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Quannum
21-04-2009, 01:27
Can't wait for the gorgeous models coming out in June and so I have created a little backstory and built this Galadhrim around it to wait in anticipation with!

Basically the idea is that I wanted to team up Elves and Dwarves, as they look great next to one another, and it's awesome to think of the ancient grudges they've had. The idea of Drar and his small company of rangers and artillery winding up in an uneasy alliance with the pointy-ear'd ones was too great to resist. It also makes a nice little competition between the greatest of dwarf archers and the greatest of Elven archers. Haldir and Drar both have Take Aim! and I'm going to tally up their companies' shooting kills every game and keep overall score.

TAKE AIM!

Legendary 1: Glorfindel, Lord of the West – 250 pts.

Legendary 2: Haldir’s Elves – 245 pts.
3 Companies/Haldir/Banner Bearer/Hornblower

Legendary 3: Drar’s Hunters (Allies) – 200 pts.
3 Companies/Drar

Common 1: Galadhrim Regiment – 100 pts.
2 Companies/Shields

Common 2: Galadhrim Regiment – 100 pts.
2 Companies/Shields

Common 3: Galadhrim Regiment – 100 pts.
2 Companies/Shields

Common 4: Wood Elf Warband – 135 pts.
3 Companies/Longbows

Rare 1: Galadhrim Knight Regiment – 250 pts.
4 Companies/Shields/Captain

Rare 2: Dwarf Ballista (Allies) – 120 pts.
2 Companies

TOTAL – 1500 pts.


Tactically, the list is pretty sound. I put my enemy between a rock and a hard place with Haldir's longbows to the front, and from turn 2, Drar and his archers to the rear. The enemy will be caught in the crossfire, and the small mobile Warrior unit get round the flanks. Now I'm not putting all my faith in shooting, so I've got a Flying, Spellcasting monster in Glorfindel (who is NAILS) and some nice cavalry too. You'll see I've not gone for Captains in the Galadhrim - in the small Warriors unit, they are a liability if Heroic Dueled, in the Cavalry, I may swap out the Fortune for one as time progresses. My game style will be reactive to my opponent and thus I won't need the Might points from Captains.

Well, whaddaya think?

Q

Jorgen_CAB
21-04-2009, 06:41
Theme wise I don't think that Galadriel go so well with Thranduil in a game of this size.
I'm not that versed in Elven politics but I don't think they would appear together on the battlefield without something major being at stake.

I really think that Galadhrim models would suit equally well for Elves of Mirkwood in armour as those of Lothlorien, they are after all basically the same type of elves.

You could also replace the name of Haldir to something else so he just is a special hero with the same abilities, but in the service of Thranduil instead.

Why not use Legolas, as far as I remember Thranduil is Legolas father after all...

All to his own though...

Otherwise I think that the list looks quite sound though. A little light on troops maybe, but that is unfortunate with elves in general I think. ;)

General Veers
21-04-2009, 13:41
Theme wise I don't think that Galadriel go so well with Thranduil in a game of this size. I agree with Jorgen_CAB. I suspect Galadriel didn't leave Lorien much if at all in the 3rd Age. Her leaving Lorien lessens it's defenses. That's a theme in the Simarillion; if the elven king/queen leave their land/city through death or travel it's put at risk. I'm not sure but I suspect the same effect on Lorien would occur if Galadriel left it. But for a simple game it's not a problem of course, it's just not thematic.


I really think that Galadhrim models would suit equally well for Elves of Mirkwood in armour as those of Lothlorien, they are after all basically the same type of elves. That's why for my Mirkwood force I'm using Tom Meier Wood Elves (https://www.thunderboltmountain.com/index.php?cPath=25). Their stunning beauty as models aside, they are armored like elves who wear it fighting IN their woods as well as when they travel outside it. Whereas my Lorien force will be the GW Galadhrim who wear armor made to be used primarily outside Lorien, since their home is still "clean" unlike Mirkwood.

Still, my Mirkwood list contains "Glorfindel" right now so I'm not 100% on theme either.

On to the army list:

How are you going to deal with Monsters?


EPICs:
You do have two decent magic users. If they get in a duel they may be in trouble. Although I think Thuirandil has Epic Strike? :evilgrin::angel:

Cavalry:
Even though you have 4 companies with a hero, how are you going to use them?

They are the fastest element in your army by far but you probably don't want to run them up against any decent formation alone. They'd make a good reserve but then I would recommend bows.

Mirkwood Sentinels:
If you're going to put your two EPIC Heroes in that unit, another company would be good. That means shuffling out a company from somewhere or loosing unit upgrades, may not be worth it.


Alternate EPIC Character:
Legolas is a good alternative choice as he has a special rule which allows his formation to strike as one type above it. IE: if he's in an infantry unit they strike at the same time as cavalry. If he's in a cavalry unit they strike at the same time as Monsters.

You've got 5 manuever elements so that's good. I'm very curious to know how this army gets on so please keep us updated.

Quannum
21-04-2009, 16:18
Will do! As for your questions regarding tactics...I suppose I will have to figure them out as I go along!

Sedge
22-04-2009, 10:27
I have to say I like your take on the elves. I have decided to go a slightly different route with more of a mix (I feel) of infanty and shock troops. I have less formations as a whole and my substitute for the cavalry is glorfindel. I think that he looks fantastic with his ability to duel then hit unit. The wood elves with legolas should be fairly durable. Celeborn and Galadriel will be reducing courage and healing units as they go.
A small but intresting force. thematic? Woodelves lead by the prince of Mirkwood coming to the aid of Lothlorien. :D

Legendary 1: Galadriel 175 pts.

Legendary 2: Celeborn- 175 pts.

Legendary 3: Legolas - 200pts

Common 1: Galadhrim Regiment 150pts.
3 Companies/Shields

Common 2: Galadhrim Regiment 150pts.
3 Companies Longbows

Common 3: Galadhrim Regiment 100pts.
2 Companies

Common 4: Wood Elf Warband 290pts.
6 Companies Banner and hornblower

Monster 1 Glorfindel - 250pts

Quannum
22-04-2009, 12:24
Yes that's a perfect idea and a great list!

What are the third Galadhrim regiment equipped with? Glaives and Shields or Longbows?

Q

Sedge
22-04-2009, 13:54
I'm not sure yet. It depends on a few things. Do I try and get longbows on the Wood elves? If so I might remove the banner form the woodies for the extra points and remove the glaives. Nitty gritty stuff really.

I have only played one game so far 725pts (which I won aginst Urak-hai:D) and love the game. When I get excited by a new system I immerse myself in it best I can to get to grips with tactics and strategems. This list still has 112 infantry figures to paint (started already) so shouldn't be too overwhellming I feel. As I play more games i imagine my ideas will change but hopefully not by too much.

General Veers
25-04-2009, 20:09
Wood Elves - If you arm them with longbows you can place them up against certain enemy archery units that would normally put the hurt on something they could hit. With the cloak rule those Wood Elves are frustrating against Uruk Crossbows and Harad Bows. Then you can use that Wood Elf unit (I'd only take 3 companies myself) as "bait" so plan on counter acting an enemy advance against that unit.

Sedge
28-04-2009, 12:22
Ok so I had a game last night against my good friend Graham. We are both very new to WotR but enjoy the feel of it. I had
Legendary 1: Galadriel 175 pts.
Legendary 2: Celeborn- 175 pts.
Legendary 3: Legolas - 200pts
Common 1: Galadhrim Regiment 150pts.
3 Companies/Shields
Common 2: Galadhrim Regiment 150pts.
3 Companies Longbows
Common 4: Wood Elf Warband 180pts.
4 Companies
1010pts
vs
Easterling Cohort x 4 hero
Easterling Cohort x 2 Pikes
Easterling Archers x 2
Easterling Kataphakt x 4 Hero
Troll
Amdur
Queen Beruthiel

Our game was shieldwall and high ground.
My shooting in the opening phases was terrific. I neutralised his archers and hit his infantry fairly hard. Then when the troll was closer I target it with Legolas's crippling shot (4+ reduce resiliance by 1) caused 4 hits. This should have ment 2 rolls on the hard to kill table but thanks to Legolas I got 4 rolls. One dead troll.

On my left flank the Katarphract cavalry braved the shooting to charge the archers. I managed to get Celeborn and the infantry into his flank reducing his attacks. After a mountain of dice from me I had killed 2 and he had killed 4 he had won. I was forced back. But he was down to one stand.

Graham marched to the top of the hill and set up camp. With his infantry. A nice target for the wood elves , his pike moved to support them. I moved through the woods to threaten his flank. The archers finished of the cavalry.

Graham managed to line up a charge after resisting transfix and immobilise. He also prevented me from charging so all I could do was prepair for the onslaute. I had whittled his formation down to 2 comapnies whilst I had 3 full comapanies of infantry. I moved Celeborn and Legolas into the formation . He charged. Game on.

Heroic action. We both declaired so had to roll. I won so Dueled his Queen Beth . Beat her by lots, casued 4 hits on her and 3 dead infantry. He then called Epic Rage, all hits cause another attack. I wasn't worried about that as I had a surprise ready for him.

Combat. As i had Legolas in the formation I struck as cavalry ! Celeborn also added his fight value to all formations. Before we new it there was only 4 infantry figures left. Q. This is enough to destroy the final formation, do they get to fight in the combat? We said yes and I will check this week.
A bad fight for graham, he lost his general, wizard and biggest infantry formation. This left two pike companies looing a bit lonely on the hill.
I sent my entire army to keep them company
After a flurry of dice, the game was over and I held the high ground.

Conclusion.
Elves are cool, elves armed with a bow are a whole lot cooler.
Celeborn was in the thick of it all the time. He should have Heroic Dueled the Kataphract hero when i had the chance. He was very useful to have around.
Galadriel - She should have stayed closer to Celeborn to use her councellor skill. This would have given Cel much more might to play with.
Legolas was very handy- he was the reason the troll dies early on in the game. His swift strike ability was useful in winning the combats as well.

Graham, imo, should have been bolder with his troops. He could have barreled into my wood elf archers much quicker and returned to take the hill later in the game. His infatry could have been larger to saok up more casualties.

A very good tactical game played without too many rules problems.

Dragon Prince of Caledor
29-04-2009, 00:35
That sounds like it would have been a lot of fun to play :D

Quannum
30-04-2009, 10:08
Hi guys, given the debate about Captains in small units up against ESHD, I've changed my list in the OP.

I've also put a nice twist on the ancient grudge between Elves and Dwarves...go see...

Q

Jorgen_CAB
30-04-2009, 12:22
I think that the list looks good excpet for one thing, you really need a captain with the knights. The "On the Double!" and chances of using Heroic Charges and Heroic Fights are really important to such a large Cavalry formation.

I would drop one Knight Company for a Captain.

Other than that I think that it probably will work. Personaly I think I would put the Galadhrim with shield in two formation of three, but on the other hand the advantage with more tactical element might be better. I would try both in different battles to find out.

Dragon Prince of Caledor
30-04-2009, 13:25
I agree I think the knights could use a captain. Maybe larger formations for the 2 company fighting units? I havent played the game more than twice so I dont really know what I am saying :P But formations do have a funny way of blowing up when they are reduced to half of the last one.

Quannum
30-04-2009, 23:07
Yeah you guys are right about the Cavalry Captain. I'll add him in now.

But as for making the Warrior units larger, its not worth it in Elves. They are high-priced elite troops that will only ever impact when used wisely. The wise thing to do is take small units with no Captains (just in case someone runs up to the unit with Epic Strike, duels me and takes down the captain and a chunk of the formation. Ergo, no Captains.

What do you guys think of the Haldir/Drar archery grudge match? It's inspired by the Legolas/Gimli kill count rivalry in the films.

Q

Jorgen_CAB
01-05-2009, 00:32
What do you guys think of the Haldir/Drar archery grudge match? It's inspired by the Legolas/Gimli kill count rivalry in the films.

Sounds like a fun element, please give us the score when you tried them out. :)

Reinholt
04-05-2009, 03:36
My quick thoughts:

1 - Without at least one wilderness caster, you are limiting yourself by not picking up one of the best tricks the elves have... both immobilize and nature's wrath are fantastic spells.

2 - Units that are only 2 companies strong have served as little more than mild annoyances in games I have played so far. Especially with the ability to kill only 12 models and get rid of the entire unit, I feel that if any unit is meant to see melee, it needs to be at least 3 strong, if not 4. Archers are fine at smaller amounts.

3 - If you aren't taking captains, take a hero that can join units, rather than Glorfindel, so that you can actually at the double them. Taking Thranduil would kill two birds with one stone regarding this and wilderness magic, in fact...

Viewing this from the perspective of playing against it with my Angmar army, I feel like I'd smash the small units so fast you wouldn't know what happened, shooting or not. The insane mobility of spirits paired with the allied cavalry would just have me on you too fast not to have a bulky melee unit or two to push me back and buy time.