.

I assume he is talking about the new taking away 6's power.

Kerill
03-03-2009, 05:48
I am indeed.

g0ddy
03-03-2009, 16:48
Pictures! it all sounds fantastic!

~ zilla

Kerill
05-03-2009, 08:42
Pictures! it all sounds fantastic!

~ zilla

Certainly, nothing is finished yet though but you can see the more chaotic bits here (the lesser lizards won't be mutated much since it doesn't go with the fluff)

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/DSC02134.jpg

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/DSC02135.jpg

In the front row you can see Aethric (unpainted as yet converted to carry a Tzeentch standard in the horror arm), 2 salamanders/razordons (converted from chaos spawn) and Kwhar-tzu the scar vet (5th edition plastic chaos warrior- since they have a similar hunched posture as saurus-with a saurus head and greenstuff tail) in the first row.

Second row are the disk riding skinks (terradons) and in the back you can see the engine of the gods (warpstone brazier isn't very big) and the disc rider who will represent Aethric until he gets painted.

All very WIP atm.

selone
05-03-2009, 09:28
it's getting there , keep us updated :D

Kerill
08-03-2009, 04:52
The battles begin!

Well I went to the store today where two players were playing a game of 40K apocalypse, Sun and Luke (apparently 3 other players failed to show), after their game I convinced Sun to crack out his bretonnians for a game of warhammer so I could actually use my lizards. He didn’t have all his army there so I suggested 1500 points, after adding up his roster though he only had 1316 points so I cut things from my army to make it equal. Since Sun if from Singapore and Luke is from the UK today’s games were carried out in English for a change (I live in China and my Chinese struggles a bit in some games  ). Both are true gentleman and Sun had beaten me in a tournament about a year before but had apparently hardly played at all since then. Luke is a 40K player and was hoping to recruit me for 40K whilst I tried to recruit him to play warhammer and he played the second game against me so I got two battles in today with the following lists:


His army (fairly soft, he always goes peasant heavy with two big buses in larger battles and usually uses a detachment style with each bus having a detachment of men at arms and skirmishing archers, works quite well):

Paladin, general, morning star, heavy armour, helm of +1AS and re-rollable armour saves
Damsel, horse, 2 scrolls
Paladin bsb, virtue of +1CR and conquerors tapestry

8 knights of the realm, FC, warbanner
trebuchet
10 archers
10 skirmishing archers
7/8 squires
grail reliquae and 16 guards
24 men at arms, halberds and shields

Total: 1316 points

Mine:

Khwar-Tzu (scar vet), chaos armour, firestorm blade (enchanted shield, burning blade, light armour )
Dhaak Fhor (Scar vet), bsb, GW, shield, light armour
Vilreth, spell familiar, spawn beast, warpstone brazier (Level 2 skink priest on engine of the gods, plaque of tepoc)
16 saurus with spears, FC (2 ranks of 6, one of 5 with bsb)
10 skink skirmishers
11 skink skirmishers
3 terradons
10 warp-tainted saurus (temple guard)
Salamander hunting pack

Total: 1316 points

Fluff:

2521 A large bretonnian warship, heavily damaged by storms beached on the shores near my city, I suspect it was blown off a course from Ulthuan and forced down the coast by the current although I am certainly not discounting the possibility that the Slann of the southlands may have directed its course to my shores rather than theirs. They have quite a large retinue of knights and men at arms that I am sure I could crush if I use all my forces but I fear to move my army from the Northwest of the city for fear the lizardmen of Zlatlan are waiting for an opportunity to strike at the city if my forces are distracted. The peasants are building crude war machines which is unusual and suggests that the bretonnians may be planning an incursion or at the least will be staying for some time- repairs to their ship alone could take months. So I have sent Khwar Tzu, Dhaak For and Vilreth with a smaller force to deal with the bretonnians or at least cause enough damage that they will not seek to move further into my territory. I can only hope that Khwar Tzu Tzu will not fail me this time.
….
It seems Khwar Tzu has launched a feint with some saurus cavalry and almost a third of the bretonnian force is chasing them through the jungle that is their home, the remaining force is going to be attacked by majority of Khwar Tzu’s army, and the forces are roughly equal in number, I will watch this battle with interest.

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/deploymentbattle1.jpg

Salamander and handlers- red
skink skirmishers- light blue
Temple guard (with general) black
Saurus spears (with bsb ) blue
Stegadon- green
Terradons- orange

His army:

Grail reliquae- red
Knights with bsb- pink
Men at arms with general- blue
Trebuchet- black
Squires- brown
archers- browny green

He got bears anger, I got comet, portent and 6+ lightning
Brets prayed

Lizardmen turn 1

Everything moved up full tilt except the engine which, skinks and salamanders entering the respective forests and terradons flying into the left hand forest.
Magic: comet was scrolled, portent was dispelled, the priest went for the 5+ ward save alignment.

Brets turn 1

They moved up cautiously, about 8 inches so they were out of charge range of everything. The squires swept wide around the forest on my right.
Shooting managed to hurt a terradon and killed a saurus spearman. The squires shot a skink handler. The trebuchet scattered off target but killed three temple guard (1 was saved by the engine). Magic (bears anger on general) was dispelled and was dispelled every turn. Burning alignment went off with 7” and the knights and men at arms were both just in range, 2 men at arms and 4 knights fell (result!)

Lizzie turn 2

Salamanders fly over the archers and drop rocks killing 5 (pass panic) but with LOS to charge the trebuchet next round. Temple guard with general moved up full speed to prevent the knights charging the spear saurus. Spear saurus moved up more cautiously and the engine of the gods moved to get a flank charge if the temple guard were charged. The salamander moved up on the right and tried to flame the reliquae but overshot and only killed a few (passed panic). The terradons shot the archers but missed and the skinks on the left moved up so they would be able to move and shoot the archers next round. The right hand skinks moved out of the way to allow the spear saurus to advance. Magic was again dispelled or useless.

Bret turn 2

His unit of men at arms and knights charge the stegadon (both pass terror), grail reliquae charged the temple guard to prevent a flank charge from them on the knights. The squires moved around the forest to be in position for a rear charge on my army. Shooting saw the trebuchet scatter and other shooting did little apart from kill a skink or two. In combat the engine of the gods priest declared a challenge and the general accepted and put a wound on the shaman for none in return. The stegadon passed its stubborn test on the re-roll. The grail reliquae failed to do any damage to the temple guard and lost 4 men in return but won due to the musician (he forgot his hatred re-rolls though) stubborn test was again passed on the re-roll.

Lizzie turn 3

The terradons charge the trebuchet at the back. The saurus spears charge the grail reliquae (but only the bsb can get in combat and I forgot to use their spears). Left hand skinks move up to shoot the archers and the right hand skinks and salamanders move back to my side of the forest to counter the squires. Magic was again dispelled (second scroll used) burning alignment rolled 3” and killed a couple of men at arms, 1 knight and put a wound on the bsb. It was short of the reliquae. In shooting the salamander ate it’s remaining two handlers, failed the ld test but then rolled a 6 on the monster reaction chart. The skinks managed to fell 3 of the squires with double-shotted blowpiping and they panicked and fled. The other skinks managed to kill the remaining archers. In combat the skink priest died and the stegadon failed to wound the general again. Stubborn test was passed again. The terradons killed three crew but suffered a wound in return killing a terradon. The terradons then spiked the machine and the crewman ran home. The grail reliquae continued to get chopped to pieces.

Bret Turn 4

The squires rallied, in magic he failed to cast bears anger and shooting saw a couple more skinks fall. The stegadon was unharmed in the following combat and passed it’s stubborn test again. The grail reliquae was finally destroyed.

Lizzies Turn 5

The temple guard with general charged the flank of the knights, the right hand skinks moved to give the squires another taste of poison whilst the left hand skinks moved into a position to rear charge/crossfire the men at arms and the terradons moved to support them. The salamander went after the archers in the forest and managed to kill one with its breath attack (passed panic). The skinks killed all but 1 on the squires who panicked again and fled. In combat the knights were wiped out along with the bsb and the men at arms fled and were crossfired (I think the stegadon managed to actually do something this round and killed the general as well).

He conceded at this point I think.

Fluff:

As dusk was descending the other third of the bretonnian army returned from chasing the saurus cavalry and were positioned on the flank of Khwar-Tzu’s army and he was forced to retreat from the shore to the jungle to prevent the army being overwhelmed from the flank. Both sides collected their dead and wounded during the knight and it seems the enemy lord survived the battle and was healed by a bitch slave of the weak elf the bretonnians worship. The bretonnians show no sign of wishing to leave these shores and so Khwar-Tzu will once again face them in battle, once more the forces are even but this time the element of surprise is lost.

Second battle was using exactly the same lists. He got bears anger, I got second sign, portent and 6+ lightning


Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/deploymentbattle2.jpg

- so fairly similar although trebuchet was much safer this time since I elected to send my terradons after the squires to prevent any redirecting.

Salamander and handlers- red
skink skirmishers- light blue
Temple guard (with general) black
Saurus spears (with bsb ) blue
Stegadon- green
Terradons- orange

His army:

Grail reliquae- red
Knights with bsb- pink
Men at arms with general- blue
Trebuchet- black
Squires- brown
archers- browny green

Lizzies turn 1

I move up similarly to the last game, magic is useless or dispelled, again I go for the 5+ ward alignment. The terradons fly over the squires to in front of the archers and roll tremendously, destroying the entire unit (reliquae passes panic test). Terradons kill 1 archer with their shooting.

Brets 1

He moves up cautiously again, this time hoping to get a charge on the saurus spears who would probably fold under the attacks and CR. The trebuchet hits the temple guard and kills 3 or 4 of them and one saurus spear. The general is hit, fails his look out sir but is not wounded (rolled a 3, thank you T5!). The archers shoot at the terradons and kill 1, they fail panic, flee and are crossfired by the reliquae. (once again he never got bears anger off in his magic phase all battle)

Lizzies turn 2

I move the TG up to block his knights as much as possible and the skinks on the right march out of the forest to block the charge path on the spear saurus being very careful that the nearest model would in fact lead them charging toward the forest. Left hand skinks moved towards the archers. In magic the burning alignment falls short of everything and my magic is dispelled. In shooting the salamander shot at the generals unit of men at arms, was short but managed to kill 1 and they panicked!

Brets turn 2

The loss of the generals unit was a bit of a blow and the grail reliquae were too far back to combo charge with the knights. We had a bit of a conflab and he decided to try and take down the depleted temple guard so charged them with his intact unit of knights. The grail reliquae marched up but couldn’t quite get far enough to prevent the stegadon flank charging the next turn. The generals unit rallied. Shooting saw a couple of skinks drop dead on the left (leaving 9) and the trebuchet scattered and hit his knights in combat. 3 partials and 1 partial on a skink. The partials failed to hit knights and the skink proved too tough to wound! In combat I rolled well for saves and no temple guard fell whilst his champion was killed in a challenge (and +1 overkill). The temple guard pass their stubborn roll and a world of hurt was about to be unleashed on the poor knights.

Lizzies turn 3.

The skinks on the right are forced to charge his archers to clear a path for the spear saurus. The saurus spears and stegadon charge both flanks of the knight bus. The left hand skinks move up to start blowpiping the archers. The salamander moved after the rallied men at arms. In magic my mage miscast, rolled a 5 and allowed bears anger to be cast on his general, second sign was then failed on 2 dice. Burning alignment saw a knight or two and 2 reliquae fall. Shooting saw the left hand skinks only kill an archer or two (they were slightly out of range so 7 of them were hitting on 7+). The salamander hit the generals unit with its flames and managed to kill 5 or 6 of them (panic passed). In combat the knights were beaten badly and the bsb and damsel were killed (the damsel accepting a challenge from the bsb with his GW), the remaining 2 knights fled and were crossfired by the skinks on the left.
- bit of a rules issue here, technically they had to flee through the US10 stegadon still in combat- should this crossfire them anyway (we rolled a die during the battle and it didn’t).-
The TG took a test to prevent chasing and the stegadon pursued into the front of the grail reliquae and the spear saurus into the flank. At this point I was pleased my shaman had managed to survive much better this battle. The skinks on the right lost combat due to being outnumbered but passed their break test with a re-roll.

Brets turn 3

His generals unit charged the spear saurus in the flank and his left hand archers killed 2 more skinks (leaving 7 so no panic test). The trebuchet shot at the TG but he guessed too far but got a hit on the stegadon. All of the skink crew were wiped out by the S5 missile and the priest took the S10 hit to his head. The stegadons T6 was too much for the S5 hit though
- again not sure if we played this right or if the whole model should be hit by S10, in the end just the shaman got the really heavy bit-
In combat killed loads and won combat (despite only 2 impact hits and the death of the crew) with the scar vet and saurus carving a path through the reliquae. The reliquae passed their stubborn test (they never failed it) but the general (who killed the saurus champ in a challenge) and his men did a runner again! The skinks on the right once again lost combat but held due to the bsb and cold bloodedness.

Lizzies turn 4

The main combat continued and the TG were left out in the cold (although in hindsight I could have charged the general into the combat). The salamander out of spite moved up to flame the general’s unit again and this time got the range about right and fried 7 of them. The skinks on the left killed the remaining archers. In combat the skinks on the right broke (2 left so couldn’t rally) and the bretonnian skirmished archers charged into the big beastie in front of them (salamander). The grail reliquae unit was butchered as the saurus spears lowered their pointy sticks and at the end of the combat only the reliquae was left with 2 wounds, but passed it’s stubborn break test.

Brets turn 4

The general rallies again. The trebuchet shoots the TG and hits them. The general again fails his look out sir roll and gets a S10 rock in the head and dies along with 2 temple guard. In combat the reliquae is wiped out.

At this point he calls it a day and we all headed home.

Fluff:
2521 Khwar Tzu utterly crushed the human force and the proud knights of bretonnia lie dead on the shores. Some of the peasants survived and I have taken half to the city to either sacrifice whilst on the remainder I have managed reproduce a practice I have deciphered from the temple writings of cutting into the brain of a human or orc to make it compliant and easily imprinted, I will place this fodder and some small part of my lizardmen troops under the control of the sorcerer Velmar which will give me further small force to reinforce my borders, is disposable enough that if it is destroyed it will be of small moment, and it will keep Velmar away from the city so that he has no chance to instigate any plots.


After I got home though I realised I had been a dirty cheat. For some reason I thought temple guard were stubborn and the slann just granted them ITP (otherwise I would have taken 15 spear saurus). It didn’t make a big difference in the first battle but in the second spear saurus would have struggled to hold against the charge, even with his poor rolling the saurus would have been testing to hold on a 4 or 5 and would probably have broken and pursued. The spear saurus would still have flank charged the grail reliquae whereas the engine would have gone after the knights instead and would have got the charge against them the next round. I felt particularly dirty since it was Luke’s first game of warhammer. Since he doesn’t have a warhammer army at present but likes the idea of elves I’ve offered to bring my high elf army to the store for him to use next time, whilst I’m sure he will try to get me into 40K in some shape . Sun also suggested we start up mordheim again which would be cool and makes a nice swift game as well.

As for the army itself, I managed to test all the units I will be using in my main army (including the stubborn temple guard :eyebrows: )and was very happy with the synergy of the lizardmen army, the army works together incredibly well and the short range firepower is remarkably good. The Engine of the gods is deadly against knights and the skink priest being able to challenge makes it very good as a knight tarpit- a challenge when charged means by the second round the lances have been lost and the stegadon is more or less invulnerable to attack (although it’s attacks barely caused any damage at all due to poor rollong). The priest does seem to have a fairly short lifespan though, although he was slightly unlucky with saves the in the first battle in a 2000 point battle a lord will likely do him in fairly reliably unless I give him a ward save of some kind. Still he has lasted long enough so far to get the job done. Heavens isn’t a great lore but as a level 3 he can actually manage to cast the comet if he gets it. The terradons performed their role excellently, although I was very lucky with the rocks in the second battle. Had they not failed their panic tests they would have supported the skinks in the archer combat and would have tipped the scales there. I only got one decent hit with the salamanders in either battle but the ability to cause panic tests was very useful indeed and it’s a tremendous utility unit. The spear saurus cause absolute butchery when the spears come into play although against bretts they will struggle to hold against the charge of a major bus unit or grail knights I think they can hold against a 9 man unit without the bsb/lord or 2 6 knight units which is plenty reliable for me. Frenzied chaos knights or blood knights can do them in comfortably of course but they can stop dragon princes well enough too so it's a great little unit.

Some lizardmen players have been slightly dubious about the new list since the “core” is M4 infantry but I think it works very well indeed, by the time combat is joined your support units have more or less done their jobs and are moving around the rear of the enemy army which has potentially lethal potential. The slower advance of the M4 blocks also means the faster skink skirmishers (or cohorts) have the time and speed to redirect anything you don’t want to get charged by. Also, although I know the maths of cold-bloodedness well, actually seeing it in battle was tremendous- wow it makes a huge difference. In a non-slann army I would say the bsb is the most important model in the whole army, opposing players should take it out if at all possible.

Kerill
08-03-2009, 07:34
Anyway, since my fluff has a new character, here is a piccie of him and his 2250 point concept force (skink and lobotomised human heavy with none of Aethrics most powerful units (spawn beasts and firewyrms) and relatively few saurus:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/velmar.jpg

Velmar, ensorcelled armour, staff of draining (truthsayer, if you aren’t familiar with them they have Ws4, S4,T4, W3, A2 and Ld9, a halberd, 4+ ward, level 3 mage with +1 to dispel and a mostly buff based lore). 265
Scar Vet, chaos armour (enchanted shield and light armour), bsb, GW, cursing eye (bane head) 151
Level 2 skink priest, diadem, scroll 150

18 Saurus spears, FC 246
12 Saurus spears, musician 150
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
16 skink cohort with one disc ogre (Krox), musician 141
16 skink cohort with one disc ogre (Krox), musician 141
16 skink cohort with one disc ogre (Krox), musician 141
Jungle swarm 45 points
Jungle swarm 45 points

Special:

3 Terradon riders 90
3 Terradon riders 90
6 Saurus cavalry with FC and banner of temporal displacement (Huanchi, +D6” charge)

Rare:

25 lobotomized humans with light armour, flails, shields and FC. Special rules: half a brain- at the start of each turn roll a D6, on a 1 they can’t do anything that turn. (These are DOW manbiters- Ws2, S3, T3, Ld6 since the squabble rule nicely ties in with the fluff of the lobotomised ones being drooling idiots). I’ll probably use zombies to represent them.

Not really a hard list but I don’t think it’s a pushover either if run well. Ld9 from velmar is a big boost and the skink cohorts are cheap manouverable +3 rank bonus that are both expendable and slightly dangerous to my opponent. Magic offence is weak at range although the buffing spells (or combined buffing spells- +1 to hit and re-roll 1s for example) can make a big difference to the saurus spears and saurus cavalry. Magic defence is very solid- up to 7DD with +1 to dispel and one scroll. The cavalry are there to give enemy cavalry units pause. The lobotomised humans can maybe do a bit of damage and have solid static CR but are there for fluff rather than utility reasons.

Total: 2250 points, 143 models!

Oh and the list of Khwar-Tzu and Dhaak-Fhor
(being of proven loyalty this force includes the rarer powerful beasts that Velmar is not trusted with).

Khwar-Tzu, chaos armour, sword of disruption, GW (maiming shield for 5A and hw+sh bonus for a 2+ save, venom of the firefly frog for magic poisoned attacks, light armour and a GW just in case S7 is needed). 136
Dhaak-For, bsb, great weaponchaos armour, charm of cursing (enchanted shield, light armour, bane head, GW, 1+ save and bane head to make enemy characters less eager to fight him) 151
Level 2 Skink priest (as yet unnamed), spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast (Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG) 405
Level 2 skink priest (also unnamed) diadem, scroll 150

17 spear saurus, FC 234
16 spear saurus, FC 222
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink cohort 50


6 Saurus cavalry, FC, banner of huanchi 285
3 terradons 90
3 terradons 90

2 salamander hunting pack 150
18 norse marauders with flails. 144 (for fluff reasons to represent the remaining marauders not in the city)

Total: 2247 points, 7PD, 5-7DD, 106 models


I doubt I'll be using these lists for now although I may have velmar lead a 1000 point force for smaller battles, but when I get more used to the "main" list I'll use the forces under Aethric's two subcommanders more often and the 1500 point list will be a variant of Khwar-Tzus full force.

Lord of Nonsensical Crap
08-03-2009, 16:59
Great reports, but a few rules snippets:


The battles begin!

The grail reliquae failed to do any damage to the temple guard and lost 4 men in return but won due to the musician (he forgot his hatred re-rolls though) stubborn test was again passed on the re-roll.

Temple Guard are only stubborn if they have a Slann with them.


The terradons charge the trebuchet at the back. The saurus spears charge the grail reliquae (but only the bsb can get in combat and I forgot to use their spears).

Spears can't be used on the charge by infantry.

Other than that, great reports! I'm really liking the conversions you've done to your Chaotic Lizzies, and look forward to seeing more of them.

Kerill
08-03-2009, 17:49
I meant I forgot to use the spears the next round, not at all clear there ;)

And yes I made a fair doozie of a mistake on the stubborn TG. Ah well. Nice to see your lizards have entered 7th edition Lonc, must be almost slann time :)

SevenSins
08-03-2009, 21:11
a nice rep, Kerill, even though you're a cheater :p
nice fluff too

Arguleon-veq
09-03-2009, 15:46
Great fluff and reports!.

I had planned on using Lizardmen models for my Tzeentch Daemons.

blackjack
09-03-2009, 18:10
Some of the best fluff I've read for an army. Way to go.


I personally use Flesh Hounds as Salamanders, I think they look more like Lizardmen models than Daemons...

ScalySkin
09-03-2009, 21:01
Loved it, can't wait for the next incursion to be reported!

Kerill
10-03-2009, 07:58
Thanks for the replies everyone (and the stamina for reading through that wall of text!) hopefully I'll get a bigger battle in this weekend. Was on a bit of a new army excitement painting drive this week so actually managed to paint and finish the terradons and Khwar-Tsu (didn't do a great job of sculpting kwar-tsu's taile though :( )

Kerill
14-03-2009, 18:36
Lizardmen vs WOC

Today I played a 1500 point battle against a WOC player, Little Sun (pronounced swuhn), after watching his battle against dwarves (I’ll try and post a battle report for their battle tomorrow, since both players are fairly new and I was helping out with rules from time to time). He’s new to warhammer with only a few battles so far so didn’t have a particularly optimised list (and is limited somewhat by what models he has available) although I did explain what each part of my army could do, what I planned to do post deployment and gave a few suggestions during the game whilst trying not to be to intrusive. Really nice guy (as was the dwarf player). I’ll post the fluff and deployment map tomorrow, off to bed now, sorry.

My List:
Khwar-Tzu (scar vet), chaos armour, firestorm blade (maiming shield, burning blade, light armour )
Dhaak Fhor (Scar vet), bsb, GW, enchanted shield, light armour
Level 2 skink priest on spawnbeast with warpstone brazier, spell familiar and scroll (EOTG, tepoc and scroll). Spells- 1,2 and 5
18 spear saurus, FC
10 spear saurus
10 skink skirmishers
10 skink skirmishers
10 skink cohort
3 Disc riders (terradons)
3 Disc riders (terradons)
Salamander

His list:
Exalted, juggernaut
Level 2 Tzeentch sorcerer- flickering and pandemonium
Level 2 Tzeentch sorceror- flickering and baleful
6 knights of Khorne, lances, musician
6 knights of Khorne, lances
- the lances actually worked at surprisingly well both against me and against the dwarf player.
10 warriors of Khorne, shields
20 marauders (naked)
5 hounds
5 hounds
5 marauder horsemen, flails
Chaos spawn
Chaos spawn

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/WOCbattle.jpg

WOC (Top)
RED- Khorne Knights/Khorne exalted
BROWN- Marauders/Mounted marauders
Black- spawn
PINK- hounds
BLUE- Khorne warriors with 2 Tzeentch mages

LIZARDS (BOTTOM)
LIGHT BLUE- skinks
RED- Salamander
BLACK- spear saurus (larger unit has bsb and general)
GREEN- terradons
BLUE- EOTG

Turn 1- Lizzies

I move the salamander deep into the forest, skinks on the right as well. The skinks on the left also move close to the left hand forest. disc riders on each flank fly into their respective forests. The rest of the army moves up about 6” with the spawn beast with warpstone brazier about 2” ahead of the saurus in preparation for skink priest suicide charges. I throw 4 dice at uranons thunderbolt (because I can!), he throws his 4 dice and dispels it. No shooting this turn.

Turn 1- WOC

His army moves up full speed although the knights with general get stuck behind a spawn. The other knights on the other flank are also potentially blocked by a spawn. He casts pandemonium, I fail to dispel. He casts baleful tranmogrification on the EOTG, I pass the Ld test using general’s Ld.

Turn 2- Lizzies

The skink cohort moves forward to force a charge from his Khorne warriors. The firewyrm moves into a perfect position for firing on the marauders. The left unit of disc riders flies over the marauder horsemen, drops rocks and heads to the rear of his army for march blocking and general annoyance. His marauder horseman passes panic on the re-roll. The right hand disc riders drop rocks on the right hand spawn but only cause 1 wound (4 hits) then fly behind his army as well. I try to cast portent on 1 die (fail) and use the remaining 4 to dispel pandemonium (more important). I forget to throw the disc riders javelins and the firewyrm prepares his template of death, misfires and eats the three skink attendants (monster reaction test passed on general’s Ld). Skinks shoot 4 of the left side hounds and right side skink skirmishers did bugger all.

Turn 2- WOC

His warriors are forced to charge the cohort who flee (saurus spears barely pass panic test) leaving them in front of the suicide priest on spawnbeast who sharpens his remarkably small stone knife in preparation. The rest of his army has to manoeuvre around the spawn to get into charge position. The right hand spawn chases towards my firewyrm but is 5”short. This actually caused a problem as we will see later in this gripping report ;). He casts pandemonium (I scroll it) and then dispel his flickering fire attempt.

Turn 3 – Lizzies

Suicide priest on spawnbeast charges the warriors to the front, one unit of disc riders go into the rear (probably not the most sound of ideas but they were bored by all the 1+ AS around them. I move the skink skirmishers on the left to block the charge of the left side chaos knights with general on the 10 spear saurus regiment. I had planned to do the same on the right but the spawn was perfectly positioned to both march block the skinks and prevent them from blocking a charge from the knights on my main saurus spear unit. Skink cohort rallied. The other unit of disc riders plinked their javelins on some armour to get the love sound a stone javelin head makes when striking chaos armour. The salamander moved up so it would be able to target the right hand knights and quite possibly overshoot onto the warriors in combat. Magic was an important phase since I needed to kill a couple of knights to prevent my spear saurus being hit hard. Suicide priest decided to cast spells before rolling for the burning alignment, cast portent on 2 dice on himself (dispelled with 2 dice) then cast second sign with 3 dice and miscast (won’t be forgetting to do the burning alignment first in future), I rolled a 5 for the miscast and pandemonium went off on the army. Burning alignment got 1 hit on the right hand unit of Khorne killing machines (killing one) and one hit on the left hand unit (killing one) it did however get 6 hits on the remaining chaos hound on the left (killing it) and 5 hits on the marauder horseman (killing him) and 2 hits on the left hand spawn (causing 1 wound). It also killed a warrior in the combat. This resulted in his left hand knights having a clear path to charge the small spear saurus regiment since I’d placed my skirmishing skink blockers slightly wrong (had not considered that the burning alignment would destroy the other troops blocking their path and then reduce their number by just enough for them to get through the gap, won’t make that mistake next time either. Shooting saw the death of the right hand hounds (or might have killed them the turn before) and the right hand spawn. The salamander spat flames that missed the knights but hit one Tzeentch sorcerer and 4 warriors but no wounds caused. Now Combat! And the suicide skink priest declared a challenge which was accepted by the sorcerer who didn’t have pandemonium. I rolled 3 impact hits and 2 warriors fell. The mighty spawnbeast attacked the sorcerer and got one hit, he passed the 6+ ward. The suicide priest launched himself off the howdah at the foul chaos sorcerer but got his foot (claw/paw?) caught in a rope and missed. The sorcerer got two hits in return but both were saved. At the rear of the unit the disc riders managed to kill a warrior and the warriors killed a disc rider in return (I was lucky there, what possessed me to charge them in the rear? Still too used to playing chaos myself perhaps). Anyway we toted up the combat, I had one by 1 (due to US), but he only had 7 warriors and 2 sorcerers left in the unit- US9 to my terror causing US10, they ran 10” and were run down by the disc riders (10”) with the engine close behind (8”) getting it out of the charge range of the right hand knights. EOTG picked up 500 points there and ended pandemonium.

Turn 3- WOC vengeance

The left hand knights with general and left hand spawn charged the left hand saurus spears, and the right hand knights charged the right hand saurus spears. The remaining spawn tries to get involved in the spear combat but is too far away. The marauders charge the firewyrm which flees, never to return (but leave the marauders stuck in the forest).Both spear saurus units held, left hand spear saurus fail their fear test but both sides have US10. No magic so straight on to combat. The left hand knights with lord kill 9 saurus on the charge meaning the spawn didn’t even get to attack (no models in b-t-b when its turn to attack came), the last spear saurus made some feeble gestures with the spear before taking to the hills with the khorne knights running him down and travelling 11” towards my table edge, spawn passed its Ld test to not pursue. Passing within 1” of my carefully placed cohort. On the right, he decides to allocate one knight and his steed’s attacks against the bsb, the rest on normal foot soldiers. The bsb takes 2 wounds but saves one thanks to his 1+ AS (which became a 4+). The knights remaining attacks kill 7 saurus. Khwar-Tsu pulls out his sword and with 5 S5 attacks with a -5 save modifier fails to cause a single wound (4 misses and a 2 to wound). The bsb also fails to kill anything, same with the spear saurus and champ. I lose combat by 3, pass the break test on the re-roll (with a huge sigh of relief).

Turn 4- Lizzies

The spawnbeast moves 11” back to where the action is to 1” behind the knights in combat with the spear saurus. The 5 disc riders fly forward to deal with the spawn on the left (now more or less in the middle of the main battlefield now), as do the left hand skinks. Right hand skinks move closer to the marauders so they can blowpipe the spawn or the marauders. The cohort in the rear shuffles three inches left to behind the knights to prevent them moving backwards. Magic sees the EOTG kill all 5 knights in combat with the spears, fails to wound the spawn and kills 1 marauder. The priest casts lightning (opponent failed to dispel, but we forgot about the MR1) on the generals unit and drops 1 knight and puts a wound on the general. Portent fails on the right hand skinks (rolled 4 on 2 dice). Shooting- 20 poisoned blowpipe shots fail to hit the spawn from the left hand unit, then the disc riders fail to put a wound on it, finally the cohort manage to down it with their javelins. The right hand skinks kill 2 or 3 marauders.

Turn 4- WOC

The marauders shuffle awkwardly out of the forest but far enough to march block the spawnbeast. His general leaves the knights and moves 7” further away from the engine. The other knights wheel so they can charge the skink cohort next turn.

Turn 5- Lizzies

The left hand skinks move towards the general to blowpipe him. The disc riders fly behind the marauders for a next turn rear charge and some javelin action. The spear saurus turn to face the remaining knights. The spawnbeast moves 6” towards his nearest knights. Magic sees another bolt of lightning hit the chaos knights reducing them to 1. Portent is cast on the right hand skink skirmishers.
Shooting saw the left hand skinks manage to cause 3 poison wounds on the general, he failed 1 save and died. The combined shooting of the disc riders and skink skirmishers killed about 12 marauders (passed panic). He called the game there.

MVP- Skink priest on spawnbeast- killed 1 unit of knights with burning alignment and most of another with magic. In combat killed a unit of Khorne warriors and 2 sorcerors. Basically about 1000 points of a 1500 point list. The priest actually survived as well, which is a first.

Khwar-Tsu did awful, I don’t think I’ll be missing scar vets from my Aethric list since they’ve done very average so far, still that’s dice for you. Still his Ld was handy several times. Dhaak-For succeeded in surviving which was all I needed.

Charging the disc riders into the rear of the warriors was foolishly risky (although it worked out well strangely enough). Had the spear saurus not held it would probably have been 800 VPs for him although the engine was uncontested in the magic phase by that point. I made a couple of mistakes (not blocking the left hand knights fully) and the randomness of the spawn preventing me from leading his knights away with the skinks had me worried for a while (the spawn was about 3.5” from the knights meaning I didn’t use my emergency redirectors (disk riders) since he would still have been able to overrun into the saurus, although in hindsight that would have allowed me to get the EOTG one more hit on the knights regardless of whether the warriors had broken or not.

So not got the hang of the lizardmen yet, but definitely learning and still all chuffed about having a shooting phase (might add a Halfling hotpot into my WOC list for a while for giggles). At 1500 points, the EOTG is insanely useful against warriors and bretts although at 2000 points warriors can handle one without too much trouble. Bretts will still suffer a bit unless they take a few more archers. 2 or 3 EOTG at 2000-2250 points would definitely a move into cheese territory and a viable tournament build although it will get raped by a proper gunline.

At 2000 points I will be glad to have a guaranteed anvil (TG) and a safe bsb who can’t be targeted. The bsb re-roll is worth so much for lizards.

Anyway it was nice to watch a game and play a game today with very pleasant players and I gave a few WOC suggestions post battle and waxed lyrical on the joys of a 4point flail on an exalted (although it was a moot point in this battle).

As a final nice round off to the day, my wife came to the store and bought me two boxed sets for my birthday (tomorrow) which together with some fellbats I’ll be making will give me a 2250 point VC list to play with as well.

selone
14-03-2009, 19:06
Happy birthday! The length of your turn 3 said it was going to be a crucial turn. Having one more US was very handy :D

Kerill
15-03-2009, 09:17
Happy birthday! The length of your turn 3 said it was going to be a crucial turn. Having one more US was very handy :D

Thanks, have already managed to cut my thumb open while getting the VC units off their sprues- really a bloodsucking army.

Turn 3 was vital indeed, although had the warriors held the engine priest was almost guaranteed to survive until my round which would have been another burning alignment in the middle of his army.

- Added deployment map

Kerill
22-03-2009, 08:55
Two games today another 1500 point and a 2250 point (hooray)

2521
With winter almost here, and my fleet and the bretonnian ships fully prepared, I have dispatched Khwar-Tzu and Dhaak- Fhor on a raiding mission to the southern wastes to gather more slaves and warpstone since my supply is swiftly running out, they will also attempt to capture more firewyrms and spawn for use in my armies. With more slaves or marauders I can expand my human forces and build a fleet on a larger scale. Khwar-Tzu has chosen his first target, a large band of undivided marauders with a large stock of warpstone and several spawn, the tribe shamans have sensed his approach and the battle is about to begin…

First game:

I had the same list as last time:

My List:
Khwar-Tzu (scar vet), chaos armour, firestorm blade (maiming shield, burning blade, light armour )
Dhaak Fhor (Scar vet), bsb, GW, enchanted shield, light armour
Level 2 skink priest on spawnbeast with warpstone brazier, spell familiar and scroll (EOTG, tepoc and scroll). Spells- 1,2 and 5
18 spear saurus, FC
10 spear saurus
10 skink skirmishers
10 skink skirmishers
10 skink cohort
3 Disc riders (terradons)
3 Disc riders (terradons)
Salamander

He had:
Level 2 nurgle sorcerer, power familiar (went in right hand marauders)
Level 2 slaanesh sorcerer, book of secrets, scroll (went in left hand marauders)
Wulfrik (went in right hand marauders)
20 marauders, nurgle (not sure what equipment)
20 marauders, (not sure what equipment)
5 hounds
5 hounds
5 Marauder horsemen, flails, throwing spears
10! Chaos knights of Tzeentch, standard: rage
2 spawn

The 10 knights of Tzeentch were there I assume to prevent them dying to the engine too quickly.

The plan- not to let those knights in combat.
His slaanesh sorcerer rolles 1,3 and creeping death from shadows
His nurgle sorcerer rolled buboes and the regeneration spell

I got comet, 6+ lighting bolt and portent.

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/WOClizardsbattle.jpg

My units:
Spear saurus- dark blue (both scar vets in right hand unit)
Skinks- light blue
Salamander- red 50mm base
EOTG- red chariot base
Green 40mm bases- terradons

His Units
Tzeentch Knights- Red
Hounds- pink
Nurgle marauders with wulfrik and nurgle sorceror- green
Marauder horsemen- brown
Unmarked marauders with slaanesh mage- brown
Spawn- red 40mm base


WOC Turn 1

He moves his hounds up 14”, marauders 8” and horsemen the full 16”. The spawn on the left moves forward 11”, the one on the right 6” and his knights move up 7” to just behind the spawn.

Lizards turn 1

Both units of disc riders fly over his lines, one going in to the forest, to march block the knights the other flying over his marauders, dropping rocks and and landing 7” beyond them. Rocks wiped out the horsemen. The firewyrm moved through the forest to get a shot on the knights (who couldn’t charge it next turn due to the spawn). Right hand skirmishers moved up a bit, cohort moved 6” wheeling towards the knights and the spawnbeast moved up behind. Left hand skinks moved up a bit so the spawn would be in range. Magic saw the engine roll a massive 11” for range, failed to kill any knights, put a wound on the right hand spawn, killed a unit of warhounds and killed 2 from the other hound unit (panic passed). I failed to cast comet on 4 dice and he dispelled portent. Shooting saw the firewyrm shoot at the knights but overshot and killed a marauder (passed panic). The cohort killed another 2 hounds (leaving one) and the right hand skirmishers failed to cause a wound on the spawn.

WOC Turn 2

No charges and his spawn rolls 8” towards my firewyrm but is 2” short for a charge. The march blocked knights move forward 7” as does the rest of his line. The remaining hound faffs about a bit.His marauders move up 8” again an the left hand spawn moves 6” His magic puts a wound on the spawnbeast.

Lizards turn 2

One unit of disk riders charges the flank of his knights (the ones that hadn’t dropped rocks). Skink skirmishers on the right move to 6” from the spawn (and partially in front of the cohort, closes skirmisher would lead knights into the forest/against the spawn and the ones on the left do the same. Other terradons fly over his knights to near his marauder unit with characters. Firewyrm moves a bit to get a shot on the marauders. Magic is dispelled again and the burning alignment rolls 5” range kills the last hound and puts a wound on the right hand spawn. Shooting saw both units of double-shotting skink skirmishers kill their respective spawn. The firewyrm rolls 8” for range and kills 4 marauders from the character filled unit who pass Close combat sees the terradons fail to kill a knight (unsurprising) and the two knights in contact cause 3 wounds, leaving two terradons who break and he has to pursue into the trees (due to banner of rage) terradons out distance him by 3”.

WOC Turn 3

His character filled marauder unit fails their terror test and run 8”. His knights charge the terradons again (who flee 14”) but are still partially in the woods. .His remaining marauder unit moves more cautiously. Once again his magic is dispelled.

Lizards Turn 3

The terradons charge his marauder unit with characters, the run 12” away but are caught by1/2 inch. Terradons rally. The firewyrm moves to get a shot on the knights. The engine and spearmen turn to face his marauder units. The engine joins the left hand spears to give them an extra rank. Left hand skirmishers move to within 12” range of the non-fleeing marauders, right hand skirmishers move into the forest to ensure the knights will never return to the main battle. Magic sees me miscast, killing 3 saurus, putting one wound on the priest and all the other crew die, ah well. The firewyrm gets a nice shot on the knights and kills 3.

Game is called at this point.

All the knights in one frenzied basket was the issue in this game, once they were led off he had nothing that could face my units of saurus spears or masses of annoyance troops.

…Another successful attack by Khwar-Tzu, he destroyed the enemy warband almost without losses, despite the reinforcement of chaos knights they received. Of the almost 300 inhabitants of the enemy encampment, over 50 have sworn allegiance to me and to lord Tzeentch, the rest have been enslaved. The more warlike ones will be turned into mindless ones. The leader of the encampment was slain and his warships have been taken along with the warpstone they had horded. Even better, both of their spawn survived the battle and have been taken to my ships to be transported back here. The sorcerors refused to recant their weak gods and were slain, but one was in possession of a book of sorcery which I have sent a daemon to fetch to me that I might study it further. Since losses were few, the disc riders are seeking for another human encampment to be raided.

2521
The slann have finally made their move, I was not expecting an attack in the winter and they have caught me off guard, a mage priest from Goqhui is leading a large force into my lands, Khwarr-Tzu and Dhaak- Fhor are still in the southern wastes and Velmar is far to the east although coming at speed, I have no choice but to face them in the field. It seems they have brought the elite of their forces to battle, two of the giant lizards, a huge regiment of their elite saurus guard and many saurus and kroxigor besides, I have assembled my forces as swiftly as I can, although my saurus cavalry outriders may not make it to the battle in time.



Game 2:

2250 points

He had:
Slann, +1PD, Becalming rumination, plaque of tepoc, scroll, bsb: warbanner
EOTG
Skinkg chief on stegadon with stegadon war spear.
- some other stuff as well, never found out what

CORE:

10 skink skirmishers
2 Krox/17 skink cohort with full command.
24 saurus spears, FC

SPECIAL:
4 terradons
20 temple guard, standard

RARE:
Razordon hunting pack

I had:

Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, 2 power stones, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery.
(Slann mage priest with 2 power stones, bane head, bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, drain magic, know all spells)
-480
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG)
-405

CORE:
18 Saurus, spears, standard, musician 234
10 skink cohort 50
11 skink cohort, krox, musician 116 (just to try it out)
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70

SPECIAL
3 Disk riders 90 (terradons)
3 Disk riders 90 (terradons)
16 Warp Tainted Black Saurus, standard, champion 284 (Temple guard)
6 Saurus Cavalry 210

RARE
Firewyrm (salamander) 75
Firewyrm (salamander) 75

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/lizzielizziebattle.jpg

Note the weird blue stuff on the left is a lake.

Units:
Spear saurus- dark blue
Skinks- light blue
Salamander/Razordon- red 50mm base
EOTG- red chariot base
Chief on stegadon- Yellow chariot base
Green 40mm bases- terradons
Grey cavalry bases- saurus cavalry


In the picture you can see what was my biggest mistake of the battle, putting the saurus cavalry on the left, god knows why I did, immediately after putting them down I knew I’d made a mistake.

For magic he took shadow and got 1,2,3,5 and 6
I took metal.
His EOTG priest got second sign and portent
Mine got both lightnings and portent.

He won the roll for first turn, I bane headed the EOTG priest.

Slann Mage Priest of Goqhui turn 1

Basically everything moved forward full tilt, with the skink cohort moving mostly into the lake. Terradons flew to behind the skink skirmishers. Magic saw me becalm his mage priest. He cast creeping death on the temple guard with 3 dice and got 12, I let it go (waiting for pit), he got 11 hits and killed 4 temple guard (not a good start!).

Aethric turn 1

Saurus cavalry go stupid. I fly the right hand terradons over his razordon and drop rocks (kill handlers and put a wound on the razordon, passes panic). The right hand terradons can’t quite fly over his terradons so fly over the cohort and drop rocks, killing 1 skink and putting 1 wound on a Kroxigor (waste or rocks, should have been more patient with them). Chose 5+ ward with Engine. Magic I cast bane head at the EOTG, failed to wound the ancient stegadon. 2D6 S4 magic missile was becalmed and spirit (using a power stone) was dispelled. My priest cast his D6 S4 missile on the engine, no damage done. Shooting sees the salamander on the left get 6 hits on the cohort unit, but after to wound and ward, now wounds caused. Terradons on the left put one wound on his terradons (one saved by engine). The left hand skink skirmishers shot at the cohort but didn’t cause any damage. The right hand skirmishers move into the forest.

Slann Mage Priest of Goqhui turn 2

His battle line continues to advance, his warchief steg is near the forest where I plan to distract it with the skirmishers or salamander. His cohort charges my skink skirmishers on the left (who flee). Razordon moves to get a shot on the terradons. His terradons overfly mine, drop rocks and Magic and his engine sticks with the 5+ ward. He gets off second sign (fail to dispel), casts creeping death on the TG again (becalmed) then casts pit of shades (becalmed). Razordon shot the terradons and put 3 wounds on them.

Aethric turn 2

Terror and both my terradons and skirmishers fail and run. My saurus cavalry pass stupidity and declare a charge on his terradons (who flee). Left salamander moves into the trees to get another shot on the cohort. Right salamander moves to get a shot on the stegadon and saurus spears. Skink skirmishers rally. Magic saw me cast ROBI on the engine again (failed to wound), cast the 2D6 S4 magic missile (partially becalmed and dispelled) then spirit of the forge on the engine with a power stone (scrolled). My skink priest cast the D6 S4 magic missile at his engine, killed one crewman. Shooting was a bit more eventful this time, the left salamander got a decent hit on the skink cohort but only caused 1 wound on a krox and 1 skink (passed panic). The right hand salamander managed to kill 1 saurus spear, and they failed the panic test and fled (which sadly opened the path for the war spear steg).

Slann Mage Priest of Goqhui turn 3

His Engine, stegadon move up to within charge range (but out of mine) and his TG march up to about 8-9” from my TG. His terradons rally and fly over the lake. His saurus spears reform and face the firewyrm in the trees. His skink cohort charges my salamander (Flee). Razordon moves to shoot at my salamander. Magic sees the EOTG roll well for range and kills 3 TG and 3 cohort skinks. Magic is dispelled or becalmed apart from second sign of amul. Shooting sees the razordon misfire.

Aethric turn 3

Things are looking a bit dangerous at this point, with my TG being depleted a bit too quickly, I charge the 1 krox cohort into his TG in the hopes of holding it up for a round and get another turn of magic. The other cohort moves to put itself between the engine and the spear saurus. The right hand skink skirmishers rally, as does the salamander and disk riders. The right hand salamander can’t move far enough to block the war spear steg so it charges his razordon (I couldn’t move far enough to get prevent the war spear stegadon getting a charge so this was the better of the remaining options ) The skink skirmishers on the left shoot at his terradons and put 2 wounds on them (3 left, one with 1 wound missing). Magic saw ROBI again fail to wound the stegadon ancient and I managed to get spirit of the forge off on the engine as well. Rolled 4 hits, one on the priest (rolled a 1 to wound) and put 1 wound on the stegadon ancient. Damn. My engine joined the saurus spears to give them 4 ranks and stubborn for the charges to come and burning alignment killed 1 Temple guard and one crewman from the warchief’s stegadon. Shooting does nothing. In combat my firewyrm puts a wound on his razordon, I have US but he passes his break test. The kroxigor fails gets one hit then rolls a 1 to wound, the skinks do nothing (of course) but 5 are killed by return attacks, cohort flees and his TG pursue. (in hindsight this was a foolish charge by me since I could have moved my TG back out of range but I was hoping to shut down the slann’s magic somewhat.

Slann Mage Priest of Goqhui turn 4

His TG charge the fleeing cohort and smack into my TG, his engine charges the cohort (flee) and gets EITW on the saurus spears, warspear steg also charges the saurus spears. His terradons fly behind my skirmishers on the left and his cohort moves towards them. Magic sees the burning alignment kill 3 more TG, a few of the cohort skinks (reducing them to 7) and a spear saurus. Magic is dispelled apart from a second sign of amul. Slann miscasts on his last spell and suffers a S2 hit, but no harm done. His cohort shoots at my left side skink skirmishers, kills 3 but the pass panic (otherwise would have been crossfired). In combat his EOTG rolls 6 impact hits and the stegadon war spear rolls 12- 18 impacts later and all I have left are two saurus warriors. His chieftain declares a challenge and my EOTG accepts. Meanwhile his ancient stegadon kills the last two of my spear saurus. His stegadon warchief causes one wound to the priest but I save it. His stegadon fails to wound mine, and I put 1 wound on the chief in return. I pass the stubborn break test. In combat his TG go for halberds, mine go for hw+sh, he kills 3 of mine, I kill 2 of his. My firewyrm kills his razordon in combat.

Aethric turn 4

I forget to move the skink skirmishers on the right, the saurus cavalry do a 180 turn and head back towards my left side to get a flank charge if his cohort charges my skirmishers. The 1 krox cohort rallies (still had the krox and 3 skinks left, just over 25%), as does the other cohort and goes for 3,3,2 formation so it can charge in against his TG next turn and negate ranks. Magic saw me get off transmutation of lead on his TG, engine killed 1 temple guard, did nothing to the two stegadons. Shooting sees me reduce his terradons to 1 (pass panic) and the salamander on the left breathes on his cohort (kills 2 skinks, pass panic). Salamander on the right breathes on saurus spears (1 kill, pass panic). Combat saw his warchief fail to wound my priest and my stegadon fail to hit his warchief. TG combat once again saw me lose 3 to his 2.

Slann Mage Priest of Goqhui turn 5

He turns his cohort towards my salamander again, not wanting to face the saurus cavalry. His terradon charges the skink skirmishers, who beat them and run them down. Magic sees him get off second sign and burning alignment put a wound or two on my stegadon, a couple more TG die. He also casts unseen lurker on the saurus spears, but they can do nothing at this point so I let it go. Other combats see my priest die and my ancient stegadon roll one hit on his chief but fails to wound. My TG are reduced to 2 (standard and champion).

Aethric turn 5

I charge in the depleted Krox cohort and in magic get transmutation of lead off on his TG. Krox fluffs his attacks, as do the skinks, he wins but break tests passed. My slann has to move into the front rank next to the champion.

Slann Mage Priest of Goqhui turn 6

Skipping to combat, my slann takes a wound, skinks are killed and 2 wounds on krox, TG champion is killed. Krox flees, slann passes break test. In the stegadon conflict, my ancient steg is killed finally and I call the game since there are other people waiting to play.

It was great to finally get a 2250 points game and get Aethric involved, but I played pretty poorly. His dice were far more blessed than mine but basically I threw this game away. I had a big advantage in the deployment phase, and not only did I waste it, I kicked it in the nads and poked it with pointy things. I should have had my TG against his stegadons (and giving the slanns ld to the skirmishers who would be redirecting a stegadon) and saurus spears with the Engine in reserve, with my spears against his TG- a battle I would win over time. I also deployed the skink/krox cohort too early which meant their correct place in my list (supporting the infantry blocks) was gone, then I compounded the error by sticking them in the middle of no-mans land, next to a lake where they were guaranteed to do little, stupidity or no. In some ways I was fortunate since he was often throwing too few dice at a spell to overcome becalming, whereas if he had tried to cast fewer spells I would have had a lot more trouble dispelling. The failure to kill his engine priest sealed my doom, 3 ROBI, 2 spirits of the forge and one 2D6 S4 magic missile and not one wound (doubled) on the priest, I really needed that engine dead to stop stripping my temple guard (and so I could do the same to his) but it was not to be. To be fair my priest was lucky to survive the chiefs attacks first round with S6 as well.

Kerill
22-03-2009, 08:55
Still, very happy to get a game in, especially against lizardmen, Aethric needed a loss against them to prevent the backstory getting dodgy ;). Becalming really had a major effect on the magic phases of both sides, but I might add a scroll to my list just the same for when you really need to be sure. The 11 skink/1 krox cohort was a big failure, doesn’t really fit with my battle-plan and not really capable of anything, so a few minor adjustments to the list. Main thing next time though is to stick to the deployment plan so the units on my flank can benefit from the slann’s Ld- although it wouldn’t have been possible
Overall so far, for scores for each unit:
Saurus spears: 7/10 – not as good as I expected overall, hitty stuff still takes them down easily enough, still they are only 234 points
Terradons: 9/10- very good indeed, a unit of 4 is definitely better than a unit of 3 but two units is very handy, need more patience with the rocks though.
Salamanders: 9/10 – Excellent units for the points, even against psychology resistant and tough armies they can pull out a few kills and, more importantly, a lot of panic tests. I can see a 4th handler being useful as well. They left hand salamander was quite unlucky with the skink cohort despite a couple of good hits few casualties were caused.
Temple guard: First time I’ve used them (but 2 units in action today), 8/10 so far. Not quite as tough as they seem, but tough nonetheless.
Skink sirmishers: 9/10 oh so useful. Don’t kill much but keep killing and do an awful lot of other things too
Naked skink cohort: 6.5/10. Cheaper than the skirmishers but not nearly as useful.
Saurus cavalry: Not used them properly yet so no judgement there so far.
Single razordon pack (he used): 8/10, not as good as the salamanders overall but much better for threatening light units and the like. It seems razordons don’t need to be in packs of 3 or more to be effective, 1 is also a decent annoyance unit.

Becalming cogitation- definitely worth the 50 points, not as sure as a pair of scrolls, but generally more effective and no IF from the main opposing mage is very good, it stopped an IF pit of shades and IF spirit of the forge in this battle.

This battle also showed how difficult it is for lizardmen to take out stegadons, my magic hardly made a dent and his magic, engine and two stegadons took a long time to kill mine. A unit of 4 Krox would definitely have its place against lizards I think.

…Curses! An ignominious defeat indeed, fortunately Velmar’s forces reached the battlefield late in the day and the slann was forced to withdraw. One of my spawnbeasts lies dead upon the field, the withdrawal of the slann had allowed me to preserve some of my warp saurus and saurus warriors, but half or dead or of no use in battle anymore. Vilreth survived the battle despite being disembowelled due to the magical effects of the warpstone brazier he was attending, he managed to hold his guts in long enough for the brazier and his magic to re-knit his flesh. The losses inflicted on my opponent were few and of little moment, I am forced to combine mine and Velmar’s forces to keep the slann at bay until reinforcements can arrive and Khwar-Tzu returns. I have been studying the book taken from the slaanesh mage and by modifying a spell I found therein I have crafted a talisman that can drain the soul from creature, leaving it an empty shell, I have gifted this to the leader of the warp saurus regiment who killed 6 of the enemy elite temple guard and soon will be healed enough to fight. He is showing promise and may perhaps be able to lead an army in future. Hopefully my enemies will not be prepared for a magical attack from a non-mage either.

The slann have not pressed their advantage, if the Zlatlan forces moved against me at this point I could not stave off their combined armies, yet for some reason they have not, I must attempt to scry the future, perhaps there is an event of import about to happen that they are preparing for. The slann from Goqhui seem more active than those of Zlatlan, and from what I can decipher from the plaques, this suggests that they are of a younger generation, if the slann of Zlatlan moves against me I fear I will need the aid of Velmar to overcome it, thankfully he has proven trustworthy so far, had his forces not arrived on the battlefield I would have been forced to try and escape through the aether, not an easy feat when a mage such as the slann from Goqhui is present.

Anyway, decided to drop the Krox cohort for a normal one, which saves me 60 odd points. Since I’m somewhat constrained with what models I have and my lack of special and rare slots, I’ve decided to boost the magic phase a bit and give me a bit more variety in spells so I’ve dropped a power stone for a rod of the storm, power stones were handy but against anything but a slann with becalming 1 is enough since most lores don’t have enough spells worth casting and bound level 6 is fairly hard to dispel. Also got a champion for my saurus spears since it might prove handy for when the engine joins the saurus. I’ve also added in the blood statuette on the TG champion to deal with any future encounters with an engine or for T3 mages in general.

I also need to re-read the aquatic rule since I wan't sure what exactly the lake meant for me in this battle.
Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, The draining amulet, 1 power stone, dispel scroll, staff of lightning, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery.
(Slann mage priest with power stone, scroll, bane head, rod of storm bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, drain magic, know all spells)
-510
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG)
-405

CORE:
18 Saurus, spears, FC 246
10 skink cohort 50
10 skink cohort 50
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70

SPECIAL
3 Disk riders 90 (terradons)
3 Disk riders 90 (terradons)
16 Warp Tainted Black Saurus, standard, champion, Aethric’s talisman of soul draining (blood statuette) 309 (Temple guard)
6 Saurus Cavalry 210

RARE
Firewyrm (salamander) 75
Firewyrm (salamander) 75

Total: 2250
PD: 9 base+2 one time bound spells
DD: 6+scroll

SevenSins
22-03-2009, 13:13
well that was interesting, two similar yet different armies facing off. Becalming on both sides sure put a dent in the magic output on both sides, and your difficulties in dealing with the stegadons did seal the game I think (scar-vets miight help?)

Kerill
22-03-2009, 13:48
I considered adding a scar vet with jaguar on foot, but it would cost me a unit of skinks (acceptable) , the rod and the blood statuettet, and one saurus warrior I could add:

Scar Vet, GW, light armour, shield, jaguar charm. 124

or drop another saurus for Scar Vet, burning blade, light armour, shield, cold one (133).

The second one is more survivable with a 1+ save and T5, the first will potentially help against a lot of things, and the jaguar charm can add pressure to the magic phase but is limited to S7 and a 4+ save or a 2+save and S5.

In my 1500 list though the scar vets haven't been that killy so far, but at the same time the second skink cohort is fairly disposable. Having said that, it was my poor deployment and subsequent moves that led to the double charge, if the skinks hadn't fled from terror, the warchief steg would have been diverted.

I'm interested in opinions...

The saurus cavalry are another potential anti-stegadon character unit since they have the US to prevent autobreak and 4 can get into combat. More importantly, they can outdistance the stegadons if they do flee. 4 Saurus cavalry will cause an average of 3 wounds on the skink priest, but will be in trouble after that with S4 against T6.

Alternatively I could dump the cavalry and the skinks and an item or two and get a stegadon. Stubborn has been huge so far. I wouldn't take the stegadon warchief though since it doesn't fit with the fluff and its a combo everyone will be taking (albeit for good reason).

Kerill
29-03-2009, 14:22
Turned up at the store today but there were no players about. Little Sun came to the store but hadn’t brought his army, thankfully I’d brought my chaos models as well (was hoping to try out my new WOC list) so we got another game in, him with his new anti-lizard list.

Khwar-Tsu, surveyed the encampment ahead, the master had ordered him to return as soon as possible, this would be the raid into the realm of chaos, this was good, he missed the steaming jungles, this freezing chaotic wilderness made him torpid and froze his nasal membranes. The tribe ahead whilst not possessed of the green stone the master coveted had many warmbloods for capture and more of the twisted beasts that would rend and slobber at the foe until hacked to shreds. He motioned with a foreclaw for the attack to begin.

He had:

Wulfrik (not using special deployment rules) chose the engine priest for challenging.
Sorceror of Tzeentch, level 2, book of secrets: steed of shadows (general)
Sorceror, level 2 (fire), power familiar
10 knights of nurgle, not sure what they had
5 marauder horsemen, musician, flail
15 chaos warriors, FC
20 marauders, musician
5 chaos hounds
2 spawn

I had the same list as usual.

Khwar-Tzu (scar vet), chaos armour, firestorm blade (maiming shield, burning blade, light armour )
Dhaak Fhor (Scar vet), bsb, GW, enchanted shield, light armour
Level 2 skink priest on spawnbeast with warpstone brazier, spell familiar and scroll (EOTG, tepoc and scroll). Spells- 1,2 and 5
16 spear saurus, FC
10 spear saurus
11 skink skirmishers
10 skink skirmishers
10 skink cohort
3 Disc riders (terradons)
3 Disc riders (terradons)
Salamander

His Tzeentch mage got flickering, baleful and steed of shadows
Fire mage got wall of fire and fireball

My priest got comet, second sign and 6+ lightning bolt.

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/latestbattle.jpg


Spear saurus- dark blue
Engine- black
Skinks- light blue
Terradons- green
Salamander- red

Chaos knights- red
Chaos warriors with tzeentch mage and wulfrik- black
Hounds- pink
Marauders with general- brown
Marauder horsemen- brown


He won the roll for first turn.

He advanced 8” with his whole line excep the horsemen and hounds next to the forest who moved up more slowly to prevent a first turn death by terradons. I dispelled his magic missiles, terradons passed the Ld test for baleful transmogrification. He cast steed of shadows on wulfrik who charged my skinks on the left who stood and shot (harming nothing). I’d considered he might try this so I’d made sure the closest model to him would mean an overrun wouldn’t go into the terradons. In combat wulrfrik hits and wounds 4 times, my skirmishers flee 1” and are run down.

Lizards Turn 1

My skirmishers and salamanders on the right move up through the forest, my right hand terradons don’t move, content to wait for the horsemen to try and take part on the battle. Left hand salamanders drop rocks on wulfrik killing him. The rest of my line shuffles slightly. Magic and I cast comet with 4 dice getting 16, he rolls 4 dice and gets 15, comet marker goes down just in front of the right hand spawn. Fail to cast second sign on one die. Salamander misfires and eats the 3 crew (any time it’s a misfire it never fails to eat all 3, probably my fault more making such a big nasty-looking critter), fails Ld test and rolls a 6 for monster reaction- now it has fighting stats to complement its appearance. Skinks kill a marauder.

WOC turn 2

Comet comes down, 3” range and kills 3 dogs, the spawn and 3 marauders. Dogs pass panic. His line moves up, hounds slipping past to the front of the marauders. Marauder horsemen move forward near the forest. Knights are now easily in charge range of my infantry. Magic is dispelled (use a scroll) except for steed of shadows but his general has nothing useful to do with his flight move and just stays where he is.

Lizzies turn 2

Salamander charges hounds who fail fear but hold. Countermeasures time, cohort adds a rank and wheels its right corner so the unit is 90 degrees to the 10 man spear saurus suicide squad which moves up a few inches. This allows the engine to sneak into the corner area between the units so that whichever way the knights charge they will miss it with their overrun/pursuit. (although I didn’t think the knights could charge the cohort without hitting suicide saurus first, my bsb was in the farthest corner of my saurus just in case with general at the other end). Left hand terradons moved to march block the warriors whilst being immune to a charge from the spawn (spawn moving in the compulsory movement part of the phase is a huge issue I have with them). Right hand terradons fly up through the forest to land beside the marauder horsemen. Magic sees the burning alignment go off on the knights and surviving spawn and cause no wounds to the knights and no wounds to the spawn. Magic saw me cast lightning at the marauder horse (dispelled) then cast second sign and get 1 re-roll. Shooting had little effectIn combat the salamander killed the 2 dogs (with help from my second sign re-roll) and overrun into his marauders in b-t-b with his general. Shooting sees a marauder horseman go down from skinks. The skink cohort throws 5 javelins at his knights. 3 poison hits, 3 failed saves, failed panic test, knights run and get crossfired by terradons behind warriors.
- at this point I felt a bit crappy, he looked shocked and then asked me if I had accounted for the mark of nurgle (in fact it would have made no difference with 6’s to hit) but I said no and re-rolled my hits and got 0 wounds and the battle could continue.

WOC Turn 3

He declares a charge on the suicide saurus with his knights (they pass fear test) and hold. His marauder horsemen move back a bit. The other spawn also heads towards the suicide saurus but is quite a bit short. Magic sees his general fly out to get LOS to cast spells and flickering fire is cast at the engine (dispelled) and baleful is cast at the big unit of spear saurus (Ld test passed). In combat the knights kill 5 spear saurus, they need snake eyes and fail twice. They pursue and run down the spear saurus (snake eyes for the fleeing suicide saurus, they really do believe in harikiri) knights go 10”. In the other combat the frenzied salamander kills his general.
- at this point I asked him if he knew he could have moved his general to the other side of the unit from the salamander in his M phase since I guessed he didn’t (quite new player) so I let him move his general and the salamander kills two marauders instead, loses combat and holds.

Lizzies Turn 3

I move the engine back 6” towards the chaos knights rear, moving so the unit can’t wheel or do anything except reform or move forward (it can’t even wheel since there are 3 knights in the back 1” away from the engine. I also move my general out of the saurus regiment so he can charge in to support the engine in my next turn. Terradons overfly and kill the marauder horsemen with rocks. Cohort skinks move to throw javelins at the spawn. Magic sees the engine again fail to kill a single knight. Magic is dispelled or fails to cast. Shooting fails to wound anything.

WOC Turn 4

He reforms the knights, warriors continue their slow march blocked attempts to reach some kind of battle. The spawn successfully charges the skink cohort who do nothing with their stand and shoot. His general moves out of the way of the knights potential fleeing/EOTG overrun. Magic sees a fireball get off on my skink skirmishers, 5 die, panic and never rally for the rest of the battle. The spawn kills 2 skinks and it’s a drawn combat.

Lizzies Turn 4

Engine and general charge the knights, who hold (otherwise flee off the board). The terradons set up to charge his marauders front and rear (since the spawn was no longer a danger to the terradons). In combat the engine and general killed 4 knights, they broke and fled off the board, both my units deidn’t pursue (test passed). Spawn and skink cohort exchange blows, another drawn combat (1 more dead skink). Salamander rallied this turn.

WOC Turn 5

His warriors continue to plod towards the action in the distance, marauders have no way out of the double charge conundrum except to turn so I only have front and flank charges. In magic his general flies back to rejoin his warrior buddies.

Lizzies Turn 5

Terradons double charge the remaining marauders (about 10-12 left at this point)Engine moves back towards the centre of the field, salamander moves to get a shot on the chaos warriors. Magic sees burning alignment kill the spawn. Shooting and the salamander misfires again but lacks the tasty skink snacks this time round. Combat and 5 marauders fall and the sorcerer kills a terradon in return. I have 5 kills, US and flank charge, he breaks and the terradons run them down easily (well one unit did easily, the other only pursued 4”).

WOC 6

His warriors don’t bother moving (last turn and what not) they just reform to face the engine. His spells are dispelled.

Lizzies Turn 6

I am in position to double charge his flank with terradons and skink cohort and frontal charge from engine, decide not to risk it and engine and salamander them to death. Engine fails to kill any warriors and he calls the game before my salamander has a chance to redeem itself.

2521 Khwar-tsu will soon return to my demesne and his raids have been successful in the extreme, with more warpstone for sorcery and stimulating the spawning pools, firewyrms and spawn that I can subdue for use in the army. The hundreds of captured slaves will also allow me to release more of the city’s skinks for fighting and scouting. More importantly with my full force assembled together again I can hold my lands more securely. I have scryed the future for matters of import, and it seems the future holds an event of cosmic importance, the Everchosen is on the move in the Northern hemisphere and the winds of chaos from the polar gates are waxing in strength. I have decided to seek allies, both to prepare for the coming storm, and to aid my efforts in general, as I have more than one enemy, allies are needed. I have used a daemon emissary to contact another follower of great Tzeentch far to the north, in the centre of the empire, nothing has been decided yet but I have no shortage of knowledge and artefacts for trade, and he, this “Mindwarper” claims he does too…

This one lasted a bit longer, and, despite the wasted points on wulfrik (flying out wasn’t a great idea but otherwise he never would have got into battle anyway, at least he got 70 points back) and deploying warriors on the flank it shows the issues WOC has against lizardmen again. WOC simply can’t get into a favourable combat against lizardmen. I don’t think my lizzie list is particularly cheesey nor is it a tailored anti-WOC build but even if he had deployed the warriors more centrally and knights on the flank, the knights never would have made it into combat between skinks and terradons forcing them to redirect and the warriors would have been decimated on the way in and ended up with an engine in the flank and saurus spears to the front. This was despite the engine steadfastly doing almost nothing with the burning alignment. Would have had a better chance and killed a bit more of my support units but still would have lost convincingly. Marauder horsemen can technically take out my redirection cohort but as soon as they move more than 8” onto the battlefield they will get terradonned to death, and even on the charge breaking the cohort is not guaranteed with Ld, bsb, cold blooded and stand and shoot killing 2 horsemen on average. At 2000 points and above it’s probably worse since lore of metal slann will be cutting knights to pieces at range and a TG unit with +7 static CR can easily hold and break 6 Khorne Knights even if charged. More magic would help him at 1500 points though, with only the engine 10 PD of magic would get a lot more through.


Anyway I'll be cracking the WOC back out again for more battles, especially against Little Sun, although I hope to get more 2250 battles in with the lizards in future or 1500 point battles against things other than WOC to see if it holds up as well against other armies. My WOC fluff will need a bit of work though to fit with the new edition.

RaZeR
29-06-2009, 13:57
o/
Nice stuff :)
Found a link to this somewhere in your Mindwarper thread, sorry for the threadomancy...
Loving the fluff and the idea of chaos lizards. Given that I used to have lizardmen, and now I have WoC, it works very nicely for me :)
Seeing as you're taking a small break from your WoC, are we going to see a revival of this log? :)

Kerill
29-06-2009, 14:03
2521
The incursions of chaos have indeed been growing in number and power, both at the North Polar gate, and near my own realm in the southlands. A host of daemons and their mortal followers had set sail towards my land but my sorcery combined with Vilreth’s astromancy split their fleet, blowing the mortals further east so the daemons would make landfall first. Guided by our sorcerous winds I know exactly where they will make landfall and I have marched a force to the shore to intercept and destroy the daemons before their mortal reinforcements can arrive. I have brought Khwarr-Tsu and Vilreth with me, leaving the remainder of my forces with Dhaak Fhor and Velmar to guard the Northern borders with the Slann, although it seems events unfolding at the Northern chaos gate are demanding their attention for now.

So my Chaos lizards are coming out to play again for a while, had two games yesterday, one against Chaos Daemons and one against WOC, both 2250 points, I'll try and add the report soon. This was my list for both games:

Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, The draining amulet, power stone, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery, rod of change.
(Slann mage priest with 2 power stones, cube of darkness, bane head, rod of the storm bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, becalming cogitation, know all spells) 510 points
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG)-405
Khwarr-Tsu, scar vet, chaos armour (l armour) GW, shield, daemonsteed amulet (jaguar charm) 124 points

10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 Skink Cohort 50
16 Spear Saurus, FC 222

5 Saurus Cavalry 175
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
16 Black Saurus (Temple Guard) FC 291

Salamander pack 75
Salamander pack 75

Total: 2247
PD: 9
DD: 6
Models: 85

RaZeR
29-06-2009, 14:06
Cool, I was right :D

Quick question though, is the Slann (equivalent) allowed to take the magic banner as well as other magic items? I thought if a BSB took a magic banner they weren't allowed other magic items. I'm guessing it's a special rule of the Slann though, similar to allowing him to be general and BSB...

Kerill
29-06-2009, 14:32
Cool, I was right :D

Quick question though, is the Slann (equivalent) allowed to take the magic banner as well as other magic items? I thought if a BSB took a magic banner they weren't allowed other magic items. I'm guessing it's a special rule of the Slann though, similar to allowing him to be general and BSB...

You were indeed- posting at the same time as me it seems:). And yes the slann has a special rule to allow the magic banner in addition to other items, you don't have the lizzie book?

Dragune
30-06-2009, 00:34
Those were really good battle reports to read. I also like how you did your fluff stuff, I'm thinking about doing something similar to that now.

I also liked your terradons :p

Can't wait to read more :D

RaZeR
30-06-2009, 03:06
I have the 6th ed lizzie book, but havent looked at it in a few years :p
Some really nice conversions here too :)

Dungeon_Lawyer
30-06-2009, 14:52
Cool reports, I really enjoyed that lizzie on lizzie action-----I would not get too obsessed with trying to figure out ways to kill that skink on the eotg however. Most of the time a bane-headed skink priest who has multiple spells /sotf cast upon it is going to go down down, you just run into one of the instances where it did not-----the blood statuette of spite+ bane head combo should do the trick nicely however.....sure to pull out a scroll in the least if not.....bombing runs with the terradons who can then march block it (thus preventing it from moving quickly towards your lines to hit them with burning alignment, may also work) Another thing I have thought of (thought not tried) is to equip a skink hero on terradon with the sword that gives him killing blow, cast portent of far and 2nd sign for him (just in case) and then challenge that preist.......just some ideas.....

good luck in these upcoming battles against chaos deamons and mortals---will their be pics? Maybe pics of deployment too? Those jpegs with the blocks and block scenary are kind of hard to follow-An actual pic just seems so much easier for you and clearer for us who luv reading these batreps....

anyway, again, good luck

Kerill
02-07-2009, 03:44
@Dragune, cheers mate, and the more battle reports we have on this forum the better :)
@Razer thanks, oh and check your pms


Cool reports, I really enjoyed that lizzie on lizzie action-----I would not get too obsessed with trying to figure out ways to kill that skink on the eotg however. Most of the time a bane-headed skink priest who has multiple spells /sotf cast upon it is going to go down down, you just run into one of the instances where it did not-----the blood statuette of spite+ bane head combo should do the trick nicely however.....sure to pull out a scroll in the least if not.....bombing runs with the terradons who can then march block it (thus preventing it from moving quickly towards your lines to hit them with burning alignment, may also work) Another thing I have thought of (thought not tried) is to equip a skink hero on terradon with the sword that gives him killing blow, cast portent of far and 2nd sign for him (just in case) and then challenge that preist.......just some ideas.....

good luck in these upcoming battles against chaos deamons and mortals---will their be pics? Maybe pics of deployment too? Those jpegs with the blocks and block scenary are kind of hard to follow-An actual pic just seems so much easier for you and clearer for us who luv reading these batreps....

anyway, again, good luck

No piccies for these battle reports I'm afraid but I will take some this weekend (against ogre kingdoms and probably WOC as well). Half the army is still unpainted though (I tend to paint in bursts, did a week of painting nothing but blue then burned out!) and the ogres will be mostly proxied since the guy doesn't actually have an army yet, just trying different ones to see which one he will collect. Yeah the priest was lucky to survive and I think adding in the second bound spell is a bit of overkill so I went with more troops. As it is the magic level of my army (even with just one engine) is getting to close to the overpowered level IMO.

So I'll take pics but they won't be too attractive :eyebrows:

Kerill
02-07-2009, 06:05
Well onto the battles, fuzzy though some details are now :)

The daemon army was:

Skulltaker on jugger (led blood crushers)
Khorne herald bsb, jugger, firestorm blade, armour of khorne: standard of sundering (led bloodletters)
Herald of Tzeentch, spell breaker, flames of Tzeentch
Herald of Tzeentch, spell breaker, flames of Tzeentch

11 Horrors
11 Horrors
20 bloodletters, FC: skull totem

5 Seekers, champ, musician, standard: siren
4 Screamers
4 Screamers
(I'd told him screamers wouldn't be a good idea against lizards but I think he didn't read the fine print about forests.

6 Flamers
3 Bloodcrushers, standard, champ: icon of endless war.

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/lizardsvsdaemons.jpg

Lizzies:
Skinks: light blue
Temple Guard with slann: dark blue
Spear Saurus with scar vet: black
Engine: Black
Terradons: green
Salamander packs: red

Daemons:
Bloodcrushers with skulltaker: red
Seekers of Slaanesh: pink
Flamers: light blue
Screamers: blue
Horrors with heralds: blue

I went with my usual deployment of my lizards, annoyance units on the flanks, then the temple guard, saurus spears and engine on the flank away from the hard hitters. Buggered up the deployment diagram- the space in front of the temple guard is where the saurus cavalry were (definitely something to be said for taking pictures :) ). The army has 8 throwaway deployables before I set down the main two units which is enough against elite armies to ensure I get to deploy them where I want. Engine goes between the two infantry units to countercharge if need be and so it can't get charged. This has a potentially big downside since the engine cannot pivot when in between the two blocks.

I won roll for first turn:

Lizards turn 1

The temple guard, spear saurus and engine move up cautiously whilst my terradons, skinks and salamanders move and fill up the forests. The saurus cav barrel towards the horrors on the left flank at full speed, hoping the seekers would be foolish enough to charge them..
In magic my advance had been too cautious and most magic was out of range. Used the rod of the storm but it was dispelled. Declared a magical charge with the scar vet on the seekers but he too was out of range so was left sitting 3" in front of the seekers.

Daemons 1

The crushers move up 14". The march blocked seekers move over to the right hand side. Left hand horrors move back two inches, right hand ones barely move. Right side screamers fly over the forest (and he learns they can't hit the units in the forest), left side ones fly to a central position. His bloodletters are immune to the march blocking scar vet due to their standard and move up a full 10" towards my infantry blocks. His magic is dispelled but draws my scroll (flickering fire at the scar vet).Shoots at scar vet with flamers ( causing 1 wound) magic is dispelled (scroll drawn)

Lizards 2

The skink cohort moves to redirect the bloodcrushers towards the centre of the field. Right hand terradons drop rocks on the screamers, killing 2. My infantry blocks wheel slightly. Scar vet doesn't charge the flamers since the stand and shoot would probably kill him. Saurus cavalry move their full 14" towards the left hand horrors. In the magic phase the scar vet magically charges the flamers, hopefully he will last a round or two and thus keep the flamers from achieving much in the battle. My other magic is mostly dispelled but both his spellbreakers are now gone. In combat the scar vet kills a flamer and puts a wound on another. HW+sh save means he survives the return attacks. Shooting sees the right hand salamander flame two horrors and the skink skirmishers finish off the screamers.

Daemons 2

Bloodletters move up close to my infantry line, inviting charges from my three units (and then a planned flanking move with the cruchers) Crushers and seekers charge cohort, wipe them out and crushers overrun into the side of letters offering their flank to the saurus spears Seekers overrun to behind my lines. In combat scar vet dies.

Lizards 3

CHARGE!!! Saurus cavalry charge the horrors. As do the left hand terradons in the flank. Spear saurus charge the flank of the crushers. Temple giard and engine combo charge the bloodletters (priest would be facing the herald and would die but I needed to cause casualties early so my static CR would count later. Right hand terradons overfly and drop rocks on the seekers killing all but the champ. In magic burning alignment puts a wound on a crusher and kills 3 letters. My magic is dispelled (4 dice at ROBI on the herald I had bane headed at the start of the battle but he passed his ward save). Shooting sees shots at horrors and flame template killing a couple. In combat priest dies in challenge but so do a lot of letters- rolled 7 impact hits and the temple guard direct almost alltheir attacks on the bloodletter champion in preparation for the next round. The letters lose by a lot but roll well for instability and only 2 more die. Crushers lose combat, but kill 2 saurus. One crusher dies from instability, another takes a wound. 3 of saurus cavalry direct all their attacks at the herald, cold ones against rn-f. The herald only takes one wound and 2 horrors are killed from the remaining attacks the the terradons. He passes instability with no further casualties.

Daemons 3

Right hand horrors charge the skink skirmishers (flee). Screamers fly to behind my lines but have no viable targets to attack with their flying move. Magic is dispelled (since the left hand herald and horrors are stuck in combat) Combat sees 4 saurus die but they kill the the crusher champ in return meaning skulltaker moves up. I win due to musician but the crushers pass instability. Letters lose again (I challenged with the temple guard champ which meant his herald was forced to accept since I'd killed the bloodletter champ previous round). And there are only 7 or 8 left. Flamers chase and burn salamander pack killing the handlers and putting one wound on the bugger. Tzeentch herald in combat with saurus once again survives the 9 attacks against him and only 2 horrors drop and pass instability again.

Lizards 4

Terradons charge the screamers. Sallie charges flamers and the skinks rally. Right hand salamander breathes on the horrors, reduced to 5 horrors now so no longer a mage. Magic sees me get off the -1 to hit wound and AS on the letters which I subequently forgot about in the combat phase. Combat sees the Tzeentch herald finally die and both the horrors and bloodletters pop from instability. Skulltaker kills 4 saurus but the saurus pass break test. Terradons kill a two screamers and take a wound in return but the seekers pass instability on skulltakers Ld. Sallie dies in combat, the only wound it caused being saved by the 5+ ward.

Daemons 4

Seeker champ charges terradons, and wins convincingly but they hold, he has 1 screamer left and I have two terradons, so I have US4 to his 3. Skulltaker kills the saurus champ three times over (I challenged since my saurus were getting very thin on the ground. I win combat due to musician but he passes instability.

Lizards 5

Engine charges crushers killing skulltaker and other crusher with impact hits.
Game called at this point. Massacre to the lizards

Post game thoughts:

Certainly not the hardest daemon list in the world, but Craig wanted to try the units he hadn;t used in the previous battle. Deployment of the flamers so far back meant they never really got to do anything dangerous, although they got their points back with the scar vet and salamander. Still the scar vet did his job despite my mistakes. The bloodcrushers should probably not have overrun but if they hadn't they would have been redirected back towards his table edge by the terradons or forced to sit there until the flamers arrived to take care of the terradons. My range estimation first turn was **** poor as well so one phase of magic was wasted.

2521
Despite a deep wound through the lung Vilreth has survived thanks to more than a little magical assistance. Whilst not fully healed he will be able to take part in the assault on the mortal force. They are marching down the shoreline towards us even now, tomorrow will certainly see the battle played out.

Lizards vs Little Sun's WOC

Little Sun's army:

Level 4 Sorceror lord of tzeentch, infernal puppet, book of secrets, homunculus, chaos dragon
Level 2 sorceror of nurgle, scroll, power familiar, barded steed
Exalted bsb of Tzeentch, disk, shield, flail, banner of wrath

10 marauders, flails, musician
10 marauders, flails
5 Marauder horsemen, flails, musician
5 warhounds
5 warhounds

6 Khorne Knights, standard: rapturous
6 Unmarked knights, standard: rage

Chaos Giant

Deployment:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/lizardsvsdragwoc.jpg

This time I had a lake on the right hand side as well as a forest. My deployment ended up almost identical to the previous battle (saurus cav are again in front of the temple guard. His knights being on the flanks meant I was pretty confident I could lead at least one unit into the forest/lake probably both whilst the left hand ones would be facing a shedload of magic and I had both the saurus cavalry and the skink cohort for emergency redirection. Even if they got through all that they would be unable to break the TG and would be butchered by the engines countercharge and burning alignment. Giant could be missiled/poisoned to death or redirected. The only danger really was the dragon.



Brown- marauders/ marauder horsemen
Red- Khorne Cavalry/Unmarked cavalry with banner of rage (joined by nurgle sorceror)
Pink- warhounds
Black- chaos giant
Dark blue monster base- dragon
Light blue monster base- bsb on disk

I bane headed his sorceror lord on dragon.

He got pandemonium, flickering, gateway, treason and drain life for his sorceror lord. The other sorceror had buboes and the 4+ regen spell.

I won the rather important roll for first turn.
I took lore of metal
Skink priest got lightning bolt, second sign and portent (swapped comet for portent)
Since our group is not fully decided on whether or not non magic missiles count as a "ranged attack" (damn GW and their dodgy wording) we rolled and it came up that they were a ranged attack so the engine would provide a 5+ ward against WOC damage spells. Incidentally we roll every battle since I am the one convinced that spells shouldn't count as a ranged attack whereas several of the other players think they should count. Whilst the RAW is up in the air on this one, I reckon that since only lizards and vamps have "ranged attack" protection and they are both strong armies from a fairness point of view ranged attacks should not include them.

Liz Turn 1

Infantry blocks and engine move up 4" to get the knights in range of the slann's magic. Saurus cavalry and cohort in front for redirecting. Left hand terradons, sallie and skinks move into the forest, right hand ones move into the lake, terradons into the forest. In magic I the scar vet tries to charge the musicianless marauders (since I knew in this kind of combat the musician makes a big difference) but is 1/2 inch short (again!). My magic is largely dispelled but his scroll is drawn. Rod of the storm goes off on his left hand knights but I roll 1 hit and fail to wound. The giant takes 2 wounds from 2D6 S4 magic missile. I keep my powerstone back for a nasty surprise in future.

WOC Turn 1

The musicianless marauders charge my scar vet. His left hand flank moves up at full speed hoping my saurus cav will charge the hounds and overrun into his knights (no way I would be taking that bait!), dragon flies forward to breathe on the salamander pack, terradons and skinks clustered in the forest. His centre and right hand is march blocked by the scar vet which seriously impedes their advance. His magic is dispelled (drawing my scroll) except drain life which kills a terradon, 2 skinks, a handler and puts a wound on the salamander. Breath attacks puts a wound on the terraons, kills another skink or two and the remaining two handlers (monster reaction test passed on slann's Ld). Panic tests also passed. The exalted roars at the In combat the marauders put a wound on the scar vet but he kills 3 in return- drawn combat (he had ranks and US and of course, no musician :) )

Lizards turn 2

Liz 2

Right hand terradons rocked the to death.warhounds and poisoned the cavalry. On other flank move saurus cav to block warhounds and since there are only two left he can't see past the warhounds to charge with the knights. All of of my magic was dispelled except I put 2 more wounds on giant then I used the slann's last die +power stone + freebie to wipe out the left hand knights with spirit of the forge. Left hand sallie flamed the musician marauders killing lots, but they pass panic. Left hand skink shooting is too effective for my liking killing all the hounds leaving the cav open to charge by giant. Shooting put a wound on dragon rider. 2 D6 S4 Magic missile kills the exalted. Scar vet breaks marauders in combat and runs them down.

WOC2

Knights march blocked move up 7”. Giant charges cav and the nurgle sorceror, frenzied by the banner is just withing charge range (although unit is not) so is forced to charge out at the saurus cav. Needless to say, they flee. The dragon flies to the flank of the temple guard. Magic is dispelled, including gateway (despite becalming he got 20 on his roll with five dice, I was fortunate enough to roll doule 6's with my four DD).

LIZ 3

Engine charges giant. I moved the temple guard in such a way that the dragon would frontal charge but they could also see the flank of the engine in case the dragon charged it next turn. Skinks move out of lake, carefully positioned so the nearest skirmisher to the hounds was in the direction of the lake. Scar vet magically charges giant (passed terror). In magic the bane-headed sorcerer lord was killed by a magic missile, and put 1 wound on the dragon. Alignment killed the nurgle sorceror. Shooting sees the right hand salamander and skinks shoot the knights but to no avail. In combat impact hits kill the giant.

WOC 3

Dragon charges the TG , it turned out I hadn't wheeled them quite enough so it was a flank charge (it was so close I called in Craig to decide and he said it was a flank charge. Props to little Sun who, although he thought it was a flank charge was going to let it go as a frontal charge (which I thought it was) before I called Craig in. Really quite fortunate with most of the gaming group- they play very fair and are reasonable about all situations. Knights charge skinks (flee) stop at lake edge. In combat the Dragon causes 3 wounds to the slann (I tend to run the slann on the edge of the second rank in case of miscasts, my poor judgement showed the flaw in always doing that here), I fail all 3 ward saves. Halberd wielding TG put a wound on dragon. Dragon loses but passes break test. Unit turns to face the dragon (so no more flank bonus)

Liz 4

Engine turns to get a flank charge on giant. Magic sees flying charge of scar vet on the dragon. In magic I give the dragon -1As -1 to hit and -1 to wound and then forget about it in the combat phase I also cast Portent of far on TG.. Combat sees 3 wounds put on dragon by scar vet with his great weapon. Dragon puts 2 wounds on slann, I save one. Dragon is reduced to final wound by TG loses by lots and breaks and is run down by scar vet.

Game called

Well I rolled very well that game whilst after his first turn little sun rolled average and didn't really get much opportunity to roll any dice at all. He also failed some crucial saves- the disk exalted's death to a 2D6 S4 magic missile and the sorceror lord dieing the same way (the majority of the hits were allocated on the rider) The battle was more or less lost at deployment- having the frenzied knights to the sides near the terrain is an almost guaranteed way to have them led off through the forests, and even if I had lost the slann to the dragon it would have been a massacre in my favour by a fair margin. Whilst I sometimes place my khorne knights on a flank like this with WOC they are not my main hitters and indeed seldom survive long enough to actually reach combat. The left since knights would also have ended up in the forest as well as long as the skink skirmishers pass their Ld9 fear test to charge the flank. As it was they were destroyed by magic.

The scar vet was amazing in this game. I had uhmmed and ahhed for a long time about whether to add him to the list but he did really well this game- in particular for march blocking the WOC battle line on the right flank first turn and then using his 360 degree line of sight to help out in combats later (although he wasn't needed against the giant). 124 points of throw away handy goodness. Will also do well against gunlines I reckon as a war machine hunter.

WOC vs. Lizzies issue

When I first got my hands on the lizard book I felt the WOC vs lizzie battles would be close and bloody affairs. Having played many battles on both sides it has become clear that WOC really have an uphill struggle against slann and engine led lizards, especially if you go the knights ftw! route. A lucky gateway could spell doom for the slann of course but it's not that likely unless you have a Daemon prince and can place him within 24" of the temple guard bit more than 24" of the slann- I certainly wouldn't be able to judge that every turn (or even near to that). First couple of turns its doable if he's deployed opposite them, but later on? Also a whole game decided on that spell getting S10+ well...

Frenzy is also a sharply double edged sword against lizards. On the one hand, without frenzy knights can't cut through spear saurus or TG well enough to win or win by a large margin. With frenzy they are far to prone to being led off and with terradons and skink skirmishers its very easy to destroy the screening units and lead them off. This is made worse in some respect by the terrain placement rules. Going by the rulebook the WOC will be advancing in a 24" wide corridor between terrain. Terrain placed by a third party would probably be a lot fairer to WOC in this situation.

ATM I think my WOC list has a decent chance at taking down lizards (despite its failue last battle) and a scroll caddy army (might need 3 caddies though) with a fighty khorne exalted should also be in with a chance. Most builds I see though online will struggle I feel. Definitely the army for WOC to beat (but also the most fun to play against with my WOC I reckon).

Spawn/Scyla Anfingrimm and maybe wulfrik could all help as well, especially scyla but spawn seem to have gone out of fashion somewhat since everything is much hittier in 7th edition than before. Generally though, gateway or no WOC will lose the magic war against slann led lizards since even if both sides can get off an equal number of spells the high point value of WOC and the power of lore of metal against them means its an uphill battle. Pandemonium is without a doubt the most important spell against a slann. Woe betide the tzeentch sorceror lord who doesn't get it.

Kerill
02-07-2009, 06:22
Next week craig will be trying out ogres and I guess little Sun will bring his WOC again. Craig only learned to play warhammer two weeks ago and has only three battles under his belt, and little sun has only been playing a few months so I won't be bringing Aethric's army to battle since WOC and ogres will really struggle against it. Instead I'll be using one of the supporting cast and his medium magic army to battle. It's got a much higher model count and a few nasty tricks up its sleeve but is, all in all, not such a struggle so there will be more fun on both sides (I hope).

The army will be led by the second of the leaders of the black sauris Dhak-Forr and the Tzeentchian mage Velmar. Velmar is using the truthsayer rules, but in case you don't have them, here are the rules following fluff changes:

Velmar, sorceror of Tzeentch:
M4, Ws4, S4, T4, W3, I4 A2 Ld9(pretty close to a chaos mage)
He carries the ensorcelled robes of change, and sceptre of draining :
Ensorcelled robes of change: These robes provide Velmar with a 4+ ward save
Sceptre of draining: Counts as a halberd in combat, adds +1 to dispel rolls.
Velmar is a level 3 mage and gets to roll on the following spell chart:

1) The twisted darts 5+ 24" range
Darts of pure change erupt from the casters hand, each tiny dart filled with the essence of change. Wherever the darts strike the targets flesh uncontrollable change occurs, sometimes mutations or extra limbs and digits will form, sometimes the flesh will melt or turn to dust or a cerulean gas. The darts cause 2D6 S2 hits. Magic missile
2) Yellow Fire of Tzeentch 6+ Infinit range
A mystic shield of pure energy forms around the target unit granting them a 5+ ward save until the casters next turn
3) Aekhold's Breath of life 7+
Across the battlefield the power of Tzeentch pulls the dead back to the world of the living. Every unit on both sides that has lost a model gets one back. Models with 4+ wounds regain one wound instead.
4) Tzeentch's Favour
Tzeentch blesses the unit with his favour, attacks from the unit slip under shields and into the joints of armour, ricocheting past parries to take the foe in the throat or face. The unit gains +1 to hit (Remains in play)
5) Curse of knowledge- Infinite range 8+
Tzeentch grants the unit a temporary understanding of the full scale of the cosmos and their pitiful insignificance therein. This understanding of the meaninglessness of their life or death means the unit cares not whether they live or die and will fight until their meaningless death occurs. The unit becomes unbreakable. If cast on a fleeing unit they rally immediately and become unbreakable.
6) Mindless confusion 9+ Infinite range
The minds of the affected are afflicted with terrors, hallucinations and an overwhelming assault of differing emotions. Only the most strong willed can do anything but drool mindlessly under this assault. The target unit takes a Ld test. If failed they cannot move or shoot in its next turn.
In addition he also knows the additional spell:
Succour of the failed ones 6+ 18" range
A chaos spawn targetted by this spell immediately regains D3 wounds as the power of change restores their twisted bodies and grants them even further mutation.

The army list:

Velmar, ensorcelled robes of change, staff of draining . 265
Dhaak-Forr, Scar Vet, chaos armour (scaly skin+light armour), shield, bsb, GW, cursing eye (bane head) 151
Algrek, Level 2 skink priest, warpstone wand (diadem of power), scroll 150
Characters: 566

17 Spear Saurus, FC 234
17 Spear Saurus, standard, musician 222
17 skinks, 2 disk ogre (krox) cohort with full command 217
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
11 Skink cohort 55
Jungle Swarm 45
Core: 983

3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
6 Cold one cavalry, musician, standard: huanchis 265
Special: 445

3 Chaos Spawn (fenbeasts, unbreakable, M6, Ws3, S5, T5, W4, I2 A3, Ld10, if Velmar dies they also die, aquatic and gain 4+ regen when in marshes or bogs) 255
Rare: 255
PD: 7
DD:5 +diadem+scroll
Models: 113! (and basically every lizardmen miniature I have.
Deployables: 14 units :)

Fluff:

2251 (soon we will be moving in to "present time")

With the slann occupied by the polar gates and the great incursion to the North I have decided to send Velmar with a force to the Dragon Isles in the east. With sorcerous winds to aid the fleet's speed the journey time will be greatly reduced. From the lizardmen plaques it seems the saurus and skinks of that area were never under the reign of the slann and instead exist as small tribes of savages. Velmar's army will be easily able to deal with these tiny tribes I am sure, it also keeps him away from my human followers to prevent treachery there- the lizardmen are firmly under my mental grip. I have sent Algrek, the second of the skink priests birthed, with Velmar and crafted a warpstone impregnated wand which can be used not only to store magic, but also to allow me to link telepathically with him easily to keep an eye on the events there. Saurus and skinks mean spawning pools, and through the connection through Algrek and the wand I can impose my will upon any newly-spawned skinks and saurus. Gaining control of additional spawning pools will allow me to boost my armies in the years to come, necessary since even enhanced by warpstone the spawning pools of my city will always produce fewer soldiers than the combined pools of the other temple cities in the Southlands. Now whilst the Slann are preoccupied may prove my only chance to send off such a large part of my forces to put an outpost on the isle and the majority will need to return before the Incursion of this new Everchosen sees its end, regardless of whether the Everchosen is victorious or not. I must trust in Tzeentch that the creatures of the Dragon Isles are as scattered and divided as the plaques suggest.

Dungeon_Lawyer
02-07-2009, 21:25
nice win against DoC and as always love the fluff you provide-the musicians really helped in those drawn combats, too bad his rolling was for those instability tests---looking forward to this next battle.

I was taking unfantomable presence for my slann to protect against gateway and bulboes spam---but reading your post on the issue, yeah you may be right a deamon prince more than 24" away is porb the only viable caster able to get that off against a slann with the negate sixes ability...

cmac
03-07-2009, 11:41
Bloodletters move up close to my infantry line, inviting charges from my three units (and then a planned flanking move with the cruchers) Crushers and seekers charge cohort, wipe them out and crushers overrun into the side of letters offering their flank to the saurus spears Seekers overrun to behind my lines.


Hello, I was Demon player. I had grand plans of demolishing his expendibles with the screamers. Letting a wooded area go down either side of the middle was probably the game. Learning I couldnt bomb the woods, the trap was revealed. Basically I had to march through the middle taking the shots from the skirmishes and flamer templates. Ambush! I think I overestimated the power of the Salamanders and rushed forward too fast, the longer I took the more shots I would take and with the Herald marked it was a matter of time before his magic got me. I figured the longer I was stuck in the kill zone the less of a competitive unit I would have when I got into CC. Kerill uses baiting and misdirection very well and I haven't actually managed to get a charge off that I want yet. That's credit to his game.

I guess I was hopinh that the Khorne Herald and Skulltaker would win me the game.

Lessons of the game: Static CR is great, reading up tactica on baiting/misdirection is a must, watch out for lizzies in the woods, and keep something back to deal the the fast stuff that goes to harress my rear.

Giving up on Demons (don't want to be THAT guy) as further lists would probably degenerate into the "cookie cutter" tourney lists. And it's a social gaming environment with limited players. As my mandarin is poor (Kerill is good), he is my only opponent at the moment as the other english speaker is fascinated with the new IG codex at the moment (the Bret player).

Ogres are the next choice. The spawn can cause my MSU's quite a bit of damage, its tempting to try to go and kill that boss which will cause the spawn to go but I have a funny feeling that Kerill will have them at the back, causing me to head flat out again. Lets hope for a t1 or t2 miscast that kills him ;). Maybe i'll take a shooty ogre army and try to get him to come to me.

Playing against good generals is the best way to improve and learn the game.

Malorian
03-07-2009, 13:09
Just got around to reading these and was amazed at how many reports there are already.

The fluff is great and the reports are clear and nice to read.


Keep it up :)

Kerill
03-07-2009, 13:58
Ogres are the next choice. The spawn can cause my MSU's quite a bit of damage, its tempting to try to go and kill that boss which will cause the spawn to go but I have a funny feeling that Kerill will have them at the back, causing me to head flat out again. Lets hope for a t1 or t2 miscast that kills him ;). Maybe i'll take a shooty ogre army and try to get him to come to me.

Playing against good generals is the best way to improve and learn the game.

Well Zack will be back at some point and another of the Chinese guys has come back from Australia who can speak a bit. Little Sun (the WOC player from last week) actually has decent enough English too, he's just shy about using it ;)

The fenbeasts actually shouldn't prove that much of an issue for ogres- the characters and ironguts will cut through them pretty damn fast with multiple high S attacks. If a unit (especially bulls) gets flanked by them though they will be stuck there all game.

I'll probably plonk down a marsh when we are doing deployment so be careful of that flank since I'll definitely be wanting to send at least one fenbeast through there so it can't be charged. And some skinks to blowpipe stuff to death.

My characters will be desperately avoiding your tyrant if at all possible although the bsb might give your tyrant a go if he gets the charge (if a fenbeast can stick the unit in place for a turn). I'll try to slow down parts of your army so my blocks can deal with them one by one.

That's the basic plan anyway, the skinks poison will be very dangerous to the ogres btw due to their relative lack of armour, leadbelchers might help with that though.

Gut magic will be very important to boost your units pre combat and maybe also to survive poison bombardment.

The saurus blocks are pretty tough and without a bull charge ogre bulls will bounce off the saurus spears. Even ironguts will bounce if they don't have a character. With a character or with a gut magic boost though it's a different story.



@Malorian, thanks- although must of these are from a few months ago when I first got the lizards :)

Kerill
07-07-2009, 18:26
I’ll add th e report today and the fluff tomorrow (its late :) ) Decided to take pictures of deployment instead of making a gif but didn’t remember until the end of Craig’s movement phase (photo’s there). Apologies for the number of proxies and unpainted saurus in advance.

2251
En route to the island the flagship spotted a small squadron of High Elf dragonships on the horizon, possibly from the Tower of the Sun. The flagship, of course, is the repaired bretonnian man-o-war, and together with the shape of the ship, the bretonnian flags and a glamour cast by Velmar the foolish high elves did not investigate further. Even the simplest tricks of my lord can fool such haughty beings. It seems that the dragon isles are not as untamed as I had been led to believe. On the northernmost island where Velmar first landed he discovered a large ogre tribe- perhaps unsurprising considering how close the isles are to the Ogre Kingdoms. The ogres had brought up their crude catapults and, rather than risk the ships, Velmar was forced to assault the ogre position on the cliffs.

Whilst I can see the reason for seeking to gain control of the dragon isles, I have no doubt my "master" has had me lead this force is at least in large part through fear of treachery. Doubtless whether I succeed or die trying my master will be pleased. I have tried to break his control of Algrek, but to no avail- that bedamned amulet has repelled any subtle attacks I have tried and I dare not use more direct and forceful magic- Aethric would certainly feel such through his link- it seems I must drag this pathetic lizard spy with me. Perhaps he will do me the pleasure of dying in the coming battle. The ogres have strangely adopted a defensive position around the cliffs, doubtless they are awaiting reinforcements, I must strike decisively to destroy the catapults so the fleet can safely leave this isle, although I like not the necessity of my troops being forced to charge uphill to the attack.



Pre battle plan.

Upon craig’s choice of double layer hills both sides at the centre of the table and what he had told me before I know he was going to try an ogre gunline. Since I had more deployables I decided to use the march to lock down the maneaters on one flank with fenbeasts for long enough for the spear saurus led by the bsb to arrive whilst the skink saurus cavalry or skink cohort would take down the bulls. I planned to not engage at all on the flank with the tyrant since I had more shooting concentrated there and would redirect his unit away from the general’s unit of saurus spears if need be. The left hand fenbeast would be used to redirect or hold the trappers in place and march block his centre so my left hand shooting could do the job. Let’s see how it worked out.

I won the roll for first turn

Skink priest got portent of far and the comet
Velmar got the 5+ ward, Ld test to move/shoot and the 2D6S2 magic missile.

Lizards Turn 1

The saurus cavalry failed their stupidity test so the infantry trundled forward 3.5 inches. Everything else moved up full pelt, one unit of skink skirmishers and the skink cohort going into the marsh with a fell beast to either side. The left hand terradons rock three trappers to death who panic and flee into the skink skirmishers and die. Magic does nothing.

Ogres Turn 1

His bulls move to face the marsh and the beasties therein. The rest of the ogre gunline doesn’t move or shuffles a bit. These are the photos after the two movement phases:


In the first pic you can see the centre and left flank of my forces heading into the treeline with the stupid saurus cavalry and the infantry blocks on my centre right. The salamander spawn is a fen beast, the ogre is the jungle swarm (forgot to bring my jungle swarm).

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/myfirstturn1.jpg

On the double height hill on craigs side from left to right you can see the ogre bulls (the bats) with leadbelchers behind, the maneaters (minotaurs) with tyrant and butcher and the two scraplaunchers on the highest tier of the hill then the gnoblar fighters with the second unit of leadbelchers behind.



In the second pic you can see the marsh with the skink skirmishers and skink cohort with the two fenbeasts (one represented by a sallie, the other by a half finished disk ogre of Tzeentch). On his side you can see the maneaters with butcher (rat ogre), bruiser and maneaters (minotaurs) and the unit of bulls facing the marsh (WHQ minotaurs):

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/firstturn2.jpg

Third picture is of the gunline hill:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/firstturn3.jpg

Magic saw my scroll pulled and nothing else went through. Shooting saw both scraplaunchers scatter off target (thankfully, those 5” templates are scary). The maneaters on the left shot two skinks and the maneaters on the right shot and killed 3 of my saurus cavalry.

Lizards Turn 2

Saurus cav pass stupidity and move forward 10 inches, fen beasts move through the swamp so that one can charge the flank of the bulls, one the front and the saurus cavalry to the flank. The skink cohort wheels a bit to get the maneaters in the flank if they go after the saurus cavalry. The fenbeast on the left moves 12” towards the centre with an idea to hold up the gnoblar fighters for the rest of the game and march block the centre. Magic sees the comet go off but the right hand butcher uses it’s scroll.

Ogres Turn 2

Once again very little movement except the left hand leadbelchers move down into the forest and just about get into range of the terradons. The left hand butcher moves to join the right hand leadbelchers. Magic is dispelled. Shooting sees another saurus cavalry drop so no longer enough for the +1 for a flank charge. The leadbelchers kill one terradon and put a wound on the second one, they panic. One scraplauncher shot scatters off target, second one misfires, rolls a 2 and goes into the leadblechers who had shot the terradons killing both of them. This panics the tyrant with maneaters who then panics the gnoblars, the other maneaters and the right hand bulls. Then of course I remember that maneaters are ITP and nothing panics at all :)

Lizards turn 3

The two fenbeasts and the saurus cavalry all charge the right-hand bulls, the banner of huanchi adding a pathetic 1” to their charge move. The bulls flee and get away but one fenbeast can overrun into the flank of the maneaters. And the other one (I think, not sure) ran into the leadbelchers. The left hand fenbeast charges the gnoblar fighters. Terradons fly over bulls and drop rocks killing two of them. The skink cohort moves out threaten a flank charge on the maneaters in a turn or two if the fenbeasts hold up. To hold them in place. Magic again sees nothing go off (I’m saving 2 dice most turns). Shooting sees a couple of wounds from poison here and there including one on the tyrant. In combat the fenbeast fails to cause a wound to the bruiser and takes 2 in return. The other fenbeast also does nothing and suffers some wounds.

Ogres Turn 3

Bulls rally on the hill not far from the table edge and face my right flank. Fenbeast dies. The Tyrant charges out of his unit a the skink cohort who stand and shoot (doing nothing) and who were positioned to allow the tyrant to overrun into the flank rather than front of the general’s unit os saurus (fear of the tenderizer). A scraplauncher on the hill (I’d forgotten about) declares a charge on the saurus cavalry and hits them in the flank. Left hand maneatuers turned to shoot terradons, causing a wound. In combat the scraplauncher kills two saurus cavalry but they hold (a very important hold). The tyrant minces the skink cohort and the remaining two flee, tyrant pursues into the flank of the general’s unit.

Lizards turn 4

The spear saurus with scar vet bsb finally charge in against the maneaters The saurus cavalry turn right to face the side of the gnoblar fighters. The skink cohort charges the flank of the leadbelchers with butcher whose flank is pretty near the table edge and a unit of terradons moves to crossfire them. Magic sees nothing go off of note the 5+ ward save being dispelled shooting sees a couple of wounds on the left hand maneaters from the skinks poisoned shooting. In combat the scar vet and three saurus attack the maneaters and manage a single dismal wound from, the champion and other saurus attack the bruiser and fail to do anything. One maneater attacks the bsb in return (doing nothing against his T5 and 1+ save). The other two maneaters and bruiser kill 7 saurus spears. I lose and am now outnumbered, the saurus break and get away but give up the bsb and standard. In combat the tyrant kills 3 or 4 saurus spears but loses and holds. I turn the unit to face him (giving up the +1 static res in the hope of causing more wounds)

Ogres Turn 4

Maneaters flank charge saurus cavalry. Magic sees little go off. The saurus cavalry are butchered by the maneaters. Tyrant causes a couple of wounds in the other combat but takes one in return, loses and holds again.


Lizards 5

Skink skirmishers flank charge the gnoblar fighters. Jungle swarm charges the ogre bull left on the left for a giggle (ogre was on higher ground and had 3 wounds left). Skink cohort moves up to invite a charge from the bulls (was pretty confident with my static CR and kroxigor return attacks). One terradon moved to block maneaters from charging the bsb’s unit again. BSB’s unit rallies, now 5 wide. Magic sees the 5+ ward go off on the general’s unit of saurus spears. More poison shots at maneaters from the skinks kill them off. Poison shots at the ogres from the cohort don’t do anything. The gnoblar fighters lose 2 models to the fenbeast and break, panicking the scraplauncher which flees into my skink skirmishers and dies (had to check the rulebook at this point, and found it very strange that it didn’t cause impact hits because the skirmishers were US5+, weird rule that). The tyrant fails to cause any wounds (one saved by armour, one by the 5+ ward) and takes 1 or 2 in return, breaks, flees and is run down. The jungle swarm kills the ogre bull with poison attacks.

* Just realised that the scraplauncher would not have taken a panic test. For some reason I thought only ogre units were immune to their panic, in fact it’s all their units. Had the scraplauncher survived it could have charged the terradon (had the maneaters not also charged it the next turn) and got enemy in the way against the bsb’s saurus spears (would probably have got them down to half strength so an extra 100 VPs but be autopopped by the bsb’s great weapon) Otherwise Craig would have had an extra 165 VPs at the end.

Ogres Turn 5

The maneaters charge the terradon (flees) and redirect into the fenbeast. The ogre bulls charge the skink cohort. In combat the maneaters destroy the fenbeast and overrun into the skink skirmishers (who flee but not far enough and are run down) and the general’s saurus spears who flee off into the left hand forest. The ogre bulls’ bull charge puts a wound on a Krox and kills a skink. They then kill another 5 with their attacks. The skink champ and krox only manage to do a single wound in return, lose, fail their break test and get away, leaving the banner.

Lizard turn 6

General’s unit rallies as do terradons and skink cohort. Lots of shooting drops maneaters to 1 and bruiser down to 2 wounds. It also kills one of the right hand ogre bulls.

Ogres Turn 6

Turns and shoots the skink priest, taking off one wound. The ogre bulls decide not to charge the skink cohort this time and keep the banner.

Post Game Thoughts

A very bloody and fun game and at the end of it craig didn’t have that many troops left but had taken tons of banners. After we counted up VPs it turned out to be a minor victory for the lizardmen. Taking into account the scraplauncher shouldn’t have died and would have probably got the saurus spears down to less than half strength I think it’s fair to say it was a draw rather than a win. The right flank was an absolute mess in terms of so many models in such a small area, blocking each other and movement was messy

My MVP: the jungle swarm, the only thing which really performed completely above expectations. Not that they are useful but I didn’t have enough skink models for another cohort :)
Most disappointing unit: the bsb and his spear saurus- I spent a fair bit of resources ensuring I would get the charge on the maneaters and if even one had died next turn the spears would have come in to play and I could also have attacked the butcher (who wasn’t in combat initially).
Biggest mistake: forgetting about the scraplauncher on the hill and offering up the flank of the saurus cavalry. In the end it worked out ok since the scraplauncher prevented the maneaters charging at my bsb’s saurus unit again but if they had failed their breaktest…


The list was fun, although I felt a bit naked without offensive magic relying solely on troops is more interesting for a change and I wanted to be the one attacking since my lizard lists up to now have been played defensively. The fenbeasts died very quickly against ogres, but that was more or less expected and they did what they were supposed to. The magic defence of the list (7DD and +1 to dispel most turns) was enough to keep the ogres honest and I think craig only managed to get one or two spells off. The problems with the saurus breaking due to fear really popped up in this battle, I’d been getting used to thinking of them as being very hard to break but against fear causers they break quickly enough thank you very much. Saurus cavalry again failed to achieve much, they have yet to impress me despite wanting to use them since I have the models.

He ogre gunline was quite an unusual concept and against my list had enough shooting to force me to come closer although at close range I felt we had equal ranged potential- although had those 5” plates landed on skinks early game that would have changed. Maneaters are deadly and they managed to pick off quite a few models at range with their handguns. The scraplauncha, despite it’s nasty misfire table is a wonderful mix of abilities. The massive caveat that is S7 attacks being more or less non-existent in my list. Whilst 165 points is an awful lot for a one shot from a cannon, dark elf, lion and chaos chariots aren’t much cheaper, don’t have US5 and can’t move and shoot. I’ve picked up one on ebay and will probably get my ogres sent to China at some point to play with them. Whilst ranged battles are not the forte of the ogre list there is no harm in having a bit of mobile shooting and its always nice to have options. The 5" template is HUGE as well

2 Butchers was not really enough and the RIP nature of the buff spells combined with the one buff per unit maximum sucks. In the list I plan to run in future I’ll be going for 3 butchers. Just for those curious, this is what I'm thinking of running for an all-comers ogre army:

Tyrant, kineater, tenderiser, heavy armour, brace of handguns
Butcher, siegebreaker, 1 tooth gnoblar
Butcher, fistful of laurels, gnoblar thiefstone, skull mantle, 1 tooth gnoblar
Butcher, bangstick, scroll, 1 tooth gnoblar

4 Ogre Bulls, bellower
4 Ogre bulls, bellower
4 Ironguts, musician, standard: war banner, look out gnoblar
20 Gnoblar fighters
20 Gnoblar Fighters
8 Trappers
2 Leadbelchers
2 Leadbelchers
Scraplauncha
1 Gorger
3 Maneaters with brace od handguns

Sadly Algrek survived the bullet. The failure of Dhaak-Forr at deafeating a few ogres was pathetic, a day or two of writhing under a pain spell will no doubt teach him that to fail Velmar is ever unwise. Aethric has communicated through Algrek ordering me to sail to the southern of the dragon isles which should be free of the ogres since they are without ships and whatever crude rafts they must have used to reach the other isle have no doubt ceased to exist long ago. My forces remain mostly intact, with only a few of the saurus warriors and saurus cavalry dying- I have managed to heal the fallen spawn. We return swiftly to the ships before more of the ogre tribe can arrive.



Anyway Craig has asked to play against a different army next time and his planning to use a Ghark Ironskin list with leadbelchers for core, two units of 3 rhinox riders,3 butchers with a shedload of scrolls and some maneaters. I’ll probably try out my VC since I’ve only had one game in with them so far and that was a 2 v 2 game. Some insanely heavy hitting units to stop then :)

This is my all-comer VC list btw:

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3630695&postcount=24

RaZeR
08-07-2009, 12:12
Nice, another report :)
Sounds like a good close battle, thought he had you when he crushed your BSB's unit, but good job getting it back...
Looking forward to the fluff!

Kerill
10-07-2009, 05:42
Cheers mate, it was indeed a fun battle, and I was very impressed with the maneaters- the may make it into my WOC list at some point (although taking two rare choices sucks a bit).

Anyway, I've added the fluff (mostly from Velmar's perspective). I'll probably have one or two more games with Velmar before moving the storyline forward into current-time.

Also I'm not sure if everyone knows where the dragon isles are on the map, so I've added a link to the warhammer map on this post, the isles are southwest of the ogre kingdoms and northwest of Ind. Fluffwise the unknown isles should allow me to justify battling a some other armies until we get another lizard player in the group :)

Kerill
10-07-2009, 06:09
I got the day off yesterday so Craig and I had another battle, this time I brought my vampire counts:

Vampire lord, lvl 3, MOTBA, Forbidden lore,, lord of the dead, book of arkhan, helm of commandment 420 points (and embarrassingly defenceless)- cowers in the small skellie bunker
Vampire, dark acolyte, summon creatures of the knight, sword of might, periapt, flayed hauberk.
Wight king, bsb, sword of kings, gem of blood (all comers list so I didn't change the sword of kings)
Necromancer, power stone, 2 spells, corpse cart:unholy lodestone

13 Skellies, spears, FC: war banner
15 skellies, spears, FC: banner of undead legion. (Because Ws7 spears might do something eventually!)
10 skellies, FC (lord’s bunker)

19 Grave guard, great weapons, full command: banner of the barrows
6 Black Knights, naked (just to threaten flanks and whatnot)
3 fellbats
3 fellbats

4 wraiths+banshee

2250 points exactly. 10PD, 6 DD.

Craig wanted to try out the Gnark Ironskin special character, this was his list (roughly)
Characters:
Gnark Ironskin (ogre tyrant on a magical metal rhinox)
Butcher, 2 scrolls
Butcher, 2 scrolls
Butcher, siegebreaker, scroll

Core:
2 Leadbelchers
2 Leadbelchers
2 Leadbelchers

Special:
3 Rhinox Riders
3 Rhinox Riders
3 Yhetees

Rare:
1 Maneater with brace of hand guns.
all three butchers joined the maneater.

Deployment:

Once again it was proxy central and since VC are my newest army (courtesy of my wife :) ) They haven't been painted yet.

Ogre Deployment:
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/ogres.jpg
I'll need to explain this due to the proxies methinks:
On the far left behing the trees are the yhetees (minotaurs)
Next to them is Gnark Ironskin (hellcannon base)
Next to him are the two units of Rhinox Riders to the front (a medley of stuff on 50mm bases) behind them are the other two unit of leadbelchers (minotaurs) and the maneater with three butchers (a mix of 40mm based creatures)

VC Line:
(from right to left)
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/VCline.jpg
We have the wraiths with fellbats in front, then the skeletons with corpse cart, then the graveguard with small skeleton bunker behind, then skeletons then fellbats and finally the black knights.

And this is the two armies facing each other- forests on both sides of the centre

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/VCrightflank.jpg

Crucially he had put both the yhetties and gnark on one flank whilst I still hadn't deployed my wraiths who of course went on the other flank with no magical attacks apart from maybe siegebreaker on a butcher (at this point I didn't know he had siegebreaker).

Pre -battle plan:

Well I basically had to ensure the rhinoxen wouldn't get the charge on my graveguard or, ideally, a charge on anything. I could more or less assure they wouldn't get any impact hits but with 18 high S attacks for each unit and the tyrant with 10 or 11 S5 attacks my units wouldn't last long if he struck my line at the same time. I planned to threaten the left with the black knights for a flank charge and at least keep the yhetties from flanking my line, one unit of bats would march block him and look for favourable charges/crossfire, the other would stay on my flank for potential tarpitting. Wraiths would try to get in combat with the right flank rhinox and generally scream away to their heart's content. My main worry was that he might move gnark across the field to face the wraiths. I would boost the skellies and fellbats first turn, then try to create some zombie tarpits. I had deployed my line 10" in so I could move back 2" and be out of his rhinoxen's 14" charge range.

I won the roll for first turn (Craig seems to have terrible luck rolling for first turn, even with the +1 for deploying first).

VC Turn 1

The black knights enter the forest on their left with view of the battlefield through the trees. The left hand fellbats moved to near the left hand forest, right hand ones moved up a few inches and the wraiths moved up 7/8" so they would still be withing 12" of the general next turn. Magic saw both skeletons units boosted by about 5 models and the right hand fellbats boosted to 5. The rest was dispelled or failed to cast (one scroll was used against my attempt to summon zombies)

OK turn 1

Gnark moved to a central position, the rhinox riders moved up about 13" with the left hand ones wheeling slightly to face the black knights. The yhetties belted through the forest and stopped 1" away from the black knights. The rest of his army moved up. In magic I let through anything that would wound the butchers (trollguts and the +1T stubborn spell) since I planned to deal with his units one by one and would dispel the spells affecting units in combat. I dispelled the healing spells.

VC turn 2

The right hand fellbats flew over his army and marchblocked them. The wraiths moved up just out of line of sight of the right hand rhinoxen. The black knights moved back 2" in the forest out of LOS of yhetties and rhinoxen. Magic sees the left hand fellbats boosted to 5 and little else got off (tried to summon zombies but was scrolled and failed to cast. Banshee screamed but did no damage against Ld9 of the general on the rhinoxen.

OK turn 3

His rhinoxen and gnark move up 7" (march blocked), one butcher left the maneater to face the wraiths (a move which screamed of magic weaponage). The yhetties moved up again to face the black knights. One unit of leadbelchers turned to shoot the bats. The remaining 2 butchers and man eater formed a conga line (1 model wide, butcher, butcher and maneater at the back so they are stubborn and you can't kill the maneater to break him). Magic saw another trollguts let through and I dispelled the healing spells (one butcher had lost 2 wounds by this point, another had lost 1). Shooting killed 2 fellbats.

VC Turn 3

The black knights get tired of running (although I could have moved them back 2" and out os sight one more time) so I decide to chance it and charge the yhetties. The left handfellbats charge the flank of the lefthand rhinoxen, the right hand fellbats charge the rear of the lone butcher and the wraiths charge the flank of the other rhinoxen. My other infantry moved forward 7" to deny any future bull charges and for some vanhels action. The corspe cart moved to behind my lines and the vampire joined the vampire lord in the bunker. Magic saw the right hand fellbats boosted back to 5 for the rear charge bonus the rest of the magc phase saw me try like hell to vanhels the wights into combat but poor rolling and a scroll or two saw the end of that. In combat the left hand fellbats lost and might have taken a wound or two. The black knights put two wounds on the yhetties but lost 3 in return, lost another due to CR (bsb was withing 12"). The bats failed to wound the butcher, he put a single wound on the bats, lost due to US and rear charge, broke and was run down. The WS7 wraiths managed to do a couple of wounds to the rhinoxen and the banshee screamed another wound off them.

OK3

Gnark charged the graveguard, the right hand leadbelchers double charged the wraiths and fellbats. Magic saw me dispel trollguts on gnark and fail to dispel trollguts on the right hand rhinoxen. In combat gnark challenged and I accepted with the wight king bsb (currently WS7). Gnark put a wound on the bsb (but was rebounded by the gem), the metal rhinox put another 2 wounds on him. Wight kings return attacks (at S4) did nothing. Gnark lost by lots, broke and got away from the pursuing grave guard who overran into the left hand rhinox (clipping them since my other skeleton warriors were in the way). In the other combat the leadbelchers roll poorly and only kill one fellbat and take a wound in return. The wraiths manage to put2 wounds on the rhinoxen and lose by one but the bsb is withing 12". The blackknights are finished off by the yhetties. I think the left hand fellbats had disintegrated by this point.

VC4
My right hand skeletons charge the right hand rhinoxen (risky since up to this point the rhinoxen had no attacks). The left hand skeletonswheel to face the yhetties. In magic I raise a unit of zombies behind his right hand rhinoxen, and boost the right hand skeletons to 19, wight king was healed back to 3 wounds. Right hand fellbats were boosted back to 5 and vanhels was dispelled again a couple of times and my vampire lord miscast, rolled a 4 and suffered a wound along with 3 skeletons in the bunker. In shooting the banshee rolled a 10 and screamed a rhinox to death. The fellbats managed to kill one of the leadbealchers, the wraiths did another wound or two to the rhinoxen and the remaining leadbelcher did very little. Both the rhinox and leadbelchers fled and got away from my pursuing units. In the other combat the Ws7 grave guard put 2 wounds on a rhinoxen, and only one rhinoxen could attack back and killed 2 graveguard. The broke, were run down and the graveguard overran into the conga line. The zombies also got in the wat of my skeletons at this point.

OK 4
Gnark, the leadbelchers and the rhinox all rallied. The yhetties charged the skeleton spears. Magic was dispelled. In combat the yhetties killed 3 or 4 Ws7 skeletons, took a wound in return (killing a yhetti), broke and fled.The skeletons pursued into the forest but failed to catch them. In combat the butcher challenged the bsb refused and went to the back (I'd rather have the 4S6 attacks than 3 S4). The grave guard put two wounds on the butcher (leaving him with one)


VC 5

The wraiths belt forward full speed, while the zombies and right hand spears shuffle about a bit, fellbats fly behind his line). Magic sees the grave guard restored and the fell bats boosted to 6. In shooting the banshee screams at the conga line, killing the front butcher (the other butcher and maneater pass their regen saves). Again the bsb refuses a challenge, the butcher takes a wound, they fail their Ld8 stubborn test and flee but are caught by the grave guard. The final bull rhinox also died from something during this turn, I think I created, vanhelsed then boosted some zombies in and chased him off the field. The fellbats also charged and broke the leadbelcher who had rallied and he went off the field as well.

OK 5

Gnark charges the grave guard again, yhetties rally and a unit of leadbelchers also moves towards my skellies. Gnark challenges, GG champ accepts, Gnark puts a measly 3 wounds on him, breaks and dies.

VC 5 Everything heads over towards the left flank, magic sees all damage healed.

OK6

The leadbealchers and yhetties charge the skeltons in the forest. 1 Dies from bull charge, a few more from attacks and the skellies lose by a couple (but are still 4 ranks strong)

VC7
(seems we went into the 7th turn)

The vamp hero is vanhelsed into the yhetties. The yhetties wound him but he saves, both leadbealchers and yhetties flee and are crossfired by the bats.

End of game I'd lost a unit of fellbats and the black knights, Craig had nothing left on the table.

Whilst his list would be scary against some armies, against my VC list they had a hugely uphill struggle. Having no real magic attacks on the right (and the magic weapon butcher being far too obvious in his move) the wraiths could run wild. I don't think he expected the flank charge from the fellbats either. My banshee rolled really well almost all game- 7, 9, 10,10, 4 which really hurt the right hand rhinox. Craig also rolled below average in most combats whilst my wraiths rolled above average most turns. Only my magic dice rolled below average and with 10/11 dice to roll it didn't really matter even against a fistful of scrolls.

The fellbats were also really really useful, I'm surprised I don't see them used more often. This is only my second outing with VC but it's easy to see why they are one of the broken 3 in warhammer. Lizardmen are a solid army but compared to VC there is a huge difference. 10Pd and 2 bound spells, skellies over ghouls and no hasslehoff banner may mean my list isn't a cheese-tournament worthy list but its still disgustingly powerful.

Craig mentioned that he underestimated the toughness of the graveguard, the wight king bsb is one tough cookie and the gem of blood saved his backside this battle (had I rolled a 1 his tyrany would have passed his break test).

VC are an army that is very easy to use but require a lot of thought to play against it seems. Whilst the wraiths and banshee are great fun I think in general the challenge of playing against VC is more fun than actually using VC.

I'll still bring them out again occasionally but only against armies fit to deal with them (dark elves, daemons, lizards, HE and other VC).

Anyway I'm curious if you all prefer the deployment photos or the deployment map bitmap. Next game Craig wants to try wood elves and the shop army is really well painted so there will be something nice to look at instead of grey/proxies. I asked him what army he wanted to play against and his words were:
"Anything except for them (VC)"

I'll probably take WOC since my BOC don't have enough core units for 2250 (damn you GW and your splitting of chaos) and apparently WOC have a hard time against woodies since know of the units in my list (bar the hellcannon) can move through forests so I'll be curious to see how they cope.

RaZeR
10-07-2009, 16:59
Another good report :)
Does seem like the list he took didn't really have any answers for yours, although charging in the character unsupported might not have been the best idea...
Still, good game, and good to see he kept going right to the end :)
Looking forward to more!

grumbaki
11-07-2009, 03:06
Nice report. I must say that the ogre player was a really good sport. Not may people fight it out to the last turn when the game goes against them. With that said, even though VC is your newest army it seems like you know what you are doing with them.

Boss_Salvage
12-07-2009, 17:54
Great series of reports, surprised I missed them until today! Love the fluff, the lists - mad props again for making up your own wargear names and renaming units as you please :D - and the models. My own Warriors of Tzeentch has lizard models in it too, but nowhere as converted as your freaky spawn critters ;)

- Salvage

cmac
13-07-2009, 10:11
Heh

After the previous game with the ogres, this wasn't my finest moment.

Held off the deployment of the yhetees as long as possible but the wraiths weren't down yet. My cunning plan of using the butcher with siegebreaker wasn't so cunning (btw whoops, realise that was 30 pts now and hence an illegal build, Kerill was forgiving, modified my list on the subway with no book). I knew where Kerill was going to charge with the wraiths, and had the butcher on the right side, but should have kept it with the unit and then charged out of the unit to counter instead of moving out of the unit.

While in theory the list should have hit really hard, with the VC ability to get at my flanks and tie up the killer units I couldn't get a charge off I wanted. Trying to kill multiple VC units at one time seems to be a mistake. One unit needs to be picked on until it is gone. Ideally in one turn as my DD can't keep up with the incantations.

The static CR was a killer here, need to outflank and remove this with a multi charge. I had thought the boss of death would nail out the grave guard, that 2+ reflecting ward save was huge. and then overrun into the vampire's hiding behind in an attempt to kil the general.

The list looked pretty but probably won't see a repeat performance. The man eater units (that have BS 4 not 3 that we messed up 2 games ago) are the stars of the army. Stubborn is godly while you try to take down RnF. They also don't have to charge or even move forward aggresively as the shooting is respectable. Probably 2 units of 3 with a butcher and tyrant/bruiser in each. 5 wide is a bit clunky but due to the limited ogre models is manageable. Bulls for baiting misdirection on the flanks with belchers in support.

Ogres aren't flash, but they are fun.

Want to move that report to the VC thread Kerill?

The woodies game was fun. Treemen are very solid. Still a big loss however. Got caught up fighting the large RnF unit, not by choice. Lakes proved to be a vital deployment for Kerill.

Dwarves next ;)

cmac
14-07-2009, 00:30
Right

The dwarves are ready for the challenge. I am determined to own your magic phase for once! If nothing else. I'll save the secrets of the list until after the game.

SevenSins
14-07-2009, 11:07
nice rep Kerill, and I must say I share your wonder at the lack of fell bats around, they're pretty good (with summon creatures of the night)
Etherals are a real hassle for armies that rely on kills like OK, my previous game vs VC was a disaster, he even got of wind of undeath a few times making even more unkillable bastards

As for pics; yes please when un-proxied and schematics for heavily proxied games :)

Kerill
14-07-2009, 14:34
nice rep Kerill,

As for pics; yes please when un-proxied and schematics for heavily proxied games :)

Thanks mate, and I'll follow you on the diagrams vs. pictures choice.

@Grumbaki, thank you
@Boss salvage, do you have any pictures of the army? Always interested in lizardy chaosy things :)

Craig and I (cmac) had another game today, slann led wizards against a dwarf gunline. Craig had 3 spell eating runes,2 spell breaking runes, rune of balance I was at -1Pd and he had a total of 10 DD.

I'll put the report up in a day or two when I have time, still need to finish the wood elves report.

cmac
15-07-2009, 10:48
Yeah, finally managed to dominate his magic phase, but that was about it. Kerill got first turn, and on my turn both of the cannons misfired :)

Was going ok until about t4 or 5 when the liz's got to the line. The anvil was banged in desperation a couple of times then things went pear shaped. Maybe the Bret's will have better luck.

Gyro's and the Runelord on the Anvil were the stars of the show for me.

Managed to block the Slann's unit for most of the game which was really the best WFB progression for me.

Overdid the magic defence just a tad.

Kerill's liz list is solid, the skinks were not too bad with flamer templates to deal with them and the teradons couldn't crossfire as they have done so devastatingly in other games. Excess magic defence still doesn't help too much against miscasting irresistible force. That killed me.

The skinks in a block seemed to be more of a hinderence than a boon in this game as I ignored them and it slowed the temple guard.

Dungeon_Lawyer
15-07-2009, 11:30
will you be posting that wood elf game here (on this thread i mean)? I am looking forward to that one, given how you described this army as lokking awesome. I would agree on the pics for non-proxied game idea. I was trying to follow that last game and was like ahhh whats going on? lol. Nice win though. My friend who plays VC has also had pretty good luck with his bats (fel or otherwise) I too am surprised they dont show up more, plus their really cool!

Kerill
16-07-2009, 03:25
The wood elf list was against WOC and craig took a somewhat non-standard army so there is still a fair bit of proxying (didn't use dryads etc.). The next battle I'll post here will be the dwarf one (no piccies since everything was proxied on the dwarven side, not a single dwarf model in sight) I'll do a deployment map of gunline hill instead :) .

selone
16-07-2009, 22:50
I prefer deployment photos even if models are unpainted :) Anything except VC is a good moniker :)

Kerill
21-07-2009, 09:28
Battle against dwarves- no fluff I'm afraid since I can't think of a fluff justification for fighting dwarves.

Craigs list was something like:

Dwarf runelord on anvil with rune of balance, spelleater rune and rune of spellbreaking
Runesmith, spelleater rune, rune of spellbreaking
Runesmith, spelleater rune, rune of spellbreaking

10 thunderers
10 thunderers
10 thunderers

19 hammerers with FC: banner of +1CR and double US
2 S7 bolt throwers with engineers
2 cannons
2 gyrocopters

DD: 10 (and -1PD for me)

My list was my usual Aethric list:

Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, The draining amulet, power stone, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery, rod of change.
(Slann mage priest with 2 power stones, cube of darkness, bane head, rod of the storm bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, becalming cogitation, know all spells) 510 points
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG)-405
Khwarr-Tsu, scar vet, chaos armour (l armour) GW, shield, daemonsteed amulet (jaguar charm) 124 points

10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 Skink Cohort 50
16 Spear Saurus, FC 222

5 Saurus Cavalry 175
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
16 Black Saurus (Temple Guard) FC 291

Salamander pack 75
Salamander pack 75

Total: 2247
PD: 9
DD: 6
Models: 85

Deployment saw craig put place two double tiered hills- one on each side of the table, whilst I put down two forests to give me some cover. You can see the deployment here:

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Deployment.jpg

Thund- thunderers
BT- bolt throwers
CA- cannons (each with a runesmith)
Gyro/Gy- gyrocopters
AN- anvil- anvil was placed behind the hill

SA- Saurus
Co- skink cohort
Skirm- skink skirmishers
Green Terr- terradons
Orange SA- salamanders
SC- saurus cavalry
E- Engine of the gods

Engine was hidden from the warmachines behind the forest.

I once again won the roll for first turn. I took shadow for my slann and bane headed one of the runesmiths with the cannons.

Pre game strategy- move up and engage as fast as possible- no other strategy against a gunline :)

Lizards 1

I moved my mainline up full speed, with the Engine coming out from hiding behind the trees. Magic saw me fail to cast a couple of spells and then Craig tried to destroy the 3D6 S1 magic missile spell but failed. I went for the 5+ ward from the engine. I may have miscast with the slann and rolled a 5. I packed the left hand forests with skinks and the right hand one with terradons.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_1_Lizards.jpg

Dwarves 1

One unit of thunderers moved about a bit. The gyro on the left flew up and killed 6/7 skinks with its steam cannon. The one on the right doing little to the terradons (caused 1 wound). The anvil put another 2 wounds on my right hand terradons and they were reduced to M1. Both cannons misfired, one couldn’t shoot this turn, one for this turn or the next. One boltthrower might have killed a couple of temple guard. The thunderers on the right killed 2 saurus cavalry (pass panic):

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_1_Dwarves.jpg

Lizards2:

Once again I moved up at full speed, the left hand terradons rocked the gyro for two wounds (and skinks killed it in shooting). Magic saw him fail to destroy unseen lurker, everything else was stopped, slann miscast and rolled a 6 on the table.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_2_Lizards.jpg

Dwarves 2

Gyros move to steam my saurus and temple guard. Bolt throwers kill the skink priest. Another 2 saurus cavalry are killed. Runelord struck with ancient power slowing the stegadon and saurus cavalry to a crawl.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_2_Dwarves.jpg

Lizards 3:

Right hand terradons and saurus cavalryman charge the right hand bolt thrower, terradons charge the other boltthrower and thunderers (no choice, had to go for the dual charge). Infantry line moved up again, along with the M3 stegadon. Right hand salamander charged the gyrocopter who fled. Magic saw me stop bothering with trying to get a spell through his dispels and I threw five dice at pit of shades on the hammerers, I miscast but rolled a 12 and 14 hammerers died. In combat I managed to kill the engineer of the bolt thrower on the right but fluffed on the crew who passed their stubborn roll. Ledt hand terradons also killed an engineer, took a wound or two and lost combat but held on Aethrics leadership.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_3_Lizards.jpg

Dwarves 3:

Both runesmiths charge the saurus cavalryman, one fails his fear test. Gyro rallied and steamed my infantry killing a couple/ Shooting sees the anvil fail to get ancient power but was otherwise fine. Thunderers put a couple of wounds on the stegadon. In combat the runesmith manages to kill the saurus cavalryman whilst the terradons killed another crew. Break tests were passed.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_3_Dwarves.jpg

Lizards 4:

The left hand salamander and saurus warriors charged the hammerers, the engine charged the front thunderers. Magic was dispelled and shooting did nothing. In combat I killed a couple of hammerers leaving 3, hammerers passed their break test. The engine killed 4 thunderers who broke and fled and got away from the pursuing stegadon whilst just about staying on the board. The terradons were still holding against the thunderers whilst the right hand terradons killed the bolt thrower crew.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_4_Lizards.jpg

Dwarves 4

Thunderers rally. Gyro moved and shot some of the skink cohort. One cannon shot almost point blank at the engine and killed it. I killed another couple of hammerers and they failed insane courage (salamanders fear causing US3), saurus overran into the cannons on the hill.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/gam1_Turn_4_Dwarves.jpg

Turns 5-8

Played past the turn limit, I cleared out everything but his anvil and gyro. The runelord was stuck in a challenge with the temple guard champion with neither side causing any damage. The gyrocopter got charged by the salamander and killed the salamander and survived ¾ turns of poisoned shots from the depleted units of skinks, work then called so we left it there. In the end it was a massacre to the lizards.

MVP Unit- the left hand dwarf gyrocopter probably killed about 250 points of stuff and was immune to shooting and was still alive on 1 wound at the end of the 8th turn.

Post battle thoughts:

Wow that was a silly amount of anti-magic, and I wasted two phases trying to get through it the normal way rather than just going for broke. I miscast almost every turn (even when only casting spells on 2/3 dice) but rolled well on the miscast table, especially with the irresistible force which killed so many of the hammerers. The -1PD items are really powerful, but especially against lizards where its more like -2PD since the slann generally has one less spell to cast. This is by far the most magic defence I’ve ever gone up against (and must be pretty near the best magic defence you can get in warhammer), but getting the one big spell through was enough. Rune of wrath and ruin is damn annoying too. I think he probably went overboard with magic defence and could have saved 100-150 points and still nullified my magic.

Craig was unlucky with his cannons misfiring first turn (and with not getting first turn, although I had the engine hidden at the start if it had been wrath and ruined early game it would have been troublesome) and also with failing to destroy my spells (although I’d been holding pit back in order to try to make him use any spelleater rune on the other spells). My skink cohort also really got in my way a bit this game. I thing Craig is still a bit too worried by magic- sometimes having enough troops to take the damage is the best defence. Turning point was with the hammerers getting the pit on them, since my TG would have taken a long time to reach his war machines with M2, probably only getting a charge in on the 5th or 6th turn.

Anyway, let me know what you think of the new battle report diagrams, I’m still getting the hang of the software (only found out this afternoon how to rotate templates so I can now use the flame template).

SevenSins
21-07-2009, 12:16
diagrams looks good, easy to follow.

Gunline is gunline and I agree that was a near silly amount of anti-magic. But oh well some trophybeards on the wall then ;)

selone
21-07-2009, 12:22
Thansk for the report and the diagrams helped. On he subject of magic defense Orcs and goblins could get 10 DD on a +1 to dispell with 4 dispell scrolls and with you at a -1 PD :D That would be silly though.

cmac
21-07-2009, 14:30
Heh, maybe just a little paranoid on the magic D ;)

Might be able to cut back a bit now, got my tick in the "won magic phase" box.

Spreading the gunline next time might help me split your force and keep the guns blazing longer.

We both learned the rule that a charge can bring the charging unit within 1" of an unengaged model. I thought my setup was going to prevent the don's charging the heavy guns, leaving that saurus hero being the only one who could really fly out and get them, easy to dispel ;)

Dungeon_Lawyer
04-08-2009, 19:36
The new diagrams look great! Dam cmac went balls to the wall magic defense in that one!

Malorian
05-08-2009, 13:59
Wow, that was a crazy amount of anti-magic. Congrats on the win.

The diagrams look great and help a lot :)

Kerill
07-08-2009, 10:17
Cool, thanks for the feedback, I'll try to use that program in future, it is a fair bit prettier than the other one and being able to add text labels in nice.

Kerill
19-08-2009, 18:24
Had a game against Orcs and goblins last week. I’d brought the models for my standard lizardmen list. My opponent didn’t have enough for 2250 points (he’s still painting his 3 units of orc boyz) so we played 2000 points, I dropped my jaguar charm scar vet and saurus cavalry and added a cohort to bring the list down to 2000 points.

My list:

Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, The draining amulet, power stone, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery, rod of change.
(Slann mage priest with 2 power stones, cube of darkness, bane head, rod of the storm bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, becalming cogitation, know all spells) 510 points
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, EOTG)-405


10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
10 Skink Cohort 50
10 Skink Cohort 50
16 Spear Saurus, FC 222

3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
16 Black Saurus (Temple Guard) FC 291

Salamander pack 75
Salamander pack 75

Total: 2247
PD: 9
DD: 6
Models: 85

His list was something like:

Grimgor in a unit of 19 black orcs with FC and shields
Level 2 orc shaman with 2 scrolls
Level 2 NG shaman with several mushrooms
Goblin hero riding a wolf with light armour, shield and maybe some other stuff

20 Night goblin spears, shields, standard, 3 fanatics
20 Night goblin spears, shields, standard, 3 fanatics
20 Night goblin spears, shields, standard

6 wolfriders, bows
6 wolfriders, bows
6 Spider riders
6 Spider riders
2 Spear Chukkas
Rock lobber
Doom diver
Giant

Deployment:

The brown circles are lakes

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Deployment.jpg

I won the roll for first turn and took lore of metal for my slann and bane-headed grimgor.

Lizard turn 1:

My annoyance units all moved up more or less full whack and the lake on the right meant the spider riders couldn’t charge the terradons even though they could see them. Skinks and sallie on the right moved into the lake. Saurus and temple guard wheeled to face his lines and the engine came out from hiding behind the trees. In magic I miscast 2nd sor 3rd pell and the magic phase ended (and the slann took a wound) but not before I cut down one unit of wolf riders.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_1_Lizards.jpg


O&G turn 1

His right hand goblins with orc shaman rolled a 6 for animosity and wheeled into the lake as a result (terradons being nearest unit they could see). One unit of spider riders failed animosity. The rest of his stuff moved up. Giant faffed about a bit. (Initially his spider riders on the other side charged the terradons and lost 3 to stand and shoot but I let him take the move back- he’d thought spider riders could cross the lake but I pointed out it was impossible terrain not difficult/very difficult). Magic was dispelled. Artillery mostly went off target and the terradons ward saved a hit from a bolt thrower.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_1_Greenskins.jpg

Lizard Turn 2

Terradons overflew his spider riders and rocked all but one to death. The other unit of terradons flew out of the forest to threaten the war machines on the hill. Skinks on the left moved into the forest to start peppering the black orcs with poison. The other side skinks and salamander moved into the lake. Cohorts move up and release fanatics. Magic saw the wolf riders with hero cut down my magic and the black orcs left several models to spirit of the forge. In shooting lots of things shot stuff and models dropped here and there.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_2_Lizards.jpg

O&G Turn 2

His main units advance. Giant is still fiddling about and turns to face the skinks in the forest. Magic is dispelled (and he might have miscast due to a mushroom this turn with the NG shaman who died). One terradon is dropped by a bolt thrower. The rock lobber hits the slann, a bunch of temple guard and some saurus spears. The slann fails his look out sir and takes a S8 hit but passes his ward save. Some temple guard and spear saurus die.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_2_Greenskins.jpg

Lizard Turn 3

Terradons charge the doom diver on one side and the rock lobber on the other. Skinks on my left move out of LOS of the giant. Magic sees little effect. Shooting sees the spider rider on the right wiped out, the giant blowpiped to death and some more NG and black orcs fall. In combat the rock lobber and doom diver are destroyed.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_3_Lizards.jpg

O&G Turn 3

Night gobos with orc shaman charge the right hand cohort. Black orcs charge the other angled cohort. Magic is dispelled and shooting does nothing. The black orcs wipe out the cohort and are forced to overrun into the lake due to hatred. The night goblins and shaman kill a bunch of skinks but the cohort passes its test on the re-roll with the slann’s leadership.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_3_Greenskins.jpg

Lizard Turn 4

The engine charges the orc shamans unit. The terradons each charge a spear chukka. Magic sees some black orcs fall but shooting is mostly ineffective. In combat the engine butchers the night goblins and runs them and the shaman down. Both bolt throwers are wiped out.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_4_Lizards.jpg


O&G Turn 4

Spider riders move in to forest, grimgor pops out of his BG bodyguard (since I could guarantee the black orcs going back into the lake with a charge from the salamander). His other stuff moves a bit.

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn49/Kerill_album/orcvslizz_Turn_4_Greenskins.jpg

Lizard Turn 5

I move the spear saurus up so he can charge them with the black orcs next turn (to give him some combat. Magic sees grimgor torn apart by rune of burning iron and then spirit of the forge.

O&G turn 5

Black orcs charge the spear saurus, beat them but the spear saurus hold.

Post game thoughts

Well that game… sucked big time. Really nice opponent but basically he was shafted whatever he did. I gave suggestions during and after the game but basically felt like a real bastard for:
a) Placing lakes against the player (he kept going with terrain because he wanted to guarantee a hill for his war machines)
b) The fact that he had no chance of winning from the start.

Even if the slann had died to the rock lobber shot I could have won the game easily by any number of methods. Not a satisfying game at all, and I think lizards are a really bad matchup for O&G (far far worse than my WOC). I gave him suggestions for his list and next time he will have solid blocks of orcs and other support troops and hopefully morks spirit totem.

The BRB rules for placing terrain really give an unfair advantage to some armies. Whilst the aquatic rule is part of the lizardmen arsenal, multiple lakes is a bit silly, and the embarrassing thing here is that I placed them. Against daemons or DE I could see the justification, but in this case it was entirely uncalled for :(

selone
19-08-2009, 20:03
Thatw as a bit of a white-wash wasn't it :D strange army list and even if you're a giant lover (I am not) taking it against lizardmen is sheer folly. The terrain rules arenot very good and yes its a real dilemma as a lizardman player, I totally agree as I've talked about here- http://www.theafkers.org/news/terrain-in-warhammer/#comments

Arguleon-veq
19-08-2009, 20:50
'Heh, maybe just a little paranoid on the magic D

Might be able to cut back a bit now, got my tick in the "won magic phase" box.'

I'd stick with really heavy anti magic man. My Orcs and Gobs run with;

10 DD,
+1 To Dispel,
-1 Enemy Power.

With weaker armies like Orcs and Dwarfs, being able to totally cut out a huge part of the new Power Armies power really helps.

Malorian
19-08-2009, 22:03
The BRB rules for placing terrain really give an unfair advantage to some armies. Whilst the aquatic rule is part of the lizardmen arsenal, multiple lakes is a bit silly, and the embarrassing thing here is that I placed them. Against daemons or DE I could see the justification, but in this case it was entirely uncalled for :(

I think they can be an important part of your strategy but I agree some people can push them to the point where it makes the game less fun.

I had one opponent that would put large swarms in the center of my line (both sides of the board) to break up my lines and thus make less of the army within range of the general when I was playing orcs (who need the generals LD).

In this battle I don't feel you pushed it too far at all. Sure you placed some things to your advantage but it was nothing extreme.

If you start finding this frustrating though try another method:

-Same method but scatter the terrain after placement
-One player places terrain and the other picks sides
-3rd party placement

bizzar6311
20-08-2009, 00:19
Use the 6th ed rule book terrain chart. Its very random and fair. Makes for a fun game.

Kerill
20-08-2009, 10:12
I think its a good suggestion, I'll try and suggest we change the terrain rules we use, although the group I play with tend to be sticklers for going by the rules.

Dungeon_Lawyer
20-08-2009, 20:44
Yeah that games outcome was hardly ever in doubt, but hey win some lose some. It was a good quick read at any rate!

Kerill
23-08-2009, 12:13
Thanks for the replies. Sadly no-one was at the gaming club this week so no battle report. I've been thinking about my list though following the O&G game. At the minute it plays a bit too much like a gunline and even the cavalry are there as an annoyance unit rather than as part of an attack force. At the same time it seems more and more lists on the internet are seeming very similar to mine, and I'd ideally like my list to be a bit different so I've decided to take some "crap" units (although I don't think they are as bad as people are saying) and a bit more attacking synergy as well as possible synergy with lores other than metal. I also think the new list will be better against dwarven gunlines with the anvil. So I'm dropping the scar vet and his bound spell, the spear saurus and the saurus cavalry(at least for now). This also goes well with the fluff since quite a large number of saurus have been sent with the fleet to the dragon isles. I don't think the new list is much weaker per se, but it should offer a bit more slugging and more units for my opponents to get VPs from.

Aethric the withered, sorceror lord of Tzeentch, disk, Curse charm of Tzeentch, The draining amulet, power stone, armour of midnight, Master of sorcery, rod of change.
(Slann mage priest with 2 power stones, cube of darkness, bane head, rod of the storm bsb and war banner. Disciplines: +1Pd per spell, becalming cogitation, know all spells) 510 points
Vilreth, level 2 skink priest, spell familiar, warpstone brazier, spawnbeast
(Plaque of Tepoc, wardrums EOTG)-435
- wardrums will hopefully complement the EOTG more offensive role in the new list and I can imagine a lot more fleeing being done so the rally bonus should come in handy- as long as the priest is still alive of course.

10 skink skirmishers 70
10 skink skirmishers 70
16 Skink Cohort, 1 kroxigor, FC 157
16 Skink Cohort, 1 kroxigor, standard, musician 149
- 2 cheap fairly fast units to attack with. Skinks may die in droves but who cares. One unit has a champion in case the EOTG needs somewhere to hide from a dragon.

Stegadon
- hammer for the skink "anvils"
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
3 Disk Riders (terradons) 90
16 Black Saurus (Temple Guard) FC 291

Salamander pack 75
Salamander pack 75

Total: 2247
PD: 9
DD: 6
Models: 88

RaZeR
23-08-2009, 21:39
Skink anvils lol :p
Looks good though, they have more varied uses than pure saurus, and the extra steg should help as well. Looking forward to seeing how it goes :)

Dungeon_Lawyer
29-08-2009, 10:58
cool new list kerill-though I would put the warbanner on the TG to cheapen your slann slightly, since you take no miscast protection...a minor quibble ....

Kerill
31-08-2009, 16:03
cool new list kerill-though I would put the warbanner on the TG to cheapen your slann slightly, since you take no miscast protection...a minor quibble ....

That might be a good idea, especially considering how often I play against chaos with the puppet :)

Not been playing lately, been painting, almost burned out on painting the saurus, need to get some games in.

I wish I didn't paint so damn slow :cries: