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The Judge
05-05-2005, 18:16
WEll, the title was misleading - I've only played four games, and they were all against (very different!) Dwarf armies. What could you recommened for, say, fighting Ogres and Undead?

I already decided to drop 1 Screamer and 1 Warrior for the 2 Dispel Scrolls. But anyway;

Chaos Lord - great weapon, barded steed, shield, Helm of Many Eyes, Armour of Damnation, Gaze of the Gods. 329pts

Sorceror - Level 2, Power Familier. 170pts
Sorceror - Level 2. 120pts
Exalted Champion - great weapon. 104pts

20 Warriors - shields, full command. 330pts
9 Chosen Knights - full command, War Banner 450pts
Chariot 120pts
5 Marauder Horsemen - flails, musician. 81pts

6 Screamers 198pts
6 Furies 90pts

Daemons kill war machines and harass flanks/charge into engaged combats.
Knights charge with warrior and chariot to break several units at once, or one turn before the slower units.
Sorcerors run around and cast magic - targeting things with low armour like Slayers, Ghouls, Leadbelchers...

Whaddya think?

Riddy
05-05-2005, 18:33
That knight unit is a huge points sink, i would consider splitting it in half and having 5 chosen and 4 normal knighs with the lord, that way both units can break enemy units and they can work together.

Hideous Loon
05-05-2005, 19:59
Why do you have 2 Sorcerors, playing against Dwarfs? Who have a buttload of extra Dispel Dice and a multitude of Spellbreaking and -eating runes? Perhaps not the cleverest thing to do, young Padawan. Plus, against Undead, trying not to get outnumbered is an intelligent thing to do, and now, only your Warriors can actually outnumber their opponent. Not even Chaos Knights are that cocky when they have been flanked by a big unit of Skellies, don't you know.

MarcoPollo
05-05-2005, 20:36
I too think that those knight are a point sink. spliting them is a good idea.

Also, I like have some beastmen around an expensive unit to screen them from getting shot up. (55 pts for 5 gor/5ungor) skirmishers.

Also, I am a fan of small unts of chosen wariors versus large unchosen wariors. Warriors are elite troops and cost like elites. So, keep them small and have them be more "killy" (i.e halberds or extrahand weapon, and chosen not with shields).

But, if you are winning, why mess with a good thing. Often time I will play a list out until I get schooled and I can see where my list lacks balance (thoughtfulness). Then I judge whether it was luck, poor decision making, or an unbalanced list.

The Judge
07-05-2005, 20:35
I take the wizards because they are actually very useful - going for purely magic missiles (Death) annoys the hell out of my opponents, who usually only take one Runesmith - and when he dies, the spells start getting through. I tend to find the army gets better as the game progresses; charges get through, enemy shooting disappears and combats go my way.

The Knights are a points sink, but they have never failed me against Dwarves - only other armies...
Can any Ogres players tell me their experiences with heavy cavalry, whether they fear it, whether it works against them, etc.

Cheers!

Oguleth
07-05-2005, 21:58
That has to be one of the smaller armies I`ve seen :)

I`d not bother with so much points in characters, not to mention getting more units that can do something.

Facing undead can mean a lot of things. A pure raising/vanhel army will give you hell; raising lots of zombies on the flank of your knight unit and vanheling them into the flank will quickly make you lose combat and perhaps get autobroken. Or hang around a long time killing zombies that won`t earn you much points, while the rest of your army (about 1000 points?) will have to care about the entire remaining undead army. Not good. That`s why having the eggs spread out amongst more units would be a good idea... You can also meet less magically oriented armies (like blood dragons with lots of knights), and if he uses speed bumps, he can get favourable charges on the knights aswell. If you can manage to get one unit in the front at the time, you`ll most likely win, otherwise there will be trouble.

As for ogres, chariots and knights are kinda bad for them/us. A single warrior chariot into a 4-5 ogre unit is really trouble; unless you put the chariot in contact with a character, you should be able to win combat, and ogres in general (especially if you charge units out of the general`s command radius) have low leadership, so if you win, they often run away. Get 3 wounds at least, and only one ogre will strike back, and he will tend to have trouble wounding. If you get 6 (which you will be able to do sometimes), you`ll surely have them run away. If you use the flying demons to march block the units, you can also concentrate the cav and chariots on parts of the ogre army and maim them while the other ogres will have trouble getting there. A Rending Sword would make the lord able to actually handle ogre units on his own (hitting on 3+, wounding on 3+, no save, d3 wounds), that`s about an ogre or something like that a turn, meaning he will win most combats against them, and strike first later on. The Warriors could be a mess if the ogres get to charge them, but well. A lot of stuff can kill the warriors without much of a sweat, so that`s life for them...

The Judge
08-05-2005, 20:43
Cheers for the Ogre advice - maybe more Chariots could be laugh.

I'm playing in the Border Princes campaign from the General's Compendium and there are chances to get extra points for you armies if you reinforce them.

As for the Undead the last army I saw the Vampire player take featured two units of Black Knights and two Banshee's, and that was in addition to the five Spirit Hosts, two BD vampires and MSU Dire Wolves. Too bad he's not that good at playing. Against that, I was considering the Banner of the Gods, combined with Mark of Slaanesh (competitive campaign - not fluffy) on big blocks of Warriors, with flanking units of Horsemen or Hounds for the extra combat res.

Cheers for the Rending Sword idea - that rocks for both armies!