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dijit80
27-04-2009, 20:03
Well its a discussion that crops up often in 40k circles - the legendary Way of the water warrior (http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.php?showtopic=101214)
Does elemental tactics have a place in WFB or do you think that WFB is a much more balanced game that lends itself to more diverse tactics?

Chicago Slim
27-04-2009, 20:13
I think that dividing tactics into "defensive tactics", "offensive tactics", "manuever tactics" and "responsive tactics" is as decent of a model as any other-- though I don't see much need to graft the classical elements of earth, fire, air and water onto those categories.

I've often said that most successful generals find their instinctive play-style, and choose to bring forces that integrate well into that play-style. Defense / Offense / Manuever / Response is a pretty good way of breaking down what I mean by "play-style" (personally, I'm a Manuever strategist, but a Response tactician-- that's why I love Wood Elves, and tend to embrace MSU builds).

But, yeah, Warhammer definitely allows for any of these play-styles, and encourages some combination of play-style.

Mercules
28-04-2009, 12:46
There is definately room for this philosophy in WH:FB.

You would be unable to really peg most factions into a particular element, but there are some classic army builds that might fit.

Dwarven Gunline & Vampire Count Bunker seem very Earth like.
MSU Wood Elf seems very Air like.
Mounted Warriors of Chaos seem to fit the Fire theme.
Water is a hard one, since so many armies could do it.

Wood Elves seem like a very good Water Army. They avoid combat until it suits them, a lot of their spells allow them to 'react' to the enemy, and you have to pick and choose your fights anyway.

Jericho
28-04-2009, 18:55
Yeah I'd peg the Woodies as closest to Water. They can be very reactive in the early phases, until they have really singled something out for a lethal flank/rear/combo charge. With their great speed, bait and flee tactics, tricksy use of Great Eagles, some nasty tarpits and defensive characters (Netlings and Stone of the Crystal Mere is a good combo for stalling enemy combat characters) they can be extremely good at neutralizing the enemy's strengths.

Overwhelming magic is really the only one they struggle to shut down.

Anyway that B&C thread is news to me I'll have to look into it further. The elemental approach seems to be an effective metaphor for the basic principles of strategy tho :)

Stronginthearm
28-04-2009, 20:49
wow I was looking at the synopsis about which are is which element and it seems by randomly selecting armies twice I have ended up with 2 earth armies... maybe somebody is trying to tell me something

bob_the_small
28-04-2009, 21:10
WATER = Responsive
FIRE = offensive tactics
EARTH = defensive tactics
AIR = manuever tactics

quite simple really, but you need to commit to one tactic, not use 2 or 3 IMO, but also you need the right army, for instance WE will have no chance of defensive tactics..

tricker53
28-04-2009, 22:21
i reckon air/fire can be a good combo, and water/earth likewise.

as a slaaneshi daemons player, im definitely an air follower, but with a slight tinge of fire (as any daemon army with a greater daemon has).

my dwarfs on the other hand, are pretty fire based IMO. . . seeing as i use the infamous 1st turn charge longbeards, miners, warmachines in their absolute abundance. . .

Chicago Slim
29-04-2009, 01:15
quite simple really, but you need to commit to one tactic, not use 2 or 3 IMO, but also you need the right army, for instance WE will have no chance of defensive tactics..

As I suggested above, I think that there actually *is* room for combinations of tactics-- though I'll agree that there are some armies that are well-suited to some styles and poorly-suited to others.

For my own part, I tend to play my wood elves (and, for that matter, my high elves and by beasts of chaos) as a combination of mobility and response-- though sometimes I'll go with more mobility+offense with HE and BoC...

And, sure, there are some combinations of tactics that are, at best, hard to wrap one's head around (how do you have a mobility+defense army? Well, see the recent points-denial thread, maybe...) but that doesn't mean that combinations are impossible, nor even necessarily a bad idea...