PDA

View Full Version : Put the armies in order



W A L 5 H Y
17-03-2009, 11:12
A lot of talk on who is the best or most overpowered army. But who do you think is the best and who is the worst.

Put them in order from best to worst, in your opinion.

Heres Mine


Deamons
Dark Elves
Vampires
High elves
Warriors of chaos
Lizardmen
skaven
Empire
Wood Elves
Dwarfs
Bretonnians
Orcs and goblins
Ogres
Tomb kings

Lets se if we get similar lists.

Voodoo Boyz
17-03-2009, 11:19
If you think Dark Elves are better than Vampires, you haven't played good VC players (or at least ones with good lists).

Akuma
17-03-2009, 11:32
Deamons
Vampires
Dark Elves
Lizardmen
High elves
Warriors of chaos
skaven
Wood Elves
Dwarfs
Bretonnians
Ogres
Tomb kings
Empire
Orcs and goblins

Shamfrit
17-03-2009, 11:35
Daemons
Lizardmen
Vampire Counts
Dark Elves
Warriors of Chaos
Wood Elves
High Elves
Skaven
Dwarves
Empire
Brettonians
Tomb Kings
Orcs and Goblins
Ogres

Nicha11
17-03-2009, 11:43
Demons
Vc
Dark Elves
Lizardmen
Wood Elves
High Elves
WOC
Brettonia
Empire
Skaven
Dwarves
Orcs and Goblins
Tomb Kings
Beasts of Chaos
Ogres

Chainaxe07
17-03-2009, 11:44
Demons
Lizardmen
Dwarves
Woc
High Elves
Dark Elves
Skaven
Wood Elves
Orcs & Goblins
Empire
Bretonnia
Vampire Counts
Ogre Kingdoms
Tomb Kings
Beasts of Chaos

Lordsaradain
17-03-2009, 11:45
DoC
VC
DE
HE
WoC
LM
WE
Bretonnia
Empire
Dwarves
Skaven
Ogres
O & G
TK
BoC

Matt1982
17-03-2009, 12:08
Demons
Vampire Counts
Dark Elves
Lizardmen
High Elves
Warriors of Chaos
Empire
Skaven
Wood Elves
Dwarfs
Orcs & Goblins
Bretonnia
Tomb Kings
Ogre Kingdoms
Beasts of Chaos

selone
17-03-2009, 12:16
Deamons
Vampires
Dark Elves
High elves
Wood Elves
Lizardmen
Warriors of chaos
Empire
Bretonnians
skaven
Tomb kings
Dwarfs (non thorek gunline)
Orcs and goblins
Ogres
Beasts of chaos

W0lf
17-03-2009, 13:28
Daemons
Vampires
Dark elves
Lizardmen
High elves

The rest imo is highly subjective and i cant with any certainty rank them.

If i did itd be something like;

Wood elves
Brettonians
WoC
Empire - if karl franz/dual stank then put above wood elves
Dwarfs - if thorek gunline then put above wood elves but below empire.
Skaven
Tomb Kings
Ogres
Orcs and goblins
Beastmen

Its odd people think lizards rank so highly, i personally find EoTGs to be crap for the pts (i assume thats the fuss, 2/3 EoTG + Slann)

Hvidponi
17-03-2009, 14:45
Deamons of Chaos
Vampire Counts
Dark Elves
Empire
Lizardmen
Warriors of Chaos
Dwarfs
Skaven
High Elves
Bretonnia
Wood Elves
Orcs and Goblins
Tomb Kings
Beasts of Chaos
Ogres

Havn't seen Lizardmen or Warriors of Chaos alot thou, so don't have that much experience with them...

mithrandir
17-03-2009, 15:44
Deamons of Chaos = 10
Vampire Counts = 10
Lizardmen = 9.5
Dark Elves = 9
Warriors of Chaos = 8.5
Dwarfs = 8.5
Skaven = 7.5
High Elves = 7
Empire = 6.5
Bretonnia = 6
Wood Elves = 6
Orcs and Goblins = 4
Tomb Kings = 3
Beasts of Chaos = 2
Ogres = 2

W0lf
17-03-2009, 16:26
People rank WoC higher then wood elves or Bretts?

wow.

Preacher
17-03-2009, 16:42
Amazed to see that High Elves ranked somewhat low in somethese. 4th sounds about right to me. Star Dragon lists, Teclis, 4 bolt throwers. Thought that would have upped them a bit.

But its all subjective I guess.

@ W0LF, really surprised as well with WE and Bretts. The knights in the right hands can just be brutal, same with WE.

W0lf
17-03-2009, 16:51
Wood elves played by a top general are almost untouchable. That being because you cant force them to engage you. The only reason they arnt top is they struggle with large terror causing flyers.

Likeiwse Bretts are brutal outside of the VC/Daemons MUs they struggle with.

Bac5665
17-03-2009, 17:00
@Preacher,

Your right that those HE lists are nasty, but those aren't serious lists, and I don't consider ridiculous lists like those for these kinds of rankings. If I did, Empire would be much higher. HE are actually pretty average and not at all scary, unless your opponent is being an absolute dick. I don't believe that Dragons should be allowed in 2250 games; the star dragon is even more extreme, and I basically won't play people who run one. Same with SCs.

If you take that away from the list, its really quite tame. I have a wining record with my HE list, but not by a lot, and it takes my top game to do well with it.

Ri-xthoal Lord of Lustira
17-03-2009, 17:02
Deamons of Choas
Dark Elves
Warrior of Choas/Lizardmen (For some reason they tied)
High Elves
Wood Elves
Empire
Drawf
Bretonnia
Tomb Kings
Skaven
Orcs & Goblins
Beast of Choas
Ogre Kingdom

GuyLeCheval
17-03-2009, 17:10
Deamons
Vampire Counts
DE
Lizardman
HE
Bretts
Woc
Empire
WE (In the hands of a real skilled player, rank them between Bretts and WoC)
Skaven
Orks and Goblins
Tomb kings
Ogres
Beasts of Chaos

Mozzamanx
17-03-2009, 17:21
Haha, 13 lists and every single one has Daemons at the top. Good showing Mr Ward.

Personally, I've always found Vampires to be worse. The sheer number of Invocations is ludicrous, and that's before you factor in the Wraiths hiding behind the zombies.

willadams33
17-03-2009, 18:36
Deamons
Vampire Counts
DE
Lizardman
HE
Empire
Tomb kings
WE
Bretts
Skaven
Woc
Orks and Goblins
Beasts of Chaos
Ogres

What is with the TK bashing? A whole magic phase where everthing casts, unbreakable and causes fear where everything can be replenished and chariot units as core? Not to mention ICFB. Just my thoughts.

Will Adams

Bac5665
17-03-2009, 19:17
TK are in a bad way because they don't have the tools to deal with the best units out there. They can't deal with monsters, and ItP troops are crazy hard for TK to kill. TK rely on breaking the enemy in combat. The most competative things right now are things that don't (or very rarely) break. TK get hit very hard by that trend. Sure, TK are great against HE, and not bad against DE, but WE, Brets, DoC, VC, LM, Dwarves, Empire and even Ogres, all give TK lots of trouble.

Some of those can be beat, but it takes an expert player to do it. You have to set up and move perfectly.

Also, its true that TK have a great magic offense, but it it literally their only advantage. Their magic defense is among the worst, they have almost no CC ability, their shooting requires a SC to be useful, and they are the slowest army if their magic is shut down, which isn't hard to do if you know what your doing and play with a 7E, all of which have pretty good magic defense.

Atropos
17-03-2009, 20:56
Daemons
Vampires
Dark Elves (Very close to VC)
High Elves
Empire
Lizardmen
Dwarves
Warriors of chaos
Wood Elves
Bretonnia
Skaven
Tomb kings
Orcs and goblins
Beasts of Chaos
Ogre Kingdoms

the_under_empire_clan
17-03-2009, 21:00
hahaha how much you wanna bet in agaust,skaven will jump up to allmost the top of these lists

Atropos
17-03-2009, 21:30
Yeah, I believe that too. But I don't think they will be tier 1 as DoC, VC or DE. But then again, we'll see... who knows? It's GW...

Kornath
17-03-2009, 22:24
They'll probably give them Vermin Lord back or whatever it's called...

Then they will go number 1 on that fancy list...

Quetzl
17-03-2009, 23:08
Daemons *Horrible, I've never enjoyed a game against them*
Dark Elves *Perhaps not as hard, but they're so cheap and have some ridiculous combinations and items - Magic is terribly good*
Vampire Counts *Probably on par with the Dark Elves, but they've become more manageable over time compared to Daemons who are still ridiculous*
Lizardmen *Still not sold that they're this high up, but from what I've been hearing they're pretty darn good*

*They're top tier IMO, kinda like the hardest to break, easy to make filthy and they've pretty much got all the answers - after that as someone said it starts to get a little subjective*

Wood Elves *Still the most versatile army out there IMO*
Warriors of Chaos *Still have to slog it across the board unfortunately, but Infernal Gateway is truly bent*
High Elves *Can be horrible when there are Dragons and a lot of magic, something to be worried about still*
Empire *Generally only really good with a Stank and War Alter, but they've got a gunline to boot*
Dwarfs *They've still got it in em' come on Snorri bash some eads'*
Skaven *Again if they got for the shooty route then they're darn good, if not then they're not so*
Bretonnia *Not as potent as they used to be, but if they're lucky then they can crush anything*
Tomb Kings *Definately not down and out, but they're lacking, only specific builds are good nowdays*
Ogre Kingdoms *I think they're still pretty good, and they're a laugh. Still it's great cause everyone used them still*
Orcs & Goblins *Waaagh over a hill! Gotta luv em'*
Beasts of Chaos *I've never played them, probably never will, but they seem to be the worst, could just be me...*

Chaos Dwarfs and Dogs of War aren't a mile behind them though :D

W A L 5 H Y
18-03-2009, 00:00
I can see that people feel that VCs are better than DEs. I can imagine it to be true, but i have played a couple of really nasty lists (without special Characters).

I agree with the wood elves comments. A good wood elves player is amazing, too bad that there are too few out there.

W0lf
18-03-2009, 00:05
Im banned from using wood elves becuase my gaming group hated me for playing them...

i didnt even run 2 treemen :(.However thats before daemons or VCs were out and i was owning them all with Hordes :S.

VC-DE are very close tbh. However vampires ability to make you kill like 50+ ghouls to get the 88 VPs for the starting unit is kinda harsh.

holanes
18-03-2009, 00:23
I haven't played a game against the daemon list and have been away from the game for a little while but I never would have guessed that so many people would have thought that DE are so great and that Skaven are even close to the middle. I must be really out of touch.

Kerill
18-03-2009, 04:31
Cheese:
Daemons
VC
Dark Elves (almost tied with VC)

- note this set of three is far above the rest.
Very Strong:
High Elves
Lizards (early to say) *
Wood elves- needs a good player (they and TK really most on player's ability)

- all very solid and capable of giving the top 3 a fight.

Strong:
Bretonnians **
Empire
WOC
Skaven

- this group and the next group (average group) are very hard to split, very little difference overall, could easily put them together in one group.
Average:

Tomb Kings
Dwarves *** (non-Thorek)
Orcs and goblins ****

Weak

Ogres
Dogs of war
Beasts of chaos *****

- Not sure where to put chaos dwarves having never played them, they look solid enough though, probably in the strong or average categories.

* Lizards with slann should do well against daemons and VC though making them a good choice for tournaments, will lose badly against dark elves though due to a certain magic item. Should get decent comp with a balanced list as well.
** Bretonnians are very powerful, and actually got a boost in 7th edition with ranking 5 wide for infantry and the slow creep in strength means compared to other knights they are better protected. They suffer against daemons and VC meaning they will have some trouble at tourneys atm. Aside from their knight build though RAF is still a disgusting list.
*** Not a good choice for tourneys since its very hard to get a massacre.
**** I don't think they are as bad as everyone says but they aren't a great tourney choice due to reliability issues.
***** This assumes a fairly balanced list, there are still 3 potential power builds- Khornate doombull army, 20 chariot army and GOC is still doing quite well with superherd build it seems.

Will be interesting to see how magic heavy WOC will fare against magic heavy lizards.

soots
18-03-2009, 04:38
Lizardmen (9.9)
Daemons (9.8)
Vampires (9.2)
Dark Elves (8.7)
Wood Elves (8.6)

Bretonnia (4.9)
High Elves (4.8)
Skaven (4.4)
Empire (4.1)
Dwarves (3.3)
Warriors of chaos (3.1)
Tomb kings (2.7)
Ogre Kingdoms (2.4)
Beasts of Chaos (2.0)
Orcs and goblins(1.5)

Laughingmonk
18-03-2009, 05:07
[QUOTE=W A L 5 H Y;3381153]

Put them in order from best to worst, in your opinion.

QUOTE]

Cool Topic.

Chaos Dwarfs
Empire
WOC
Skaven
Orcs and Goblins
Wood Elves
Tomb Kings
Dark Elves
Ogre Kindoms
Daemons
Lizardmen
Beasts of Chaos
Dwarfs
High Elves


I play Empire. I Love that army. But, if they were to make Chaos Dwarfs, I might actually pre-order models for the first time, especially if they resemble the hellcannon crew.

I Like WOC and Skaven as well.

Orcs and Ogres have weak lists, but have a lot of character. Deamons are universally viewed as overpowered, but are still a good concept. They just need to be toned down a notch (or 10).

Dwarfs have cool background, but an excruciatingly boring playstyle. High elves are just missing something. They are far too generic, lacking the character of their cousins, whilst also being one of the worst army lists ever written. No character, just ASF, Dragons, and repeating bolt throwers.


....

Oh, you meant power wise?

Daemons
VC
DE
(Mid tier armies)
Orcs
Ogres
Goblins
Gnobars
Snotlings
Amoebae

etc

etc.....

Thomus Darkblade
18-03-2009, 05:22
Demons-(10) ( The toughest, or second toughest match up for any army in the game. period)

Vampires-(9.5) ( Pain in the ass - unless you can kill the Lord - Some armies find them harder to beat than them, Elves especially struggle with them)

DE-(9) Abusive combos alert- Struggle against both VC and Demons, but have the tools to defeat either.

Entering the fuzzy zone- The following armies are all solid- some match up better than others-
4th-(8)
Wood elves/ High Elves/ Lizards
Flexible unit choices, multi attack infantry and or cavalry make these better than the 6th place choices
5th-(7.75)
Brets- Powerful one trick pony army. Pegasus knights are still powerful, but the trains are pretty easily derailed these days
6th-(7.5)
WoC/ Empire/ Dwarves/TKs
Less flexible list construction is a limiting factor. Empire and Dwarves are capable of the cheesier lists here
7th-(7)
Skaven-
8th-(6)
Orcs, Beasts- Animosity, drunken and unruly

9th-(5) Ogres- poor combat stats- few unit choices. bad army. Nice models though!

KillbotFactory
18-03-2009, 07:10
My List...

Demons
Vampires
Dark Elves
Lizardmen
WoC
High Elves
Wood ELves
Bretonnia
Skaven
Tomb Kings
Dwarves
Empire
Orcs and Goblins
Ogres
Beastmen

summerlove
18-03-2009, 07:51
wow i guess i shouldnt pick up tomb kings as my first warhammer army. gotta go vampire undead it seems to be really brutal. tnx for post.

selone
18-03-2009, 09:36
I think @ wolf its all down to personal perception really, I hadn't until yesterday seen brett's in action, sadly now I have ;)

Harwammer
18-03-2009, 12:29
I'm suprised how many people rate BoC as better than O&G I play both and I think O&G are much better. Unruly/4 wide bites you in the **** far worse than animosity ever does (even though animosity happens more often).

I think the people who don't even consider BoC to be an army in their lists have the right idea.

Out of the armies I play:

Vampire Counts,
High Elves,
WoC,
Dwarves,
O&G,
BoC

W0lf
18-03-2009, 13:52
Beastmen can still make a few competitive builds.

Core chariots that can be marked (Tz), powerful wizards, minotaurs and cheap abundant skirmishers.

They only real problem is they are stuffed by large flyers (see a pattern here?) and cant reliably deal with things like hydras/treemen or hard to break units like GG, Ironbreakers or Temple guard.

Wolf 11x
18-03-2009, 14:38
As a Lizard player, I'm shocked to see them so high. I think this has almost solely to do with the EotG. They're a solid, well-rounded list but I would place WE over them every time.

Demons
Vampires
Dark Elves
WoC / High Elves
Wood Elves
Lizardmen
Skaven / Dwarves / Empire
Bretonnia
Orcs & Goblins
Tomb Kings / Ogres
Beastmen

^Haha, can I do that? :D

wizuriel
18-03-2009, 14:58
assuming average (not extreme cheese builds) and no SC

Demons
Vampires
Dark Elves
Lizardmen
High elves
wood elves
Bretonnia (not raf)
WoC
Chaos Dwarfs
Dwarfs
Skaven
Empire (not duel tanks/pope)
Tomb Kings
Orcs & Goblins
Ogres
Beastmen (not spamming chariots)

AmBlam
18-03-2009, 23:33
Vampires
Skaven
Dark Elves
Lizardmen
WoC
Tomb Kings
Beastmen
High Elves
Power Bears
Wood ELves
Bretonnia
Demons
Dwarves
Orcs and Goblins
Ogres
Empire

W A L 5 H Y
23-03-2009, 20:11
high elves dont seem to be doing too well here. Has everone forgot how good in combat they are? And they have very flexible magic.

CaliforniaGamer
23-03-2009, 20:24
Daemons
Daemons
and more Daemons
------a gap of infinite depth and darkness-----
Dark Elves
Vampire Counts
Lizardmen
Warriors of Chaos
Wood Elves
High Elves
Empire
Dwarves
Skaven
------second gap of bleak blackness---------
Tomb Kings
Brettonians
Ogre Kingdoms
Orcs and Goblins
Beasts of Chaos (definitively the worst)

Rubicon
23-03-2009, 20:28
Of the armies that I play:

Dark Elves
High Elves
Empire
WoC

Rubicon
23-03-2009, 20:28
Vampires

Power Bears

Empire

Just noticed this, AWESOME!