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View Full Version : Could this work? 2K Dragon list.



W0lf
08-03-2009, 21:39
Right so ill playtest this next weekend but was wondering how people think itd do and any suggestions to improve it. Literally the only thing im set on is the Dragon.

Sorcerer lord
lvl 4, MoT, Runesword, Armour of Morsleib, spell familiar
Chaos Dragon
750 pts.

- Huge cost but if im careful and he dosnt die great for pts denial. I opted for the sorc as he influences the magic phase aswell as Movement (dragon) and combat. For 700+ pts versatility is key. The regen is possibly over-protection but you never know. The idea was that any fight the chaos dragon cant win on his own is a fight you shudnt get into anyway. Dragons biggest strength is to control your opponents movement through placement whilst flaming up sttuff. (plus it scares them :P). Plus he can always sit back and spam gateway/pandi if needed.

Lvl 2
Steed, MoN, scroll, power familiar
206 pts

Lvl 2
Steed, MoN, enchanted shield, scroll
206 pts

- magic heavy is win :P

5 Marauder horsmen
Flails, Mus
81 pts

5 Marauder horsmen
Flails, Mus
81 pts

5 Marauder horsmen
Flails, Mus
81 pts

5 hounds
30 pts

6 Chaos knights
Stand, mus, warbanner
295 pts

6 Chaos knights
MoK
270 pts

2000. Exact.

11 PD
6 DD + 1 scroll
35 models.

Neknoh
08-03-2009, 22:04
If usually playing tournaments, you should be able to build to 2250 points, enabling you some more options.

In my eyes, the list should fair decently, however, I really think the only gripe I have with the list would be, strangely enough, with the Mark of Khorne as well as the gear on your characters.

First of all, there is a complete lack of the puppet in an 8 level Gateway list, this is one major flaw, the second being the presence of a Book of Seecrets in a list where Steed of Shadows has no use at all.

Also, your Sorceror doesn't have protection against neither killingblow, nor multiple wounds, he IS a Sorceror of Tzeentch though, so there are a few different kits that I would attempt, all keeping the Spell Familliar, but possibly losing the magical attacks.

Bronze Armour of Zhrakk (He doesn't even need to be the general), Spell Familliar, Crown of Everlasting Conquest, 80 points on the spot, immunity to killingblow, five spells and regeneration. And still 20 points to do with what you see fit.

The Armour of Morrslieb, Spell Familliar, Crown of Everlasting Conquest, 3+ wardsave against anything non-magical, regeneration and five spells, 100 points.

Crimson Armour of Dhargan, Spell Familliar, Golden Eye of Tzeentch, this leaves 15 points, these can be used for the Favour of the Gods allongside the Biting Blade, enabling you magical attacks AND modification on the Eye of the Gods table, seing as you are likely to be munching on a lot of Large Targets with your spells, especially after a few buboes, gateway can well kill off a Bloodthirster without sucking it into the warp. This is also the favourite kitout of the ones I would suggest to you, immunity to Killingblow and multiple-wound weapons allongside a 3+ wardsave against missiles of all sorts. Basically, the enemy must do 3 wounds in one close combat phase or use the Lore of Metal to hope killing you. Otherwise, you are likely to nibble on the person attempting to kill him.

This also frees up the Enchanted Shield, an excellent item to go with the Puppet on a normal Sorceror.

At the moment, I cannot think of any others, but there are sure to be some out there.

W0lf
08-03-2009, 22:16
Thanks for the time Neknoh :)

This is what i was really looking for when posting this thread lol. (My magic item selection was crappy and i knew it).

Puppet+enchanted shield is a good idea for a lvl 2.

Keep the other one with scroll + Power fam. I should be ok for defence/offence still. Ive never actually played w/o puppet (well actually once and a vamp lord rolled a 3 on miscast lol) and i had just got over that 'safety blanket' but your right, i need it :P.

So with lvl 2 kit a bit better onto the lvl 4.

Spell fam is a must, ive nearly always ran a lvl 4 tz sorc general and have rolled everything but 3+6 more then is statistically possible lol.

So thats 15 pts, dead set.

Bronze armour ive considered as i agree on its merits, however on a flying large creature i should be picking my fights and thus avoiding killing blow (same reason i think obsidian armour is over-rated). However armour of morsleib is inspired.

so 50 pts down. Which is perfect for regen... i cant help looking at runesword thou :angel:. Im going to go for runesowrd this time. 6 S6 WS 6 + 4S5 ws 6 should kill most things my lords in combat with + morsleib is a nice item.

p.s i usually play 2K but at 2,250 i would probably drop a horse unit for a marauder bunker (bunch of marauders with MoS for wizards to hide in) and go for 3x 5 khorne knights with warhounds thrown in.

Oh and whats wrong with the knights?

Neknoh
08-03-2009, 22:19
You could pick the Golden Eye and the Sword of Might though, this leaves points for the Favour as WELL

EDIT: Facepalm, big facepalm, no need for the eye. Perhaps the Collar though? MR2 would be well worth it on him I reckon

W0lf
08-03-2009, 22:22
Sword of might + Collar of khorne would be my option if i change the runesword i feel.

Im happy keeping it at runesword atm. Runesword/Daemonsword sorcs have served me emmensly well as im sure you've heard ^^

Slam
08-03-2009, 22:35
Consider third eye of tzeench gift, it fits perfectly for a gateway sorc becouse you dont always roll the spell but this way you can get something similary destructive from the enemy. The +1 to cast remains with the enemys lore and its always fun to drain magic high elves and tree sing the woodelves... give them a taste of their own medicine :-).

MOK on the knights seems a bad choice as you can give them the frenzy banner for only 5 points more and you wont loose frenzy.

I personally dont think flails are a good choice. Usually the S5 doesn't matter that much as they are bait or screen not realy a hammer, and the units you need a flank attack to break are usually though enough to kill horsemen and make you loose more than you gain. Besides I cant forget the mental image of that flail hitting the horse out from under the marauder after it bounces back from an attack :-P

Book of secrets works well with mark of tzeench if you use it as an extra magic missile as you get the +1 for the book spell too. Fireball on 4+ flickering fire on 3+ per round is quite doable with 3PD (wich a lvl 2 sorc generates for himself).

Edit: I don't see the need for sword of might on a dragon mounted character. If you want magic attacks get biting blade and save some point the +1s doesn't do much if you already have an S6 dragon under you IMHO.

W0lf
08-03-2009, 23:00
Runesword is +1 attack, s and WS.

4S5 WS6 could be the diffrence between winning by 1 or losing by 1 (assuming the dragon does badly). Its a 750 pt Ld 8 model lol. Losing combat isnt really an option XD

Plus i cant get over the fact my mates HE star dragon lord has 4S5 WS 8 which is pretty damned close to my sorc ^^

Slam
08-03-2009, 23:33
I was refering to the idea of Neknoh.

But to be honest runesword isn't that much better either IMHO. He becomes notably better, hiting just like an exalted but in my experience an exalted isn't going to decide the fate of a close combat most of the time (seriously I never seem to be able to kill anything :-)). Ofc I wouldn't use demonsword either so obviously our tastes/gamestyles are different. Not to mention that I never used a dragon mounted char so you know better what he needs.

Winning by one or losing by one is a matter of luck. I prefer to win by a lot or not get in combat at all. But thats just becouse of my dice luck probably :-).

Lafkak
09-03-2009, 00:10
I think it's a pretty solid list, w0lf, with the corrections that Neknoh suggested. The only thing I would suggest, however, is that it's absolutely imperative to get Diabolic Splendor onto your Sorcerer Lord on Dragon. I don't know where you'd free up the points from, but I think this is definitely a worthy investment since you get 3 phases of use out of it:

Enemy's start-of-turn "phase:" -1 Ld for terror bombing with Dragon
Your Shooting phase: -1 Ld for panic tests caused by double breath weapon attacks (and these WILL cause panic tests)
Your Magic phase: Sorcerer Lord pewpewing multiple units with Flickering Fire / Gateway can cause further -1 Ld panic test havoc.

Now, I know what you're going to say, w0lf, and it's going to be something along the lines of "Well, that doesn't work against ItP Daemons and VC and they're the strongest right now," but honestly if you want the list to massacre at tournaments not EVERY enemy you face will be ItP/Daemons/VC. Well worth the 35 pts, IMO, since you don't already have a Gift on the Sorcerer Lord.

Alternatively, if you STILL don't like the Splendor idea, Bloodcurdling Roar is always tasty for additional killyness/panic in the Shooting phase, esp. against Knights (really shines against Blood Knights or Chaos Knights as it can't tell the difference between T3 and T4) where having that 1 extra Knight around for Outnumber or attacks back could be game-changing.

Those are my suggestions :) As far as magic item combos go, I think Neknoh covered it pretty well (so well, in fact, that I changed up my core list now, hehe). Good luck w0lf!

W0lf
09-03-2009, 00:37
I do see the merits of splendour and it was my first must include. However pts....

and for the very reasons you listed i loath to dropa knight for it.

How about;

Lose hounds, 1 unit of M. horse is demoted to throwing spears (likely screening khorne knights now anyway.

Thats splendour in and 2K exact ;). Unless theres a better way?

Jericho
09-03-2009, 02:32
Heh I wish I got a chance to test out my patented "Oh god hit me with anything but flaming magical attacks" L4 build today, but when I got to the gaming club everyone was just starting games and I didn't have time to wait around 2.5 hours before starting a 2250 game :( Boourns, all I got to do was critique army lists and tell people what they did stupid after they didn't have a chance to fix it anymore :p

I think your Lord setup is quite good, with a dragon you have incentive to engage in combat most games, so Runesword could be a make or break item in some situations. On a disc rider, having Armor of Morrslieb and Crown of Conquest would be delightful ;)

W0lf
09-03-2009, 13:18
imo eye + Enchanted shield is best set-up for a disc wizard. It allows for puppet+book or 3x power stones (wanna try this one lol)

But thatsneither here nor there atm lol.

Oh and jericho no criticism? :) Nice to know yousupport the runesword though (as i do intend to engage in CC - id use a disc otherwise lol)

Angelust
09-03-2009, 18:21
I actually tend to like Collars on dragon riders, as they'll usually avoid getting shot through terrain placement, and if not for some reason, 5+ ward is still handy.

And generally, if you can't clear the killzone of counter-attackers, you probably should not be charging.


For that reason, I'm thinking of using MoT, Daemonsword + Collar + 3rd eye + roar. Light on armor and ward save, but resilient against magic. He becomes a fair CC fighter, and can also throw out some Tzeentch magic/roar/dual breath attacks.

Too light on defense? It's a huge amount of points if he dies...

Jericho
10-03-2009, 22:30
Oh and jericho no criticism? :) Nice to know yousupport the runesword though (as i do intend to engage in CC - id use a disc otherwise lol)Not much else to say really. The Dragon's eating up all the points so you can't have your other units bigger, marked, or otherwise bulked up.

If you wanted to take infantry or a Disc-rider then there would be things to debate :p

Kerill
12-03-2009, 04:08
Looks good, there are some alternative options but I wouldn't necessarily call them suggested changes:
Drop the runesword for sword of might and enchanted shield (-15 points) Obviously this means the nurgle sorcerer can't take the enchanted shield any more so give him the book of secrets for a decent flaming magic missile option. (+10 points). Slightly reduced combat power for your lord (-1A, Ws5/6 will seldom make a difference IMO) but increased survivability and means he has fairly good defence against magic missiles. Also boosts your magic phase and gives one of the nurgle sorcerors a magic missile for early game when enemy units are screened preventing buboes spam.

Puppet would be nice but would lead to a loss of dispel scrolls which you probably don't want to risk with the dragon rider and considering your group's armies.