PDA

View Full Version : First Age gaming



Dogui
16-03-2009, 05:21
I am very interested in gaming and modeling stuff from the First Age. Turin and his band of outcasts, Beleg, the elves from Nargothrond, Tuor and the elves from Gondolin and such.

Do you guys know of a good source for conversions using the actual range of models (this is in case anyone has done this already)?

Any tips also welcomed from the more knowledgable members of Warseer.

jaws900
16-03-2009, 08:46
You could uses the profiles of current elves for them like using Elf captains or Elrond (Without magic).

lotrchampion
16-03-2009, 11:55
Flick around on The Last Alliance should throw somethings up, both on the forums and in the article sections. Theres a nice conversion of Fingon and some conversions for Elves of Hithlum recently added an article for. Link in my sig. You could also take a look on OneRing.co.uk (www.onering.co.uk) where if I recall correctly there is a supplement detailing the Fall of Gondolin.

You've actually touched on some of my own specific areas of interest in your words there. Here's my current ideas for some of which you've mentioned:

Turin (wearing Helm of Dor-lomin)-Aragorn (defenders of rohan) with metal HElf Spearmen head. Gives a great model with a similar pose to Turin on the cover of the Tales of the Children of Hurin.

Tuor-My conversion for him was the bare-headed metal RotN lifting the spear above his head, with spear and bow replaced with Faramir's sword and a Dol Amroth shield.

Outlaws-Easy, Rangers of Middle-earth.

Beleg-Haldir (unarmoured) w/ Bow does it nicely.

Elves of Nargothrond-see article mentioned above Re: Hithlum.

Elves of Gondolin: Upcoming plastic Armoured Wood Elves would do the job nicely IMO.

Hope that helps a little-as has been said, you could probably improvise profiles, or House Rule in your own. :)

Dogui
16-03-2009, 12:59
Excellent tips lotrchampion. I specially like the conversion idea for Turin. Beleg Iīd like to make him more personal, so Iīll look into that.

Lots of possibilities for skirmish scenarios in Turinīs story. Thanks for the links too! It amazes me that thereīs so much conversion work in LotR SBG sites and forums but so little regarding the First Age.

Phoenix Blaze
16-03-2009, 14:33
I too yearn for the day when I can comman an army made up of Maedhros and his riders (the superior Son). The Silmarillion interests me a lot more than LotR ever could, so I'd much rather be playing 1st age stuff rather than this silly 3rd age nonsense.


Conversion wise, well, I planned on doing a pure Noldor force, the exiles, and I figured that armour wise, they'd be wearing the same, if not damn similar stuff to the armour of the Last Alliance Elves (seeing as they were also of the Noldor, for the most part).

There's also some great looking elven models by Andrea miniatures, some of them should be a suitable scale (maybe, they're a bit heroic) and would be great for the Elven lords.

I also think Thranduil with a little work would make a great Thingol. He practically fits the bill as he is. Also, models like armoured Glorfindel, Erestor and Elronds sons which are not based on actors would be great as they don't look too characterful compared to those of say the Fellowship.

And of course, there's Cirdan, Celeborn, Galadriel, Gil Galad and Elrond (although, Elrond was only around towards the very end of the 1st age, and even then he was very young and sadly, the Gil Galad model sucks, mightily so).

Dogui
16-03-2009, 14:56
I agree with you on the Last Alliance elves. I think they are suitable for First Age elves, and adding to them some wood elves you can get some very good and simple conversions.

And letīs not forget that a simple conversion on models like Glorfindel, Erestor and such with a different paintjob can create some wonderful things.

jaws900
16-03-2009, 20:32
I completely agree. a simple lick of paint here and there can make a large diffrence. I have a Dwarf army with Blue armoour and Purple Clothing(Enchanted Blue and Warlock Purple if you want to know) and also a Blue wash over the top (To dull down the colour) and it look massivly diffrent from the rest of the dwarfs even the Gimli that i have was painted like that and sometimes you can't tell it's Gimli.

Phoenix Blaze
16-03-2009, 21:18
*smacks self of head*, duh! When listing the characters around in the 1st age, I totaly forgot about Glorfindel! I even mentioned the model!

Armour wise, he could easily be used as he is, but I would like to be able to convert him to be helmetless, showing off his blonde hair.

Dogui
16-03-2009, 22:07
Yeah jaws900, a different paintjob on very established characters makes all the difference and can be used as other figures (captains, for example)

Phoenix Blaze, isnīt the Glorfindel model without a helmet already? Maybe you refer to another character?

Phoenix Blaze
16-03-2009, 22:39
There's two, unarmoured from the Felowship and a bit fulgy, then armoured (from some other time) which looks awesome! A head swap would be good, but doesn't seem possible. I'd def. be using his armoured version though. I can't imagine him taking on that Balrog unarmoured.

Dogui
16-03-2009, 23:28
You are right, from the White Council set. Awesome figure. And an easy conversion having both Glorfindels :)

jaws900
17-03-2009, 10:19
You could use Green Stuff for the converions but again i couldn't tell you how you would do it as i have about as much skill with Green stuff as George Bush as go skill at talking proper English.

VeriNasti
17-03-2009, 10:41
lol, that is true about Bush...
How about converting the normal glorfindel for Beren and Arwen for Luthien?

Phoenix Blaze
17-03-2009, 13:22
Beren was a man, so using a mighty elf for a conversion would seem odd to me. One of the Aragorn's, or maybe even a Beregond or something could work. Replace Beregond's raised sword with a Silmaril and you're set!

Dogui
17-03-2009, 13:37
Nice ideas guys. Keep īem coming. Iīm sure lots of people are interested in this Age and this thread is becoming juicier every day.

I was wondering about creating Nienor Niniel, Turinīs sister, for a small scenario. And itīs making me crazy. How would you model her from LotR figures? Goldberry seems suitable (and almost the only one) but would need some heavy conversion.

Any ideas?

Godswildcard
17-03-2009, 14:09
Hmmm...

Isn't that an elf goddess?

*ducks under shoe*

I'm not really up with my fluff outside of the trilogy. You may want to have a look at the Brettonian Damsels. The scale would be a tad off, but not terrible.

Phoenix Blaze
17-03-2009, 14:28
I think Goldberry would make a great Luthien.

Is there a model of Eowyn (sp?) in a dress or anything?

Dogui
17-03-2009, 15:49
No, Godswildcard, sheīs just a human girl, sister of Turin and an important part of his story (thatīs why Iīd like to model her). The Brettonian damsels are a bit too much. I think a regular girl with a dress would do.

Sadly, no Eowyn is unarmoured. I think a girl with a cloak can do too, since she first escapes Thingolīs kingdom disguised as a Grey Elf. Tough one though. Mithrilīs models are too big, and WFBīs are too chunky.

Godswildcard
17-03-2009, 16:25
So you need an unarmored human female?

how about Eowyns head on Arwen's body? Wouldn't be a tough conversion, and would probably look pretty good!

Dogui
17-03-2009, 16:38
Arwen on foot, with Eowynīs head and some kind of staff in place of the sword. That would make an excellent Nienor. Thanks Godswildcard!

PD: And there is an unarmoured Eowyn now that I check my collection. Itīs the one from the Helmīs Deep set!

Phoenix Blaze
17-03-2009, 17:42
Does anyone have any ideas on how to model some of the Valar and the Maiar?

Morgoth should be easy, using Sauron as a basis for the size and great armour design, but what of the Valar? The book is never clear on how tall or large they are. We know that Morgoth towered over all the Children of Illuvatar, but it never implies that he was always so big, or that he towered over the Valar. Does this mean he changed his size at times? Or does this mean all the valar are fairly large? I doubt it as they chose to cloth themselves in the likenesses of the Children of Illuvatar as they had great love for them.

Dogui
17-03-2009, 18:25
Good point. I always imagined them big like Sauron. Maybe using figurines from a different scale? Youīd need to do some converting and sculpting, but larger scales are usually well proportioned and may look the part.

jaws900
17-03-2009, 21:01
I might have to try that now you said that. (Prepares for a filer with green stuff tho) I think Radagast's staff would look the best as it' the most Earth like (A.K.A not metalic looking like Sarumans)

Crisis_Core
17-03-2009, 23:58
I think Goldberry would make a great Luthien.

Is there a model of Eowyn (sp?) in a dress or anything?

You may want to look at Miranda - from Hasslefree Miniatures. She's a 'not'-Eowyn sculpt.

http://www.hasslefreeminiatures.co.uk/pack.php?pack=688

Dogui
18-03-2009, 03:59
Thatīs a beautiful model Crisis_Core. Do you know how does Hasslefree compare with GWīs LotR sizewise?

Phoenix Blaze
18-03-2009, 11:44
Wow, a hasslefree female model with its clothes still on.

I think hasslefree are a good size for the LotR range, but the LotR range has this annoying habit of being very true scale, rather than heroic so finding models that not only are the right size, but also fit the look is difficult.

Dogui
18-03-2009, 16:15
Yes, thatīs why modeling and converting figures for First Age gaming is such a challenge. The rest of GWīs lines are out of the question and itīs even hard to match some historical manufacturers with this range for conversions.

Crisis_Core
19-03-2009, 15:05
@Phoenix Blaze: Haha thats a little unfair, Kev has lots of clothed scuplts - actually his adventurers range is top-notch.

@Dogui: I'll try and post up a scale shot soon, but off the top of my head Miranda is the same height as most of the metals, however she is rather petite if you get my meaning.

Dragon Prince of Caledor
20-03-2009, 14:00
:angel:
Does anyone have any ideas on how to model some of the Valar and the Maiar?

Morgoth should be easy, using Sauron as a basis for the size and great armour design, but what of the Valar? The book is never clear on how tall or large they are. We know that Morgoth towered over all the Children of Illuvatar, but it never implies that he was always so big, or that he towered over the Valar. Does this mean he changed his size at times? Or does this mean all the valar are fairly large? I doubt it as they chose to cloth themselves in the likenesses of the Children of Illuvatar as they had great love for them.

They are spirits and can take on any form so, in theory, they can be anything. I could imagine a pretty cool Ulmo something like an elf surrounded by a bunch of water and an unearthy colour scheme. I wonder what form they take on when interacting with the elves. I assume they are guised like an elf. You could go with that. A maiar wed one of the noldor (thingol i thought it was) i forget her name atm. Melian thats her name. anywho i think that would work. Just use some of the unarmored elf heroes and paint them in really grand colours. Morgoth was larger than the sauron model would imply but not by a whole lot (atleast when he was in physical form fighting fingolfin)


That reminds me: my high elf prince/future standard bearer is painted like a dragon prince, on the elven steed (the new hero kit thing) and has the head with hair blowing and a smal crown. I think that model, on foot, painted the exact same way would be an awesome Fingolfin model. Just have to put him on a circular base.
I think war of the ring is the solution to my wanting to play first age games. Oh dear this is going to be fun.

P.S. I have made many posts about first age gaming on this site and the palantir and no one ever replied. Im glad someone got a reply :angel:

Dragon Prince of Caledor
20-03-2009, 14:41
Flick around on The Last Alliance should throw somethings up, both on the forums and in the article sections. Theres a nice conversion of Fingon and some conversions for Elves of Hithlum recently added an article for. Link in my sig. You could also take a look on OneRing.co.uk (www.onering.co.uk) where if I recall correctly there is a supplement detailing the Fall of Gondolin.

You've actually touched on some of my own specific areas of interest in your words there. Here's my current ideas for some of which you've mentioned:

Turin (wearing Helm of Dor-lomin)-Aragorn (defenders of rohan) with metal HElf Spearmen head. Gives a great model with a similar pose to Turin on the cover of the Tales of the Children of Hurin.

Tuor-My conversion for him was the bare-headed metal RotN lifting the spear above his head, with spear and bow replaced with Faramir's sword and a Dol Amroth shield.

Outlaws-Easy, Rangers of Middle-earth.

Beleg-Haldir (unarmoured) w/ Bow does it nicely.

Elves of Nargothrond-see article mentioned above Re: Hithlum.

Elves of Gondolin: Upcoming plastic Armoured Wood Elves would do the job nicely IMO.

Hope that helps a little-as has been said, you could probably improvise profiles, or House Rule in your own. :)

The first age conversion is very clever. In fact I think i may do the exact same thing this summer and such including the addition of the model for fingolfin i mentioned i could convert. Orcs are orcs and rangers would do for turins group. The conversion mentioned for turin is also clever.
Anywho i didnt find one for fingon on the site you said. I saw that fall of gondolin supplement thing. That is going to be really cool when completed. Can you tell me where to look for Fingon's conversion?

lotrchampion
20-03-2009, 17:12
Linky (http://www.thelastalliance.com/index.php?pid=viewgallery&catid=8&subid=39&galleryid=3&galleryuser=15628&action=ViewGallery)

Thats the chappy's gallery, with Fingon and a converted First Age Elf archer.

One of the guys at our store has been nagging me to come up with some First Age material for Veteran's nights, and I'm considering a linear narrative campaign for the Tales of the Children of Hurin. If I get something written up, I'll try to remember to upload and post it. :)

Phoenix Blaze
20-03-2009, 18:14
The link's broken.


When GW released the new high elves for WFB, I was tempted to start an army and paint them up as Noldor. I'm not sure why, but their metal heroes really reminded me of Turgon and Fingolfin. Turgon for the axe wielding one and Fingolfin for the hero with the high helm and sword.


I looked at some of the Elf conversions on Last Alliance. I really like the arm swap for the swordsmen and spearmen. Come on GW, release more 2nd age elves and I'll play one your damned games again!

lotrchampion
20-03-2009, 19:46
Link doesn't appear broken to me....you might need to register to view the gallerys, thats all I can think of.

brightblade
23-03-2009, 10:54
Thank god there are no First Age miniatures/ rules. I do not need anymore expenses. LOL.:p The only reason I don't play lotr is because it isn't set in the First Age.

So good to see such love for the First Age it really is where the gaming opportunities are.:)

(Makes me think back to old merp days);)

Dragon Prince of Caledor
23-03-2009, 17:39
Does anyone know of the picture in "The Children of Hurin" at the beginning ot the chapter: The battle of unnumbered tears? I think that the plastic Galadrim and the metal wood elves, with some conversions and maybe a different colour scheme represent the Noldor in the picture. If they were given some spears and maybe some shields. ?!?!?!

I think that my idea for Fingolfin from the High Elf hero box set (fantasy) will be sick. I will have to send in a pic of my prince that looks like what i had imagined Fingolfin looking like. Does anyone think that the plastic galadrim cavalry could suffice (if equipped differently) as the cavalry of Nargothrond?
I suppose I want to be able to use the models and have them make sense in the first, second, and third age if that is possible...
Have I mentioned that I am stoked for WotR. I dont have any reasonable cashflow until the summer :( (four month summer for post secondary students :D)

I read the chapter "The Battle of Unnumbered tears" the other day for something to do. Trying to wrap my head around all of this in WotR.

Dragon Prince of Caledor
25-03-2009, 15:09
Someone answer to this thread

Dogui
25-03-2009, 15:36
Donīt panic. I think some people are already working on their First Age conversions :)

Dogui
25-03-2009, 15:45
Turin (wearing Helm of Dor-lomin)-Aragorn (defenders of rohan) with metal HElf Spearmen head. Gives a great model with a similar pose to Turin on the cover of the Tales of the Children of Hurin.


Do you have an image of this cover? I canīt find it online, and my Tolkien books in Spanish usually have different covers :(

Dragon Prince of Caledor
25-03-2009, 21:15
Do you have an image of this cover? I canīt find it online, and my Tolkien books in Spanish usually have different covers :(

http://www.endorion.org/books/images/childrenofhurin/wallpaper_1_1024x768.jpg

Dragon Prince of Caledor
25-03-2009, 21:16
Donīt panic. I think some people are already working on their First Age conversions :)

lol. Good stuff :D (i hope)

brightblade
25-03-2009, 23:14
I have been working on them for ages. Lol. :D

Phoenix Blaze
26-03-2009, 16:17
I think the Galadhrim could easily pass for the elves of Menegroth or something, hell you could just use them as 1st age elves regardless of type, (besides the Nandor of course). The dilemma is because there are models of elves in 2nd age (and most likely 1st age) armour who are mostly Noldor, so I feel constrained to use that armour type!

I think I might buy the armoured Elrohir and Elladan (is that right?) and do some converting. Then I'll have my Celegorm and Caranthir! I'll need something a bit more heroic for Maedhros, but he will be on a horse.

Damn you GW, why can't you just release tonnes of new elven stuff that isn't of the Galadhrim!