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From Shadows
23-03-2009, 23:21
Just wondering what lists people could come up with, with the fewest models in the list, but still legal. Also still following F.O.C. So lets do it at 1700 points.Please give detailed lists.

Imperius
23-03-2009, 23:24
6 Phoenix Lords, then tanks overloaded with useless junk.

Aegius
23-03-2009, 23:31
6 Phoenix Lords, then tanks overloaded with useless junk.

this is made of fail

captain malachi
23-03-2009, 23:35
Well my 1500 daemon list only has 26 models in it, but I'm sure I could lower that with fewer troops and more elites.

stainawarjar
23-03-2009, 23:38
Here's my best shot:


Big Mek 160
Shokk Attack gun, power klaw, cybork body, 'eavy armour, bosspole, attack squig, grot oiler

Big Mek 160
Shokk Attack gun, power klaw, cybork body, 'eavy armour, bosspole, attack squig, grot oiler

Deff Dread 120
4 Dreadnought ccws, grot riggers, armour plates

Deff Dread 120
4 Dreadnought ccws, grot riggers, armour plates

Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

3 deffkoptas 270
Bigbomms, Buzzsaws, twin-linked rokkit launchas


170 points exactly, 10 models (12 if you count the grot oilers, but they don't even have a profile...). Completely legal.

IAMNOTHERE
23-03-2009, 23:40
Hmm, Legal.

GK Brother Captain: 61
2 Squads of 5 GK: 300
3 Land Raider Crusaders: 765
2 Elite Inquisitors with 2 mystics each: 64
2 Dedicated transports Landraiders for the Inquisitors: 500.

Leaves you with 10 pts. I reccomend extra armour on the Raiders.

22 Models.

MrGiggles
23-03-2009, 23:40
Warboss - Mega-Armour, Attack Squig, Bosspole, Cybork Body - 130

Ghazghkull - 225

3 Meganobz with Kombi-Weapons - 135
Dedicated Transport - Battlewagon - 'Ard Case, Deff Rolla, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Stikkbomb Chukka, Armour Plates, Boarding Plank, Wreakin' Ball, Grabbin' Klaw, Zzzzap Gun, 4 Rokkit Launcha's - 225 Points

3 Meganobz with Kombi-Weapons - 135
Dedicated Transport - Battlewagon - 'Ard Case, Deff Rolla, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Stikkbomb Chukka, Armour Plates, Boarding Plank, Wreakin' Ball, Grabbin' Klaw, Zzzzap Gun, 4 Rokkit Launcha's - 225 Points

Battlewagon - 'Ard Case, Deff Rolla, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Stikkbomb Chukka, Armour Plates, Wreakin' Ball, Grabbin' Klaw, Zzzzap Gun, 4 Rokkit Launcha's - 215 Points

Battlewagon - 'Ard Case, Deff Rolla, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Stikkbomb Chukka, Armour Plates, Grabbin' Klaw, Zzzzap Gun, 4 Rokkit Launcha's - 205 Points

Battlewagon - 'Ard Case, Deff Rolla, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Stikkbomb Chukka, Armour Plates, Grabbin' Klaw, Zzzzap Gun, 4 Rokkit Launcha's - 205 Points

1700 points in 12 models if my math is right.

So, what do I win?

MrGiggles
23-03-2009, 23:41
Apparently nothing since stainawarjar beat me. :(

stainawarjar
23-03-2009, 23:56
Managed to shave one off my other list :D here 9 models except "decorative" grots:

Ghazghkull 220

Big Mek 166
Shokk Attack gun, power klaw, cybork body, 'eavy armour, bosspole, attack squig, 2 ammo runts, grot oiler

Deff Dread 120
4 Dreadnought ccws, grot riggers, armour plates

Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

3 nobs bikers 324
Painboy, 2 power klaws, 2 twin shootas, stikkbombz
eavy armour, bosspoles, waaagh banner, cybork bodies, two ammo runts

1700 points exactly

Nabeshin1106
24-03-2009, 00:04
19 model Deathwing

Belial
-Deathwing Terminators (Assault Cannon, Apothecary, Banner)
-Deathwing Terminators (Assault Cannon)
-Deathwing Terminators (Assault Cannon)
-Land Raider
-Land Raider
-Land Raider

d0dgeuk
24-03-2009, 00:38
11 man Dark Angel / Ravenwing

Azreal - 225
Sammual - 205
Ravenwing Attack Squadron (3) inc Apoth,standard bearer,plasma gun,searg with meltabombs,powerfist and plasma pistol - 220
Ravenwing Attack Squadron (3) inc 2 plasma guns,seargent with powerfist,melta bombs and and plasma pistol - 195
3 x land raider inc Extra armour,pintle Storm bolters and hunter killer missle - 855

1700 exactly

Senbei
24-03-2009, 01:19
Armoured Company... All L.Russ Battle Tanks with maxed sponsons and extra gear.

Serg. Lynchbox
24-03-2009, 01:38
Someones forgetting a Nidzilla army. I don't have my codex so I cant count up the points... *nudge nudge* someone do it!

Axis
24-03-2009, 04:17
I did a chaos one

3 Dreads with lascannon, heavy flamer, extra armour
3 defilers with lascannon, havoc launcher
1 Greater Daemon
2 5 man thousand sons squads with sorcerer having bolt of change
2 Daemon princes with MoT, bolt of change and warptime.

1774 points. So drop a psychic power on a prince. It has 19 models.

You can shave one or two off with the following list (but it is less cool since the other one had a tzeentch and monstous creatures/walkers theme)

Abaddon
Ahriman
1 Dread with lascannon, heavy flamer and extra armour.
3 Land Raiders with dozer blades, extra armour, demonic possession, pintle havoc launcher, dirge caster.
2 5 man thousand sons squads with sorcerer having bolt of change

16 models but like 100 points over so you can drop the useless extra armour off the Land Raiders and some upgrades somewhere.

EDIT: thought the max points was 1750 not 1700 so you have to drop a few more powers and upgrades

fluffstalker
24-03-2009, 06:28
THe funny thing is, some of these lists would actually be pretty nasty to face in KP. They probably have the AT to deal with other tanks, grab some KP early, and then use their toughness to sit out any return fire. However if you brought them to a tournie 2/3 of the time it would be pretty hard to reliably grab objectives, especially if your troops are a priorty for the enemy.

Ddraiglais
24-03-2009, 06:55
I believe we are still allowed SH detachments. I'd start with that. 1 reaver titan at 1250 points. I'm sure you could squeeze a SM HQ and bare minimum troops for the next 500 points.

stainawarjar
24-03-2009, 09:27
I believe we are still allowed SH detachments. I'd start with that. 1 reaver titan at 1250 points. I'm sure you could squeeze a SM HQ and bare minimum troops for the next 500 points.

Can you play ONLY superheavy detachments? then you could play something like
2 x Warhound titan with double-barreled turbolaser and plasma blastgun: 1680 points.

Marlow
24-03-2009, 09:40
Well I would have said Nidzilla as eight MC is quite low, problem is minimum troop choice is 2 x 6 Genestealers which makes twenty models.

However nine models for an Ork army wins!

Managed to shave one off my other list :D here 9 models except "decorative" grots:

a squig
24-03-2009, 10:04
if iam allowed to use IA books= 2

Hierophant 1250
Barbed hierodule 450

1700 in two models :D

nazrag
24-03-2009, 10:11
Now let's try this with imperial guard (not tank comopany) :cool:

mughi3
24-03-2009, 10:17
19 model Deathwing

Belial
-Deathwing Terminators (Assault Cannon, Apothecary, Banner)
-Deathwing Terminators (Assault Cannon)
-Deathwing Terminators (Assault Cannon)
-Land Raider
-Land Raider
-Land Raider

He wanted small, pull out a terminator squad and stick in a venerable dread in a pod for 3 less models :p

Ddraiglais
24-03-2009, 14:36
Can you play ONLY superheavy detachments? then you could play something like
2 x Warhound titan with double-barreled turbolaser and plasma blastgun: 1680 points.

That would work in Apocalypse, but the OP mentioned the FoC. I'm assuming he wants something legal for regular games. If that's the case, you have to field a normal FoC to be able to field your SH detachment. One SM character and a couple of troop choices should get you to the 500ish leftover points after you take your reaver. I don't play SM, but they are a little more expensive. Maybe if there is a way to take dreads as troops?

Sceleris
24-03-2009, 15:34
Now let's try this with imperial guard (not tank comopany) :cool:

Working from memory

Doctrines - carapace, bionics, grenadiers, camo (think its compatable with carapace), mechanized

Command Squad - HSO with max wargear, 4 guys as vets (all the pointless upgrades). Chimera with everything
2 x 5 grenadiers (2 special weapons, vet with pointless upgrades). Chimeras with everything.
3 x LRuss Demos (plus all applicable vehicle upgrades)
3 x Hellhounds (plus all applicable vehicle upgrades)

That should get you somewhere near IIRC the points required.
15 infantry and 9 tanks.

A Last chancers list could possibly do something silly (as they can all get access to stupid amounts of upgrades), and you end up with 30 models or so.

Bunnahabhain
24-03-2009, 15:35
Min sized IG, not Armoured company.
-->Armoured battlegroup ( FW list from IA 1)

OK, taking it seriously.

HQ.
Standard command squad men,
HSO,100 pts wargear
all frag and krak garnades
vetaran with regimental standard, 50 pts wargear -
3 Vetarans with 50 pts wargear,
5 models ----474 pts

Troops, 2 x 5 men grenadier squads, 2 x 151
vet sarge, with 50 pts wargear
2 plasma guns, melta bombs, vox,
10 models

Heavy
3 Leman russ demolishers 3 x 257
lasacoon, multi-melta sponsons
3 models

1547 pts
Add in Yarrick or hellhound with upgrades to make 1700.
19 models

Actually running it as a vaugkey sensible, codex legal armoured company, it tends to be:

Cheap Hq in chimera
2 or 3 squads of grenadiers in chimeras
2 or 3 hell hounds
3 russes

so still under 30 models.

Edit, forgot about expnsive doctrines as well. Trouble is, so few of them apply to grenadiers, you can only add them to the command squad, so even with the msot expensive combination possible( grenadiers, carapace, cyber enhance, hardened fighter, sharp-shooters), you only add 65 pts to their cost, so can't drop anything elsewhere...

TheBigBadWolf
24-03-2009, 15:38
A SM biker army would be fairly low in model count, dont have the codex to check at the moment though

itcamefromthedeep
24-03-2009, 15:38
Tyranids do 11 at the fewest for 1700pts. Orks still have it, though neither list has any scoring units. Unless you can fill your Troops for a stupidly low model count, you can't compete here.

303pts Tyrant
215pts Tyrant
078pts 3 Ripper bases
078pts 3 Ripper bases
342pts Carnifex
342pts Carnifex
342pts Carnifex

Please don't ask me to itemize everything.

Daemons tie them with almost exactly the same method at 11.
Marines can do something similar with bikes instead of swarms, a Chapter Master and Captain on bikes, and Land Raiders in heavy support for 11 total.

Eldar can get it down to 14:

230pts Asurmen
215pts Karandras
076pts 3 Guardian Jetbikes
076pts 3 Guardian Jetbikes
390pts 3 Vypers (you can do another 105 here)
235pts Falcon
235pts Falcon
235pts Falcon


So far the score is
5 models: Armored Company
9 models: Orks
11 models: Tyranids
11 models: Daemons
11 models: Space Marines
11 models: Ravenwing
14 models: Eldar
15 models: Witch Hunters
16 models: Chaos Marines
17 models: Daemonhunters
19 models: Guard
20 models: Tau
~20 models: Black Templars
~20 models: Blood Angels
~20 models: Space Wolves
~25 models: Dark Eldar
27 models: Necrons

EDIT: Just checked the armored company rules. With upgrades you can do:

432pts Vanquisher Command Tank, Ace Gunners, Blessing of the Machine God, Reinforced Ceramite
367pts Vanquisher Tank Ace, Ace Gunners, Blessing of the Machine God
367pts Vanquisher Tank Ace, Ace Gunners, Blessing of the Machine God
267pts Leman Russ Battle Tank, Ace Gunners, Blessing of the Machine God
267pts Leman Russ Battle Tank, Ace Gunners, Blessing of the Machine God

a squig
24-03-2009, 15:46
Nids still win according to my previous post the Hierophant it self fills a whole FOC and so covers all the bases and the hieodule is just gravy:)

it slightly strange one of biggest hoard armies, can feild the smallest number of units in a 1750pt game.

Lungboy
24-03-2009, 15:54
~25 models: Daemonhunters

I think DH can get down to about 19.

itcamefromthedeep
24-03-2009, 16:15
Nids still win according to my previous post the Hierophant it self fills a whole FOC and so covers all the bases and the hieodule is just gravy:)
It really depends on how you count super-heavies. Before Apocalypse the only way to play with them was to have them take their own FOC. Those rules have since disappeared with Apocalypse.


I think DH can get down to about 19.
Show me how and I'll edit to put in the new number.

Hypaspist
24-03-2009, 16:22
Show me how and I'll edit to put in the new number.

474 = Inquisitor Lord "Greedypants" blinged out to the nines on wargear + psychic powers & 3 gun servitors (1 x PC 2 x HB) + LR transport
61 = Brother Captain
200 = Justicar + 4GK +2 psycannons
200 = Justicar + 4GK +2 psycannons
255 = LRC
255 = LRC
255 = LRC

1700 on the button and a model count of 19, if thats how Lungbuy was doing it?

Hypa
(actually..

190 Grand Master + Bling
200 5 x GK + 2 x Psycannons
200 5 x GK + 2 x Psycannons
370 INQ + Gear + LR
370 INQ + Gear + LR
370 INQ + Gear + LR

I make that 17, nudging the DH ahead of Guard ^^

Lungboy
24-03-2009, 16:41
1700 on the button and a model count of 19, if thats how Lungbuy was doing it?


Slightly different but essentially the same, yes.

sydbridges
24-03-2009, 17:19
~25 models: Necrons

I think the smallest necron 1700 point list is 27ish models. Nightbringer + Lord with max stuff + 2 squads of ten warriors with disruption fields + 3 liths + 2 destroyers.

Grazzy
24-03-2009, 17:28
190 Grand Master + Bling
200 5 x GK + 2 x Psycannons
200 5 x GK + 2 x Psycannons
370 INQ + Gear + LR
370 INQ + Gear + LR
370 INQ + Gear + LR

I make that 17, nudging the DH ahead of Guard ^^

Actually, inqs need a retinue to take a LR adding 3 models.

Hypaspist
24-03-2009, 17:44
Actually, inqs need a retinue to take a LR adding 3 models.

Completely correct you are as well, my mistake.

165 - Grand Master + Mini-Bling
200 - 5 x GK + 2 x Psy
200 - 5 x GK + 2 x Psy
255 - LRC
255 - LRC
255 - LRC
370 - Inq + Familiar + Bling + LR

Amended and now at 17. (thank you lung for doing the arithmetic as I clearly can't cope!)
(wish I had brought my codex with me to work as I am doing all of this without reference material)

Lungboy
24-03-2009, 17:49
Amended and now at 16. Drawing with the Chaos Marines.


That's 17 still, unless the familiar doesn't count (although i can't see why it wouldn't).

Hypaspist
24-03-2009, 17:56
That's 17 still, unless the familiar doesn't count (although i can't see why it wouldn't).

No, Just me who can't count.. :cries: well 17 is still good.

Doppleskanger
24-03-2009, 18:16
I can get tau down to 20
3 hammerheads with all options @235pts
2 devilfish with all the options @175
2 squads of 6 FW with all the options @122
Shas O with twl Plasma and Shield generator and special edition stuff and hard wired stuff and bonding knife @ 203
Shas O with twl Plasma and shield generator and hard wired stuff and bonding knife @148

So that's 1650, add a single crisis suit body gaurd to give you 1700pts using 20 models

Doppleskanger
24-03-2009, 18:49
And Witch Hunters with 15 (not a chance i'm writting out all the wargear)
Karamanov 205
Saint Celestine 201
5 Storm Troopers with a stack of wargear 202
5 Storm Troopers with a stack of wargear 202
3 Orbital Strikes (Melta Torpedo) 240
1 Inquisitor with LOTS of wargear 253
1 inquisitor with slightly less wargear 203
1 Inquisitor with slightly less wargear 193

Total of 1699 (although there would need to be several wheel barrows full of equipment for each character)

So that's me, Doppleskanger, enjoying his last week of unemployment :)

Lungboy
24-03-2009, 18:52
That would only be 12 actual models.

itcamefromthedeep
24-03-2009, 18:55
3 Orbital Strikes (Melta Torpedo) 240
Ha! That's a good one. Well done.


That would only be 12 actual models.
No, 15. He counted right. 2 Special characters, 10 Storm Troopers, and 3 Inquisitors.

Inquisitors are Elites, right? You wouldn't make that kind of mistake.

Lungboy
24-03-2009, 19:00
Ha! That's a good one. Well done.


No, 15. He counted right. 2 Special characters, 10 Storm Troopers, and 3 Inquisitors.

Inquisitors are Elites, right? You wouldn't make that kind of mistake.

Oops, my turn for the bad maths. I just knocked 3 off his total for the orbital strikes when it had already been done.

Hypaspist
24-03-2009, 19:17
1 Inquisitor with LOTS of wargear 253


Aren't you limited to 100 points of wargear (not including weapons, top of the armoury page)
actually you can probably split this still over the three inqs.
force weapon + eviscerator + Divine pronouncement plus your 100 points of wargear makes a loadout of 215 each, so you are still able to do it with 12 models, snazzy!

Hakkapelli
24-03-2009, 19:26
Actually, inqs need a retinue to take a LR adding 3 models.

But an elite ínq may take a retinue of between 0 and 6 models. Therefore the original list is legal since the elite inquisitors have retinues of 0 models with a land raider transport.

Hypaspist
24-03-2009, 19:31
the dedicated transport option states "if the inquisitor lord has a retinue", therefore mandating having at least 1 of the 0-6. I know the box says 0-6 for an inquisitor but that would be a *very* RAW interpretation as the 'if' implies the possibility that he might not be accompanied which I believe is probably meant to cover the 0-6 situation.
Nice fish! But I think Grazzy was right and I did need 1 henchy.
Hypa

itcamefromthedeep
24-03-2009, 19:45
Oops, my turn for the bad maths.
I figured as much. Almost did the same thing myself.


Therefore the original list is legal since the elite inquisitors have retinues of 0 models with a land raider transport.
I don't think being rules-lawyery like that isn't the kind of fun this thread is intended for.

Let's keep to solid ground on this one, shall we?

I'm impressed that I've had to edit down all of my guesstimates. I guess I underestimated the army lists (or is that overestimated?).

Nym
24-03-2009, 19:46
Battlewagon 290
Zzap gun, 4 rokkit launchas, and everything else (except reinforced ram)

Fully tooled BW is 285pts in my 'dex ! How do you get 290 ? :D

itcamefromthedeep
24-03-2009, 19:59
Fully tooled BW is 285pts in my 'dex ! How do you get 290 ? :D
I get 285 as well. It's not a big deal as the Bikernobz don't have any Waaagh!!! banners yet, but it might be worth revising.

sydbridges
24-03-2009, 20:03
I figured as much. Almost did the same thing myself.


I don't think being rules-lawyery like that isn't the kind of fun this thread is intended for.

Let's keep to solid ground on this one, shall we?

I'm impressed that I've had to edit down all of my guesstimates. I guess I underestimated the army lists (or is that overestimated?).

Well, except the 'Crons, who have a 21 model bare minimum legal army anyways, so it's hard to get to 1700 without going a bit higher.

Doppleskanger
24-03-2009, 20:08
Aren't you limited to 100 points of wargear (not including weapons, top of the armoury page)
actually you can probably split this still over the three inqs.
force weapon + eviscerator + Divine pronouncement plus your 100 points of wargear makes a loadout of 215 each, so you are still able to do it with 12 models, snazzy!

Yep, you got me, didn't even think to check if I was over the 100.

Karamanov 205
Saint Celestine 201
5 Storm Troopers with a stack of wargear 205
5 Storm Troopers with a stack of wargear 205
3 Orbital Strikes (Melta Torpedo) 240
1 Inquisitor with lots of wargear 215
1 inquisitor with lots of wargear 215
1 Inquisitor with lots of wargear 214

1700 exactly, 15 models and now it really is legal:D

Hypaspist
24-03-2009, 20:25
ok... the final attempt to get those GK as Beardy as possible.
SO. the armoury allows for 2 weapons (1 may be two handed, and up to 100 more points spent on further wargear)
Justicars dont get the weapons options though.

Grand Master Smash
325 - Psycannon/Daemonhammer + Bling + Holocaust

300 - Justicar + Bling + 4GK w/2xPsycannon
300 - Justicar + Bling + 4GK w/2xPsycannon

110 to 210 - Inq + force weapon + Psycannon + Bling + Banishment

80 - Melta orbital strike (its 0-1)
324 - LRC inc upgrade goodness (blessed/dozer blade/hunter killer/pintle mounted storm bolter/psycannon bolts/sacred hull/searchlight/smokes
324 - LRC as above

comes in between 1683 and 1783 dependent on spread of wargear on inquisitor...
14 models!!
*phew*

aquilius
24-03-2009, 23:02
Daemons can get to 15 with actual scoring non-swarm troops.

hq
fateweaver 333
skarbrand 300

troops
5 plaguebearers 75
5 plaguebearers 75

hs
3x daemon prince w mark of tzeentch, flight, iron hide, unholy might, bolt of tzeentch, master of sorcery, daemonic gaze, and breath of chaos 960

total 1703

That might actually be a half decent list.