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Aceious
11-03-2009, 17:57
About a month ago my friend and I were playing a game where a strange instance happened. My swordmasters were charged by a unit of ghouls which had the ability to strike first due to a nearby corpse cart. Generally with 2 units both striking first you go by initiative, yet the swordmasters have greatswords. My friend makes the point that those with great weapons strike last, but the Speed of Asuryan rule seems to override that. We both have been playing for years, yet couldn't figure this one out. Swordmaster's win in initiative, so would they still strike first? My opinion was yes. But if anyone could throw theirs out too that would be good.

Lord Malorne
11-03-2009, 18:00
The Swordmasters would strike first, just because he has ASF does not mean you lose the benefits of ASF, you still have it so would strike at Initiative as per the ASF rules.

Spirit
11-03-2009, 18:01
Don't you go to initiative, and considering the sword masters have great weapons, the ghouls go first?

WLBjork
11-03-2009, 18:02
This has been clarified in the HE Q&A.

If there are 2 units in btb with ASF, the next criteria is Initiative.

Great Weapons play no part in this particular case.

Aceious
11-03-2009, 18:04
YES! Thank you :) Could have sworn I had read it but couldn't find it again.

EvC
11-03-2009, 19:16
It's in both the HE FAQ and the main rulebook FAQ. Always good places to check when you have a question ;)

CaliforniaGamer
11-03-2009, 19:47
Yep, GW wielding ASFers especially fast ones like the HEs are deadly. The corpse cart miasma of deathly vigor bound spell is almost worthless against them.

WLBjork
11-03-2009, 22:44
Good point EvC, I'd forgotten that GW put it in the main rulebook Q&A as well!

XXL
13-03-2009, 04:08
thats a retarded rule imo. :)

Lord Yawgmoth
13-03-2009, 04:22
I agree,

^.^ mainly because I play VC versus HEs alot.


but i do know of this rule, and still follow it to the letter.

WLBjork
13-03-2009, 08:56
thats a retarded rule imo. :)

They had to do it that way, otherwise there would be no advantage for a DE Assasain attacking HE.

(Originally, it was ruled differently)

Gazak Blacktoof
13-03-2009, 11:36
Aye, GW painted themselves into a corner with ASF when they did the first FAQ for it. The new one isn't any better and screws with a lot more models than the dark elf assassin under the specific condition of his unit being charged.

The new FAQ makes a mockery of greenskin and necromancy spells as well as ASF items carrid by dwarfs and tomb kings.

XXL
13-03-2009, 16:32
They had to do it that way, otherwise there would be no advantage for a DE Assasain attacking HE.

(Originally, it was ruled differently)

ahh man, I dont understand how the logical ruling can mess with the DE assasain vs HE matchup? Pls explain :)

Gazak Blacktoof
13-03-2009, 16:36
The older ruling used the full sequence on p.34 for determining striking order (somebody will correct me if I'm misremembering) so charging was used as the first criteria in a tiebreaker between two ASF models. Thus an assassin would strike after a charging high elf which would prompt an ass kicking for the unarmoured ninja.

Lord Yawgmoth
13-03-2009, 18:46
The older ruling used the full sequence on p.34 for determining striking order (somebody will correct me if I'm misremembering) so charging was used as the first criteria in a tiebreaker between two ASF models. Thus an assassin would strike after a charging high elf which would prompt an ass kicking for the unarmoured ninja.

Yeah, thats how it was for a while, I remember them saying to go by the normal 'who strikes first' when both models had ASF, but 'twas changed.