PDA

View Full Version : Returning to 40K - I can has Tau?



Spyral
28-02-2009, 22:23
I used to play 40k as a secondary interest to Fantasy since second edition. I've had marines, dark eldar, necrons and nids.

However I've yet to properly read the 40k rules in entirety. I've only peeked at the new 40k rules. I have no idea about metagame/what is currently cheesy*, and I know that you now **NEED** troops to capture things.

(*to an extent...I know that drop podding 6 dreads on top of you and having 2 minimsed squads of sniper scouts for my core as my army is cheeseballery)

What is the generally friendly ratio of HQ/E/T/FA/HS ?

When I played (not counting 2nd ed) from 3-mid 4th ed the standard army used to be HQ1/E1-2/T2/FA0/HS3 in terms of minimum troops and tonnes of HS and power weapon melee elite. Now I'm told it's about troops being able to capture things. So is 3 units a good idea as a minimum ? What about transports are they totally useless like last edition? if not what has changed to make them a decent choice?

I'm thinking of pathfinders + skyray and then having a markerlight drone with stealth teams all over the place to try and tag and bag units reliably rather than go pure JSJ mecha tau that was prevalent in last ed. (maybe it's still prevelant now?)

Assuming that the older units function the same (eg previous codex) what are the use of parhanas, skyrays and drone sniper teams and they are effective?
I know the skyray can mark stuff and throw smart missiles around corners in addition to seeker missiles so keeping in line with the markerlight theme.

To me the Parhanas seem quite weak as they are open topped skimmers with a short ranged gun and don't seem to be good value for money unless 2 of them with fusion blasters went tank hunting.

Drone sniper teams - are they useful? Better than giving rail rifles to pathfinders?

If I get a commander and a battle box I'll have 650 points give or take. That means that I'll need another 1150-1350 to give a good 1800-2000 pt selection which I would like to aim for. But as I understand 1800 is a 'standard' game where I am. However I do not wish to double any units until I have at least one of each.

I was thinking :

Battleforce + Commander - That gives me 650 points

Shas'la, Cyclic ion blaster, TL plasma rifle, ejection port, combat stims, hard wired multi tracker {anti marine}
XV8 Suit - Team Leader, Airburst Launcher, TL burst cannon multi tracker {anti troop/pleb}
3 Stealth suits - leader with marker drone
12 kroot
12 fire wariors - inc shas'ui, bonding knife and 2 gun drones
Devil fish with disruption pod.

to bring it to 1000 add:
6 path finders - 3 rail rifles, shas'ui bonded, target lock, 2 gun drones
{rail rifles can tag one target, 2 MLs to another with gun drone pinning at -2 or -2 cover save agaisnt the rifles, and sepeate ML for seeker missiles if necessary}

Although it may be better to have just 6-8 normal pathfinders and take a sniper team for the rail rifles?

and a Skyray w/ SMS, Disruption pod and targeting array

---

What would be recommended next? (Assuming I have 1HQ, 2E, 2T, 1FA 1HS)

Should I get more troops - I imagine that I would need more fire warriors anyway as 1 unit is hardly enough yes?

Assuming I have the above I can spend about 80 more on the initial army and I think I need some anti armour like broadsides or a TL fusion blaster/missile pod XV8 unit. If I did get another battle box then I have enough left for about one or two more units - 2 broadsides, or a hammerhead or some vespids.

So in that regards would it actually be best to get a second battlebox which would give me lots of useful things? - like another stealth team, fire warriors, another XV8 to accompany the first one on its vehicle/armour killing and drones - all of which are useable and the saving over buying each bit of it separately works out about same cost as the 12 kroot anyway (might as well take em if its for free!) I could possibly use the extra bits from the skyray to convert the devilfish into a hammerhead (or just use it as a devil fish if it would be better).

So assuming 2 battle boxes, leader, 6 pathfinders and a skyray equates to about 1575.

The only thing is that in terms of the army itself I dont know how effective it would be though, as I've perceived a trend in warhammer fantasy that the best units are the pricey metal ones.... and the best army lists are usually more expensive to purchase. I dont know if 40k has gone that route yet although I know in the past lots of vehicles were necessary . But there is no point shooting myself in the foot either by being cheap because that is a waste as well. However the 2 battle boxes gets 4 units of troops out there ready to go and I understand that troops are important. Plus I like reasonably biggish armies. [as opposed to the condensed, min/max tourney armies. One or two good hits and they die!]

Assuming that 2 battle boxes + leader + pathfinders + skyray are the way to go (I think I've convinced my self while writing this) what would be the most efficient use of the remaining funds? 2 Broad sides to add some anti tank and a balanced 2nd Heavy Support That would be ~1700pts and 1 HQ, 3E 4T 2FS 2 HS

I do have Aun'Va - I got him at a games event for doing the photography. I could use one of his bodyguards as an ethereal and give him some drones... that's 50 pts. Leaving me with 1750.. 250 shy of 2000 but still large enough and its a feasible 1800 pts. I have thought of a way of converting a sniper team should I need the extra 80 points (though it will really be +50 as then the 3 rifles would be dropped from pathfinders to dedicate them to marking/pinning [+80-30=+50])

So can anyone provide feedback as to this army building idea and also the warhammer 40k new edition questions I've posed?

Grimtuff
28-02-2009, 22:27
This thread (http://warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=163474) will be a good start. ;)

Spyral
01-03-2009, 00:55
I'm reading the rules at present and have the current codex.

Thanks for the link but advice on how to build a decent army at reasonable cost would be appreciated. I'm more used to fantasy stuff and even then for my 2 armies I just got the BIG boxes when they were released and supplimented it with the odd unit here or there.

Whereas there is no BIG Tau army that I can see so hence why I was wondering about 2x battleforce approach?

fluffstalker
01-03-2009, 01:04
Tau are fairly expensive as armies go. Really most 40k armies dont have a massive boxed set in most stores that you can buy and be done.

In any case getting one of each unit may get you good comp scores but will handicap you in gaming terms- 40k is about redundancy, the more you get of one thing, especially hammerheads and crisis, the more exponentially effective your army becomes.

big squig
01-03-2009, 02:02
(*to an extent...I know that drop podding 6 dreads on top of you and having 2 minimsed squads of sniper scouts for my core as my army is cheeseballery)


No it isn't. That might be the worst army list I've ever seen. You would get slaughtered every game except against the most noobish of noobs.

noobzor
01-03-2009, 03:37
Yep. Once the scouts are gone, you lose. GG :D

GW has wonderful package deals that give you more than you want. Or combinations you don't want. If you think the army box will be cool, buy it. But it very well might be better to just buy the stuff you want separate.

Spyral
02-03-2009, 01:55
Yep. Once the scouts are gone, you lose. GG :D


Well this was in a killpoints only based cheesballery tournament as I am informed... kill points seem idiotic... oh look biovore fired a spore mine = +1 kill point for me :wtf::wtf:


GW has wonderful package deals that give you more than you want. Or combinations you don't want. If you think the army box will be cool, buy it. But it very well might be better to just buy the stuff you want separate.

Well If I did not but an army box I would need to buy more firewarriors anyway, a devilfish at least (I want to try and get a pressure build - close but not too close along with lots of marker lights to help be sure of taking down units) and I would need at least one other crisis suit. I like the idea of stealth teams and wouldn't mind having 2 x 3 or 1 x 5 so that doesn't bother me that much to be honest. Ironically its the kroot that you get free (you save 11.73
which is about 2/3 of a kroot box, and 12 kroot is about 2/3 of a kroot box) however kroot are useful and cheap so I think its worthwhile if I'm going to get those units 'anyway'.

I cannot envision what to buy for the same money (instead of a 2nd battle box that would be i) as efficient in terms of what it can do and ii) be worth the right amount of points. Obviously these are tied together. I could just spend 50 on kroot but it wouldnt be points, money or game effective.