PDA

View Full Version : Protecting the Heirophant



Nicha11
10-03-2009, 09:32
I've just started gaming again with my TK, and i'm having severe trouble protecting the big H.

I've tried 3 ways of protecting him

a)unit of archers, medium effective can be destroyed by skirmishers or magic.

b)unit of light cavalry, devestated by magic.

c)on his own, absoloutely owned by magic.

So how should i protect this crucial character?

moose
10-03-2009, 09:44
Give her the Golden ankhra for a 4+ ward - it is needed imo.

I keep mine in a block of skellie warriors, and keep them at the back in front of my catapults to cast smiting. Usually the enemy has enough trouble dealing with chariots and ushabti if magic/gunline heavy that they don't have time to go HeiroHunting.

I've also given her the cloak of the dunes, and make sure shes well out the way of charges. Though i'd only advise this against non gunlines.

Moose.

W0lf
10-03-2009, 11:33
Cloak of dunes and just hide behind/in blocks.

Speaking of which what kinda list you run? TK were ganna be my first fantast army (2 years ago) but chaos one. Im thinking of returning to them but as i see it only 1 or 2 types of builds work.

Oenghus
10-03-2009, 13:03
I'm a big proponent of the Cloak of Dunes method. Keep him in a big skellie block (or a smaller one bunkered behind the main line) until the turn that combat will begin in earnest. Then pop him out and drop him behind one of your units, behind terrain, or behind your enemy's lines. This method also requires, of course, that you've silenced (or at least distracted) mages and shooting units. I like scorpions and swarms for that.

This method, of course, doesn't work so well if you're dealing with greater demons and the like, but TKs don't really have any method for dealing with those things.

moose
10-03-2009, 16:02
This method, of course, doesn't work so well if you're dealing with greater demons and the like, but TKs don't really have any method for dealing with those things.

Screaming skull catapaults, and good rolling (10,11,12) on the casket of souls.

Malorian
10-03-2009, 16:12
I'm a big proponent of the Cloak of Dunes method. Keep him in a big skellie block (or a smaller one bunkered behind the main line) until the turn that combat will begin in earnest. Then pop him out and drop him behind one of your units, behind terrain, or behind your enemy's lines. This method also requires, of course, that you've silenced (or at least distracted) mages and shooting units. I like scorpions and swarms for that.


Well no use saying it when it would just be a rewording of this.

Our regular does this and it has worked very well. Being up front means it could be a target for fast character killers, but as long as you watch out for them then you'll be fine.

TomcatBG
10-03-2009, 20:35
Hello,i'm not that new to the game i've been into this stuff from about 2-3 years now but i've just collected a small army of TK caz i'm not alowed to make new thread i thought i should post here... so here's my question,i have a friendly battle with a friend of mine in a couple of weeks and i was thinking a good strategy,so.. here's the thing my army consist of 1 skeleton warrior group,1 skeleton steed group,3 ushapti,3 carrions and one lich priest on horse and 1 tomb prince,and my foe will be dark elves most probably.So i was thinking what items to put to my charactors,i think to put Armor of the Ages and a biting blade and a shield to the tomb prince and idk what to the lich priest.Any sugestions?

thx in advance

Nicha11
10-03-2009, 20:59
Speaking of which what kinda list you run? TK were ganna be my first fantast army (2 years ago) but chaos one. Im thinking of returning to them but as i see it only 1 or 2 types of builds work.

I'm playing 1000pts right now. I prince 2 liches 1 unit of chariots 2 units of archers 1 tomb scorpion and 3 ushabati.


Hello,i'm not that new to the game i've been into this stuff from about 2-3 years now but i've just collected a small army of TK caz i'm not alowed to make new thread i thought i should post here... so here's my question,i have a friendly battle with a friend of mine in a couple of weeks and i was thinking a good strategy,so.. here's the thing my army consist of 1 skeleton warrior group,1 skeleton steed group,3 ushapti,3 carrions and one lich priest on horse and 1 tomb prince,and my foe will be dark elves most probably.So i was thinking what items to put to my charactors,i think to put Armor of the Ages and a biting blade and a shield to the tomb prince and idk what to the lich priest.Any sugestions?

thx in advance

hmmm armour of ages is a good choice.
On the liche priest i recommend the hieractic jar.

Good luck i find Dark Elves a tough match up.

Red_Duke
10-03-2009, 22:52
I tend to run the Heirophant with Cloak of Dunes and a Heiratic Jar. Gives him the flexibility to get where he needs to be, plus pop that extra incant just when its needed (or of course to get him the hell out of a sticky situation with a second move of course).

One cheeky little trick you can use is keeping a 3 strong swarm unit infront of whatever unit your priests are in to keep fliers like terradons and the like at bay from suiciding or hit and running your priests - and since they're swarms you can see over them (they also work well to protect catapults and so forth from fliers, while still allowing them to see stuff to shoot)

Honestly though, now that i see you're playing sub-2k with TK you're gonna have a hard time just staying in the game, let alone keep the Big H alive. TK are possibly the suckiest army under 2k (id even rate them worse than Beastmen at that points level).

Point to note btw: Ushabti are a bit crap, and are damned expensive points wise. Nice to use in a friendly list, but generally you're much better off with some Tomb Guard, as they're more resilient, give a good place for characters to hide, plus have magical attacks - highly useful in certain situations.

On tomcatBG's list: Unless your DE opponent is bringing an extremely friendly list you're going to find yourself playing a very very short game. Possibly the softest TK list i've ever seen. What kind of strategy were you planning exactly? anything with any punch in the army is slow, and is rather vulnerable to bowfire (something DE have in abundance). Magic missiles don't go down well either, especially when you've only got a fairly lacklustre magic phase stopping you doing much healing, given the prince can only try and move his own unit. (although thats more the core problem sub-2k then your characters)

At 2k there are a number of reasonably successful builds, although all of them struggle against Daemons and HE with a star dragon to a degree. You tend to either see 'bunker' armies, with a couple of catauplts, king in TG with something like destroyer of eternities, or something more chariot based. a mix of chariots and catapults can work well too, although it can sometimes cause movement issues, as you really want to get those catapults firing twice a turn with magic, but on the flip side you want the liche's in position where they can help other units like the chariots get magical charges off.

One thing to note: TK are not as resilient as vamps, so generally against most armies i find the most successful tactic is to play as agressively as possible (which means chariots are a good choice generally), and use your potentially superior movement to rattle your opponent and also get as many flank charges as possible. Carrion are very handy, both for marchblocking and anti-warmachine duty, and no-one likes potential 40" charges :)

W0lf
11-03-2009, 00:33
The succesful TK lists ive seen all seem to be Gunline style with 2-3 scorpions and a block of TG with ether prince (then HLP +2LP) or Khalida + 3LP. 2 catapults and your laughing.

TomcatBG
11-03-2009, 19:05
Thx for the advises and my army is so 'soft' as Red_duke sad caz this is an introduction battle till i get my army... sorted out(the next unit i intend to buy when i have the chance is a Tomb Guard most probably) so i'm just asking for advises from you guys caz you're more experienced players,so you say the armor of ages is a good choise? and the biting blade with an extra shield that should give the tomb prince about 3+ armor save i think? and you say the hieractic jar that sounds good to me =) i've played 2 battles before against that DE player the firs tone ended up draw(beginers luck) the second one was a total disaster caz i failed to keep my troops in one place and the DE player used some really nasty magic witch wiped out hole bunch of my army =/

snottlebocket
11-03-2009, 21:42
Thx for the advises and my army is so 'soft' as Red_duke sad caz this is an introduction battle till i get my army... sorted out(the next unit i intend to buy when i have the chance is a Tomb Guard most probably) so i'm just asking for advises from you guys caz you're more experienced players,so you say the armor of ages is a good choise? and the biting blade with an extra shield that should give the tomb prince about 3+ armor save i think? and you say the hieractic jar that sounds good to me =) i've played 2 battles before against that DE player the firs tone ended up draw(beginers luck) the second one was a total disaster caz i failed to keep my troops in one place and the DE player used some really nasty magic witch wiped out hole bunch of my army =/

Hieratic jar is another one of those must have items for tomb kings. You absolutely need your magic as a TK player and the best way to do that is by casting as many low level spells as possible. For instance by adding bound spells to your army, the hieratic jar helps with this.

Armour of the ages is a decent choice for Tomb Kings. Their natural toughness of 5 is a nice protection, especially at smaller pointslevels, the armour helps with this. Princes also have a nice selection of regular weapons though, their iniative is very low so most likely you'll never strike first, that means the great weapons is a decent weapon choice and won't take a magic item slot, unlike the biting blade. If you take a magic weapon you must use it, but if you take a great weapon you can always opt to strike with a handweapon and shield instead if you need the extra protection. One example setup would be to have a great weapon, enchanted shield, and the collar of shapesh. The collar lets him pass off all his wounds on his unit, making him unkillable until the unit dies. The great weapon can give him strength 6 or the enchanted shield can give him a 3+ armoursave in combat, whichever you choose.

You can then add 2 liche priests, one hierophant with the hieratic jar and cloak of dunes to fly away from danger. And a second one with two scrolls to help keep your army safe.

The main problem though is that you lack both strengths of tomb kings. Aside from the ushabti you have no punch and no real shooting. Most tomb king armies use a lot of stuff like tomb scorpions to delay the enemy while raining down shooting on them, especially screaming skulls. While other armies delay and then mass counter charge with stuff like chariot units and ushabti.

You have the army core, you have the units like carrion and horsemen that help you attack artillery and delay enemy assault units, but you have no followup to deal a punch of your own. If you want to go the combat route one of the cheapest ways to expand your army would be to start a unit of chariots, then place the tomb prince in the chariot unit and try to manouvre that one into vital combats. (the shooting method seems to be most effective though, max out on tomb scorpions to delay people and start pouring as much screaming skull fire into the enemy as possible)

Red_Duke
11-03-2009, 22:07
If you've got a prince on foot, GW is definitely a good way to go. Armour of ages is a handy one, although so is scorpion armour, as you can then if you lose combat, you can suck up half the amount you lose by for just a single wound. However, given the points levels, and that he's stuck in an expendable unit, give him the collar of shapesh. Cant really get better than an effective 25pt 4+ ward save :) Given the points level, id save the rest for either a bit more gear on the priests, or some extra troops. Thing with the prince though is that he's never going to be a particularly awesome CC monster, so its more about him challenging stuff, and bogging bits down, while you get other things in to help him. Items like the flail of skulls help, although that little beauty works best on a king in chariot with a unit of chariots with the +1 to hit banner in it. The king can really do the business then, especially against knights and multi-wound creatures such as ogres.

Heiratic Jar really is a must though, the trick with it is to save it till that all important magic phase when you really just have to get a magical charge off. You might want to have your heirophant with the cloak of dunes and the jar as well, in with the prince's unit to try and encourage stuff to actually go near it, then he can fly on out to somewhere safer, and help incant the unit into combat.

If you have a scorpion, that can work wonders in dealing with things like skirmishers and light cav, not to mention being superb for taking down enemy characters in units (gotta love killing blow), and given they can manage an impressive 21" with magical charges, can be highly effective (they're also one of the few undercosted units in the TK arsenal, which is another reason they're so popular)

TomcatBG
12-03-2009, 16:55
K thx for the advises guys!
my tactic will most probably be the prince in the skeleton warriors ranks and the lich priest in the skeleton steed's ranks who will be with bows. or something like that i usualy come up with a plan either like 5 mins before the battle or during the battle =D