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View Full Version : Will there be a WotR starter box?



DarthFugly
10-03-2009, 12:28
There doesn't seem to be a bad word said about the AoBR/BfSP starter sets, which is miraculous given that this is the internet.

So following the pattern of Warhammer and 40k, what are the chances that a AoBR/BfSP style 'starter' set will be released for War of the Ring?

Assuming a starter set is released a few months after the big rulebook, what do you all think might (or should) be in it? What troop models are yet to be released? Elven cavalry? Recut Uruki (or any sprue with only 20 models?). What about a couple of big monsters?

Due to the game having a much stronger tie to a third-party IP, do you even think a box set is feasable? What 'Tolken-historical' battle could be used, that also uses new troop models? (eg with my examples above, could you have elven cav vs Uruki without making a Tolken fan head exploding?;))

I haven't seen the new book. Apparently it includes all the rules and all the army lists. Would making a small version like the AoBR even be feasible? Split the book giving small rulebook and separate small army 'beastiary'?

Tae
10-03-2009, 13:26
I can't really see them making a WotR starter boxed set, the amount of models they would have to include would be stupidly big - and would probably end up making the set cost 150-200 or so.

As for smaller rulebook, it might be nice however I'm not personally going to hold my breath for one as I don't think GW will see any point to making it.

But if they do, for the love of god don't separate the army lists from the actual rules, as people will always lose/forget one of the parts.

Dosadi
10-03-2009, 13:26
I think a starter set is not in the cards. Army "deals" and Battle force boxes are however. A small Pocket rulebook isn't really feasable because you would need to cut out the army lists and hobby section. But then you have to have some other way of getting the lists into people's hands. I can't see a "codex" release for each faction, but I suppose it may happen one day.


Dosadi

DarthFugly
10-03-2009, 13:55
I can't really see them making a WotR starter boxed set, the amount of models they would have to include would be stupidly big - and would probably end up making the set cost 150-200 or so.

Ok, but think about the Battle for Skull Pass. How many models in that?

Assault on Black Reach; marines don't even get a legal army.


I think one of the main hurdle for GW would be trying to pick which forces to include. For 40k, space marines are the iconic 'good guys' so putting them against [fill in blank] aliens is the obvious choice.

Warhammer; They just pick a race that hasn't seen love in a while, then pit them against another race that is diametrically opposed to them.

But for WotR, what forces could they pick that are 'iconic', yet havn't already got lots of new models released?

Eg you could do a box based on Helms Deep, with Rohan foot, elves, Rohan Cavalry, vs Uruki and troll, with scenery being castle wall and gate and battering ram.
BUT all those models have already been released, so apart from recut Uruki there would be no point.

What about a box with gondor knights and foot vs mordor orcs and winged fell beast? Classic matchup with 'Iconic' armies, but again nothing we haven't seen before.

(however, as someone who hasn't played LotR before, I would snap up either of those boxes)

What about a box set that is 'suspiciously' like the end of the Hobbit - small army of men (warriors, archers, some cav etc) verses goblins and a Dragon??

If GW released that box for ~40 I bet everyone would buy it. They would get people like me who haven't got any LotR stuff, and everyone who bought the big rulebook would also go buy the box for the dragon etc.:)

Godswildcard
10-03-2009, 14:13
GW always does well when it releases box sets, and your correct in that both of the other starter sets contain respectable starter armies.

I would love to see a WotR box. Looking at it this way:

GW has had one box for LotR. The Mines of Moria doesn't contain any 'army' besides the goblins, as the good side is represented only by the Fellowship.

...on second thought, I have no idea where I'm going with this...

I'd buy one. Be simple and make it Gondor vs. Orcs. Call it "WotR: Battle of Pellennor (sp?) Field.

Done and done.

Tae
10-03-2009, 14:19
Ok, but think about the Battle for Skull Pass. How many models in that?

Over 100, but given each WotR (infantry) company consists of 8 models, that only makes for 12.5 companies. That's barely a few hundred points, which represents a much smaller percentage of a 'typical' game than either the BFSP or the AOBR sets.


Assault on Black Reach; marines don't even get a legal army.

Legal army requirements:
1 HQ - Captain
2 Troops - 10 tactical marines which can be taken as 2 five man squads.

Sorry, think you'll find the marines in AOBR are perfectly legal.


I think one of the main hurdle for GW would be trying to pick which forces to include. For 40k, space marines are the iconic 'good guys' so putting them against [fill in blank] aliens is the obvious choice.

Warhammer; They just pick a race that hasn't seen love in a while, then pit them against another race that is diametrically opposed to them.

But for WotR, what forces could they pick that are 'iconic', yet havn't already got lots of new models released?

Eg you could do a box based on Helms Deep, with Rohan foot, elves, Rohan Cavalry, vs Uruki and troll, with scenery being castle wall and gate and battering ram.
BUT all those models have already been released, so apart from recut Uruki there would be no point.

What about a box with gondor knights and foot vs mordor orcs and winged fell beast? Classic matchup with 'Iconic' armies, but again nothing we haven't seen before.

(however, as someone who hasn't played LotR before, I would snap up either of those boxes)

What about a box set that is 'suspiciously' like the end of the Hobbit - small army of men (warriors, archers, some cav etc) verses goblins and a Dragon??

If GW released that box for ~40 I bet everyone would buy it. They would get people like me who haven't got any LotR stuff, and everyone who bought the big rulebook would also go buy the box for the dragon etc.:)

Whilst WotR is definately a completely different gaming system, look at it's release more akin to the Apocalypse release in 40k. It's all about taking what you already have and making it bigger. As such any 'starter kit' would have to include a massive amount of models to a) make it worth while and b) to distinguish it from the MoM starter kit. At which point we're back at the cost issue.

Plus, if they released a WotR boxed set for 40, who in their right mind would ever buy the MoM starter kit? The WotR one would have to, by pure game mechanics, have to give you a HELL of a lot more models, at which point the saving you've just made could buy you the LotR hardback rulebook and probably still have saved you some money.

lotrchampion
10-03-2009, 14:24
Nothing is planned for the coming months regarding a WotR boxed set. Realistically, I don't believe it would work-condensing a 328 page rulebook to a mini format is simply far to difficult to be achievable. Also considering that its meant to be a 'Starter' set, what do you define as the 'Start' of a WotR force?

As far as forces are concerned, I would anticipate Rohan + Uruk-hai if anything. Both excellent WotR armies, very well defined from the films (Helm's Deep et al) and contrasting troop types. Enough to make a couple of Cav formations with Command, perhaps Eomer in plastic, and then shedloads of Uruks, again with command options. Potential there for the release of Uruks Xbows in plastic as well.

However, I doubt it would happen. As has been said, its more likely that more 'Army Boxes' will come out, giving players an 'instant' WotR army.

Laser guided fanatic
10-03-2009, 17:50
Legal army requirements:
1 HQ - Captain
2 Troops - 10 tactical marines which can be taken as 2 five man squads.

Sorry, think you'll find the marines in AOBR are perfectly legal.



.

Uhh no they have to be taken as 1 10 man squad but can be combat squadded. (Because of the Heavy and special weps)

Znail
10-03-2009, 19:07
Nothing is planned for the coming months regarding a WotR boxed set. Realistically, I don't believe it would work-condensing a 328 page rulebook to a mini format is simply far to difficult to be achievable. Also considering that its meant to be a 'Starter' set, what do you define as the 'Start' of a WotR force?

As far as forces are concerned, I would anticipate Rohan + Uruk-hai if anything. Both excellent WotR armies, very well defined from the films (Helm's Deep et al) and contrasting troop types. Enough to make a couple of Cav formations with Command, perhaps Eomer in plastic, and then shedloads of Uruks, again with command options. Potential there for the release of Uruks Xbows in plastic as well.

However, I doubt it would happen. As has been said, its more likely that more 'Army Boxes' will come out, giving players an 'instant' WotR army.

How much of those 328 pages are rules and how much is fluff? It doesnt matter anyway as it will still be smaller due to the smaller page size and text.

I would be rather surpriced if we dont get a box for WotR. That we havent heared any news about it isnt strange as it was the same for the last WHFB and 40k releases as well. They want people to buy the hardcover book and not hold back and wait for the boxed set.

A boxed set the size of BfSP would be a pretty good start for WotR. It may only be a few hundred points in pure troops, but remember that any characters or even command options can push that up to 500-1000 points depending on army. Then consider the option to trade half a box to get 2 halves of the same army to get a fairly huge army for low cost.

I would expect some Orcs as all the evil forces can have them. Both sides will probobly get a decent mix to showcase the diffrent types of units.

Tae
10-03-2009, 22:42
Uhh no they have to be taken as 1 10 man squad but can be combat squadded. (Because of the Heavy and special weps)

Okay, I thought they gave you 10 bolters as well as the heavy/special weapons. Apologies.

lotrchampion
10-03-2009, 23:19
Znail, the majority of the book is points values and stats for existing models. The whole range is covered, hence why it is so weighty. Even extracting the hobby section, its still weighing in at probably 250+ pages. Not the most condesible.

HsojVvad
11-03-2009, 00:49
I would love a box set for WotR, or even a new box set for SBG. I think the Fellowship would be a must for a beginer box set. Remember a box set is usually to get people into the game, so people who know what LotR is but not the game system, will only be able to associate with the game better if there is a Fellowship.

From there they can expand to what they want. Maybe they can have a Fellowship, with a bit of Goblins, a bit Urik-hi, a bit of everything and throw in a Balrog so people can get into monsters.

I guess it would really be for SBG, but could be used for WotR as well. Maybe the box set could introduce both sets of the game.

Joewrightgm
11-03-2009, 02:15
I'm of the mind that the only time we'll see a new set of minis to replace Mines of Moria is when the Hobbit film is released.

Simple fact of the matter is that GW will be striking while the iron is hot, and give them to repackage some existing minis like the goblins and plastic cave troll and the Dwarf Warrior plastics, maybe including a plastic 'captain' for each side.

Then it might also give them an excuse to do the expedition to erebor (the twelve dwarves, bilbo and Gandalf) with some new minis in plastic like Giant Spiders, Wargs (minus Riders) or even Gundabad Black Shields (who have stats in WoTR!)

They really have a lot more options when it comes to the Hobbit; they may even do plastics elves against any of the aforementioned adversaries, or plastic men of dale against the gobbos and their allies.

The door is really wide open, but not for War. At best they might throw in some quick start rules.

HsojVvad
11-03-2009, 03:15
I guess you are right Joewrighthgm. I havn't read the Hobbit yet, waiting for the movie then will read the book. I guess you hit it dead on with your guess.

VeriNasti
11-03-2009, 03:33
I personallly don't think that they will do a WOTR starter set - the amount of models needed for just 500 - 600pts!
I agree with you joewrightgm - that is a possibility

Znail
11-03-2009, 04:45
Znail, the majority of the book is points values and stats for existing models. The whole range is covered, hence why it is so weighty. Even extracting the hobby section, its still weighing in at probably 250+ pages. Not the most condesible.
It would still only be double the pages or possible split in two books by splitting the rules and the unit stats.

I doubt the fellowship thou as they are in the LoTR box. Hmm, maybe mounted versions of them would work.

WotR is on a similar scale as WHFB and nothing has kept them from doing a box there, so I dont see why it would be impossible for WotR.

bringerofdecay
11-03-2009, 09:00
i highly doubt there will be a 'starter' box for WoTR in the foreseeable future, they already have the entry box in to LoTR SGB which is in itself the entrance in to WoTR, i also have reason to believe that WoTR is being treated very much like a specialist game (not being counted as a core sale etc etc) much like the apocalypse suppliants.
and after all LoTR apocalypse is essentially what WoTR is (a way to play large games with all your minis in a reasonable time frame).

there are a number of other reasons they won't release a stater set;

1. it's not a core game
2. it's not being treated as a core game (despite the fact that it's more in keeping with the 2 main core systems)
3. GW can't afford to undercut themselves on LoTR sales to much as a massive chunk of what they make from LoTR sales goes straight to new line (or whoever it is they have the contract with)
4. they already have a LoTR starter box

there are others, but these are the main ones in my eyes.

WoTR is a money making exercise and an attempt to ascertain if the contract with new line is worth renewing (i believe it's up in the next year or two) and cashing in on the probable success of the hobbit film (the the tie in film) or if they should drop it and focus their attention elsewhere.

having said this i think they have done a superb job with the ruleset and i'm in no doubt that this will outsell the core LoTR system (which is a no brainer, if it's more popular than the core rules it will sell more by the nature of the game (large scale battle = more models to buy)). and if the success is big enough we may well see LoTR SGB take a step down (or up ;)) to specialist games and WoTR take its place as a core then and only then will a starter box be considered (and don't expect it to be for 40)


edit: but for the record my money'd be on dwarves and goblins, small models so more can fit on each sprue (which brings down the cost as they can make less molds), they already have a plastic cave troll they can cut onto the sprue (1 or more), for the most part D&G are 1 part models, do a couple of captains/banners/heros in plastic for each and bobs your uncle. it will sell well to goblin players as well, (as they'll need masses more than any other army if they want to go the horde route), 72 goblins 2 cavetrolls and a glut of /commands/commanders for 40, and some free dwarves to put on bases? :p

DarthSte
11-03-2009, 09:35
I would love to see a WotR box. Looking at it this way:

GW has had one box for LotR. The Mines of Moria doesn't contain any 'army' besides the goblins, as the good side is represented only by the Fellowship.


I can think of 4 boxed games for LotR.
1. Fellowship of the ring, came with men of the second age, elves with bows and sword - and lot's of goblins. (as the first film came out)
2. Two Towers, came with mounted rohan and uruk hai (as the 2nd film came out)
3. Return of the king, came with mordor orcs and men of the third age. (as the final film came out)
4. Mines of moria (again lot's of goblins).

Think the first and 3rd box came with about 50 models, you'd need at least 80 in the set for basic sized "army" each.

lorelorn
11-03-2009, 10:13
I think Mordor versus Gondor would be a good set for inclusion in any boxed intro game. You could probably get awya with the equivalent of 6 plastic boxes in such a set

eg 2x soldiers of Gondor, 1x knights of Gondor
2x Morannon Orcs, 1x warg riders

would be a nice set to start with and the core of a reasonable army for either side.


Not that I think there is such a box coming. I'll be happy enough with the book and the models I have now.

Kronos
11-03-2009, 16:54
why would it have be a legal army, i think two forces (mordor and gondor of course) of equal or near point cost wold be just as good.

Most 40k battles are 1,500 but neither of the aobr forces included come near that point cost, i think some scenery two forces dice etc alng with a small step by step of the rules is just what what WoTR would need to boost the amount of players.

Xarius
11-03-2009, 19:20
right sorry but there will not be a starter box for wotr, it isnt cost effective and the system is kind of midway betwen a specialist game, sbg and apocalypse. They really only want to stick with the 3 main at the mo to get peole in then get them to buy more to build wotr, apoc, legendary battle armies.