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Makaber
11-12-2005, 21:15
Halberds are generally considered vastly inferior to great weapons, as their advantage doesn't come into play often enough. So I was thinking, halberds (as well as the vast majority of strangely shaped polearm variants also covered under the name) were made to fight cavalry, using their hooks to pull them from their mounts, and their impact and spikes to smash through their armour. This isn't really covered in the rules, so to balance the halberds a little, maybe it could give a +1 to hit against cavalry, as well as its current rules? It would make it a viable choice, but so task-spesific that it wouldn't make any other choice obsolete.

As a side though, maybe a similar advantage to spearmen, representing how spears are better at defending against cavalry than say, swordsmen? I'm thinking giving charging cavalry a -1 WS or -1 to hit.

Izram
11-12-2005, 23:39
This deserves to be in the general discussion area.

and they already have pikes for anti cavalry shaft weapons.

Makaber
12-12-2005, 00:03
Yeah, it stuck me just after I posted it it's not really a rules question as such. I hope it can get moved if a mod reads it or something.

In any case (while the spear thing isn't really the main topic) pikes work just fine, but they're really rare, and are really just an extention of pikes. Nobody complains about pikes not being effective enough (rather the contrary), and spears are regularly griped upon. I've also reached the conclution that spears rarely are worth the effort compared to handweapon and shield. So, the general idea is to add some anti cavalry capabilities to spears without making them as good as pikes.

Pikes are very rarely seen, since they're only used to significant extent in Dogs of War armies, which are really few and far between. Also, there's no reason why there can't be several types of weapons with the same purpose in the game, just look at flails and great weapons.

Keller
12-12-2005, 00:34
Personally, I would like to see spears strike first when charged, or give a penalty to WS or the actual roll for those charging into them. I don't think it should be limited to cavalry though.

I would like to see something done with halberds, though I already like them. A bonus against cavalry could work I suppose, but a simple +1 strength isn't much of an improvement when you can generally just have great weapons instead, which get the bonus against anything.

Frankly, the HW/S combo is too good to pass up in most cases, and just overshadows everything else. It is more expensive to buy other weapons for troops, and they don't perform as well as the +2 save from a shield. Its been suggested that making the bonus save apply based on WS, which would really help out elite armies, but theres been plenty of other ideas on the matter too.

All I know is I will still be taking my halberds nonetheless, just because I think models armed with them look awesome on the table.

Ganymede
12-12-2005, 04:53
How about... All chariots, cavalry and monsters are at -1 to hit against any model armed with a polearm (spear or halberd).

Mad Makz
12-12-2005, 05:37
-1 to hit is WAY too powerful for a generic weapon (it is MUCH more powerful than +1 save from HW Shield, which is likely to get neutered down to WS 4 or more troops only the in next edition according to rumours anyway.)

Halberds offering an additional -1 Save against Cavalry and chariots would be one not too powerful solution (So Strength 4 but -2 save versus Cav). Even an additional +1 Strength versus cavalry only would also work.

Spears, I think their advantage is pretty good at the moment, just not as good as HW and Shield, which is too powerful in the hands of WS3 or less Soldiers and now likely to be toned down.

Sir Charles
12-12-2005, 06:27
Personally I'v always that it was the pole arm options that should be standard equipment, w/ hand weapons and shields being the upgrade. That should take care of some of the balance issue.