PDA

View Full Version : Deciding between Skaven and Beastmen



Chaos Warlord
07-04-2009, 22:56
I am mighty confused when choosing between Skaven and Beastmen.. :confused:

but made some pros and cons for each, and would appreciate any toughts and perhaps tips and tweeks for either skaven or beastmen, or the choosing of wich.

Skaven Pros:

i love the models of the rat ogres, and plague monks
enjoy the tought of having hundreds of warriors at my command, are they weak, so be it, aslong as they are mine to command :evilgrin:
like the filthy, unclean and "scratchy" feel that rat-men give with their overgrown nails and miscolured teeth
S6 rat ogres in 7th ed
new, hopefully fierce-looking stormvermin (in plastic)
many tactical oppurtunities
if stormvermin become S4 base, armored opponents will no longer be an issue.


Skaven Cons:

hate the current models for clanrats
weak units and low LD
alot to paint
hard to deal with heavily armored opponents
hard to deal with an ancient stegadon or stardragon, large gribbly monster-thingy etc



Beastmen Pros:

powerful characters (especially when mutations will be included in 7th ed)
brute strenght of units beside elite minotaurs (bestigors etc)
raw mindset, "gor is strong, gor is true!"
muscular and barbaristic
new, hopefully brute & fierce-looking bestigors (in plastic)
many tactical possibilities
absolutley crazy about the artworks of 6th ed beast of chaos book, got totally in the "mood" ;)
culd perhaps even be made only of resolute blocks of infantry (not skrimishers, or skrimishers ranked up -
after all, its my choice if i place them out 1" away or not, right?)

Beastmen Cons:

skrimishing models, i hate to moove 20+ skrimishers one-and-one
below average LD
hard to deal with an ancient stegadon or stardragon, large gribbly monster-thingy etc
unruly special rule may interfere with my tactics
S4 base for elite minotaurs..

bob_the_small
07-04-2009, 23:00
Beastmen = bottom of power chart.. you are going to win very few games...
Skaven = great army can make great lists! They will be even better when the army book comes out.

IMO go for skaven!!!

Malorian
07-04-2009, 23:00
Just some thoughts on your skaven cons:

-hate the current models for clanrats: nothing to be said here.
-weak and low LD: with ranks and within range of the general they actually have a high Ld.
-alot to paint: but they are easy to paint
-hard to deal with heavily armored opponents: actually between jezzels and ratling guns knights don't stand a chance
-hard to deal with an ancient stegadon or stardragon, large gribbly monster-thingy etc: again you can just shoot/magic them to death. WLC can get the job done too.

I think you should go for skaven.

dariakus
07-04-2009, 23:01
Stegadons can't stand up to our (Skaven) firepower. They're pretty easy to bowl over. Or you can just march some PCBs and Plague Monks right up to the thing and punch whatever's riding it to death, since that's often going to be more of a threat than the stegadon itself.

Chaos Warlord
07-04-2009, 23:07
thanks for the feedback!, alltough im not really a fan of skryre :angel:
i might even say that, if i would start skaven, id be against that particular clan ^^

bob_the_small
07-04-2009, 23:10
Where has skyre come from?
Skaven have the advantages of lots of pros and a new book soon.
1 Question : How did you rule all the other armies out?

Chaos Warlord
07-04-2009, 23:23
1 Question : How did you rule all the other armies out?

good question, i did never rule the other armies out, i just didnt want to start any of them, since ive had both mortals and lizardmen aswell as Vampire counts & Dark elves, ive played alot and gained the understanding of what i like in an army aswell as fluff & looks of models, and what i would like to continue with

first, i like to be CC-oriented and thus sticking away from magic, beat the crap out of my opponent its in my best intrest to not have:


Bretonnia - noble and ignorant, dislike the whole "knights of the true way"-theme
Daemons - too restricted or mixed
Dwarfs - beardy and M3
elves - T3
fishmen - sorry not out yet
ogres - dislike the whole fatty-theme
empire - give me whole-covering helmets for them and i might consider it, otherwize theyr just weak humans! bah!
mortals - been there done that


plus, beastmen & skaven have been drawing my attention for some time now and just can't decide, im totally stuck:confused:

Erie Ed
07-04-2009, 23:35
good question, i did never rule the other armies out, i just didnt want to start any of them, since ive had both mortals and lizardmen aswell as Vampire counts & Dark elves, ive played alot and gained the understanding of what i like, and what i would like to continue with, as with the current "unwanted" armies, ill put it like this:

firs, i like to be CC-oriented and thus sticking away from magic, beat the crap out of my opponent its in my best intrest to not have:


Bretonnia - noble and ignorant, dislike the whole "knights of the true way"-theme
Daemons - too restricted or mixed
Dwarfs - beardy and M3
elves - T3
fishmen - sorry not out yet ;)
ogres - dislike the whole fatty-theme
empire - give me whole-covering helmets for them and i might consider it, otherwize theyr just weak humans! bah! :angel:
mortals - been there done that


plus, i have been looking and drooling at beastmen & skaven for some time now and just can't decide, im totally stuck:confused:

seems like skaven are wrong for you because most of the time you will be running away from CC, and skaven magic is key to victory...

soots
07-04-2009, 23:40
Stegadons can't stand up to our (Skaven) firepower. They're pretty easy to bowl over. Or you can just march some PCBs and Plague Monks right up to the thing and punch whatever's riding it to death, since that's often going to be more of a threat than the stegadon itself.

Killing the rider, providing you can get past the knightly armor save, isnt gonna do much, the monster reaction table is beneficial.

Also, if your basing this on rumors, then jezzails will be S5. And thats not gonna help much vs T6 stegs

Borri
07-04-2009, 23:45
"fishmen - sorry not out yet "

lol

Bum
07-04-2009, 23:56
As a skaven player Big Monsters don't scare me. Last game I roasted that special lizardmen char on top of a carno and him in about 2 turns. And thats without jezzails/globs.

What does scare me is heavily armored infantry units. Those take a lot of firepower to take down and most of the time they butcher whatever Skaven they touch. Knights played well can also crush my lines.

havoc626
08-04-2009, 00:30
Just to point out, even if we lose S6 Jezzails, we will still have Globadiers to take out the Steg, and they would be more effective, as if any hit the crew, it ignores the save they normally have completely.

As was pointed out, some of the Cons for Skaven really arent Cons once they are on the field. Okay, the Clannies and painting them are justified, but Ld and anti armour issues are easily dealt with. Okay, no skryre, so that rules out some of the better things for dealing with them, but there is still PCBs with heavy hitting attacks, Plague Monks with their sheer number of attacks and with Tunnelling Teams coming in the middle of the game within your opponent's warmachines, they can be dealt with too.

For beastmen, while I would love to collect them as well (mind you, going for a Dragon Ogre theme instead), it seems that Skaven are more suited to your tastes.

Herod
08-04-2009, 01:19
Man I would just wait on committing to either army until at least one of the books comes out. The possibility for "buyer's remorse" is too high. :)

H

Chaos Warlord
08-04-2009, 01:24
"hopefully", if i may call it that.. either stormvermin or bestigors will turn out less than i expected, if not totally out of place and i will reject the whole idea of that army because of them :(

selone
08-04-2009, 12:29
I'd waitt also, you dont know what they're doing :)

Mercules
08-04-2009, 12:40
Beastmen = bottom of power chart.. you are going to win very few games...
Skaven = great army can make great lists! They will be even better when the army book comes out.

IMO go for skaven!!!

Right now... Wait till BoC comes out to make this determination.

If I was to start a new army right now, it wouldn't be anything that still has a 6th Ed. book. Not unless I built a very core heavy Warband to play. :)

Foegnasher
08-04-2009, 12:43
Skaven.

i might be a bit biased, but the ld 10, str 6 shots, tons of troops, very diverse army that i love, can whoop anybody on any given day.

they are tricky to use right, you have to use the entire army together to make it work.

if you'd like some tips/lessons/have any skaven questions, pm me.

Max_Killfactor
08-04-2009, 12:47
Man I would just wait on committing to either army until at least one of the books comes out. The possibility for "buyer's remorse" is too high. :)


Herod speaks the truth.

Try to wait, I know it's hard. Hopefully both army books will be out by the end of the year, although beasts might be early next year.

Maybe you could pick up a unit or two for each army that won't likely be replaced (like plague monks and rat ogres) just to get a feel for them.

Dexter099
09-04-2009, 06:28
Wait till Beastmen come out sometime this year. I waited to start vampire counts because I needed to expand my Warriros, and when the new book came out sooner than expected, I decided I disliked the book and now have no want whatsoever to play the now bloodline-less vampires.