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Corpse
11-05-2009, 06:59
I've been playing against tyranids lately (with my death guard). And it seems they are lacking in certain areas that. Well, due to their older version codex, and the newer codexes give them trouble. I want to figure out the compedetive builds for a list.

Recently, they all just dive into scuttle+tendril genestealer lists. I feel there's more to the list then that, so I dug deeper. Trying to find the synergetic combos that bypass certain things, like trying to have a lictor or two replace all those silly tendrils and allow them to have frag grenades (flesh hooks) to not require using catalyst power to strike back. Then just trying to use a broodlord and 3 lictors for 40+ scuttle-stealers to help with reserve rolls, and get the broodlord up there I find the list lacks shooty elements. So adding shooty elements, that means putting things on the table that dont shoot well, die quick or get bogged down/short range issues.

Trying to find that "real good" list is hard. I should have been playing my tyranids more and get up to speed with them but... Too into my chaos and daemons (and orks).

So, how far does one take upgrades on the genestealers? Is there one unit with tendrils among many, or rely solely on the lictors and broodlord's tendrils? What fire support would survive the turns leading up to the arrival of the stealers outflanking?

I know lictors are bum, but that reroll reserves thing makes for three large genestealer units(or even broodlord+stealers) to arrive easier.

So with that aside. The shooting element, for those pesky skimmers and transports (got to empty them before charging after all). I hear this and that about venom cannons, warp blast, and barbed stranglers. I want to venture more into spore mine clusters specificlly acid mines. They seem legit for a one time blunder against vehicles, 3+2D6.

So filling fast attack with those (sorry raveners) I suppose another venue can be run into. The HQ is a Broodlord, perhaps a winged tyrant, keeping with the anti tank theme takes warp blast, enhanced senses and wings of course, with twin scything talons. The anti tank covered, and everything rolling off reserves, what I need most being rerolled.

Sound good so far I hope? The heavy support is the big question, and getting a free shot at them is very unwelcoming even if they shoot back. I hate to say it but biovores actually seem good for this style, using acid mines. (Enhancing the anti transport appeal)

So, consideration in the list consists of:
Broodlord, some stealers, taking flesh hooks.
Flyrant with warp blast and twin talon sets.
Genestealers, undecided but taking scuttle and hooks at bare minimum.
Maybe one without number scuttle+spinefist gaunt unit of 8.
Two or three lictors, depending on points.
Acid mines and biovore with acid mines as well, maybe more.

I wont accept "Go with carnifexes" comments, as the list is very direct in being purely reserves and out of sight. Catching the opponent offguard. Raveners may be a better choice then some, but thats just me thinking two basic genestealers are better then one rend-ravener.

What is your compedetive list made up of? Strength 4 hormagaunts that slap vehicles around and catch enemies offguard with catalyst charging into terrain? Using double numbers with spinefist gaunts? (Half the cost of a hormagaunt, near same effectiveness but with double the ablative wounds). Do you run with something very different?

Though, some lists come off as hard, I find tyranids a bit too squishy (My hidden powerfist units never failed to down every carnifex they came into contact with, even a meleefex of 7+ attacks numbering 5 models). Perhaps I just prepare too well for tyranids with my chaos and orks. A shame really, they used to be the staplemark which melee armies feared. Now its turned around (at least here).

JustTony
11-05-2009, 12:07
If you're going to take gaunts, take massive units, 8 gaunts is just an easy kill. My normal lists include at least 3 units of 30 gaunts, two of deathgaunts (hormagaunts with WS5, S4, I5) and one of either Scuttling spinegaunts or S4 devourer gaunts, depending on points. Yes they're expensive units and easy to kill the individual gaunt but the unit usually survives to charge no later than second turn. At 1500 points I'll add a Hive Tryant with talons and a VC and 2+ save, a Dakka-Carni and a Zoeanthrope with warp blast. It's weak against vehicles, and an army with a walker or or two can be really hard to stop but overall it's worked fairly well. As points go up I add a Broodlord with talonstealers, Winged Warriors and either another Carnifex or more Zoeanthropes.

I've managed to pound orks with them, tear up Space Marines, demolish the IG (old codex, haven't seen the new one in action yet) phase out Necrons and prove the superiority of my Hive Fleet against other nids. All in all they work pretty well. It helps when the other player looks across the table and goes "Yikes! I can't kill all that!" The psychology of a huge number of models can always be fun, I've seen several Ork players use it as well. My Nids vs Orks tend to be slaughter-fests as every turn usually results in dozens of models being removed, from both sides.

Still, it's a lot of fun to play and isn't that the point?

Peace: through lots and lots of Nids.

mukelnas
11-05-2009, 13:11
I agree with JustTony, more gaunts.

As for biovores, most people will tell you the flat out suck, because they give up KP. If you don't care about that they are so much fun. They can pop tants, even land radiers, but are not reliable. They need to hit the tank first, then need a very good roll because of the low strength. On the other hand people tend to be more afraid of spore mines more than they should be. The best way to use them I have found is to cover an area on the board with as many spore mines as you possiably can. It will help to restrict enemy movement. If your opponent does wander into your spore mine field use the synapse power to detonate them. Another thing, few of the people I play aginst are willing to use an entire unit's shooting to destroy spore mines when there are other targets avaliable.

freddieyu
11-05-2009, 13:27
Have you tried the big bug+stealer list? One of our guys has been having excellent success recently, esp vs marines..

Basically, it comprises of a hive tyrant+tyrant guard unit (shooty weapons), flying tyrant, 2 to 3 elite fexes, 2 dakkafexes, and his troops were all stealers. Stealers on board had 4+ saves, scuttling stealers had them feeder tendrils..(2 each)..that was for 1500 pts..in bigger games he uses a broodlord to replace the flying tyrant, and he maxes out his stealers (sometimes uses a single gaunt unit as a screen)..

Pretty tough, uses his linebreaker fexes to shield everything (of course also using terrain) and leaves the dirty work to the dakka fexes and tyrant, and of course stealers...

Takes skill to use, but when it works it works...