PDA

View Full Version : 2,000 Ogre army



wilzif
12-04-2009, 18:43
Hi all.

It's been a long time since I've had a game of fantasy, after leaving my regular club and not finding a replacement.

Anyway, I am now able to get games back at my old club (hurray) on a semi-regular basis. And so I have my first game of fantasy for at least a year next week.

It's going to be a 2k game with my ogres facing off against Warriors of Chaos. Now I know my opponent fairly well, so I'm sure to be facing at least decent magic and probably a mixture of marks of chaos. I want to take a fairly general list, as it has been a long while and I'm looking to the possibility of getting back into tournaments - although perhaps not with ogres.

Anyway, any comments will be gratefully received. I am a little limited in my choice of models - I need to get some more ironguts and assemble my gnoblars - so what you see is the majority of my collection. I do, however, have a slavegiant, 4 leadbelchers, 2 gorgers, and more bulls which I could add. I thought I would try a 3 butcher list, as from my handful (about 3!) of games with my ogres, their magic didn't really have the bite I was looking for. Depending on how badly my generalship goes, I may even attempt a battle report!

I'm in two minds whether to take Kineater on the Tyrant, and if I should drop the standard. I think I will probably stick with 3 butchers to see how it goes. I wasn't sure whether I should also try a butcher with the maneaters - but couldn't remember if that means he becomes stubborn or not.

So here goes:

Tyrant: 286 pts
Hvy Armour
Tenderiser
Gnoblar Thiefstone
Fistful of Laurels

Butcher: 190 pts
Dispel Scroll
Bangstick
2 Tooth Gnoblars

Butcher: 190 pts
Power Stone
Halfling Cookbook
2 Tooth Gnoblars

Butcher: 190 pts
Dispel Scroll
Bloodcleaver
2 Tooth Gnoblars

3 Bulls: 127 pts
Extra hand weapons
Bellower

3 Bulls: 127 pts (2nd butcher here)
Extra hand weapons
Bellower

4 Bulls: 166 pts (3rd butcher here)
Extra hand weapons
Bellower

3 Ironguts: 174 points (1st butcher here)
Gutlord
Bellower

4 Ironguts: 242 points (Tyrant here)
Gutlord
Bellower
Standard

3 Maneaters: 258 points
Cathayan Longsword

8 Gnoblar Trappers

MTUCache
13-04-2009, 07:35
Really can't go wrong with the bull/ironguts in the OK list...

The Tyrant/Tenderiser + 3 Butchers is definitely the "harder" way to make an OK list, but considering they're one of the weaker lists at the moment it's generally over-looked. There's not a whole lot of other builds that will work effectively against all-comers (especially against the DoC/VC/DE lists out there now).

I'd probably give one of your Butchers the Siegebreaker to get a little bit more combat out of him. Even against Chaos your casters are going to be able to stand up to his fighty-characters in combat if you give them the right weapons.

The Maneaters are freaking mint if you give them the brace of pistols... expensive as hell, but sweet.

Against Chaos (with no shooting) you'll be alright running your characters, especially your tyrant, outside of units. With the Longstrider that gives him a very nice charge range. The Wyrdstone Necklace is a nice option rather than the Laurels if you're not running him in a unit. If he is in a unit I'd consider the Jade Lion if you can find the points (may have to move the Tenderiser to one of the Butchers).

The Trappers are nice, but they'll really shine if you can use their march-blocking to boost your shooting. A unit of Leadbelchers (and the Maneaters with Braces of Pistols) will really capitalize on that. You'd have to drop one of your Ironguts units, but that's your call.

Against WoC you'll probably match up pretty well... considering these are the models you have I think you chose the right ones. The Gorgers would be a waste against WoC as they don't really have anything that will stay in there deployment zone longer than turn 1.

wilzif
13-04-2009, 08:11
Thanks for the tips.

To be honest, I think I'll at least start characters in units as my opponent is likely to have good magic.

It's my first game for a while, so I'll play it by ear I think. As for giving butchers decent magic weapons, from my limited experience (3 games or so) they don't tend to do well in combat. I gave one butcher the bloodcleaver as his characters/champions have to challenge under the new WoC rules so I am going to have to pick my fights.

As you said, could be after T1 some of the butchers leave their units. I'll consider the brace of handguns, but only have enough points for one at the moment barring other tweaks.

Time of Madness
13-04-2009, 13:07
I'd drop the maneaters and pick up 2 gorgers. They really help in removing war machines etc.

With the extra points get a couple of standards with look out gnoblars.

MTUCache
13-04-2009, 13:17
I'd drop the maneaters and pick up 2 gorgers. They really help in removing war machines etc.


Generally not the easiest thing to find in your opponent's deployment zone when playing WoC.... :p

In an all-comers list, I'd agree, probably going for Gorgers 2/3rds of the time and the MEs 1/3. But, against a non-shooting army they don't make a whole lot of sense. Unless you can deny them an entire flank and get them to move at you along the board edge, the Gorgers are just going to be spending two turns waiting and then two turns chasing before they get into the back of a unit (which they may or may not be able to hurt anyway).

Classical Mushroom
13-04-2009, 13:30
I would drop one unit of bulls this gives you 127pts to play with. So i would take 2 units of Gnoblars, give your Tyrants ironguts The rune maw banner, and give the other unit of ironguts a standard. overall that comes to 120pts.

The gnoblars will offer your army ranks and numbers always a plus in combat. :) have them close to your Tyrants unit so any nasty spells can be redirected against them, they will also be able to take most charges if they are in range of the general LD 9 :p and if they can hold a unit up then your tyrant and irongut can smash into the flank.

wilzif
13-04-2009, 14:30
I like Gorgers, but I figured they would be next to useless against WoC as he wants to be in combat just as much as me and won't be anywhere near his deployment zone.

As regards dropping the bulls, I have no assembled gnoblar models at the moment barring the trappers so I am a little limited in that regard. I'm also loath to take a standard, as it's another 100 VPs to lose. That said, I will certainly bear both points in mind after this first battle.

Keep the tips coming!

narrativium
13-04-2009, 14:41
I wouldn't discount Gorgers because a WoC army won't stay in their own deployment zone. For that matter, I wouldn't automatically move everything forwards against a WoC army just because I'm playing Ogres - you might want to consider letting them come to you. With Gorgers you can appear on a flank and take a frenzied unit out of play, forcing it to kill you then overrun off the board. Gorgers aren't fantastic in combat without support but they'll hold things up a while with Unbreakable.

As to Gnoblars... I'm not convinced that they'll help, in terms of numbers. I don't doubt they can help, but I tend to find that most of the things they could attack will get to attack them back, causing so many casualties their ranks and numbers count for nothing. I've had them lose me combats that the involved Ogres would otherwise have won. They're nice and cheap, so they're more sacrificial/table quarters than much else, I think.

Mercules
13-04-2009, 16:02
Gnoblars...

I love the little buggers. Then again I would never get them involved in a fight where Ogres already are unless I was able to join the fight where one gnoblar is touching 1 foe so they couldn't generate a lot of kills against my Gnoblars.

Gnoblars are better for harassment than anything else. Sharp stuff is an annoyance but it really ticks people off when a unit of Gnoblars kills a model worth almost as much as the whole unit. I've gotten people to charge the little baiters simply because they picked off a knight or two with Sharp Stuff.

Classical Mushroom
13-04-2009, 17:06
Well my thoughts are that the gnoblars will offer numbers in combat and 3 ranks (maybe :p) which will help with CR. So then you have orges doing the killing and Gnoblars looking big :D

Mercules
13-04-2009, 17:30
And Gnoblars dying by the bucketful and earning your opponent Combat Resolution for kills. :) If it looks like more Gnoblars are going to die than the Rank bonus and outnumber you probably want to keep them away from the fight.

Keller
13-04-2009, 17:39
Well my thoughts are that the gnoblars will offer numbers in combat and 3 ranks (maybe :p) which will help with CR. So then you have orges doing the killing and Gnoblars looking big :D

The problem is, the enemy will just rack up CR by killing the Gnoblars with models that would otherwise be unengaged. With the stats of the gnoblars, they can usually make 4 kills pretty easily, which negates the bonus of gnoblars (+3 ranks, +1 Outnumber) and possibly puts you behind in CR overall.

Of course, it depends on luck and what you are fighting.


For me, Gnoblars are for stringing in wide formation and throwing tons of SHarp Stuff at enemies. And since all ranks can fire at units on a hill or Large Targets, units of 25 with 2x shots can be devestating, even at S2.

I do love my Trappers, though, even if they only ever seem to bicker at the worst possible times.

Classical Mushroom
13-04-2009, 17:39
And Gnoblars dying by the bucketful and earning your opponent Combat Resolution for kills. :) If it looks like more Gnoblars are going to die than the Rank bonus and outnumber you probably want to keep them away from the fight.

Indeed tho im not saying you have your Gnoblars charge chaos Warriors in the front :p tho if they can kill 2 then they have got their points back :D

Really i use them to annoy enemy units and work with the Ogres on the charge. Also the Rune maw redirecting magic at them will help protect his Tyrants unit and the Gnoblars will be LD 9 if they panic not to shabby.

Classical Mushroom
13-04-2009, 17:45
The problem is, the enemy will just rack up CR by killing the Gnoblars with models that would otherwise be unengaged. With the stats of the gnoblars, they can usually make 4 kills pretty easily, which negates the bonus of gnoblars (+3 ranks, +1 Outnumber) and possibly puts you behind in CR overall.

Like i said buddy i'm not saying charge them at warriors of chaos TBH i was thinking more of in the ogres get there first which they mostly will then the Gnoblars can charge in the flank. Also marauders aren't going to to be killing droves of them.

Mercules
13-04-2009, 19:26
4 Mauraders

WS4, S3

3+ to hit WS2, 4+ to wound To3(baring any upgrades)

4 attacks means 2.6666 hits which means 1.33333 wounds.

So yeah, breaking their Rank with Flanking Gnoblars wouldn't be horrible. Good luck getting the Mv4 Gnoblars into a flank to help out the Mv6 Ogres. ;) It can happen but is fairly rare.

More often your Gnoblars make GREAT bait. If they stand 8" from the foe and the front line of Gnoblars are at least 8" from the Ogres there isn't much that can catch them when they flee. Most likely they will end up fleeing through the Ogres and leaving the foe just short of Enemy in the Way.

http://i41.tinypic.com/30j62l3.png

http://i40.tinypic.com/23w0bop.png

Who would charge Gnoblars that are going to run? Well, Knights who are taking 10 shots every turn 5+ to hit, 6+ to wound. You have a 9% chance of getting a wound in on Chaos Knights what with their armor and everything. They hate loosing a 40 point model to a 40 point unit. ;) Khorne Knights are even easier as they HAVE to charge.

Then you charge back. There is only 6" difference from the back of the Gnoblars to the Ogres so your chances of them getting out of the way is VERY good. If not you have a second unit that can at least clip the other and hopefully pin it for a turn(notice the bulls on the side). Gnoblars do not cause panic in anyone so they can run all through your army and not make you roll once. :)

The only issue is that Gnoblars move 4" slowing down your whole line. I tend to use them to slow down my foes on a flank with Ogres to back them up.

Classical Mushroom
13-04-2009, 19:39
Oh dear lord i don't understand math hammer i just buy lady luck a drink before my games :p

It must just be me most of the time my gnoblars catch up to my ogres never had much luck on breaking enemies on the charge with my lads :( their not fat enough!!

I guess im trying to make it a more all comer list tho id use gnoblars against chaos they have been good to me the little buggers :)

Anyway i will leave you all in the hands of the wise Mercules :) teach them well my friend